Moving to Portland
Im thinking about moving to Portland ( getting a touch of island fever ), and was looking for advice about suburbs to live in, the tech industry, current state of jobs etc etc.
Are there any good local sources for tech jobs ( Hawaii has a tech jobs website, which is how I got my current job )?
Im a web developer ( Java, Coldfusion, ASP, .Net ), whats the pay like?
I want to live in a family friendly suburb ( house, yard, shops etc ), and Id like to avoid a huge commute to work.
Whats the state of broadband? Who is the best provider, do they have limited coverage?
How about public transport, Ive heard its good, what suburbs get the best service?
Are the downtown/inner suburbs good?
Are there any good local sources for tech jobs ( Hawaii has a tech jobs website, which is how I got my current job )?
Im a web developer ( Java, Coldfusion, ASP, .Net ), whats the pay like?
I want to live in a family friendly suburb ( house, yard, shops etc ), and Id like to avoid a huge commute to work.
Whats the state of broadband? Who is the best provider, do they have limited coverage?
How about public transport, Ive heard its good, what suburbs get the best service?
Are the downtown/inner suburbs good?
Comments
Originally posted by Scott
You're on a pretty good island now.
We could argue the pros and cons of living in Hawaii for a long time, but Im sitting firmly in the cons. Biggest one: cost of living.
Originally posted by Splinemodel
so be it. . . but why portland? There are better places to be, as far as I can tell. The other thing is that, generally speaking, cool places have high costs of living. That's just a fact of a market economy.
Portland is the result of a systematic reduction of places neither my wife nor I want to live, for various reasons. Portland is the "least worst". Having since discovered things like it being voted best city to live in america ( by some magazine ) I dont feel to bad about it.
Any suggestions for better place are welcome, it needs to be:
not too expensive ( rules out San Fran, New York ).
not on the east coast
fairly close to the ocean
reasonably cold ( my wife cant stand the heat of HI )
family friendly
pedestrian friendly
some sort of tech industry, or at least a growing economy
As for cost of living - Hawaii might cool if you are a surfer, or on holiday, but its actually a really shitty place to live. There is no way anyone with a typical income can afford to live anywhere 'cool', at least, not without sharing a house with 6 other people ( which is what surfers do to live on the beach ). In addition to the amazing cost of housing ( a lot of my workmates live with their parents ) things like food are expensive, and limited in choice. Hawaii isnt expensive because it is cool. Its expensive because its out in the middle of the ocean, with no land and no resources.
I lived in Sydney for a few years before moving to HI, it was more expensive ( 5th most expensive city in the world ), but in exchange for that cost you did get a lot of cool things. Living in HI is like living in my home town, only twice as expensive.
Originally posted by mmmpie
not on the east coast
fairly close to the ocean
reasonably cold ( my wife cant stand the heat of HI )
I'm not quite sure what's wrong with the East coast, unless you just have a thing against the atlantic, or seriousness. Anyway, my real point are that if your wife thinks Hawaii is hot, then I guess you're pretty much forced to live north of San Fran on the West coast, or North of Boston of the East coast. . . Stay out of the center of the country, which is known for hot summers and cold winters.
Hawaii doesn't even get very hot.
Lastly, the ocean due west of Portland is very, very cold. The current comes from Alaska. Just FYI. If your deeply into surfing, it might get a bit painful.
Originally posted by Splinemodel
Hawaii doesn't even get very hot.
Yeah, its not the absolute heat, its the 6 months of "88, no clouds" that's a killer. Literally. Endless summer indeed. Winter is actually very nice, temperature varies, it rains, and is sunny.
Originally posted by mmmpie
Yeah, its not the absolute heat, its the 6 months of "88, no clouds" that's a killer. Literally. Endless summer indeed. Winter is actually very nice, temperature varies, it rains, and is sunny.
Heh heh. The Hawaiian kids I knew in college were even bigger pansies than the Florida kids. Now that I've moved to Florida, I can understand why. Summer here is brutal.
summer is nice though . . . but not Hawaii nice!
then . . .
aother nine months of wondering why you're alive . . .
after the first two years you'll get to like it . . . if you buy full spectrum lights . .
only place that I have lived consistently darker was Syracuse . . . and in Syracuse it wasn't rain everyday all the time, it was thck snow . . .
