Focused thread for new iMacs

Posted:
in Future Apple Hardware edited January 2014
what are you thoughts? the reason why i ask is because not only is a family member of mine (my dad) switching and getting an imac (i'm having him wait just a bit) but so is one of our clients. I am interested in hearing what other people think the likelihood of new imacs this coming January and what features they will boast.



As in that one threat "g5 in everything" I was curious to think of how the old imacs compared to the powermacs at the time. So is it possible then to assume that we'll have g5 imacs here soon as well? also will there be a form factor change as well? How long has the current iMacs been in production 2 years? so is it time for a case redevelop?



What are the odds, I'm asking you for your opinion.



me and my bad spelling in thread titles, can a mod please change that to say *thread* I apologize in advance for any misconceptions.



[Fixed. -Amorph]
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Comments

  • Reply 1 of 28
    I find it highly unlikely that the g5 would penetrate so quickly. i guess i am pessimistic because all these years have never seen it happen so quick.



    i mean...G5s JUST started shipping a few months back. i do not doubt that IBM is great and the new g5 chip will be much better with heat and energy ? but i think MWSF is just too soon. i think that an announcemnet in mid-2004 would be more acceptable/believeable.



    look, it's safe to wait for after MWSF though.
  • Reply 2 of 28
    macnn sux I have the same perception right now, esp with apple having pretty good sales with their existing iMac's from what i hear they sell reasonably well. It would be in apples best interest to wait too i think, however I said this last year when I bought my Ti, then only 2 weeks later Al was announced heh.
  • Reply 3 of 28
    January 24th will be the 20th Anniversary of the "1984" Macintosh launch



    A special edition "?Mac" wouldn't be a surprise to me, but speculation abounds.
  • Reply 4 of 28
    cubistcubist Posts: 954member
    If the G5 iMac doesn't come out at MWNY I'm going to look for a used or refurb 1.8GHz single G5 Powermac. I know the case is GIGANTIC but I want the performance.
  • Reply 5 of 28
    mac+mac+ Posts: 580member
    I hope the iMac goes G5 - but I'm not sure it will. I'm also intrigued by a new form factor/industrial design. I don't know whether to expect a redesigned case (alongside a redesigned motherboard hopefully), but I certainly am looking forward to seeing what Ives comes up with.
  • Reply 6 of 28
    I'm sure Apple would have liked the iMac to go G5 as soon as possible, but there are several factors that come into play here.

    First: There have to be a sufficient gap between the PowerMacs and the iMacs performance-wise, and that means that Apple probably will have to await new and faster 970 chips from IBM.



    That brings me to the second factor: IBM. Apple will probably not release new iMacs before IBM comes out with faster processors. The base PM will probably have faster processor than the top of the line iMac. So if Apple gets faster processors we can see new PM's from 1,8 to 2,2 ghz, and iMac with 1,6 ghz G5. Or they release the G5 iMac at MWSF in january with the new G5 PM's shortly thereafter.



    Third: Cooling. Can the current iMac design dissipate enough heat to make it the home of the current G5 line. If not, we probably have to wait until summer to see the G5 hit the iMac.
  • Reply 7 of 28
    You mean like the processors in teh next generation PowerMac? If the conservative speculation on the specs of the next PowerMac are true 2.0 2.2 2.4 ghz machines then the imac can surely get a 1.6 1.8 ghz g5 and there will be a good enough gap. However...since these chips obviously run hot an imac case redesign is probably necessary for that to happen...cheese grated dome? Liquid cooling maybe? I don't think we would have to wait for MWNY. If apple wanted to introduce hot running iMacs than the design would have already been done a while back considering the amount of time they have known g5 specs. Rumors of iMac redesign in my opinion make it more likely that the imac will indeed sport a g5.
  • Reply 8 of 28
    Quote:

    Originally posted by NETROMac

    I'm sure Apple would have liked the iMac to go G5 as soon as possible, but there are several factors that come into play here.

