The reason Apple has no interest in doing a DVR is this:
Network television is DYING. In five years, you will be watching shows off the internet or downloading content from stores like iTunes. The concept of channels is over folks. Future widescreen displays will have operating systems built-in and will be internet accessible. Its already happening. HD over the Internet. Of course, it will be slow to happen in the good ol' USA because our internet connectivity sucks. But elsewhere in the world, the fortunate ones who have high speed internet, not the crummy high-speed access promoted by our cable companies, but real high speed access in the range of 100Mb/s will allow HD content over the internet.
Network TV is not dying just yet. The Internet isn't close to offering what cable and satellite can today. Will that change? Of course but for now its not close. And honestly no one has adequately explained why this is an either/or solution. I don't see Tivo/DVR owners saying "geez i'd rather move from a relatively automated process back to downloading and managing my files again"
You guys simply aren't grokking what a DVR does. It functions like a VCR but you have excellent Guide Data resources, with Tivo you have the ability to record suggested items or a series without lifting a finger. Want to record Lost everytime a new episode comes..it does that.
now juxtapose the iTMS strategy.
I must download the tracks I want.
I must handle searching and gathering the files
I must handle routing the video files to other TV.
You guys are asking people to move from a BMW to an Edsel because Apple thinks they can convince people they want less power less automation.
There is nothing spontaneous about downloading a video file, a DVR allows me to find unique programming and deal with it deftly in real time.
Apple is on crack if they think iTunes video stand a chance against a good DVR system.
I agree. I was looking for something simple but powerful to replace my stereo and DVR in the living room. Something that would let me play my iTunes music, videos iTunes videos, DVDs, and act as a HD-DVR (with two tuners!), and let me see iPhoto pictures and iMovie video clips of family. Possibly even video conferencing with the grandparents. A central (very large hard drive) file storage for iTunes, iPhoto, iMovie, etc. Combination of a gaming system and a system that can run educational software would be nice too! Let's not forget the ability to set ratings for the kids! (did I forget anything?) Short of that, there really is not much reason for me to have Apple in the living room/ family room (except for the Powerbook in my lap!). Oh, did I mention that I need that touch screen tablet (to replace my laptop in the living room?) which seconds as a remote control.
Ya know, except for the bedroom, I spend more time at home in the living/family room than anywhere else. Too bad Apple can?t do more to make my life more simple and pleasant and to keep me more entertained there! I guess I will have to keep all those independent/incompatible boxes around the house (with all the wires sticking out the back for the kids to play with!), keep playing iTunes music from my laptop and iPod (not crazy about the looks of the iPod HiFi with the iPod sticking of the top and since it can?t play radio, it would just add another box to the many I already have in my living room, not to mention another color and design style), resist downloading TV shows from iTunes (except for the must have, missed episodes too catch up with which are few and far between with my DVR), keep fighting with external storage for my photos and videos, and keep buying DVDs and cable TV (or maybe satellite soon). Too bad for me and for Apple.
I could see myself buying two of these imaginary systems upon release and another one or two as soon as I could get the money together (family of 5), to cover the TVs around the house (especially if they would link to share files, videos, recordings, etc.) Would I need it as a computer? Not really, only to be able to handle all the files, share them, and play games and learning software on the TV. As for on-demand option from Apple, I think they would have to completely replace my digital cable TV with all the shows and movies that my family likes to watch, be HD quality, and be the same or cheaper than my cable (with movie channels of course) before I would even consider it (especially with my DVR being as useful as it is). Well, at least I can dream and I will finally ditch cable, get satellite, and put down a chunk of change to get an HD-DVR in the living room and get multiple DVRs around the house. No Mac mini for me either! No sharing of DVR recordings, no iTunes, iPhoto, or iMovies around the house?..so sad!! Watch, as soon as I fork out the money on satellite equipment and a few DVRs, Apple will release something that is better than what I just described, and I?ll be broke and very envious!! But I can?t wait much longer?.here comes that two year contract!!
I didn't call you a name. Relax. I simply said that you were being irrational for believing that Apple has "painted you (or anyone else) into a corner".
Yes you did, and lying about it doesn't change the fact that you did. You said I was daft. Irrational is not even in the definition of daft. But stupid is.
Yes you did, and lying about it doesn't change the fact that you did.
I am not lying.
Quote:
Originally posted by onlooker
You said I was daft. Irrational is not even in the definition of daft. But stupid is.
