Firewire isn't lost. It's still available for every model but the shuffle.
... and the new 6gb Mini iPod. I don't see this as a big problem personally, it saves Apple money only having one type of iPod interface plus USB 2.0 is more then fine for transferring music. If we we're talking about using USB for DV transfer then I would be on the roof taking out bi-planes. RROOOAAARRRR!!!!!
[B]... and the new 6gb Mini iPod. I don't see this as a big problem personally, it saves Apple money only having one type of iPod interface plus USB 2.0 is more then fine for transferring music. If we we're talking about using USB for DV transfer then I would be on the roof taking out bi-planes. RROOOAAARRRR!!!!!
The only iPods that still ship with firewire cables are the old 20 GB non-photo and 30 GB U2 ones.
USB2 is fine for transferring songs, but Firewire is better. Also don't overlook that you don't get an AC adapter anymore for the mini. So to add these to the cost of a 4GB version brings us to a round $247.
Hmmm. Not so much cheaper now than they were the day before yesterday (as you got both of these accessories included).
I appreciate Apple has given us more choice and I do welcome it. I also welcome that they are aggressively pushing the perceived value of the brand. Agreed, it will get more people to purchase, but as a Mac user who has already experienced iPod transfers, I wouldn't not want a Firewire cable. That would cost me more. That is all...
[Edit: this is not a tantrum about Apple removing the option of firewire transfer out of the box. Rather, as some have observed, it is a concern about a precedent that Apple as a company may be setting, that they are stripping back down to essentials only. I remember when a keyboard DID cost extra to buy on top of your computer purchase, but I would not want to return there...]
... and the new 6gb Mini iPod. I don't see this as a big problem personally, it saves Apple money only having one type of iPod interface plus USB 2.0 is more then fine for transferring music. If we we're talking about using USB for DV transfer then I would be on the roof taking out bi-planes. RROOOAAARRRR!!!!!
while your post was very entertaining... 6gb Mini DOES support Firewire 400
No FUD please, even though you're obviously concerned about Apple possibly dropping FireWire to please the Pee Cee lusers (not gonna happen on our watch, dammit)
while your post was very entertaining... 6gb Mini DOES support Firewire 400
No FUD please, even though you're obviously concerned about Apple possibly dropping FireWire to please the Pee Cee lusers (not gonna happen on our watch, dammit)
AARAARARARGGHGHHGHGHG
APPLE SITE;
?iPod mini lets you do more than enjoy your music. Much more. For example, you can use the included USB 2.0 cable or optional FireWire cable (sold separately) to connect iPod mini to your computer and copy files. Word documents. Keynote presentations. Excel spreadsheets. Photoshop files. You name it. After all, iPod mini has up to 6GB of hard drive space(2), and while you?ll want to reserve most of it for your music and audiobooks, you may also like to use a bit of it to tote documents, too.?
Crap your right I should check these things, I was just going off of other peoples post earlier. They must of only seen USB and not the, "FireWire cable (sold separately)" I personally don?t like the iPod because of the DRM issue with iTunes but I can understand the frustration people might have if Apple did decide to drop FireWire. Good call, thanks for straightening me out.
Crap your right I should check these things, I was just going off of other peoples post earlier. They must of only seen USB and not the, "FireWire cable (sold separately)" I personally don?t like the iPod because of the DRM issue with iTunes but I can understand the frustration people might have if Apple did decide to drop FireWire. Good call, thanks for straightening me out.
no worries, and i love FireWire too... i mean, that's one of the coolest names for a technology.. "USB".... pfft just another stupid three letter acronym...
thanks to Apple championing decent names (though i am NOT saying that they created all the standards), we go around saying
while your post was very entertaining... 6gb Mini DOES support Firewire 400
No FUD please, even though you're obviously concerned about Apple possibly dropping FireWire to please the Pee Cee lusers (not gonna happen on our watch, dammit)
AARAARARARGGHGHHGHGHG
no FUD....please stop saying that too, it's the fucking stupidest internet dork word on earth.