    First: There have to be a sufficient gap between the PowerMacs and the iMacs performance-wise, and that means that Apple probably will have to await new and faster 970 chips from IBM.



    That brings me to the second factor: IBM. Apple will probably not release new iMacs before IBM comes out with faster processors. The base PM will probably have faster processor than the top of the line iMac. So if Apple gets faster processors we can see new PM's from 1,8 to 2,2 ghz, and iMac with 1,6 ghz G5. Or they release the G5 iMac at MWSF in january with the new G5 PM's shortly thereafter.



    Third: Cooling. Can the current iMac design dissipate enough heat to make it the home of the current G5 line. If not, we probably have to wait until summer to see the G5 hit the iMac.




    To regain the strength that the original iMac had Apple needs a processor in the high end iMac at least as fast as the low end PowerMac, and they could go as high as the medium range PM if the PM model was running dual processors. Today's speeds for the iMac are very under powered for the money that they cost.
  • Reply 9 of 28
    Quote:

    Originally posted by @homenow

    To regain the strength that the original iMac had Apple needs a processor in the high end iMac at least as fast as the low end PowerMac, and they could go as high as the medium range PM if the PM model was running dual processors. Today's speeds for the iMac are very under powered for the money that they cost.



    Has there ever been an iMac with a faster processor than the base line PowerMac. I think not (please prove me wrong), and I don't think Apple is going to change this, not any-time soon that is.

    With the current money Apple is charging for the iMacs, they are almost ridiculously underpowered compared to similar PC set-ups. They are wery well designed, look expensive, have great displays, enough memory and drive capacity to be used for some fairly demanding work. But as it is now the iMac is just too SLOW to be a serious contender in the market, and I'm sure Apple knows this.

    We'll probably see a slightly redesigned iMac G5 unveiled some twelve days from now. GO Steve!



    Psst! And I want my flower power iPod DV SE too
  • Reply 10 of 28
    Quote:

    Originally posted by NETROMac

    Has there ever been an iMac with a faster processor than the base line PowerMac. I think not (please prove me wrong), and I don't think Apple is going to change this, not any-time soon that is.





    When the iMac G4 debuted with a 800mhz processor, the low-end G4 was 733. In February, 2002, the base G4 had an 800mhz chip.
  • Reply 11 of 28
    Quote:

    Originally posted by NETROMac

    Has there ever been an iMac with a faster processor than the base line PowerMac. I think not (please prove me wrong), and I don't think Apple is going to change this, not any-time soon that is.

    With the current money Apple is charging for the iMacs, they are almost ridiculously underpowered compared to similar PC set-ups. They are very well designed, look expensive, have great displays, enough memory and drive capacity to be used for some fairly demanding work. But as it is now the iMac is just too SLOW to be a serious contender in the market, and I'm sure Apple knows this.

    We'll probably see a slightly redesigned iMac G5 unveiled some twelve days from now. GO Steve!



    Psst! And I want my flower power iPod DV SE too




    When the iMac was released, for a price of $1299, it had a 233 mhz G3, which was equal to the base PM model. Today the iMac is arguably a higher end computer than the iMac of old was. I believe that the G3 iMac/DV was at 400 mhz when the G4 PM was pulled back to 350 mhz. Yes it was a different processor but with the lack of AltiVec optimization on software the G3 preformed comparable to the G4 of equal clock speed. My main point was that the top end of the original iMac line was comparable in clock speed to the bottom end PM that was being sold at the same time, not 20% slower. Motorola does make 1.4 Ghz G4's and that is the processor that the iMac should have been shipping with when the PM's moved to the G5.



    It is my opinion that the 20" iMac should have a 1.8 Ghz processor. The PM 1.8 is a dual processor so there is product difference there. Also the 20" iMac is a premium computer, and should have the speed to go with its price point.



