eMac Owners: How's Your Display?
Morning, all. First post here, but longtime Mac user.
I'm looking at a new eMac (great price for G4), but I saw one on display at a local store, and there seems to be some interference from the speakers (and perhaps the other surrounding CRT iMacs). It looks as though there are "sound waves" moving through the display image when there's music playing. I remember my old iMac doing this, but only when the speakers were cranked up to unbearable levels....
So, anyway, I was hoping I could get some feedback/input from eMac owners and users on how their display performs in a single-computer environment. Do your speakers have an effect on the image? Etc., etc., etc.
Thanks!
I'm looking at a new eMac (great price for G4), but I saw one on display at a local store, and there seems to be some interference from the speakers (and perhaps the other surrounding CRT iMacs). It looks as though there are "sound waves" moving through the display image when there's music playing. I remember my old iMac doing this, but only when the speakers were cranked up to unbearable levels....
So, anyway, I was hoping I could get some feedback/input from eMac owners and users on how their display performs in a single-computer environment. Do your speakers have an effect on the image? Etc., etc., etc.
Thanks!
Comments
<a href="http://forums.appleinsider.com/cgi-bin/ultimatebb.cgi?ubb=get_topic&f=2&t=001012"; target="_blank">http://forums.appleinsider.com/cgi-bin/ultimatebb.cgi?ubb=get_topic&f=2&t=001012</a>;
I was going to buy one of these. The design is brilliant, clean and solid, the speakers are way better than the ones in the classic iMac and the overall performance is identical to the new iMac G4 that was sitting next to it (but I hate the LCD that the new iMac G4 has - jagged edges, blah colors and washed out. At least the 2 that I've seen at this one particular store). Anyway, after seeing 2 eMacs in person - you can't help but notice this huge flaw in the display. Also, the only resolution that the convergence/geometry is perfect in is the highest (and best) resolution. Anything lower, and you've got the uneven banded corners and sides that you had with the classic iMac - and there is no geometry tweak in the world that will straiten that out the way it should be.
So a sales guy comes over to me as I was examining this machine and asked me if I wanted one. I showed him the obvious display problem and he said - "oh, don't worry - lets just go into the display settings and raise the refresh rate'. So, I didn't bother to argue and let him go and try. He then said, "oh, that's weird - there is only one hertz option available". He agreed that this was odd and a big problem and then realized he'd have a hard time moving these out to buyers like myself. Across the room were the 'low end' newly designed HP, Compaq and Sony PCs starting at $899 and they all included crisp 17" CRT monitors with zero flicker and even borders. Now, here's Apple with an $1100 machine with a monitor I'd return back to the store had it been purchased separately. I am very disappointed at Apple for releasing this with this huge, obvious and very annoying (to the eye), problem.
I'll have wait for a revision model to come out or a driver fix from NVIDIA before I buy one.
Thanks for the tip, but why link back to our own (i.e. this) discussion?
Patchouli,
Thanks for the info. I'm still convinced it has something to do with EMI from other displays, since there were quite a few CRT iMacs next to the eMac in the store. But this display stopped waving at me (lol) when I quit iTunes. Hmm. I guess we'll see. And BTW, the gamma settings (in ColorSync) are all wrong on the new iMacs. On the (any) Apple LCD, you should set the gamma to the maximum (i.e. highest number, darkest image) to give loads of contrast and rich, vibrant color.
More input, please!!!
Go to the eMac section of the Apple Support discussion forums and you'll see that just about everyone has mentioned a problem with the new eMac's display. It's a shame, cuz' it's such a crisp beautiful and vivid display.
About the LCD iMac, I actually did change the color profiles and the display was just awful with all of them. Maybe this store had two duds? Maybe Apple is using two different manufacturers for the display and it's a hit and miss game. All I know is, the title bar fonts are jagged, the colors are washed out by this slight haze (even when lowering the brightness) and the buttons on each window don't look 100% round and liquid perfect as they do on other displays. They are a bit jagged as well. I was in shock. To be honest, I wasn't that impressed with the Apple 15" Display quality either, but even that was 10X better than the iMac LCD. Maybe Apple used a inferior brand when trying to get these out the door and this store happened to have gotten them. If this is how the iMac LCD is, then the price is even more unjustified, and the fans who rave over them do not know what a good LCD is.
