Apple pressured to raise iTunes pricing in 2006

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Comments

  • Reply 21 of 54
    rokrok Posts: 3,519member
    Quote:

    Originally posted by syklee26

    and I never had problem with copy-protected CDs as of yet. Maybe because I encode it with Apple Lossless?



    this is just a guess, and i'm not that informed on drm, but i do know the history of companies that try to make new technologies that limit play, they usually gear towards the windows-using market, and our minoruty tends to work in our benefit. in other words, they can't find anyone who knows enough about the mac os to really inflict it upon us.



    however, this has been changing since 2000, with the underbelly of mac os x being more exposed.



    but hey, if you really want to get around cd protection, if your computer can boot into classic, like mine can, do that and fire up an old version of ituens and THEN rip the cd. no one is making drm to stop classic users anymore,and with the clasic environment frozen at 9.2.2 until the end of time, there's a lot to love about having an dol-school environment kicking around your network somewhere.



    8)
  • Reply 22 of 54
    Outside of literally one or two bands I buy all of my songs over the iTunes music service. I spend a considerable amount on music coming in fits and spurts and found a good number of songs, in many different genres, that I either wouldn't have found or tried out otherwise.



    If the price goes up, while I love the service, I just won't be buying as much music if at all anymore.



    It comes down to one word plain and simple. Greed. That's all the music industry is because lord knows they don't have an ear for much of the talent out there. Apple managed to do something none of them did or could have done and now they want a piece of the pie so to speak.



    And this whole thing about needing other formats and not being able to play the songs on other players is just too damn bad in my eyes. The shuffles are cheap enough and people can spend one extra week to save another $10 on the player. Apple really needs to shove it to these companies. I've never had a problem with iTunes, the service, and for the most part my iPod.



    It just all comes down to the almight dollar and greed and I hope Apple shoves it to them even more. Because ultimately any band not on the service is going to lose sales. Being a designer I also KNOW for a fact that many many bands don't get paid and the companies squelsh on the contracts but the bands can hardly do a thing about it. Yet this is allowed and is perfectly fine.
  • Reply 23 of 54
    skatmanskatman Posts: 609member
    Quote:

    It just all comes down to the almight dollar and greed and I hope Apple shoves it to them even more. Because ultimately any band not on the service is going to lose sales. Being a designer I also KNOW for a fact that many many bands don't get paid and the companies squelsh on the contracts but the bands can hardly do a thing about it. Yet this is allowed and is perfectly fine.



    This is why I'm not planning on buying any songs in the near future. They want my money, they better start listening to what I want.

    Otherwise, I get it from alternate sources.
  • Reply 24 of 54
    cosmonutcosmonut Posts: 4,872member
    Remember that you all are informed, critical-thinking consumers. If the RIAA raises the price of a song to, say, $1.09, the average iTMS user will grumble for a little while and maybe stop buying songs for a few days...and then go back to their old habits. Within a couple months it'll be like nothing changed, and the RIAA will be happy.



    Look at gas prices. People griped and moaned when they topped $2 and everyone said they'd boycott. Are people still complaining that gas is still above $2? Are people REALLY buying less gas now?



    Higher prices on iTMS are coming. You will complain. Nothing will really change.
  • Reply 25 of 54
    rokrok Posts: 3,519member
    Quote:

    Originally posted by CosmoNut

    Look at gas prices. People griped and moaned when they topped $2 and everyone said they'd boycott. Are people still complaining that gas is still above $2? Are people REALLY buying less gas now?



    well, i see what you're trying to say, but gas is damn-near necessary for living (which is a thread unto itself), so when the price goes up, we can complain all we want, but i can't telecommute, so i have to suck it up.



    adding a few cents here and there will push some people back into the p2p arena, and the riaa can sue all they want, but p2p is a pandora's box that cannot be shut completely anymore. the only way to kill it is to offer a better alternative for the target market/violators, and the itms does a halfway decent job of that.
  • Reply 26 of 54
    sunilramansunilraman Posts: 8,133member
    Quote:

    Originally posted by CosmoNut

    Remember that you all are informed, critical-thinking consumers. If the RIAA raises the price of a song to, say, $1.09, the average iTMS user will grumble for a little while and maybe stop buying songs for a few days...and then go back to their old habits......



    i was going to make some comment about inflation. but inflation is about 2-3% per year in general in most places.



    a 10 cent increase may not be much but it is actually an almost 10% increase in price. bad record companies! *spank*
  • Reply 27 of 54
    aegisdesignaegisdesign Posts: 2,914member
    The copy protection on much of these 'CD's is incompatible with the iPod because Windows users that don't know any better stick them in their computers and they automatically run a program to only allow access to DRM'd WMA encoded versions of the songs stored on the CD and not to the normal audio tracks.



    It's entirely wrong of the record companies to blame Apple for the CDs not being iPod compatible as it's the record companies that have inflicted this kind of 'protection' on it's customers, not Apple.