So is "foolish" and "mad" and "crazy". The word was used to characterize your behavior and words...not you personally.
I said "don't be daft" as in: "Don't act/behave/speak in a manner that is daft". But, to put a more precise wording to it: Stop making daft/stupid/foolish/mad/crazy statements.
The main reason I see for not adding DVR functionality to the mini is (or actually are) the many different TV standards. Which should Apple include? DVB in all its different flavours (-T, -S, -S2, -C), regular analog, CableCard etc.?
Would controlling a TV be comfortable enough with the Apple Remote's restricted capabilities?
I'd prefer Apple to open up FrontRow and the IR port to third parties and these to take the opporunity to come out with appealing products... I have been waiting for Elgato to adapt the mini's enclosure through out its product line.
It's a damned shame that this thread is so long, and EyeTV was only mentioned once. WTF?
EyeTV 2 with EyeTV 200 (or EyeTV 500 for HDTV) is everything I wanted in PVR software, and now I have it. Apple couldn't improve on what ElGato has done (think Disc Burner vs. Toast), so they smartly decided not to.
It's a damned shame that this thread is so long, and EyeTV was only mentioned once. WTF?
EyeTV 2 with EyeTV 200 (or EyeTV 500 for HDTV) is everything I wanted in PVR software, and now I have it. Apple couldn't improve on what ElGato has done (think Disc Burner vs. Toast), so they smartly decided not to.
But the problem I see with Eye TV is it's cheaper to get a TIVO. Not to mention you have to tack on the price of a mini too. That's a lot of change for a PVR.
So is "foolish" and "mad" and "crazy". The word was used to characterize your behavior and words...not you personally.
I said "don't be daft" as in: "Don't act/behave/speak in a manner that is daft". But, to put a more precise wording to it: Stop making daft/stupid/foolish/mad/crazy statements.
Is that better?
( I doubt it )
Fine prick. (that's not a name either. I'm actually referencing part of a phrase from the bible) You could never do anything wrong, or uncaled for. Not you. You could have just apologized like a man but obviously you have years ahead of you before that day comes.
Fine prick. (that's not a name either. I'm actually referencing part of a phrase from the bible) You could have just apologized like a man but obviously you have years ahead of you before that day comes.
Geez. Nothing to apologize for. I stand by what I said.
I think the markets poised for not just a DVR but an true Digital Hub.
I want to be able to pick up my remote and switch to my computer to check out the website of the company I just saw on TV. I want to be able to view my 1920x1080 pictures shot on my Digicam in all their glory. I want to be able to preview my Garageband tracks or iMovie files. And finally I want Tivo class DVR. Downloadable iTunes content is great for stuff that has already been broadcast but it's not going to help you for real time events.
Think you'll ever see the Final Four or the MLB Playoffs on iTunes? Probably not. iTunes will be good for unique content but DVRs will reign supreme for overall management and items that are watched in real time.
I do want it all and Apple has been talking a good game about Digital Hub but that hub is still centered around a $600 and up computer. Bring me a hub that is tailored for my living room. Come'on...impress me.
I think the markets poised for not just a DVR but an true Digital Hub.
I want to be able to pick up my remote and switch to my computer to check out the website of the company I just saw on TV. I want to be able to view my 1920x1080 pictures shot on my Digicam in all their glory. I want to be able to preview my Garageband tracks or iMovie files. And finally I want Tivo class DVR. Downloadable iTunes content is great for stuff that has already been broadcast but it's not going to help you for real time events.
Think you'll ever see the Final Four or the MLB Playoffs on iTunes? Probably not. iTunes will be good for unique content but DVRs will reign supreme for overall management and items that are watched in real time.
I do want it all and Apple has been talking a good game about Digital Hub but that hub is still centered around a $600 and up computer. Bring me a hub that is tailored for my living room. Come'on...impress me.
Makes sense to me. Why don't they make it happen now?
Think you'll ever see the Final Four or the MLB Playoffs on iTunes? Probably not. iTunes will be good for unique content but DVRs will reign supreme for overall management and items that are watched in real time.
I thought the Rose Bowl was on iTunes, and had the largest # of video downloads to date at the time.
I don't have a TV. I haven't watched more than news or snippets of shows in years. But a Mac mini DVR might make me buy a TV.
Why don't I watch TV? I don't have time to fuck around scheduling my day to watch shit. It's not that important.
But I discovered I love The Office and so I downloaded all of it. Astoundingly good quality.
