Well that is definitely not the case. Safari can handle XMLHttpRequest. How do you think most dashboard widgets work? iWeb also uses AJAX for the slideshows. Safari certainly has the "advanced tools" that are necessary for AJAX.
You're wrong. Yes, Safari supports XHTMLHttpRequest, but there's more to most web apps than just that.
From April 2005 to March 2006, users of the Apple OS on the Net increase in share by over 0.75 percent, from 3.52 percent to 4.29 percent.
Er... 3.52% to 4.29% is a .75% increase?
That's great news. Much more important than Safari's increase as it tells us the Mac OS X is gaining ground at a very nice rate. After all, that is the reason behind Safari's increase in popularity.
Another note, don't forget that Safari is based on WebKit (open source), which is a branch of kHTML. People are working hard to improve compatibility and even making it available to other platforms - the core engine that is.
You're wrong. Yes, Safari supports XHTMLHttpRequest, but there's more to most web apps than just that.
No, I'm not wrong. AJAX is DXHTML and XMLHttpRequest. Safari has no problem with either. Safari has some of the best CSS support of any browser, and also supports almost all of DOM 2. Those are what is required for DHTML. So what exactly is Sarari (or webkit) missing?
Here's a link that shows how well WebKit did back in september.
In my case, I have switched from Safari to Camino.
Same here. Safari is nice (especially once purged of brushed metal via UNO) but I've found it unstable since about 10.4.4 crashing once a day or so on me (and yes before UNO too). I've used Safari since it was in beta, my Jaguar PowerBook shipping with IE much to my Mac newb surprise. Safari blew it away and my newbishness waned in time.
Camino meanwhile is a swift little SOB and has my undivided attention now!
Safari and Camino are both way better than Firefox on Windows of course, and comparing even that to IE is to set out on a search for a truly outlandish euphemism...
I hope there are no Mac users left still using Internet Exploder.
There are TONS. Everyone on OS 9 (even though the % is small it's a lot of people), and still a lot of people on early OS X and even some still on the later OS X releases. Hard to believe, I know. But some people still have AOL. They just don't know where the intarweb is if the blue E is not there. That is the interweb. You see?
There are TONS. Everyone on OS 9 (even though the % is small it's a lot of people), and still a lot of people on early OS X and even some still on the later OS X releases. Hard to believe, I know. But some people still have AOL. They just don't know where the intarweb is if the blue E is not there. That is the interweb. You see?
Although it may be true that some people who are still running MacOS 9 use Internet Explorer, this is no way implies that all of them are. MacOS 9 shipped [and Classic still ships] with Netscape Communicator in addition to Internet Explorer. Many MacOS 9 users prefer it to IE. Many others run Netscape 5, 6, or 7. Still others run Mozilla. Some run Opera or iCab. I use MacOS X 10.4.6 are my OS almost exclusively, but I most certainly remember not only a time before Microsoft adopted the blue E for its Internet Explorer icon; I remember a time when there was no Internet Explorer at all. Before, making broad statements about other people's knowledge, one would do well to inventory one's own.
Before, making broad statements about other people's knowledge, one would do well to inventory one's own.
Boy, you don't get it, do you. People who aren't computer-literate like you or me, people who don't read computer websites, people who barely know the difference between shutting down and restarting a computer -- these people often use Internet Explorer because that's the only browser they know. In fact, many of these people don't even know what the word "browser" means. All they know is Internet Explorer is The Web. Or The Internet. And that's a big step for them, because they previously thought AOL was The Internet.
These people don't see a difference between browsers, except that some browsers look different that Internet Explorer. (Different buttons, bookmarks instead of favorites...) They don't know tabs, they don't know control-clicking, they don't change preferences... and these, my friend, are unfortunately the majority of users. Without education, if they see the blue E in the dock next to the Safari compass, and they want to go online, they'll click the one they think will put them on the internet. And guess what, it's not the compass.
My small number of posts to this particular website sure does make me a loser.
But, Mr. Me, your large number of posts supports my point -- you are a knowledgable Mac user. You get and understand computers and the web. You would never think of using Internet Explorer. Neither would I.