The first revision to the Apple iPod Mini site said USB 2 only and made no mention of firewire compatibility or option. It was quickly updated to include optional firewire connectivity.
The first revision to the Apple iPod Mini site said USB 2 only and made no mention of firewire compatibility or option. It was quickly updated to include optional firewire connectivity.
So perhaps we as Apple fans need to scale back our predisposition for kneejerk overreactions?
So perhaps we as Apple fans need to scale back our predisposition for kneejerk overreactions?
No, I was aware that the firewire cable was purchasable, but what pissed me off is that it's not in the box. That means I pay $20 more for an iPod than a Dell user would, because none of the three Macs I own users USB2. And, since USB2 is included, the price of my iPod purchase subsides the Dell users USB2 device. From a PC manufacturer, I understand this. From Apple, I don't.
Firewire isn't lost. It's still available for every model but the shuffle.
I should have been clearer, I know it is available, but not out of the box--and at an additional cost of between 5-10% of the cost of the iPod. I have to pay a premium to mac an Apple product work on my Mac.
I was glad when Apple began including USB as an option in the box. I thought it was a great move to treat the PC world as equal. But now it seem the PC is slightly more equal that the Mac.
Here's what I posted to those lunes at MDN freaking out:
Apple doesn't expect everyone to [upgrade their macs]. Got a Mac with FireWire and no USB 2.0? Simply prefer FireWire? Buy the FireWire cable. You're covered.
Apple has 2 choices here:
1) Make the majority of the iPod consumers, the people without FireWire, pay an additional $20 to downgrade their cable to make their iPod useable.
2) Make the minority of the iPod consumers, the people without USB 2.0, pay to upgrade their cable to make the iPod work as fast as possible.
Anyone with any business sense knows which choice is the correct choice.
And no, bundling the dual [USB + FireWire] cable with iPods is not an option. It's god-aweful ugly and both Ives and Jobs would find it blasphemous to bundle it with the beautiful iPod.
Here's what I posted to those lunes at MDN freaking out:
MDN jumped the shark a long long time ago. They went from being a halfway decent site to a pathetic joke 0-pathetic in 2.3 seconds flat. I'm surprised their not still riding Paul Thurrot's coattails.
Slightly more equal? Is that mathematically possible?
According to you: When Apple bundled Firewire and made USB a $20 option, it was equal.
Now that USB is bundled and Firewire is a $20 option, it's unequal?
How so?
No, I thought it was bad when they made PC users shell out $20 dollars for a USB connector. I thought it was good when both were included in the box, which is what the last generation did. That was equal, you could use either one out of the box.
Now, this has changed. USB2 is in the box and Firewire isn't. This is also bad. One, because it alienates people like me, and two, because firewire was a feature that made iPods different than other MP3 players.
The slightly more equal comment is a reference to George Orwell's animal farm. The quote is "All people are equal, some are just more equal that others."
And be honest, people, doesn't it rankle you even a little that the lead banner on the Apple store reads "PC + Mac"?
That being said, if cost is the main issue, then it seems the best solution would be drop another $19 off the price, and make both cables a separate purchase. Printers and Scanners do this. I just hate paying for a cord I won't use, then having to pay again for the cord I want.
Anyone with any business sense knows which choice is the correct choice.
If you follow that business sense to it's logical conclusion, you end up with a Dell Jukebox or some other off-brand player. Apple, to this point, has done a good job of balancing between too cheap, and chasing features at the expense of functionality. With the iPod photo replacing everything on the high end, and unbundeling the dock and firewire, I think Apple messed up on both counts.
And frankly, more people on the PC side are worried about the lack of WMA support than were worried about firewire cables adding to the cost.
And, one last thing, I am a customer--not a stockholder. This means I want Apple to be profitable, but even more I want them to produce products that meet my needs. When they don't, as a customer, I feel it is my right to complain.
