Windows vs OS X
For two weeks I have no Mac. My PowerBook catch was faulty so Apple are kindly replacing it. Unfortunately due to delivery etc. I'm not gettign the new one for two weeks, my PowerBook went today! :-(
Anyway the point of tbis thread is for me to highlight the missing features of XP on a user used to sign OS X almost exclusively. My knowledge of XP is excellent, none the less.
Redraw rates
I'm using a 2.25GHz Pentium 4 with 256 MB RAM (yes I know - it belongs to my Dad) and 64MB nVidia GeForce 4Ti. However, I minimize a window to the task bar and then refresh it later. It takes ages to appear, redrawing is awful. Why is Windows so bad at this. My 600MHz G3 iMac whips this computer in every way - apart from CS work.
Lack of feedback
When you click an icon in the dock it eithe bounces or has an arrow flashing, depending on one's preferences. I know the App is opening and I'm happy. In XP I click on iTunes, Firefox or whatever. Not only do they take an age to open but there's no feedback. The clock sometimes appears but it's really frustrating, waiting and not knowing if you should press the app. If they were quicker at opening they wouldn't need the feedback but they're not. I always end up with 10 firefox windows or 5 word documents.
Also Windows is very slow at opening apps, even simple dialogue boxes take an age.
Expose
For somebody in the past who has said that expose wasn't that useful it's the feature I miss most when using XP. If I want to see another app while the computer is waiting it's a pain with the redraws etc. but also you can't check on all your apps at once. Expose is difficult to live without.
logging on
Why once I've logged on does the clock appear for two minutes or longer - I can't do anything aaaaaaaaahhhhhhhhhhh.
full screen
Apps are designed for full screen which is stupid it you want to glance at other windows. Although changing window sizes is fast under XP they have the file menu on every window which is just shit and you waste so much space with the borders of windows so you can't see more content.
however,
In CS the right click command has an immediate response, which is so much faster than my 1.67GHz G4. Maybe ist's the rendering of the transparent menus or something but right click they've manged to do right. Menus though can take an age and sometimes can be as snappy.
Also Firefox has nicked some Mac features which it hasn't included on it's own Mac version! The up and down arrows used to go to the end of a document or the beginning doesn't exist on windows but ti's there in MSN and Firefox. But not there on Firefox for the Mac.
What I've really noticed is the PC varies a lot with speed. Typing is instantaneous no matter how many ads are in the window, so is right clicking but the opening times of apps and other performances such as redraw really lag when compared to a Mac. It's probably unfair to compare a 1.67Ghz G4 to a Pentium 4 especially when I have four times the RAM and double the graphics. BUT my iMac G3 600MHz can outperform all processes and actions except the obvious CPU heavy tasks.
Before anyone replies there's something wrong with your PC, I've noticed this on all XP boxes. There's something not quite right. Anyway I hope this helps the switchers out there and makes the Mac faithful feel good inside.
Anyway the point of tbis thread is for me to highlight the missing features of XP on a user used to sign OS X almost exclusively. My knowledge of XP is excellent, none the less.
Redraw rates
I'm using a 2.25GHz Pentium 4 with 256 MB RAM (yes I know - it belongs to my Dad) and 64MB nVidia GeForce 4Ti. However, I minimize a window to the task bar and then refresh it later. It takes ages to appear, redrawing is awful. Why is Windows so bad at this. My 600MHz G3 iMac whips this computer in every way - apart from CS work.
Lack of feedback
When you click an icon in the dock it eithe bounces or has an arrow flashing, depending on one's preferences. I know the App is opening and I'm happy. In XP I click on iTunes, Firefox or whatever. Not only do they take an age to open but there's no feedback. The clock sometimes appears but it's really frustrating, waiting and not knowing if you should press the app. If they were quicker at opening they wouldn't need the feedback but they're not. I always end up with 10 firefox windows or 5 word documents.
Also Windows is very slow at opening apps, even simple dialogue boxes take an age.
Expose
For somebody in the past who has said that expose wasn't that useful it's the feature I miss most when using XP. If I want to see another app while the computer is waiting it's a pain with the redraws etc. but also you can't check on all your apps at once. Expose is difficult to live without.
logging on
Why once I've logged on does the clock appear for two minutes or longer - I can't do anything aaaaaaaaahhhhhhhhhhh.
full screen
Apps are designed for full screen which is stupid it you want to glance at other windows. Although changing window sizes is fast under XP they have the file menu on every window which is just shit and you waste so much space with the borders of windows so you can't see more content.
however,
In CS the right click command has an immediate response, which is so much faster than my 1.67GHz G4. Maybe ist's the rendering of the transparent menus or something but right click they've manged to do right. Menus though can take an age and sometimes can be as snappy.