Also, Portland is in love with itself . . . all the young wannabe rock stars that have just come from Kansas and who will be gone in a few years make it somewhat transient feeling
But I loved my time there (after the adjustment) . . . and I know some good people who still live there. . . . make that GREAT people.
No clue on jobs. I know INtel was dropping people for a while and they are obviously a big Portland employer and general tech bellweather although that may have changed with the slowly improving economy.
Portland has a nice little little rail system, MAX, but it pretty much is just one straight line. Two Northern spurs to the airport and downtown but mostly it goes East-West with the terminuses [terminii?] at Gresham on the East and Hillsboro on the West. I know they have plans to extend it some more out to Tigard and even further South but I dunno the details. THey are supposed to have a good bus system as well but I know nothing about that.
Personally I think Portland would be an excellent place to live but of course it is all dependent on your priorities. Solid tech industry, pretty educated area, fairly low crime rates and probably the most affordable housing of any fairly big city on the West Coast. You get the laid back West Coast culture. Portland has poseurs and such but who doesn't? Nice restaurants. No idea on schools but I would imagine that they are solid. Excellent outdoor oppurtunities if you are into that sort of thing with the ocean, forests, waterfalls, mountains, volcanoes, desert, Columbia River Gorge etc all within close reach of Portland. Ocean up here is different. It's not swimming ocean or beach ocean and such but it has a cold rugged beauty that you also don't see along most of the Pacific below Monterrey Bay or the Atlantic below Acadia. Oregon had the foresight to lock up all of its beaches as state parks so none of that condos on the beach crap either.
Vancouver WA is also a popular option for the great Portland area. Its kinda its own city and kinda a Portland suburb. Nice monetary advantages in that Washington has no state income tax [but moderately high sales tax] while Oregon has no sales tax [but an income tax] and so by living in Vancouver you avoid state income tax while also sometimes avoiding sales tax by buying in Portland although on real big stuff like cars they try pretty hard to close all the loopholes.
Originally posted by ColanderOfDeath
NW weather, the cloudy skies more so than the rain does take some getting used to and perhaps even moreso if you are from Hawaii. I dont think that it is nearly as bas as pfflam says though.
Well, I grew up in Christchurch, New Zealand, home the pertual overcast. Gotta love those Antarctic storms
That was really helpful, Ive heard of Vancouver, but never really knew why someone might live there rather than in Portland proper. Likewise, I had heard about the train system, but nothing was ever very clear about how extensive it is, or what the suburbs it services are like.
After a quick check Portland and Christchurch are nearly at the same latitudes, Im sure Ill be right at home with the weather.
The weather is not nearly as bad as people believe. This winter it has been rather balmy with temps in the 60's. Of course that means no snow in the mountains so we will be rationing water come summer. Summers are great in Seattle with little rain, low humidity, and temps in the 80's. Portland tends to be about 5 degrees hotter.
As for jobs, Seattle is crawling with out of work web developers, but I am not sure about Portland. Check out craigslist.org for job listings in both cities.
By the way, I just moved from Seattle to Newport on the Oregon coast so going through a but of culture shock myself. Thank god for the internet so I can stay a bit connected to the rest of the planet!!
Originally posted by craiger77
Portland is nice, but I like Seattle more. Not so many years ago Portland was branded the whitest city in America for its size. If you like ethnic diversity then head further north to Seattle. Portland, and Oregon in general, are suffering from the "lets pay no taxes and see how far to hell services can go" syndrome.
Dude, that's why Prague is such a great place. Droves upon droves of hot white chicks. Now, Portland might not have the germano-slavic thing going on, which seems to be a good combination, but my point is that a lack of ethnic diversity isn't necessarily a bad thing.
As far as taxes, some people don't like taxes, and would rather pay for private services anyway. Come to think of it, Portland might not be such a bad place, aside from the utter lack of a football, soccer, or hockey team.
Some people do move here and find that the persistent overcast skies during fall and winter make them kind of depressed. On the other hand, if you're an "indoor" person who likes reading, computers, video games or whatever, then it's perfect. The weather is never extreme.
Another good thing about Portland is that there are no really "bad" neighborhoods, no areas where it isn't safe to go. People who have never left Portland think we have "slums" but those people have never seen parts of Philly, NJ, NY, Detroit, and so on.