When Apple drops firewire connectivity, I'll be right there with you. Until then, all they're asking you to do is shell out $20 for the cable if you perceive as a must have item. As it stands, the USB cable is a non-negotiable must have item, so it's getting bundled at this low price point.
When Apple drops firewire connectivity, I'll be right there with you. Until then, all they're asking you to do is shell out $20 for the cable if you perceive as a must have item. As it stands, the USB cable is a non-negotiable must have item, so it's getting bundled at this low price point.
Why not just keep the cables separate, then let the customer pick their cable at checkout? If you want a USB2 cable, then that's what you get. If you want a Firewire cable then that's what you get. Solves the problem for everyone, and no one feels left out.
This way, no one has to pay a 'penalty' because their preferred way of connecting was left out of the box.
Why not just keep the cables separate, then let the customer pick their cable at checkout? If you want a USB2 cable, then that's what you get. If you want a Firewire cable then that's what you get. Solves the problem for everyone, and no one feels left out.
This way, no one has to pay a 'penalty' because their preferred way of connecting was left out of the box.
sadly, as Mac users, we know the pain of being in the minority. a bit of a slap in the face that again, when it comes to iPod of all things, Mac users are the minority...
That becomes a potential stocking problem however. You don't know what stores will run through the USB cables or firewire cables first.
I support Apple's decision on this. I think it makes financial sense. The iPod is responsible for Apple actually being able to ship a $500 Mac without going into the red. Anything they can do to get the revenue and profits rising without shafting users too much is ok with me. Fact is 2 weeks ago you would have spent $249 on a mini with 10hrs less battery time and %50 less storage space for the same money. The USB cable does everything that the firewire cable does albeit a tad slower. This is such a non issue but then again Mac users have become a rather whiny lot in the last few years.
Comments
Originally posted by rageous
Firewire isn't lost. It's still available for every model but the shuffle.
... and the new 6gb Mini iPod. I don't see this as a big problem personally, it saves Apple money only having one type of iPod interface plus USB 2.0 is more then fine for transferring music. If we we're talking about using USB for DV transfer then I would be on the roof taking out bi-planes. RROOOAAARRRR!!!!!
Originally posted by Relic
[B]... and the new 6gb Mini iPod. I don't see this as a big problem personally, it saves Apple money only having one type of iPod interface plus USB 2.0 is more then fine for transferring music. If we we're talking about using USB for DV transfer then I would be on the roof taking out bi-planes. RROOOAAARRRR!!!!!
The only iPods that still ship with firewire cables are the old 20 GB non-photo and 30 GB U2 ones.
USB2 is fine for transferring songs, but Firewire is better. Also don't overlook that you don't get an AC adapter anymore for the mini. So to add these to the cost of a 4GB version brings us to a round $247.
Hmmm. Not so much cheaper now than they were the day before yesterday (as you got both of these accessories included).
I appreciate Apple has given us more choice and I do welcome it. I also welcome that they are aggressively pushing the perceived value of the brand. Agreed, it will get more people to purchase, but as a Mac user who has already experienced iPod transfers, I wouldn't not want a Firewire cable. That would cost me more. That is all...
[Edit: this is not a tantrum about Apple removing the option of firewire transfer out of the box. Rather, as some have observed, it is a concern about a precedent that Apple as a company may be setting, that they are stripping back down to essentials only. I remember when a keyboard DID cost extra to buy on top of your computer purchase, but I would not want to return there...]