Also Firefox has nicked some Mac features which it hasn't included on it's own Mac version! The up and down arrows used to go to the end of a document or the beginning doesn't exist on windows but ti's there in MSN and Firefox. But not there on Firefox for the Mac.
What I've really noticed is the PC varies a lot with speed. Typing is instantaneous no matter how many ads are in the window, so is right clicking but the opening times of apps and other performances such as redraw really lag when compared to a Mac. It's probably unfair to compare a 1.67Ghz G4 to a Pentium 4 especially when I have four times the RAM and double the graphics. BUT my iMac G3 600MHz can outperform all processes and actions except the obvious CPU heavy tasks.
Before anyone replies there's something wrong with your PC, I've noticed this on all XP boxes. There's something not quite right. Anyway I hope this helps the switchers out there and makes the Mac faithful feel good inside.
Comments
Originally posted by MacCrazy
Lack of feedback
When you click an icon in the dock it eithe bounces or has an arrow flashing, depending on one's preferences. I know the App is opening and I'm happy. In XP I click on iTunes, Firefox or whatever. Not only do they take an age to open but there's no feedback. The clock sometimes appears but it's really frustrating, waiting and not knowing if you should press the app. If they were quicker at opening they wouldn't need the feedback but they're not. I always end up with 10 firefox windows or 5 word documents.
That is the biggest hate of Windows for me. Not only does it not tell me what is and isn't running/launching, but it also lacks the option to keep an app open while closing its windows. Bad, bad, bad.
Originally posted by MacCrazy
Before anyone replies there's something wrong with your PC, I've noticed this on all XP boxes.
Indeed, there is something wrong there. It is perhaps the memory (too little), something with the installation, or some background process eating up CPU.
Originally posted by PB
Indeed, there is something wrong there. It is perhaps the memory (too little), something with the installation, or some background process eating up CPU.
well there is something wrong with the Palm installation (i've told my dad to sort it) but any PC I've used that's been used for a few months is so slow! It has got too few RAM as well. But most of the points I make are complaints about windows and the way it works. The feedback issue is the biggest problem. You don't know if it's doing something or not!
Edit: The point is on Mac OS X I can have an installation running in the background and re-draws are fine, in Windows you cannot do this. I've NEVER had a probelm with redraws on a Mac. Look at the recent Doom 3 results for the Mac - yes the mac doesn't do as well. But the Mac can run the game almost without penalty in a window - Windows cannot do this.
Originally posted by Placebo
but it also lacks the option to keep an app open while closing its windows. Bad, bad, bad.
That is awful, although apple has adopted this for iLife (except iTunes) which really annoys me, if you close a movie it quite iMovie - no I want a new document! Although it's so quick to open but that's not the point. Feedback is so important and that's Windows' biggest downfall.
Originally posted by MacCrazy
Before anyone replies there's something wrong with your PC, I've noticed this on all XP boxes. There's something not quite right. Anyway I hope this helps the switchers out there and makes the Mac faithful feel good inside.
Sounds like either your windows box has spyware, or you have way more running than 256 can handle: which isnt much in Windows XP, go to Blackvipers web site and use the table to de-bloat your windows box, also turn off the window effects:
press "windows key"+pause/break key to access system properties
click advanced tab
in the preformance frame click settings
Turn off all effects.
This makes a huge differance in redraw.
Originally posted by a_greer
Sounds like either your windows box has spyware, or you have way more running than 256 can handle: which isnt much in Windows XP, go to Blackvipers web site and use the table to de-bloat your windows box, also turn off the window effects:
press "windows key"+pause/break key to access system properties
click advanced tab
in the preformance frame click settings
Turn off all effects.
This makes a huge differance in redraw.
they were all of a while ago and I didn;t notice much difference. I like animations to some extent as they give the user fewedback. Expose without animations would be useless. I'm not trying to fix the PC I'm trying to demonstrate the limitations of XP!
Thank you for your help though.
No spyware
Originally posted by MacCrazy
Expose without animations would be useless.
As for the limitations of XP, there really are none. And that is bad because then you could really have a non-working computer really fast. There are some really cool things you can do with both operating systems and I do like them both. But for me, XP is for gaming and OS X is for everything else.
