Apple previews Mac OS X Leopard

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  • Reply 121 of 176
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by a_greer


    I attempted to price the value of Leopards features earlier and I need to make a correction -- the value of this is now $0 because I can do it already -- along with a cool cube interface too on Linux... all I do is type "apt-get install XGL" and then do about 5 minutes of (well documented) configing and presto...instant 3d multidesktop...complete with neat lil' cube effect!



    And it is OPEN SOURCE!



    info at: http://en.opensuse.org/Xgl



    "but grandma on the 800Mhz iMac with 256MB ram may have a hard time with that..."



  • Reply 122 of 176
    chuckerchucker Posts: 5,089member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by a_greer


    I attempted to price the value of Leopards features earlier and I need to make a correction -- the value of this is now $0 because I can do it already -- along with a cool cube interface too on Linux... all I do is type "apt-get install XGL" and then do about 5 minutes of (well documented) configing and presto...instant 3d multidesktop...complete with neat lil' cube effect!



    Good look getting that to run with Aqua applications.



    Quote:

    And it is OPEN SOURCE!



    Who gives a shit, and why? Does that make it easier to use? Does that add features? Are you going to look at the source code or change it around? Are you going to accept the restrictive license?
  • Reply 123 of 176
    aegisdesignaegisdesign Posts: 2,914member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by melgross


    A somewhat different take on Leopard. Not a fanboi's view.



    http://www.tomshardware.com/





    For even more wrongness, look no further than the anti-fanboi...



    http://www.internet-nexus.com/



    Really, What a tool. Someone who dislikes Apple's surface gloss but never looks deeper than it.
  • Reply 124 of 176
    franksargentfranksargent Posts: 4,694member




    Me likes 64-bit appz and Xcode 3.0!



  • Reply 125 of 176
    melgrossmelgross Posts: 33,035member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by danielctull


    My point wasn't so much that Leopard will release earlier than spring 2007, but that there will be new and better features coming to Leopard. Although, I can't help but imagine it coming out at MWSF 07 to blow away Vista. Nay-sayers like in that Tom's Hardware article (which got a fair amount of information wrong - mostly, it presumed that this was a complete feature list) will be reporting of this crazy "Mac OS X" which has come along, not only earlier than projected, but with double the amount of released features. Compare this to the "still lingering Vista" release with hardly any of the ground breaking features. Hmm hmm...



    To be fair, I'm not sure how many new/updated features are going to be in Vista, there may be fewer in the Leopard release, but it's all mind games at the end of the day right? Leopard will look like it's getting more because the feature list got bigger, whereas Vista's got smaller.



    PS. Will there be a MW Paris keynote does anyone know? I think they will use that to display more user oriented updates. If you think about the ones we have seen at WWDC, there were a lot of developer-oriented apps (Dashcode, Xcode 3, Core Animation, Spaces) or apps developers are expected to hook into (Time Machine), but not too many end user apps. They may have chosen to logically split these up so that they will be focusing on the right user groups. Not that developers aren't users, but developers will surely know of features released at MW Paris, if they see them there or on the web.



    First of all, one must stop thinking about "blowing away Vista". I assure you that Apple's strategy is more sophisticated than that. I doubted that it would come out during MWSF before, and I still do. There isn't enough time for developers to access the new code, and the requirements for what they will have to do. If there are features that Apple hasn't finished yet, which is very likely, even more time will be needed. The developers on the board have generally agreed with that.



    This isn't a game. Jobs likes to tweek MS's nose during these conferences, but back home, things are more serious. While I'm sure that Apple is keeping an eye on Vista's release date, they aren't going to go to their programming teams and tell them to rush because they want to beat MS. It doesn't work that way.
  • Reply 126 of 176
    melgrossmelgross Posts: 33,035member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Mr. H


    I hope that was a joke. (I'm not sure if your smiley at the end was in response to the message you'd quoted, or an indication that you were being sarcastic.)



    Obviously it was a joke. not sarcasm, which people seem to think everything not serious is, but just a wry joke in response.
  • Reply 127 of 176
    melgrossmelgross Posts: 33,035member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by aegisdesign


    Because it buys you 5 licences. I've never registered a copy of OSX. Skipped that stage at installation every time. Registration isn't mandatory, unlike Windows Activation. Bertrand even made a joke about Windows Activation during the keynote. If it's ok by Apple, then it's ok by me.



    Only if you register each machine, which is the point to the whole thing. If you don't, then no license. If you are your own support, as I am, then you have no need of it. Apple's unofficial position is that while they would prefer you to license each machine you own, they will accept the fact that you will buy one copy for more than one, for the home, not for business, which, of course, is different.



    But when you call for support, you must give them the number. I suppose you can fake it by giving the one that was registered, but if the problem on the other machine is machine specific, then support won't be able to help.



    The point is, again, that this is a FAMILY pack license, friends living around the city can't use it with you, unless, as I said, Apple changed their stance on that.
  • Reply 128 of 176
    aegisdesignaegisdesign Posts: 2,914member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by melgross


    Only if you register each machine, which is the point to the whole thing. If you don't, then no license. If you are your own support, as I am, then you have no need of it. Apple's unofficial position is that while they would prefer you to license each machine you own, they will accept the fact that you will buy one copy for more than one, for the home, not for business, which, of course, is different.