    There's a simple way around it though - switch off autorun in Windows or hold shift down when you insert the CD. And don't let them anywhere near Windows Media Player. They'll be able to then play the higher quality CD audio tracks and rip them anyway they want.



    This is also why us Mac users can rip almost any CD since they almost all rely on running a Windows only program.



    The ipodnn.com article referenced states...



    "The protection scheme prevents users from importing music onto iPods because Apple's Fairplay DRM software is incompatible with Windows."



    ...which is frankly nonsense and ipodnn.com should have stated so. Apple's Fairplay DRM software is NOT incompatible with Windows as iTunes and iTMS running on Windows plainly proves. What is incompatible here is that the record companies have chosen a DRM scheme that is incompatible with iTunes and incompatible with Macs and non-Windows computers that renders their protection useless.
  • Reply 28 of 54
    amac4meamac4me Posts: 282member
    A marginal increase in price will not cause people to move away from iTunes. Either way, Apple's goal for iTunes is to sell iPods which in turn is to get people to purchase a Mac.
  • Reply 29 of 54
    sunilramansunilraman Posts: 8,133member
    Quote:

    Originally posted by aegisdesign

    The copy protection on much of these 'CD's is incompatible with the iPod because Windows users that don't know any better stick them in their computers and they automatically run a program to only allow access to DRM'd WMA encoded versions of the songs stored on the CD and not to the normal audio tracks.



    It's entirely wrong of the record companies to blame Apple for the CDs not being iPod compatible as it's the record companies that have inflicted this kind of 'protection' on it's customers, not Apple.



    There's a simple way around it though - switch off autorun in Windows or hold shift down when you insert the CD. And don't let them anywhere near Windows Media Player. They'll be able to then play the higher quality CD audio tracks and rip them anyway they want.



    This is also why us Mac users can rip almost any CD since they almost all rely on running a Windows only program.



    The ipodnn.com article referenced states...



    "The protection scheme prevents users from importing music onto iPods because Apple's Fairplay DRM software is incompatible with Windows."



    ...which is frankly nonsense and ipodnn.com should have stated so. Apple's Fairplay DRM software is NOT incompatible with Windows as iTunes and iTMS running on Windows plainly proves. What is incompatible here is that the record companies have chosen a DRM scheme that is incompatible with iTunes and incompatible with Macs and non-Windows computers that renders their protection useless.






    good on ya aegisdesign for clearing this up. gawd the average consumer is a dumbass. (me included now and then)



    it really upsets me. this is their friggin copy protection? autorun to force people to download the drm .wma files? while the audio tracks are still there? this is the most retarded copy protection idea i have ever seen, since the "javascript-windows-update-genuine-check" thing that was "cracked" in 24 hours
  • Reply 30 of 54
    aegisdesignaegisdesign Posts: 2,914member
    Yeah, look at the "I'm a dumbass" explanation that Suncomm, the people who supply the copy protection placed on their website claiming Apple are the bad guys...



    http://www.sunncomm.com/support/sonybmg/





    It even provides a link you can click on to implore Apple to support Suncomm's DRM. ie. They want Apple to support Windows Media 10 'Janus' DRM.



    There's an in-depth analysis of this scheme at http://www.cs.princeton.edu/~jhalderm/cd3/
  • Reply 31 of 54
    cosmonutcosmonut Posts: 4,872member
    If this story is indeed true, it sounds like the RIAA is trying to squeeze out the concept of "fair use." Taking your songs off the CD and putting them on an iPod is NO DIFFERENT than making a copy of the CD to cassette and playing the tape in your Walkman.



    But then again, I'm preaching to the converted here.
  • Reply 32 of 54
    brussellbrussell Posts: 9,812member
    What's the deal with the Japanese stores "two-tiered" system?
  • Reply 33 of 54
    sunilramansunilraman Posts: 8,133member
    Quote:

    Originally posted by aegisdesign

    .......There's an in-depth analysis of this scheme at http://www.cs.princeton.edu/~jhalderm/cd3/







    heh..........................

    "The PMTC [Professional Media Test Center] determined that none of the ripper programs used in the testing process was able to produce a usable unauthorized copy of the protected CD yielding a verifiable and commendable level of security for the SunnComm product."

    WTF?



    is it just my paranoia or is it just so convenient that this PMTC

    http://www.pimc.be/

    has its bank account details listed on the MAIN front page of it's website



    making money off suckers, well, i guess where would we be without the gullible public



    .................................
  • Reply 34 of 54
    sunilramansunilraman Posts: 8,133member
    Quote:

    Originally posted by aegisdesign

    Yeah, look at the "I'm a dumbass" explanation that Suncomm, the people who supply the copy protection placed on their website claiming Apple are the bad guys...



    http://www.sunncomm.com/support/sonybmg/



    It even provides a link you can click on to implore Apple to support Suncomm's DRM. ie. They want Apple to support Windows Media 10 'Janus' DRM......






    "Can I transfer MediaMax digital audio files to my iPod?

    Apple's proprietary technology doesn't support secure music formats other than their own, and therefore the secure music file formats on this disc can't be directly imported into iTunes or iPods.