Started to ask why you were talking about iMacs and about text clarity, then re-read the post above. Oops. :eek:
Patchouli,
I didn't see anything on Apple's discussions, so I think I'm still sold on the eMac. But I'll buy from someone with a good return policy. I just don't like the iMac enough to forget about the crooked display and pixel outage issues. But that's a personal thing...YMMV.
C'mon eMac owners...any testimonials?
[ 06-15-2002: Message edited by: JohnnyDangerously ]</p>
<strong>I have 2 new imacs with absolutely nothing wrong as you had stated. Perhaps someone has installed tinkertool and turned off the anti-aliasing on the 2 imacs in which you speak?
Or maybe you need glasses?
-Xidius</strong><hr></blockquote>Well, I have 20/20 vision, so maybe the display was just crappy?
These iMacs did not have an internet connection and no, there was no TinkerTool installed. Even so, lets say anti-aliasing was in fact turned off - that wouldn't effect the buttons and over all color and clarity of the display which were poor.
Whatever the case or the cause, these particular iMac G4's had shitty displays. Again, perhaps this store just got a couple of duds.
<strong>Well, I have 20/20 vision, so maybe the display was just crappy?
You are right Patchouli. I went to CompUSA the other day to check out the eMac (they didn't have any) <img src="graemlins/hmmm.gif" border="0" alt="[Hmmm]" /> But anyway, while there I did noticed the iMac's LCD display had a "washed out" look when compared to the other LCD displays by Apple. That is not to say that the LCD in the iMac sucks, but yes, it's not as good as the stand alone LCD displays. What I would like to have is an iMac with a wide screen high quality LCD display.
[ 06-18-2002: Message edited by: PooPooDoctor ]</p>
Watch the wheels of cars in car ads. They seem to rotate backwards.
So if you stand under a fluorescent light and look at a monitor and that monitor has little apparent flicker, then it's at 60 Hz, 75 Hz, or theoretically some other multiple of fifteen. The brightest line stays in one place, or backs up a quarter of a screen every cycle, meaning that it is brighter at four places on the monitor than the others. But that's too stable to notice. Take a look next time. I bet you'll be able to see the four brighter regions.
Apple monitors, however, are a bit odd. For some reason there's a tendency to run at 60.4 Hz, or 58.9 Hz, or some such, when in the higher resolutions. I don't know why, but that's what it negotiates, and it's hard to convince it otherwise. When an Apple monitor is under a fluorescent light at a high resolution the brightest line, the line of maximum reinforcement, jumps all over. Simple physics. Under incandescent lights it's an entirely different matter.
If you want something fun, back up from a low-frequency monitor under flourescents and chomp your jaw. The monitor image often jiggles separately from the frame of the monitor.
So, you see, not all harmonic interference is necessarily EM signal degradation, and not everything is as it appears in a retail store.
Oh, and a note: I have no doubt the speakers cause waves too. I'm just addressing the mysterious "top resolution in an empty store" issue.
[ 06-18-2002: Message edited by: AllenChristopher ]
[ 06-18-2002: Message edited by: AllenChristopher ]</p>
This is a real let down as I was looking to buy one. I am hoping there is a revision and or a fix for this soon. Since Apple's warranty and support practices are amongst the shoddiest in the business, I am not going to take the risk to see if the eMac's display performs better under incandescent lighting.
I would also like a larger HD. 40GBs just doesn't cut it anymore and I hope to god they aren't using the cheap assed Maxtor whiners that are in the classic slot-loading iMacs - in the new eMacs. So much for a 'silent' iMac - when the HD power supply buzzes like hell. I'd rather hear a steady low grade fan - but I digress.