The area is currently experiencing unusually high unemployment, as is Seattle, due to the downturn in high tech. This is improving, though, and it's also slightly misleading. There had been a huge influx of tech workers from out of state, during the "bubble," and many of those people are moving away again. The economy is fairly diverse, though, and the heavy industrial sector (where I work) is kicking butt. Population is still gaining steadily, though. Lots of people want to live here.
Originally posted by hakeem joe
I've lived in Portland most of my life and have found that almost 100% of the people who visit here when the weather is good, love it and think about moving here. It's true that it rains more days out of the year than it does in a lot of other places, but conversely, it doesn't rain as heavily (inches per year) as some places such as Georgia, most of Florida, Alabama, etc., that are thought of as having dry weather.
Some people do move here and find that the persistent overcast skies during fall and winter make them kind of depressed. On the other hand, if you're an "indoor" person who likes reading, computers, video games or whatever, then it's perfect. The weather is never extreme.
Wow, that's exactly right. I've driven through Portland many times to get to the Oregon coast, where I used to rent a beach cottage for a few weeks every summer. The weather on the coast in July and August is stunningly beautiful. But one year, I took my weeks in June. It rained the entire time; and though I generally love rain, I did start to get heartily sick of it. It never occurred to me that Portland had nine months of rain, too, just like the coast. I guess I assumed the rain and fog were more a coastal phenomenon.
Over time, I have met a fair number of people who spend part of the year in Oregon and the rest in Arizona. Lucky people who can pull that off.
The weather and laid-back atmosphere in San Diego are really nice, though I haven't been there for a few years. When I go there and hang out in the beach communities, I can feel the tension and stress just flowing out of my body. Ahhhhh.....
I love Seattle. It seems like a wonderful city. But, again, I've only been there in the summer months, so I have never experienced the rain. I have to point out that the traffic on the freeways is just an unmitigated nightmare. I do love the fact that it's a huge port city, with ships from everywhere. Plus, I love the Navy ships and aircraft carriers, too. Of course, San Diego has a lot of that same stuff, with the advantage of better weather. However, the San Diego health care and education systems have probably been swamped by the tide of illegals, given its proximity to the border.
So, all in all, Portland would be a good choice for a city to live in. Though, to repeat, I just *LOVE* visiting Seattle. If someone could live in Seattle without having to drive the freeways, it would be a fairly idyllic location. I think Oregon, as a state, has a better economy and seems 'attitudinally' superior (i.e., progressive) to most other states in many ways; whereas when I drive through the state of Washington (to get to Seattle), I see a fair number of run-down towns and ramshackle buildings. Maybe those are towns where the logging industry has taken a hit. That would explain a lot, I guess.
How about Vancouver up in Canada? Seems like a wonderful place. And Victoria on Vancouver Island? Gorgeous!
It rained the entire time; and though I generally love rain, I did start to get heartily sick of it. It never occurred to me that Portland had nine months of rain, too, just like the coast. I guess I assumed the rain and fog were more a coastal phenomenon.
Kind of. It rains a lot especially in the sense of the amount of time that rain is falling [as opposed to inches of rain] in Portland relative to other cities. But it rains an incredibly amount along the coast; a lot more on the coast than it does in Portland or other cities in the I-5 corrider. So it really is a coastal phenomenon. Portland [and Seattle] get around 30 inches of rain a year. The Northern California coast gets 60-80 inches up around Crescent City which is why you get those nice big Redwood trees. Not familiar with stats on the Oregon coast but it probably has some spots that get over 120 inches a year. If you get up into the Washington coastline there are places that get 200 inches per year. Of course at that point you start seeing resultant temperate rainforests like the Hoh, Bogachiel, Queets etc.
Seattle has bad traffic but I have yet to see a major American city that doesn't. It's maybe a shade worse than average but really aside from LA and maybe NY IMO traffic is kind of the same in any large urban area.
Colander, it's true that any big city has traffic problems, but you must admit that there are some aspects of Seattle traffic (certain highways, certain times, certain directions) that really transcend ordinary big city traffic. It's certainly possible to live in the Seattle area and mostly avoid real problems (for example, I used to live near downtown and work in Lynnwood, and the commute wasn't too bad), but it's also possible to encounter some truly horrific problems -- two hour drives from Bellevue into downtown Seattle for dinner on a Friday, that sort of thing.
I'd say LA and SF are worse, but Seattle ranks higher than it should given its size. Several bigger cities (Atlanta and Philly for example) have smaller transportation issues than Seattle, in my opinion.