And Expose is the greatest invention invented by an inventor as of now.
Originally posted by MacCrazy
Redraw rates
I'm using a 2.25GHz Pentium 4 with 256 MB RAM (yes I know - it belongs to my Dad) and 64MB nVidia GeForce 4Ti. However, I minimize a window to the task bar and then refresh it later. It takes ages to appear, redrawing is awful. Why is Windows so bad at this. My 600MHz G3 iMac whips this computer in every way - apart from CS work.
I've noticed this as well. Even on a fast machine with 768MB of RAM. Just the other day I had two apps open: AIM and Firefox. I minimized Firefox for a while and continued chatting. When I went to restore Firefox from the taskbar, I swear it took over 10 seconds to redraw that friggin window, with the hard drive churning constantly. And no, there is no spyware on this machine.
Originally posted by Borborygmi
I've noticed this as well. Even on a fast machine with 768MB of RAM. Just the other day I had two apps open: AIM and Firefox. I minimized Firefox for a while and continued chatting. When I went to restore Firefox from the taskbar, I swear it took over 10 seconds to redraw that friggin window, with the hard drive churning constantly. And no, there is no spyware on this machine.
exactly, windows saucks. I've NEVER known and Mac OS to have redraw issues with anything!
Originally posted by MacCrazy
exactly, windows saucks. I've NEVER known and Mac OS to have redraw issues with anything!
People still use Windows, I thought that fad went out years ago.
Originally posted by Borborygmi
I've noticed this as well. Even on a fast machine with 768MB of RAM. Just the other day I had two apps open: AIM and Firefox. I minimized Firefox for a while and continued chatting. When I went to restore Firefox from the taskbar, I swear it took over 10 seconds to redraw that friggin window, with the hard drive churning constantly. And no, there is no spyware on this machine.
I have a 1Gb relatively slow machine(AMD 2.4gh) running Win2003 Standard edition with 2 Visual Studio instances, firefox, 2 vmwares - one running XP & the other NetBSD, Outlook, ultra edit and Perforce. Windows retore just fine. Maybe you got a bunch of spyware?
Firefox leaks memory. I just closed it. It was consuming 80mb. Reopened it, exact same tabs as before and consuming 28mb. Whenever I leave it open overnight i find mem usage up to 120mb.
What really bugs me about windows is that although you may thing you only have 2 apps open, in reality you've got a bunch of services, daemons in Unix speak, taking up resources. I turn off as many as I can without losing basic functionality. I prefer my UNIX boxes - I can really strip a BSD box down to the bare minimum of running processes and know exactly whats running and why.
Originally posted by Relic
People still use Windows, I thought that fad went out years ago.
Since when have games become a fad?
People love to play games - they need Windows for that. They also get spyware too, but that's another issue...
Originally posted by UnixPoet
Since when have games become a fad?
People love to play games - they need Windows for that. They also get spyware too, but that's another issue...
Thank you Captain Obvious! With a name like UnixPoet I thought you?d be the last person to rebuke my obviously sarcastic post. Next time I?ll add one of these ?
Originally posted by Relic
Thank you Captain Obvious! With a name like UnixPoet I thought you?d be the last person to rebuke my obviously sarcastic post. Next time I?ll add one of these ?
i liked your comment! There is no spyware on this machine. It only does it when a couple of apps are open. I just have forgotten how bad windows was that's all. Uisng it more has become irritating again.
Redraw rates
I'm using a 2.25GHz Pentium 4 with 256 MB RAM (yes I know - it belongs to my Dad) and 64MB nVidia GeForce 4Ti. However, I minimize a window to the task bar and then refresh it later. It takes ages to appear, redrawing is awful. Why is Windows so bad at this. My 600MHz G3 iMac whips this computer in every way - apart from CS work.
Funny, I think Mac OS is weaker with redrawing, and redrawing speed than Windows. In Windows, everything is drawn quite fast, snappy. In MacOS, I often see pauses, and window resizing is dogslow. So, I experienced the opposite on several Mac/Windows computers.
Lack of feedback
When you click an icon in the dock it eithe bounces or has an arrow flashing, depending on one's preferences. I know the App is opening and I'm happy. In XP I click on iTunes, Firefox or whatever. Not only do they take an age to open but there's no feedback. The clock sometimes appears but it's really frustrating, waiting and not knowing if you should press the app. If they were quicker at opening they wouldn't need the feedback but they're not. I always end up with 10 firefox windows or 5 word documents.
