Hey folks........here that sound? That's the sound of Mac users whining in unison again.
Just a quick check in my database show that USB modems for PC all average $50 or more. Thus Apple's pricing is right on the button for a USB Modem. Sure their may be cut rate vendors but a USR USR5633A is $50.
Broadband users equally have the right not to have to pay for people that live in broadband challenged areas. Pony up the money if you need it. Apple isn't gouging you here.
Certainly there are a lot of people out there who still use dial-up internet access. Current Nielsen estimates indicate that about 60% of active home internet users have a broadband connection. That number is projected to reach 70% by January of next year. I'd wager there will be about 15% of internet users who will never go broadband (approximately the same percentage of TV viewers who don't have some form of cable/satellite).
Those people have no desire to get "more" out of their internet connection than the occasional e-mail and web surfing that they do. They're not likely to ever try to download a song from iTunes, and they don't care about streaming video or playing games online. In fact, they probably have little use for a "modern" computer like the new iMac.
They'll replace their old computer if, and only if, it dies. My mom is still using my old bondi-blue iMac, with dial-up access that she uses once a day to check her e-mail. While she admits it might be nice to have a faster or always-on connection, it's simply not worth the $40 or so a month to my parents. Just the same way the $90 per month cable wasn't worth it when all they were watching was network primetime anyway...
For that 15% of people, when the time finally comes for a new computer, they'll still have the option of buying an external modem. I don't think Apple's price for it is as low as it could be, but search Amazon for "56K USB Modem" and you'll find a bunch of other solutions... usually within the $30-50 price range.
While I wasn't actually paying much attention to Apple at the time, their decision to remove internal floppy drives years ago seems analogous to removing internal modems (from desktop computers) now. Back then I'm sure there were initially plenty of "why did, and how dare, they do that?!" reactions, but eventually the number of people affected decreased into relative insignificance.
Same thing again now, just with different technology. Realizing that modem users are an increasing minority ought to be enough reason not to get worked up about it even if you are affected now, especially with the option to use an external modem (which can't be that big a deal with desktop systems). Who wants to waste time and look ridiculous fighting a losing battle that's already over?
Too much expensive for my taste, I would add. It certainly should not be at 55 Euros that it is now. It is evident that Apple treats it like the memory modules on sell in the online store.
Remember the iPod FW cables ($1 to make, sells for $20) Just because everyone price gouges doesn't necessarily make it right.
This is nothing to do with TV but more about digital content. Now we definately will never see a TV tuner from Apple since all the TV stuff is converging with the digital side.
i disagree. while i don't expect an apple TV tuner, i certainly feel "never" is a strong term.
vis: iTMS now selling TV episodes for iPod. one next logical evolution is a PVR solution for folks to integrate their own recordings. eg: record several shows, load them into your iPod before a trip, and watch them on the trip, whether on hotel TVs or otherwise.
again, i'm not saying apple will do this. just that "never" is precarious. eg: apple will "never" use intel chips. apple will "never" make a video ipod.
I wouldn't of disagreed about never seeing an intergrated Apple TV Tuner until they brought out Front Row, presumebly, to compete with MCE2005. WHile it looks like a great program, if Apple is serious about competing in this market, they need to give you PVR or at least let you watch TV on your pretty 20" screen LCD screen.
Sure Front Row and its remote are great, but without an intergrated HDTV or at least Analogue tuner, I dont see that much of a point of owning one. Even allowing it to control an external third party tuner surely wouldnt of been that difficult to script.
SOme will call me a winer - I really do love everything else about these new iMacs, they are great machines, and should be purchased by virtue of the intergrated iSight, All in one design, ATI Radeon X600 GPU's, ridiculous amounts of storage etc - but the lacking in the PVR department is a serious cockup if Apple really does want to compete in the already highly competitive HTPC market.
...I have very memory-heavy requirements in a computer, but not really too much as far as CPU requirements. So I would rather have an iMac than a Powermac...
vis: iTMS now selling TV episodes for iPod. one next logical evolution is a PVR solution for folks to integrate their own recordings. eg: record several shows, load them into your iPod before a trip, and watch them on the trip, whether on hotel TVs or otherwise.
again, i'm not saying apple will do this. just that "never" is precarious. eg: apple will "never" use intel chips. apple will "never" make a video ipod.