Same with Curb your enthusiasm and sex and the city. My fiancee finds them and downloads them in Acquisition. And we don't even have a TV.
It IS the same as music. People don't have time to fuck around with CDs, and soon they'll realize they don't have time to fuck around watching live broadcast TV.
I don't have a TV. I haven't watched more than news or snippets of shows in years. But a Mac mini DVR might make me buy a TV.
Why don't I watch TV? I don't have time to fuck around scheduling my day to watch shit. It's not that important.
But I discovered I love The Office and so I downloaded all of it. Astoundingly good quality.
Same with Curb your enthusiasm and sex and the city. My fiancee finds them and downloads them in Acquisition. And we don't even have a TV.
It IS the same as music. People don't have time to fuck around with CDs, and soon they'll realize they don't have time to fuck around watching live broadcast TV.
This isn't really new. It's called time shifting. It's been done since Sony came out with the first vcr in 1976, I think it was.
I agree with a comment made above - no TiVo like Mac mini doesnt mean that Apple is not working on another product.
Personally I still want to keep my Mac OUT of the living room, but want a Eyehome-type device or an airport AV that will let me see all the video and photo stuff on my Mac whilst loafing in front of the TV. Eyehome is all well and good, but it wont do h264 or play anthing protected (ie stuff from ITMS). Oh yes and if this new device worked both ways I could then record onto my remote Mac
Didnt apple take on someone senior from Elgato recently. I think/hope this means that there is still something in the pipeline...
You guys simply aren't grokking what a DVR does. It functions like a VCR but you have excellent Guide Data resources, with Tivo you have the ability to record suggested items or a series without lifting a finger. Want to record Lost everytime a new episode comes..it does that.
now juxtapose the iTMS strategy.
I must download the tracks I want.
I must handle searching and gathering the files
I must handle routing the video files to other TV.
You are right in that sense. But I think the iTMS strategy is pointed more at putting the video on your iPod than your television.
Switch the end point from watching television to watching your iPod and the Tivo solution becomes much more work than iTMS.
... but want a Eyehome-type device or an airport AV that will let me see all the video and photo stuff on my Mac whilst loafing in front of the TV. Eyehome is all well and good, ...
Well Eyehome with build-in HD to record into, well one can dream...
Comments
Originally posted by jocknerd
The reason Apple has no interest in doing a DVR is this:
Network television is DYING. In five years, you will be watching shows off the internet or downloading content from stores like iTunes. The concept of channels is over folks. Future widescreen displays will have operating systems built-in and will be internet accessible. Its already happening. HD over the Internet. Of course, it will be slow to happen in the good ol' USA because our internet connectivity sucks. But elsewhere in the world, the fortunate ones who have high speed internet, not the crummy high-speed access promoted by our cable companies, but real high speed access in the range of 100Mb/s will allow HD content over the internet.
Network TV is not dying just yet. The Internet isn't close to offering what cable and satellite can today. Will that change? Of course but for now its not close. And honestly no one has adequately explained why this is an either/or solution. I don't see Tivo/DVR owners saying "geez i'd rather move from a relatively automated process back to downloading and managing my files again"
You guys simply aren't grokking what a DVR does. It functions like a VCR but you have excellent Guide Data resources, with Tivo you have the ability to record suggested items or a series without lifting a finger. Want to record Lost everytime a new episode comes..it does that.
now juxtapose the iTMS strategy.
I must download the tracks I want.
I must handle searching and gathering the files
I must handle routing the video files to other TV.
You guys are asking people to move from a BMW to an Edsel because Apple thinks they can convince people they want less power less automation.
There is nothing spontaneous about downloading a video file, a DVR allows me to find unique programming and deal with it deftly in real time.
Apple is on crack if they think iTunes video stand a chance against a good DVR system.
Lot a kool aid drinkers here on this one.
Ya know, except for the bedroom, I spend more time at home in the living/family room than anywhere else. Too bad Apple can?t do more to make my life more simple and pleasant and to keep me more entertained there! I guess I will have to keep all those independent/incompatible boxes around the house (with all the wires sticking out the back for the kids to play with!), keep playing iTunes music from my laptop and iPod (not crazy about the looks of the iPod HiFi with the iPod sticking of the top and since it can?t play radio, it would just add another box to the many I already have in my living room, not to mention another color and design style), resist downloading TV shows from iTunes (except for the must have, missed episodes too catch up with which are few and far between with my DVR), keep fighting with external storage for my photos and videos, and keep buying DVDs and cable TV (or maybe satellite soon). Too bad for me and for Apple.