However, I'm lucky enough to work in offices where people use Macs. Hundreds of Macs. And day after day, year after year, I see people sitting at their computers, usually running Panther or Tiger but occasionally Jaguar, and time and time again I see them using Internet Explorer to browse the web. Their screen resolution settings are lame, they don't know expose exists, they constantly minimize windows to the dock instead of ever "hiding" anything, they use AOL instant messenger instead of iChat or Adium, Microsoft Word doesn't have any of the Service Release updates, the little @ icon is still next to the trash can in the dock. They just don't know, nobody has ever sat down to teach them, they don't even want to learn. What they do seems to work, and that's that.
They watch me use my computer and they can't believe the way I switch between progams using Command-Tab (or Apple-Tab, since they've never heard of the "command" key), or they way I switch windows with command-~, or the way I right click, or use smooth scrolling, or keep my desktop organized, or use different finder views, or anything. But they don't want to learn, either. They prefer to just hobble along, confident in their narrow scope of understanding. And in that narrow scope, Internet Explorer is the thing you use to go on the internet.
That's how I figure that, geek who has posted over a thousand times to a rumor site message board.
Shit, some people can't even tell the different between the big blue E and Teh Intarweb. They don't even know that there could possibly be something that lets your browse the internet and, um, uh.. isn't IE.
Do I have it right Mr. Me or do you not count non-newbies' opinions?
Do I have it right Mr. Me or do you not count non-newbies' opinions?
What I don't count is someone who knows squat trying to tell me what I get and what I don't. On a less personal level--for me, at least--dak splunder makes the fundamental mistake of believing that his personal experiences are universal and that his opinion is anything more than that--his opinion.
What I don't count is someone who knows squat trying to tell me what I get and what I don't. On a less personal level--for me, at least--dak splunder makes the fundamental mistake of believing that his personal experiences are universal and that his opinion is anything more than that--his opinion.
Unfortunately, Mr. Me, dak splunder is right. This is how most people are with a computer. And he's not telling you what to think, he's just observing a fact of live.
The vast majority of the internet users use IE for no other reason as that is what they know. Yes, it is crappy, full of holes an insecure, but, that is all they know...
Mac users are the ones who have broken free of that crappy paradigm that is Win XP and IE.
Comments
Originally posted by Mr Beardsley
Well that is definitely not the case. Safari can handle XMLHttpRequest. How do you think most dashboard widgets work? iWeb also uses AJAX for the slideshows. Safari certainly has the "advanced tools" that are necessary for AJAX.
You're wrong. Yes, Safari supports XHTMLHttpRequest, but there's more to most web apps than just that.
Originally posted by AppleInsider
From April 2005 to March 2006, users of the Apple OS on the Net increase in share by over 0.75 percent, from 3.52 percent to 4.29 percent.
That's great news. Much more important than Safari's increase as it tells us the Mac OS X is gaining ground at a very nice rate. After all, that is the reason behind Safari's increase in popularity.
Originally posted by Chucker
You're wrong. Yes, Safari supports XHTMLHttpRequest, but there's more to most web apps than just that.
No, I'm not wrong. AJAX is DXHTML and XMLHttpRequest. Safari has no problem with either. Safari has some of the best CSS support of any browser, and also supports almost all of DOM 2. Those are what is required for DHTML. So what exactly is Sarari (or webkit) missing?
Here's a link that shows how well WebKit did back in september.
http://webkit.opendarwin.org/blog/?p=27
Originally posted by DanMacMan
In my case, I have switched from Safari to Camino.
Same here. Safari is nice (especially once purged of brushed metal via UNO) but I've found it unstable since about 10.4.4 crashing once a day or so on me (and yes before UNO too). I've used Safari since it was in beta, my Jaguar PowerBook shipping with IE much to my Mac newb surprise. Safari blew it away and my newbishness waned in time.
Camino meanwhile is a swift little SOB and has my undivided attention now!
Safari and Camino are both way better than Firefox on Windows of course, and comparing even that to IE is to set out on a search for a truly outlandish euphemism...
I hope there are no Mac users left still using Internet Exploder.
There are TONS. Everyone on OS 9 (even though the % is small it's a lot of people), and still a lot of people on early OS X and even some still on the later OS X releases. Hard to believe, I know. But some people still have AOL. They just don't know where the intarweb is if the blue E is not there. That is the interweb. You see?