Originally posted by Relic
... and the new 6gb Mini iPod. I don't see this as a big problem personally, it saves Apple money only having one type of iPod interface plus USB 2.0 is more then fine for transferring music. If we we're talking about using USB for DV transfer then I would be on the roof taking out bi-planes. RROOOAAARRRR!!!!!
while your post was very entertaining... 6gb Mini DOES support Firewire 400
No FUD please, even though you're obviously concerned about Apple possibly dropping FireWire to please the Pee Cee lusers (not gonna happen on our watch, dammit)
AARAARARARGGHGHHGHGHG
Originally posted by sunilraman
while your post was very entertaining... 6gb Mini DOES support Firewire 400
No FUD please, even though you're obviously concerned about Apple possibly dropping FireWire to please the Pee Cee lusers (not gonna happen on our watch, dammit)
AARAARARARGGHGHHGHGHG
APPLE SITE;
?iPod mini lets you do more than enjoy your music. Much more. For example, you can use the included USB 2.0 cable or optional FireWire cable (sold separately) to connect iPod mini to your computer and copy files. Word documents. Keynote presentations. Excel spreadsheets. Photoshop files. You name it. After all, iPod mini has up to 6GB of hard drive space(2), and while you?ll want to reserve most of it for your music and audiobooks, you may also like to use a bit of it to tote documents, too.?
Crap your right I should check these things, I was just going off of other peoples post earlier. They must of only seen USB and not the, "FireWire cable (sold separately)" I personally don?t like the iPod because of the DRM issue with iTunes but I can understand the frustration people might have if Apple did decide to drop FireWire. Good call, thanks for straightening me out.
Originally posted by Relic
Crap your right I should check these things, I was just going off of other peoples post earlier. They must of only seen USB and not the, "FireWire cable (sold separately)" I personally don?t like the iPod because of the DRM issue with iTunes but I can understand the frustration people might have if Apple did decide to drop FireWire. Good call, thanks for straightening me out.
no worries, and i love FireWire too... i mean, that's one of the coolest names for a technology.. "USB".... pfft just another stupid three letter acronym...
thanks to Apple championing decent names (though i am NOT saying that they created all the standards), we go around saying
FireWire ...not IEEE3934 or whatever
AirPort ..not 802.11 etc
and...
Bonjour
bwah ha ha ha ah ha hahhhhahh hahh a
Originally posted by sunilraman
while your post was very entertaining... 6gb Mini DOES support Firewire 400
No FUD please, even though you're obviously concerned about Apple possibly dropping FireWire to please the Pee Cee lusers (not gonna happen on our watch, dammit)
AARAARARARGGHGHHGHGHG
no FUD....please stop saying that too, it's the fucking stupidest internet dork word on earth.
The first revision to the Apple iPod Mini site said USB 2 only and made no mention of firewire compatibility or option. It was quickly updated to include optional firewire connectivity.
The first revision to the Apple iPod Mini site said USB 2 only and made no mention of firewire compatibility or option. It was quickly updated to include optional firewire connectivity.
So perhaps we as Apple fans need to scale back our predisposition for kneejerk overreactions?
Originally posted by rageous
So perhaps we as Apple fans need to scale back our predisposition for kneejerk overreactions?
No, I was aware that the firewire cable was purchasable, but what pissed me off is that it's not in the box. That means I pay $20 more for an iPod than a Dell user would, because none of the three Macs I own users USB2. And, since USB2 is included, the price of my iPod purchase subsides the Dell users USB2 device. From a PC manufacturer, I understand this. From Apple, I don't.
Originally posted by rageous
Firewire isn't lost. It's still available for every model but the shuffle.
I should have been clearer, I know it is available, but not out of the box--and at an additional cost of between 5-10% of the cost of the iPod. I have to pay a premium to mac an Apple product work on my Mac.
I was glad when Apple began including USB as an option in the box. I thought it was a great move to treat the PC world as equal. But now it seem the PC is slightly more equal that the Mac.
According to you: When Apple bundled Firewire and made USB a $20 option, it was equal.
Now that USB is bundled and Firewire is a $20 option, it's unequal?
How so?
Apple doesn't expect everyone to [upgrade their macs]. Got a Mac with FireWire and no USB 2.0? Simply prefer FireWire? Buy the FireWire cable. You're covered.
Apple has 2 choices here:
1) Make the majority of the iPod consumers, the people without FireWire, pay an additional $20 to downgrade their cable to make their iPod useable.