While very attractive from a consumers point of view, I'm not sure Apple will want to step on the tv networks toes like that. Right now they are trying to lure them into making their content available digitally by showing them that selling episodes on the itunes store can act as an additional revenue stream. If Apple comes out with a tuner and makes it easy for people to record shows and take them with them for free, the networks will not take kindly to it. I know there are all sorts of arguments that the content is free and people do the same thing when they record shows with their VCR, yet being able to do it with a video ipod is and is not the same situation. Much as converting the CDs one buys into MP3s was and wasn't the same as making a taped copy of them (and we know how the content providers reacted to that). No, I think Apple's got to play the same game as they did with the music side with the carrot and stick. Act like the white knight and show the networks a way to make money while indirectly reminding them of the alternative - the threat of stolen episodes of Lost over their heads.
Owning what, an iMac G5? Surely the point of owning that system is decided by more than Front Row and a remote.
MI bad. Didi't realise it sounded like that. What I meant was, that while Front Row and everything is great, without a TV tuner, Front Row is limited in its usefullnessyou cant watch TV from across the room. Sure its alright for DVD's and things, but if Apple is going to stand up there and say - "we are so great, our remote has six buttons, our competitors with MCE2005 have 40+" While it is great that Apple is making remote simpler, if they are going to make such a direct comparison to MCE2005, they are leaving themselves well open to an attack from the Windows side that goes something like this. "Apple, well sure it has a six button remote. But how usefull is a remote which doesnt control the TV?"
Someone made a good point by saying that Apple is playing the white night by not doing this. Again, its great for Apple to play the white night and play well by the TV industry. BUt all I'm saying that is if they arent offering PVR computers, they are not going to lure people away from their cheaper SFF PC's.
MI bad. Didi't realise it sounded like that. What I meant was, that while Front Row and everything is great, without a TV tuner, Front Row is limited in its usefullnessyou cant watch TV from across the room. Sure its alright for DVD's and things, but if Apple is going to stand up there and say - "we are so great, our remote has six buttons, our competitors with MCE2005 have 40+" While it is great that Apple is making remote simpler, if they are going to make such a direct comparison to MCE2005, they are leaving themselves well open to an attack from the Windows side that goes something like this. "Apple, well sure it has a six button remote. But how usefull is a remote which doesnt control the TV?"
Someone made a good point by saying that Apple is playing the white night by not doing this. Again, its great for Apple to play the white night and play well by the TV industry. BUt all I'm saying that is if they arent offering PVR computers, they are not going to lure people away from their cheaper SFF PC's.
but i think apple doesn't want to go head to head with http://www.elgato.com/ eyeTV which is a great PVR solution for macs. how eyeTV and frontRow may eventually completement (or already do) is something i haven't tried out myself so i cant comment further.
edit: this is where the "apple should buy so and so company" comes in... in which case i say apple should by elgato
but i think apple doesn't want to go head to head with http://www.elgato.com/ eyeTV which is a great PVR solution for macs. how eyeTV and frontRow may eventually completement (or already do) is something i haven't tried out myself so i cant comment further.
edit: this is where the "apple should buy so and so company" comes in... in which case i say apple should by elgato
I would settle for s-video in so I can hook up my direct tv box.
On the reverse side of the motherboard you can see the micron ram chips soldered to the board, directly underneath some of the "kodawarisan" tagging. (I was wrong!) They also appear to be BGA parts, so there's no way anyone is going to be able to take them off and solder higher capacity parts in the same place.
However, I was correct in my hypothesis that the built-in RAM would be right where the slot is, but on the reverse side of the board.
I really think Apple has awoken from the stupor they have been in.
I know the pro crowd is upset that it's always about the iPod and now this spectacular iMac (The ultimate dorm room computer). But it is exactly what Apple should be doing.
They are chasing the under 25 crowd as hard as they can. It's where the moneys at.
I mean be honest. Why would Apple even want to enter the enterprise market of no margins? I know that they would like to keep A/V, print and various other pro markets as well as education. But if they can capture the 12-25 crowd, all the rest doesn't matter.
I foresee in the near future that all macs will be consumer devices and that there will be a seperate pro line named something else.
I know it upsets the pro crowd because they have been so faithful and feel that if it wasn't for them then Apple would have been done a long time ago. But Apple can't survive on the pro market and education. It's just not there.
My hats off to Apple. Man what a company! This new iMac, the nano and new iPod is the start of something great.
Comments
Just a quick check in my database show that USB modems for PC all average $50 or more. Thus Apple's pricing is right on the button for a USB Modem. Sure their may be cut rate vendors but a USR USR5633A is $50.