    While these discs aren't currently compatible with iTunes or iPod, we are actively working on an acceptable solution, and have reached out to Apple in hopes of addressing this issue. To help speed this effort, we ask that you use the following link to contact Apple and ask them to provide a solution that would easily allow you to move content from protected CDs into iTunes or onto your iPod: http://www.apple.com/feedback/ipod.html



    Even though there is no direct support on the disc for iTunes or iPod, SONY BMG has worked out a way for consumers to move content into these environments, despite the challenges noted above. If you'd like more information on how to move content to iTunes please CLICK HERE."






    Okay, so Apple's "proprietary technology" (ripping standard audio cds to non-drm'ed open codec such as AAC) doesn't support secure music formats (such as suncomms piece of shit) and therefore the secure music file formats can't be directly imported.... etc.



    Okay, so SONY BMG has come to the rescue and "worked out a way to move content, despite the challenges noted above (caused by suncomm and SONY BMG and microsoft not APPLE)





    "......and have reached out to Apple in hopes of addressing this issue. To help speed this effort, we ask that you use the following link to contact Apple and ask them to provide a solution that would easily allow you to move content from protected CDs into iTunes or onto your iPod"



    the poor recording music industry... oh dear... oh they have 'reached out' to the evil iPod corporate dark empire of apple.





    "[ask apple to provide].... a solution that would easily allow you to move content from protected CDs into iTunes or onto your iPod"



    hmmm.... how about we STOP FUCKING BUYING YOUR EXPENSIVE BULLSHIT ASS DINOSAUR RECORDING INDUSTRY PLASTIC, hmm... let's see, does apple have a way to move protected music content from iTunes to the iPod easily? hmm.... what is it? OMFG IT IS iTMS WHICH YOU ARE NOT SUPPORTING. MOTHAFUCKERS.



    i'm so mad right now i'm getting incoherent.



    if i didn't know more about the structure of sony's different divisions i would fucking throw my brand new beautiful sony 17" lcd out the window. but it's sooooo pretty....



    the content industry dinosaurs are gonna get what's coming to them. this sort of nonsense.... sheesh



    okay, there, i got it off my chest
  • Reply 35 of 54
    aegisdesignaegisdesign Posts: 2,914member
    The funny thing is, the suncomm protection actually stops you ripping a Sony-BMG CD to many of the Sony minidisks and network walkmans since they only support ATRAC and won't re-rip the M$ DRM.



    Sony's divisions must have some massive communication problems if they can't even get their media divisions to talk to their electronics divisions. Still, could be worse, the CD could have 64kbps ATRAC files on it instead of 256kbps WMA.



    Pricing wise, I hope Apple will up the bitrate if they do increase prices but I suspect they won't if the extra money simply goes to the record companies.



    Most of this furore has been going on for months, if not years, but it blew up again when the Foo Fighters last album came out. Various reports put DRM evasion down to just a matter of holding down shift whilst some people reported that they were still getting jumbled audio without installing the software. I think perhaps they'd installed suncomm or WMP10 which protects the CD earlier and were just seeing the consequences then as Mac owners reported no problems at all.
  • Reply 36 of 54
    sunilramansunilraman Posts: 8,133member
    Quote:

    Originally posted by aegisdesign

    ...... I think perhaps they'd installed suncomm or WMP10 which protects the CD earlier and were just seeing the consequences then as Mac owners reported no problems at all.



    heh. microSoft: install now, pay later. when you least suspect it.
  • Reply 37 of 54
    icfireballicfireball Posts: 2,594member
    Apple won't raise individual song prices. 99 cents is everything iTMS stands for, and if you notice they are raising their prices on some albums to $11-13, which should keep some record companies quiet.
  • Reply 38 of 54
    akhomerunakhomerun Posts: 386member
    this entire thing is the music industry's fault



    apple has a great pricing structure of 99 cents that makes the music industry more money per song than physical CDs did.



    the music labels making music CDs incompatible with iPods is retarded on their part. they deserve consumers to be pissed off. if they wanted to include copy protection in audio cds, they should have actually gone to apple and offered tons of money to apple to license the fairplay technology.



    besides that, ANY IDIOT CAN STOP THE COPY PROTECTION ON THESE NEW AUDIO CDS!! windows users just turn off autorun or hold shift! the copy protection DOESNT EVEN WORK ON LINUX, UNIX, OR MAC OS X!!
  • Reply 39 of 54
    akhomerunakhomerun Posts: 386member
    if only the itunes music store was even more popular, apple could just say "fine, you don't have to sell your albums here, it's your lost profits" but sadly iTunes only accounts for 5% of music sales or something like that.



    how about screw this and let's pirate music.
  • Reply 40 of 54
    cosmonutcosmonut Posts: 4,872member
    It's interesting how the music and movie industries are trying to quietly push "fair use" out the window to its demise. It's shifting from buying the rights to a *title* to the rights for a *copy* of that title. Big difference.
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