2) Make the minority of the iPod consumers, the people without USB 2.0, pay to upgrade their cable to make the iPod work as fast as possible.
Anyone with any business sense knows which choice is the correct choice.
And no, bundling the dual [USB + FireWire] cable with iPods is not an option. It's god-aweful ugly and both Ives and Jobs would find it blasphemous to bundle it with the beautiful iPod.
Here's what I posted to those lunes at MDN freaking out:
MDN jumped the shark a long long time ago. They went from being a halfway decent site to a pathetic joke 0-pathetic in 2.3 seconds flat. I'm surprised their not still riding Paul Thurrot's coattails.
Originally posted by rageous
Slightly more equal? Is that mathematically possible?
According to you: When Apple bundled Firewire and made USB a $20 option, it was equal.
Now that USB is bundled and Firewire is a $20 option, it's unequal?
How so?
No, I thought it was bad when they made PC users shell out $20 dollars for a USB connector. I thought it was good when both were included in the box, which is what the last generation did. That was equal, you could use either one out of the box.
Now, this has changed. USB2 is in the box and Firewire isn't. This is also bad. One, because it alienates people like me, and two, because firewire was a feature that made iPods different than other MP3 players.
The slightly more equal comment is a reference to George Orwell's animal farm. The quote is "All people are equal, some are just more equal that others."
And be honest, people, doesn't it rankle you even a little that the lead banner on the Apple store reads "PC + Mac"?
That being said, if cost is the main issue, then it seems the best solution would be drop another $19 off the price, and make both cables a separate purchase. Printers and Scanners do this. I just hate paying for a cord I won't use, then having to pay again for the cord I want.
Originally posted by rageous
Anyone with any business sense knows which choice is the correct choice.
If you follow that business sense to it's logical conclusion, you end up with a Dell Jukebox or some other off-brand player. Apple, to this point, has done a good job of balancing between too cheap, and chasing features at the expense of functionality. With the iPod photo replacing everything on the high end, and unbundeling the dock and firewire, I think Apple messed up on both counts.
And frankly, more people on the PC side are worried about the lack of WMA support than were worried about firewire cables adding to the cost.
And, one last thing, I am a customer--not a stockholder. This means I want Apple to be profitable, but even more I want them to produce products that meet my needs. When they don't, as a customer, I feel it is my right to complain.
Originally posted by applenut
no FUD....please stop saying that too, it's the fucking stupidest internet dork word on earth.
Somebody needs a timeout.
Originally posted by rageous
When Apple drops firewire connectivity, I'll be right there with you. Until then, all they're asking you to do is shell out $20 for the cable if you perceive as a must have item. As it stands, the USB cable is a non-negotiable must have item, so it's getting bundled at this low price point.
Why not just keep the cables separate, then let the customer pick their cable at checkout? If you want a USB2 cable, then that's what you get. If you want a Firewire cable then that's what you get. Solves the problem for everyone, and no one feels left out.
This way, no one has to pay a 'penalty' because their preferred way of connecting was left out of the box.
Originally posted by PBG4 Dude
Why not just keep the cables separate, then let the customer pick their cable at checkout? If you want a USB2 cable, then that's what you get. If you want a Firewire cable then that's what you get. Solves the problem for everyone, and no one feels left out.
This way, no one has to pay a 'penalty' because their preferred way of connecting was left out of the box.
sadly, as Mac users, we know the pain of being in the minority. a bit of a slap in the face that again, when it comes to iPod of all things, Mac users are the minority...
minorities usually end up paying this 'penalty'
I support Apple's decision on this. I think it makes financial sense. The iPod is responsible for Apple actually being able to ship a $500 Mac without going into the red. Anything they can do to get the revenue and profits rising without shafting users too much is ok with me. Fact is 2 weeks ago you would have spent $249 on a mini with 10hrs less battery time and %50 less storage space for the same money. The USB cable does everything that the firewire cable does albeit a tad slower. This is such a non issue but then again Mac users have become a rather whiny lot in the last few years.