    Notice, I did not say that the iMac should have a G5 processor, I just referred to clock speeds. I do realize that Motorola does not currently have a 1.6 Ghz G4 shipping at this date, but that doesn't mean that they don't have them. They also did not list a 1.4 chip when the PM's were shipping with that chip. With the die shrink of the '57 chip one could reasonably expect at least a 20% boost in speed which would put the high end G4 in the range of 1.7 Ghz. If Motorola cannot deliver a chip that can match the low end PM in clock speed then it is time to drop Motorola or drastically reduce the price point of the iMac.
  • Reply 12 of 28
    I'm certain that Apple has been developing the G5 iMac along side the PowerMac. It's just matter of having enough G5's to offer both desktop lines with the same chips. Really, I don't see any reason the iMac should run at slower clock speeds than the PowerMacs, other than to keep costs down. The PowerMac should all be duals, after all.



    The only other factor that might delay the G5 iMac would be cooling. We may have to wait for the 90nm G5s, though some think that the 90nm will debut at SF 2004.
  • Reply 13 of 28
    Quote:

    Originally posted by @homenow

    Notice, I did not say that the iMac should have a G5 processor, I just referred to clock speeds. I do realize that Motorola does not currently have a 1.6 Ghz G4 shipping at this date, but that doesn't mean that they don't have them.



    I'm pretty sure the new *major* revamp of the iMac line will include a G5 class processor. If we have a new PowerMac line from 2,0 to 2,4 ghz (droool!) with the two upper models being DPs, iMacs from 1,6 to 1,8 would not be unthinkable, but then again we could see the top of the line 20" iMac getting the 2,0 ghz processor. That would be some jump in performance if this is the case. But I still think we will see more modest speed increases in the first batch of G5 iMacs, at least in megahertz.
  • Reply 14 of 28
    Quote:

    Originally posted by scottiB

    When the iMac G4 debuted with a 800mhz processor, the low-end G4 was 733. In February, 2002, the base G4 had an 800mhz chip.



    Thank's for pointing that out Scott! Someone have been doing their homework
  • Reply 15 of 28
    Quote:

    Originally posted by NETROMac

    I'm pretty sure the new *major* revamp of the iMac line will include a G5 class processor. If we have a new PowerMac line from 2,0 to 2,4 ghz (droool!) with the two upper models being DPs, iMacs from 1,6 to 1,8 would not be unthinkable, but then again we could see the top of the line 20" iMac getting the 2,0 ghz processor. That would be some jump in performance if this is the case. But I still think we will see more modest speed increases in the first batch of G5 iMacs, at least in megahertz.



    I tend to agree with your assessment, and think that we will see 1.6 & 1.8 G5's in the iMac if they come out early next year (based on the current G5 speeds). I think that if these are released in January, and the PM update is held off till Feb. then it gets the iMac closer the level of performance that it was back in 99-00' in comparison to the PM.



    A key question though is how the die shrink 970's are doing in production. It is possible that the new 970's yield and quality are good enough coming off the line that Apple would have to "underclock" chips to get them down to 1.6 Ghz.
  • Reply 16 of 28
    addisonaddison Posts: 1,185member
    I am sure G5 is the future. I am also sure that there are sufficent low end G5's available. The major question is, is there a cool enough G5 130nm 1.6 maybe not but 2ghz 90nm possibly, I don't know.



    It seems quite clear the the arm and screen is going to stay for some time and I say this because the 20" has only just been released. that means that either:-



    1. There is no imminent change to the iMac.



    2. That a G5 can be accommodated and cooled within the existing case.



    3. That the base will change but that the top will remain the same.





    I think it is 50/50 whether we get a change in January. My guess is that we will get a modified case with the same screen/arm, but in say April-June. If it happens in January I will be delighted and surprised.
  • Reply 17 of 28
    I can't believe so many people are suggesting that Apple would use the current iMac enclosure for the G5. Or that they would slightly modify the iMac G4 enclosure. That's just silly. I think we'll see a major architectural change. Not just for cooling, but for marketing.
  • Reply 18 of 28
    Quote:

    Originally posted by Michael Wilkie

    I can't believe so many people are suggesting that Apple would use the current iMac enclosure for the G5. Or that they would slightly modify the iMac G4 enclosure. That's just silly. I think we'll see a major architectural change. Not just for cooling, but for marketing.