I could see myself buying two of these imaginary systems upon release and another one or two as soon as I could get the money together (family of 5), to cover the TVs around the house (especially if they would link to share files, videos, recordings, etc.) Would I need it as a computer? Not really, only to be able to handle all the files, share them, and play games and learning software on the TV. As for on-demand option from Apple, I think they would have to completely replace my digital cable TV with all the shows and movies that my family likes to watch, be HD quality, and be the same or cheaper than my cable (with movie channels of course) before I would even consider it (especially with my DVR being as useful as it is). Well, at least I can dream and I will finally ditch cable, get satellite, and put down a chunk of change to get an HD-DVR in the living room and get multiple DVRs around the house. No Mac mini for me either! No sharing of DVR recordings, no iTunes, iPhoto, or iMovies around the house?..so sad!! Watch, as soon as I fork out the money on satellite equipment and a few DVRs, Apple will release something that is better than what I just described, and I?ll be broke and very envious!! But I can?t wait much longer?.here comes that two year contract!!
Originally posted by bigmig
You know what's another technology you can't live without?
Safari -> Edit -> Spelling -> Check Spelling As You Type.
Spellcheck is for P****ies. Let it all hang out
:P
Originally posted by hmurchison
Spellcheck is for P****ies. Let it all hang out
:P
Oops! You spelled P***ies incorrectly. Too many *.
Originally posted by Chris Cuilla
I didn't call you a name. Relax. I simply said that you were being irrational for believing that Apple has "painted you (or anyone else) into a corner".
Yes you did, and lying about it doesn't change the fact that you did. You said I was daft. Irrational is not even in the definition of daft. But stupid is.
Originally posted by onlooker
Yes you did, and lying about it doesn't change the fact that you did.
I am not lying.
Originally posted by onlooker
You said I was daft. Irrational is not even in the definition of daft. But stupid is.
So is "foolish" and "mad" and "crazy". The word was used to characterize your behavior and words...not you personally.
I said "don't be daft" as in: "Don't act/behave/speak in a manner that is daft". But, to put a more precise wording to it: Stop making daft/stupid/foolish/mad/crazy statements.
Is that better?
( I doubt it )
Would controlling a TV be comfortable enough with the Apple Remote's restricted capabilities?
I'd prefer Apple to open up FrontRow and the IR port to third parties and these to take the opporunity to come out with appealing products... I have been waiting for Elgato to adapt the mini's enclosure through out its product line.
EyeTV 2 with EyeTV 200 (or EyeTV 500 for HDTV) is everything I wanted in PVR software, and now I have it. Apple couldn't improve on what ElGato has done (think Disc Burner vs. Toast), so they smartly decided not to.
Originally posted by gordy
It's a damned shame that this thread is so long, and EyeTV was only mentioned once. WTF?
EyeTV 2 with EyeTV 200 (or EyeTV 500 for HDTV) is everything I wanted in PVR software, and now I have it. Apple couldn't improve on what ElGato has done (think Disc Burner vs. Toast), so they smartly decided not to.
But the problem I see with Eye TV is it's cheaper to get a TIVO. Not to mention you have to tack on the price of a mini too. That's a lot of change for a PVR.
Originally posted by Chris Cuilla
I am not lying.
So is "foolish" and "mad" and "crazy". The word was used to characterize your behavior and words...not you personally.
I said "don't be daft" as in: "Don't act/behave/speak in a manner that is daft". But, to put a more precise wording to it: Stop making daft/stupid/foolish/mad/crazy statements.
Is that better?
( I doubt it )
Fine prick. (that's not a name either. I'm actually referencing part of a phrase from the bible) You could never do anything wrong, or uncaled for. Not you. You could have just apologized like a man but obviously you have years ahead of you before that day comes.
Originally posted by onlooker
Fine prick. (that's not a name either. I'm actually referencing part of a phrase from the bible) You could have just apologized like a man but obviously you have years ahead of you before that day comes.
Geez. Nothing to apologize for. I stand by what I said.
Originally posted by Chris Cuilla
Geez. Nothing to apologize for. I stand by what I said.
Of course not. You could never do anything that was uncalled for. Not you. I bow humbly at you feet highness.
The Roku Labs Photobridge HD
or the
Sony HDPS- L1
I think the markets poised for not just a DVR but an true Digital Hub.