Broadband users equally have the right not to have to pay for people that live in broadband challenged areas. Pony up the money if you need it. Apple isn't gouging you here.
Those people have no desire to get "more" out of their internet connection than the occasional e-mail and web surfing that they do. They're not likely to ever try to download a song from iTunes, and they don't care about streaming video or playing games online. In fact, they probably have little use for a "modern" computer like the new iMac.
They'll replace their old computer if, and only if, it dies. My mom is still using my old bondi-blue iMac, with dial-up access that she uses once a day to check her e-mail. While she admits it might be nice to have a faster or always-on connection, it's simply not worth the $40 or so a month to my parents. Just the same way the $90 per month cable wasn't worth it when all they were watching was network primetime anyway...
For that 15% of people, when the time finally comes for a new computer, they'll still have the option of buying an external modem. I don't think Apple's price for it is as low as it could be, but search Amazon for "56K USB Modem" and you'll find a bunch of other solutions... usually within the $30-50 price range.
Same thing again now, just with different technology. Realizing that modem users are an increasing minority ought to be enough reason not to get worked up about it even if you are affected now, especially with the option to use an external modem (which can't be that big a deal with desktop systems). Who wants to waste time and look ridiculous fighting a losing battle that's already over?
Originally posted by PB
Too much expensive for my taste, I would add. It certainly should not be at 55 Euros that it is now. It is evident that Apple treats it like the memory modules on sell in the online store.
Remember the iPod FW cables ($1 to make, sells for $20) Just because everyone price gouges doesn't necessarily make it right.
Originally posted by Lincolnrozelle
This is nothing to do with TV but more about digital content. Now we definately will never see a TV tuner from Apple since all the TV stuff is converging with the digital side.
i disagree. while i don't expect an apple TV tuner, i certainly feel "never" is a strong term.
vis: iTMS now selling TV episodes for iPod. one next logical evolution is a PVR solution for folks to integrate their own recordings. eg: record several shows, load them into your iPod before a trip, and watch them on the trip, whether on hotel TVs or otherwise.
again, i'm not saying apple will do this. just that "never" is precarious. eg: apple will "never" use intel chips. apple will "never" make a video ipod.
Sure Front Row and its remote are great, but without an intergrated HDTV or at least Analogue tuner, I dont see that much of a point of owning one. Even allowing it to control an external third party tuner surely wouldnt of been that difficult to script.
SOme will call me a winer - I really do love everything else about these new iMacs, they are great machines, and should be purchased by virtue of the intergrated iSight, All in one design, ATI Radeon X600 GPU's, ridiculous amounts of storage etc - but the lacking in the PVR department is a serious cockup if Apple really does want to compete in the already highly competitive HTPC market.
Originally posted by pyriX
Sure Front Row and its remote are great, but without an intergrated HDTV or at least Analogue tuner, I dont see that much of a point of owning one.
Owning what, an iMac G5? Surely the point of owning that system is decided by more than Front Row and a remote.
Originally posted by Splinemodel
...I have very memory-heavy requirements in a computer, but not really too much as far as CPU requirements. So I would rather have an iMac than a Powermac...
Hehe. Not any more. Can you say 16 GB?
Well, if you have $11,900 to drop.........
vis: iTMS now selling TV episodes for iPod. one next logical evolution is a PVR solution for folks to integrate their own recordings. eg: record several shows, load them into your iPod before a trip, and watch them on the trip, whether on hotel TVs or otherwise.
again, i'm not saying apple will do this. just that "never" is precarious. eg: apple will "never" use intel chips. apple will "never" make a video ipod.
While very attractive from a consumers point of view, I'm not sure Apple will want to step on the tv networks toes like that. Right now they are trying to lure them into making their content available digitally by showing them that selling episodes on the itunes store can act as an additional revenue stream. If Apple comes out with a tuner and makes it easy for people to record shows and take them with them for free, the networks will not take kindly to it. I know there are all sorts of arguments that the content is free and people do the same thing when they record shows with their VCR, yet being able to do it with a video ipod is and is not the same situation. Much as converting the CDs one buys into MP3s was and wasn't the same as making a taped copy of them (and we know how the content providers reacted to that). No, I think Apple's got to play the same game as they did with the music side with the carrot and stick. Act like the white knight and show the networks a way to make money while indirectly reminding them of the alternative - the threat of stolen episodes of Lost over their heads.
Originally posted by sjk
Owning what, an iMac G5? Surely the point of owning that system is decided by more than Front Row and a remote.