Originally posted by Aquatic
There are TONS. Everyone on OS 9 (even though the % is small it's a lot of people), and still a lot of people on early OS X and even some still on the later OS X releases. Hard to believe, I know. But some people still have AOL. They just don't know where the intarweb is if the blue E is not there. That is the interweb. You see?
Although it may be true that some people who are still running MacOS 9 use Internet Explorer, this is no way implies that all of them are. MacOS 9 shipped [and Classic still ships] with Netscape Communicator in addition to Internet Explorer. Many MacOS 9 users prefer it to IE. Many others run Netscape 5, 6, or 7. Still others run Mozilla. Some run Opera or iCab. I use MacOS X 10.4.6 are my OS almost exclusively, but I most certainly remember not only a time before Microsoft adopted the blue E for its Internet Explorer icon; I remember a time when there was no Internet Explorer at all. Before, making broad statements about other people's knowledge, one would do well to inventory one's own.
Originally posted by Mr. Me
Before, making broad statements about other people's knowledge, one would do well to inventory one's own.
Boy, you don't get it, do you. People who aren't computer-literate like you or me, people who don't read computer websites, people who barely know the difference between shutting down and restarting a computer -- these people often use Internet Explorer because that's the only browser they know. In fact, many of these people don't even know what the word "browser" means. All they know is Internet Explorer is The Web. Or The Internet. And that's a big step for them, because they previously thought AOL was The Internet.
These people don't see a difference between browsers, except that some browsers look different that Internet Explorer. (Different buttons, bookmarks instead of favorites...) They don't know tabs, they don't know control-clicking, they don't change preferences... and these, my friend, are unfortunately the majority of users. Without education, if they see the blue E in the dock next to the Safari compass, and they want to go online, they'll click the one they think will put them on the internet. And guess what, it's not the compass.
Sad, but true.
:d
Originally posted by dak splunder
Boy, you don't get it, do you. ...
How do you figure that, newbie?
Originally posted by Mr. Me
How do you figure that, newbie?
Ouch.
My small number of posts to this particular website sure does make me a loser.
But, Mr. Me, your large number of posts supports my point -- you are a knowledgable Mac user. You get and understand computers and the web. You would never think of using Internet Explorer. Neither would I.
However, I'm lucky enough to work in offices where people use Macs. Hundreds of Macs. And day after day, year after year, I see people sitting at their computers, usually running Panther or Tiger but occasionally Jaguar, and time and time again I see them using Internet Explorer to browse the web. Their screen resolution settings are lame, they don't know expose exists, they constantly minimize windows to the dock instead of ever "hiding" anything, they use AOL instant messenger instead of iChat or Adium, Microsoft Word doesn't have any of the Service Release updates, the little @ icon is still next to the trash can in the dock. They just don't know, nobody has ever sat down to teach them, they don't even want to learn. What they do seems to work, and that's that.
They watch me use my computer and they can't believe the way I switch between progams using Command-Tab (or Apple-Tab, since they've never heard of the "command" key), or they way I switch windows with command-~, or the way I right click, or use smooth scrolling, or keep my desktop organized, or use different finder views, or anything. But they don't want to learn, either. They prefer to just hobble along, confident in their narrow scope of understanding. And in that narrow scope, Internet Explorer is the thing you use to go on the internet.
That's how I figure that, geek who has posted over a thousand times to a rumor site message board.
:d
Do I have it right Mr. Me or do you not count non-newbies' opinions?
Originally posted by Gene Clean
...
Do I have it right Mr. Me or do you not count non-newbies' opinions?
What I don't count is someone who knows squat trying to tell me what I get and what I don't. On a less personal level--for me, at least--dak splunder makes the fundamental mistake of believing that his personal experiences are universal and that his opinion is anything more than that--his opinion.
Originally posted by Mr. Me
What I don't count is someone who knows squat trying to tell me what I get and what I don't. On a less personal level--for me, at least--dak splunder makes the fundamental mistake of believing that his personal experiences are universal and that his opinion is anything more than that--his opinion.
Unfortunately, Mr. Me, dak splunder is right. This is how most people are with a computer. And he's not telling you what to think, he's just observing a fact of live.
The vast majority of the internet users use IE for no other reason as that is what they know. Yes, it is crappy, full of holes an insecure, but, that is all they know...
Mac users are the ones who have broken free of that crappy paradigm that is Win XP and IE.
But we are still in 1984 like it or not..