    Change to what??? I think the current iMac is the greatest "designed" computer ever made, at least in the all-in-one form factor segment. If Apple makes changes to the iMac at this time, it will certainly not depart in any significant way from the current model. Just some tweaking. They will probably cut the 15" model from the line-up when they go G5, and that makes it possible to make the dome somewhat bigger without it looking strange. And I think the G5 announcement alone will have a lot more people consider it as a viable alternative to a PowerMac or a comparable PC. And where would they possibly go from the current iMac if they are doing something major with the desing - back to the gelly bean iMac. I think not.
  • Reply 19 of 28
    hasapihasapi Posts: 290member
    Quote:

    Originally posted by NETROMac

    Change to what??? I think the current iMac is the greatest "designed" computer ever made, at least in the all-in-one form factor segment. If Apple makes changes to the iMac at this time, it will certainly not depart in any significant way from the current model. Just some tweaking. They will probably cut the 15" model from the line-up when they go G5, and that makes it possible to make the dome somewhat bigger without it looking strange. And I think the G5 announcement alone will have a lot more people consider it as a viable alternative to a PowerMac or a comparable PC. And where would they possibly go from the current iMac if they are doing something major with the desing - back to the gelly bean iMac. I think not.



    Agreed, the current design is IMO unparalleled. Rumours of case changes are more to do with cooling issues. Remember, the iMac does not have a fan - so it has the same problem the PB does. I hope they dont drop the 15", Apple NEEDS a 15" for businesses more than home users that would gravitate to the 17/20 models.



    I just hope the 90nm G5's with lower voltage and lower clocked 1.4-1.8G will be engineering feasible for iMacs/PB's for MWSF.



    My wish list for the iMac/PB @ MWSF



    15" 1.4G G5

    17" 1.6G G5

    20" 1.8G G5



    PB 12" 1.2G

    PB 15" 1.4G

    PB 17" 1.6G
  • Reply 20 of 28
    Let's take a look at what the rumors have reported this far:



    90nm G5's are ready to go. Pessimism says 2Ghz, 2.2Ghz, and 2.4Ghz chips. Optimism says they'll bring it up to 2.6Ghz. Some rumors have even said the Powermac line will be all Dual, with Dual 2Ghz in the low-end Powermac. Whether that's true or not, a 2Ghz chip in the low-end Powermac is certain this January. They have to make it to 3Ghz by this summer (Steve said so), so this speed bump will most certainly happen now, leaving enough time between now and the summer for the 3Ghz speed bump.



    Now, with that in mind, does it make any sense for the iMac to remain at it's paltry 1.25Ghz clockspeed? Absolutely not. Would it be safe to assume Motorola has faster clocked G4 chips ready to go? Hahaha, yeah right. I'm confident we'll see an iMac containing the new 90nm G5 chip, and if the Powermac line is indeed an all-dual line-up, then the high-end iMac will carry a single 2Ghz G5 chip. Like others have stated, the iMac used to hold the same clockspeed as the low-end Powermac. I think those days are going to return very soon.



    Apple has been selling underpowered and overpriced computers for 3 years now. They've got the chips available to catch up, and they're going to use them as soon as possible. Powermacs are actually selling again, and selling well. It's time to make the iMac a hot item once again. It will most certainly get a G5 chip, and because it's Apple we're talking about, you can certainly expect a new case to go along with that fast new chip.



    Y'all may as well consider an updated iMac as fact come this January. The iMac can't possibly remain at 1.25Ghz while the Powermacs move up to 2.4Ghz.
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