MI bad. Didi't realise it sounded like that. What I meant was, that while Front Row and everything is great, without a TV tuner, Front Row is limited in its usefullnessyou cant watch TV from across the room. Sure its alright for DVD's and things, but if Apple is going to stand up there and say - "we are so great, our remote has six buttons, our competitors with MCE2005 have 40+" While it is great that Apple is making remote simpler, if they are going to make such a direct comparison to MCE2005, they are leaving themselves well open to an attack from the Windows side that goes something like this. "Apple, well sure it has a six button remote. But how usefull is a remote which doesnt control the TV?"
Someone made a good point by saying that Apple is playing the white night by not doing this. Again, its great for Apple to play the white night and play well by the TV industry. BUt all I'm saying that is if they arent offering PVR computers, they are not going to lure people away from their cheaper SFF PC's.
Originally posted by pyriX
MI bad. Didi't realise it sounded like that. What I meant was, that while Front Row and everything is great, without a TV tuner, Front Row is limited in its usefullnessyou cant watch TV from across the room. Sure its alright for DVD's and things, but if Apple is going to stand up there and say - "we are so great, our remote has six buttons, our competitors with MCE2005 have 40+" While it is great that Apple is making remote simpler, if they are going to make such a direct comparison to MCE2005, they are leaving themselves well open to an attack from the Windows side that goes something like this. "Apple, well sure it has a six button remote. But how usefull is a remote which doesnt control the TV?"
Someone made a good point by saying that Apple is playing the white night by not doing this. Again, its great for Apple to play the white night and play well by the TV industry. BUt all I'm saying that is if they arent offering PVR computers, they are not going to lure people away from their cheaper SFF PC's.
but i think apple doesn't want to go head to head with http://www.elgato.com/ eyeTV which is a great PVR solution for macs. how eyeTV and frontRow may eventually completement (or already do) is something i haven't tried out myself so i cant comment further.
edit: this is where the "apple should buy so and so company" comes in... in which case i say apple should by elgato
Originally posted by sunilraman
but i think apple doesn't want to go head to head with http://www.elgato.com/ eyeTV which is a great PVR solution for macs. how eyeTV and frontRow may eventually completement (or already do) is something i haven't tried out myself so i cant comment further.
edit: this is where the "apple should buy so and so company" comes in... in which case i say apple should by elgato
I would settle for s-video in so I can hook up my direct tv box.
Originally posted by aplnub
I would settle for s-video in so I can hook up my direct tv box.
I handt thought of that. Perhaps some sort of auxilary input so u can hook up an external tuner/console whatever. That would be kinda funky.
talk about pie in the sky to begin with
Originally posted by DaveLee
Hmmm, indeed. Maybe we need to wait for kodawarisan to work some of that investigative magic...
Ask, and ye shall receive...
Originally posted by DaveLee
Ask, and ye shall receive...
This is EXACTLY what I wanted to see.
On the reverse side of the motherboard you can see the micron ram chips soldered to the board, directly underneath some of the "kodawarisan" tagging. (I was wrong!) They also appear to be BGA parts, so there's no way anyone is going to be able to take them off and solder higher capacity parts in the same place.
However, I was correct in my hypothesis that the built-in RAM would be right where the slot is, but on the reverse side of the board.
Originally posted by pyriX
MI bad. Didi't realise it sounded like that.
It kind of did.
Thanks for the clarification.
Originally posted by sunilraman
how eyeTV and frontRow may eventually completement (or already do) is something i haven't tried out myself so i cant comment further.
edit: this is where the "apple should buy so and so company" comes in... in which case i say apple should by elgato
That been mentioned in "Apple Germany gets a new leader".
I really think Apple has awoken from the stupor they have been in.
I know the pro crowd is upset that it's always about the iPod and now this spectacular iMac (The ultimate dorm room computer). But it is exactly what Apple should be doing.
They are chasing the under 25 crowd as hard as they can. It's where the moneys at.
I mean be honest. Why would Apple even want to enter the enterprise market of no margins? I know that they would like to keep A/V, print and various other pro markets as well as education. But if they can capture the 12-25 crowd, all the rest doesn't matter.
I foresee in the near future that all macs will be consumer devices and that there will be a seperate pro line named something else.
I know it upsets the pro crowd because they have been so faithful and feel that if it wasn't for them then Apple would have been done a long time ago. But Apple can't survive on the pro market and education. It's just not there.
My hats off to Apple. Man what a company! This new iMac, the nano and new iPod is the start of something great.
Yes. He gets it.
Lemon Bon Bon