I won't deny Apple can make some very fundamental electronic mistakes. The original AirPort was wired wrong and broke, amusingly, in exactly thirteen months, almost without fail. My last G4 tower picked up AM radio on the headphone port no matter what I did to shield it. Eventually I erected a giant Faraday cage in my room, to no avail. I'm merely pointing out a physical phenomenon that could explain a waver in an lit empty room.
<strong>The Emac,Imac Apple is producing some real junk lately! No wonder they have 1.2% market share! And the prices they charge for their junk! You would have to be an idiot to buy this crap!!! <img src="graemlins/lol.gif" border="0" alt="[Laughing]" /> <img src="graemlins/lol.gif" border="0" alt="[Laughing]" /> <img src="graemlins/lol.gif" border="0" alt="[Laughing]" /> </strong><hr></blockquote>
What? You are suggesting that I go and waste a grand on WinTel **** ? No way in hell am I gonna stoop to the level of my next door neighbor
<strong>Morning, all. First post here, but longtime Mac user.
I'm looking at a new eMac (great price for G4), but I saw one on display at a local store, and there seems to be some interference from the speakers (and perhaps the other surrounding CRT iMacs). It looks as though there are "sound waves" moving through the display image when there's music playing. I remember my old iMac doing this, but only when the speakers were cranked up to unbearable levels....
So, anyway, I was hoping I could get some feedback/input from eMac owners and users on how their display performs in a single-computer environment. Do your speakers have an effect on the image? Etc., etc., etc.
Thanks!</strong><hr></blockquote>
I also was disappointed in the eMac's display I saw at the CompUSA in Baton Rouge. It seemed that it was set at a odd proportion that seemed too upright. I found from the Studio Display 17 that Apple sometimes offers a standard resolution and interpolates the other choices (this doesn't work for me).
I bought one 2 days ago and it's superb!
Full blast with iTunes and no waves or funny spots on my screen. Tried all resolutions and it works fine. Everything works well, againts all the complains that was posted here. The only thing I wished they had on the eMac was the holder on the top. It was bit scary walking and 'hugging' a 22kg 'egg' around!
After 5 years of G3 Beige and AppleVision 750, I am happy with this purchase
and i, too, inspected one at our local campus computer store, and everything seemed absolutely fine.
p.s. rbald, go suck your winXP install CD. i think it's getting lonely.
Even if there isn't a defect, monitors vary even in the same line in picture quality,brightness, color, etc. That's why, in an ideal world, you could have a 30 day window to exchange a monitor (or in this case computer) that just doesn't work for you.
I can see the side of the manufacturers and retailers. People don't usually think about return or exchange policies until after they've bought the computer and had a problem, and the policies companies have reflect that reality. If you found the right person at Apple they could probably give you a pretty accurate estimate of how much that kind of exchange policy would cost. In Apple's view the lower selling price will outweigh the very limited return policy in customers' buying decisions. Still, it flat out sucks to make an over $1000 purchase from a premium Computer Company and have a worse return/exchange policy than a $10 toaster at Wal-Mart.
I'm typing this on a 700MHz 12" iBook, which I took for a few days while I decide what to do about a desktop Mac. I had bought an eMac, and it exhibited the following:
- Hard disk & CD-ROM access would cause tiny vibrations in the lower-1/3 of the display. This was most apparent when seen in the Mac OS X Dock.
- When listening to music, apparent "waves" would move through the display, directly above the speakers. This would vary with the music, not with volume, as if it had to do with certain harmonic levels.
- Moire (focus) became increasingly fuzzy towards the extreme sides of the display. This was very VERY minor, and probably a CRT-wide quirk.
I really don't like the iBook. I'm not a portable kind of person; I prefer computing at a desk. And there are already some surface scratches on the bottom. I don't know where the f__k they came from, but I can already tell most surfaces will be like sandpaper to the beautiful lucite shell. Hmph.
I think I'm going to go back for another eMac. I still do not trust the iMac's design, and I'm just paranoid of flat panels and dread stuck pixels. I'm shaking just thinking about it! :-)
Oh well, if it's the lesser of two evils (or in this case, mistakes?), I'll take the solid, tried-and-true CRT desktop.
More input, anyone?
/johnny_dangerously