Also Windows is very slow at opening apps, even simple dialogue boxes take an age.
Ages to open? On my Windows machine, apps open much, much faster than on any Mac I ever worked on.
Windows taskbar gives feedback very well. Yes, it doesn't bounce, but it does get a blue background color.
"The clock sometimes appears?" What are you doing with your PC computer? Did you install 8 megabytes internal memory?
Jesus, is this another biased "I love Mac Windows Sucks" post? I use both platforms, but I hate this kind of posts.
Expose
For somebody in the past who has said that expose wasn't that useful it's the feature I miss most when using XP. If I want to see another app while the computer is waiting it's a pain with the redraws etc. but also you can't check on all your apps at once. Expose is difficult to live without.
Expose is handy, but it lacks a few things.
On Windows, i press the "Show desktop" icon on my computer, and every Window is hidden. Very handy, and without the annoying zoom/move animation Expose shows (looks cool, but I'm using the computer, not presenting a nice slide show with effects).
On OSX, the desktop is shown when you open an application. on Windows, the application opens a grey canvas. This helps the user focus on what is open at the time. If you maximize the Windows, it *is* Maximized! (not the "maximize" on OSX which works differently on each application, talking about inconsistency!) Because of this, Windows doesn't need the Expose function that "dims the desktop but not the active application".
What I am trying to say here is NOT that I find XP better, I am trying to say that your experience is just YOUR experience, which is quite different than mine. So, what does your forum post benefit to the community, teach us, if you simply say "XP sucks, OSX rules" like I did, but in the opposite? Your forum post is pointless!
logging on
Why once I've logged on does the clock appear for two minutes or longer - I can't do anything aaaaaaaaahhhhhhhhhhh.
It takes max. 10 seconds on my computer.
It's time you install a virus scanner, a firewall and an anti-ad tool. Yes, that is a drawback of the #1 OS in the world. If MacOS would be the #1, you had to install that software on OSX too.
full screen
Apps are designed for full screen which is stupid it you want to glance at other windows. Although changing window sizes is fast under XP they have the file menu on every window which is just shit and you waste so much space with the borders of windows so you can't see more content.
however,
In CS the right click command has an immediate response, which is so much faster than my 1.67GHz G4. Maybe ist's the rendering of the transparent menus or something but right click they've manged to do right. Menus though can take an age and sometimes can be as snappy.
Agreed. I think/hope that Tiger will bring lots of good Quartz 2D extreme stuff (= a huge improvement in GUI speed).
What I've really noticed is the PC varies a lot with speed. Typing is instantaneous no matter how many ads are in the window, so is right clicking but the opening times of apps and other performances such as redraw really lag when compared to a Mac. It's probably unfair to compare a 1.67Ghz G4 to a Pentium 4 especially when I have four times the RAM and double the graphics. BUT my iMac G3 600MHz can outperform all processes and actions except the obvious CPU heavy tasks.
I think OSX is responsible for the GUI "lag". I find it rediculous and totally unacceptable that BeOS runs smooth on an old computer and looks cool, and that OSX (which looks even cooler) feels so slow.
Before anyone replies there's something wrong with your PC, I've noticed this on all XP boxes. There's something not quite right. Anyway I hope this helps the switchers out there and makes the Mac faithful feel good inside.
Again, I never experienced those things on all the PC's I worked on.
Wow. Nice "switch" post. What did you think? "Hey let's say a lot of bad things about the PC, and add some positive things in the end to make it sound more realistic"?
Is this post to "help switchers out there etc"?
Most PC users won't switch! I think the "switch" idea is bullocks. PC users will perhaps use 2 OSses and go "cross-platform", but they will never toss away their PC's, or stop using them.
I'm using a 2.25GHz Pentium 4 with 256 MB RAM (yes I know - it belongs to my Dad) and 64MB nVidia GeForce 4Ti. However, I minimize a window to the task bar and then refresh it later. It takes ages to appear, redrawing is awful. Why is Windows so bad at this. My 600MHz G3 iMac whips this computer in every way - apart from CS work.
My 750 MHz Duron PC running Windows 2000 bogs down in the same manner under load, and so does my friend's new Dimension 3000 with Windows XP. We both have 256 MB of RAM. The year-old Pentium 4 computers I use at school, running Windows XP, perform much better under load. They have 512 MB of RAM. This suggests to me that there's nothing specifically wrong with Windows XP, and that a lack of available RAM is the cause.