I want to be able to pick up my remote and switch to my computer to check out the website of the company I just saw on TV. I want to be able to view my 1920x1080 pictures shot on my Digicam in all their glory. I want to be able to preview my Garageband tracks or iMovie files. And finally I want Tivo class DVR. Downloadable iTunes content is great for stuff that has already been broadcast but it's not going to help you for real time events.
Think you'll ever see the Final Four or the MLB Playoffs on iTunes? Probably not. iTunes will be good for unique content but DVRs will reign supreme for overall management and items that are watched in real time.
I do want it all and Apple has been talking a good game about Digital Hub but that hub is still centered around a $600 and up computer. Bring me a hub that is tailored for my living room. Come'on...impress me.
Originally posted by hmurchison
I like El Gato as a choice. The only problem is that an Apple DVR would likely support iLife very well. If you look at devices like
The Roku Labs Photobridge HD
or the
Sony HDPS- L1
I think the markets poised for not just a DVR but an true Digital Hub.
I want to be able to pick up my remote and switch to my computer to check out the website of the company I just saw on TV. I want to be able to view my 1920x1080 pictures shot on my Digicam in all their glory. I want to be able to preview my Garageband tracks or iMovie files. And finally I want Tivo class DVR. Downloadable iTunes content is great for stuff that has already been broadcast but it's not going to help you for real time events.
Think you'll ever see the Final Four or the MLB Playoffs on iTunes? Probably not. iTunes will be good for unique content but DVRs will reign supreme for overall management and items that are watched in real time.
I do want it all and Apple has been talking a good game about Digital Hub but that hub is still centered around a $600 and up computer. Bring me a hub that is tailored for my living room. Come'on...impress me.
Makes sense to me. Why don't they make it happen now?
Originally posted by hmurchison
Think you'll ever see the Final Four or the MLB Playoffs on iTunes? Probably not. iTunes will be good for unique content but DVRs will reign supreme for overall management and items that are watched in real time.
I thought the Rose Bowl was on iTunes, and had the largest # of video downloads to date at the time.
Why don't I watch TV? I don't have time to fuck around scheduling my day to watch shit. It's not that important.
But I discovered I love The Office and so I downloaded all of it. Astoundingly good quality.
Same with Curb your enthusiasm and sex and the city. My fiancee finds them and downloads them in Acquisition. And we don't even have a TV.
It IS the same as music. People don't have time to fuck around with CDs, and soon they'll realize they don't have time to fuck around watching live broadcast TV.
Originally posted by Aquatic
I don't have a TV. I haven't watched more than news or snippets of shows in years. But a Mac mini DVR might make me buy a TV.
Why don't I watch TV? I don't have time to fuck around scheduling my day to watch shit. It's not that important.
But I discovered I love The Office and so I downloaded all of it. Astoundingly good quality.
Same with Curb your enthusiasm and sex and the city. My fiancee finds them and downloads them in Acquisition. And we don't even have a TV.
It IS the same as music. People don't have time to fuck around with CDs, and soon they'll realize they don't have time to fuck around watching live broadcast TV.
This isn't really new. It's called time shifting. It's been done since Sony came out with the first vcr in 1976, I think it was.
Personally I still want to keep my Mac OUT of the living room, but want a Eyehome-type device or an airport AV that will let me see all the video and photo stuff on my Mac whilst loafing in front of the TV. Eyehome is all well and good, but it wont do h264 or play anthing protected (ie stuff from ITMS). Oh yes and if this new device worked both ways I could then record onto my remote Mac
Didnt apple take on someone senior from Elgato recently. I think/hope this means that there is still something in the pipeline...
You guys simply aren't grokking what a DVR does. It functions like a VCR but you have excellent Guide Data resources, with Tivo you have the ability to record suggested items or a series without lifting a finger. Want to record Lost everytime a new episode comes..it does that.
now juxtapose the iTMS strategy.
I must download the tracks I want.
I must handle searching and gathering the files
I must handle routing the video files to other TV.
You are right in that sense. But I think the iTMS strategy is pointed more at putting the video on your iPod than your television.
Switch the end point from watching television to watching your iPod and the Tivo solution becomes much more work than iTMS.
Originally posted by the3rdParty
... but want a Eyehome-type device or an airport AV that will let me see all the video and photo stuff on my Mac whilst loafing in front of the TV. Eyehome is all well and good, ...
Well Eyehome with build-in HD to record into, well one can dream...