    I'm sure they'd rather have you buy a Family pack than install a single user licence on 5 Macs.



    I'd imagine any Apple employee espousing anything other than the 'Thou shalt not install OSX on more than one machine created by us at a time' commandment would shortly be struck down with a bolt from Jobs.



    http://docs.info.apple.com/article.html?artnum=26275



    Quote:
    Originally Posted by melgross


    But when you call for support, you must give them the number. I suppose you can fake it by giving the one that was registered, but if the problem on the other machine is machine specific, then support won't be able to help.



    The point is, again, that this is a FAMILY pack license, friends living around the city can't use it with you, unless, as I said, Apple changed their stance on that.



    Dunno. Never rang support, ever.



    Technically, I'm possibly stretching the terms of the licence myself as the family licence is used to update machines I use for my business but then it's a family business ran from home.
  • Reply 129 of 176
    rokrok Posts: 3,519member
    i want to make something clear... go review the keynote movie if you like, but steve was VERY CAREFUL NOT to call Spaces "new" but "new to the Mac." so he isn't lying. it's called "marketing spin." see also: "political spin."
  • Reply 130 of 176
    melgrossmelgross Posts: 33,035member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by aegisdesign


    I'm sure they'd rather have you buy a Family pack than install a single user licence on 5 Macs.



    I'd imagine any Apple employee espousing anything other than the 'Thou shalt not install OSX on more than one machine created by us at a time' commandment would shortly be struck down with a bolt from Jobs.



    http://docs.info.apple.com/article.html?artnum=26275







    Dunno. Never rang support, ever.



    Technically, I'm possibly stretching the terms of the licence myself as the family licence is used to update machines I use for my business but then it's a family business ran from home.



    I did say it was unofficial. But Apple used to say it clearly. Now they say it and shrug. The legalese must be there, but it isn't being enforced the way MS does it, because they do have that unofficial position that, after all, it will be installed on a Mac. The concession is that there will be no support.
  • Reply 131 of 176
    vox barbaravox barbara Posts: 2,021member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by ggshmoogly


    I

    ...

    As for "spaces"...how many more features can they possibly add to shuffle windows around? Command-H and command-tab are pretty much all you need anyway.

    ..."



    Hahaha. I like your thinking.
  • Reply 132 of 176
    rokrok Posts: 3,519member
    i wonder what happens if you're IN a set of Spaces, and then trigger Exposé? Anyone with a preview release installed at WWDC wanna try and report on what happens? ooh, or maybe trigger a option-shift-minimize on an app with lots of windows open, and while the genie effect is going switch to spaces AND activate exposé.
  • Reply 133 of 176
    a_greera_greer Posts: 4,594member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by rok


    i wonder what happens if you're IN a set of Spaces, and then trigger Exposé? Anyone with a preview release installed at WWDC wanna try and report on what happens? ooh, or maybe trigger a option-shift-minimize on an app with lots of windows open, and while the genie effect is going switch to spaces AND activate exposé.



    and dashboard: differant dashboards in each space? and what happens if you hit F12 in the 4-up view...



    Also, can you up it to say 6 or 8 spaces?
  • Reply 134 of 176
    meelashmeelash Posts: 1,045member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by a_greer


    and dashboard: differant dashboards in each space? and what happens if you hit F12 in the 4-up view...



    Also, can you up it to say 6 or 8 spaces?



    Given the logo, and the onscreen animation when switching spaces, I would say that, at least for now, four seems to be the limit. And I agree the possibilities are definitely exciting. As someone who's used multiple desktops on Linux, I'm definitely looking forward to Apple's implementation.
  • Reply 135 of 176
    hobbeshobbes Posts: 1,252member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by a_greer


    and dashboard: differant dashboards in each space? and what happens if you hit F12 in the 4-up view...



    Dashboard is global -- I don't think each Space will have a different Dashboard.



    Quote:
    Originally Posted by a_greer


    Also, can you up it to say 6 or 8 spaces?



    You can apparently add as many Spaces as you want.
  • Reply 136 of 176
    gene cleangene clean Posts: 3,481member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by mark2005


    Time Machine is way beyond System Restore. And that's discounting the user interface, and the assumption that it works. Go read about it some more.





    Time Machine is what OpenVMS was 20 years ago (and still is). It's what Dirvish and Wayback in Linux are, and what Windows Server 2003 calls Volume Shadow Copy.
  • Reply 137 of 176
    kickahakickaha Posts: 8,760member
    But with a usable interface.



    I've said it before, and I'll say it again - all the power in the world does you squat if you can't get to it easily.



    I used to use VMS daily, and the versioning was a pain in the ass to use for anything but the most simple actions. Most users never used it, and just wanted it to get out of their way.



    I use a custom rsync script set now, and while it's functional it is not something the average user is going to whip up or even be able to adequately use in daily tasks.



    TM looks like it makes it grandma-usable, and that's the only thing that really matters to 95+% of the users out there.
  • Reply 138 of 176
    icfireballicfireball Posts: 2,594member
    I must say, after viewing the website version of the preview of leopard -- I was not really impressed that much at all. Certainly not excited about Leopard. After watching the Keynote though, I was impressed. Apple did not do a very good job with their preview.



    With Tiger, I was also much more impressed with the keynote preview than the website preview.
  • Reply 139 of 176
    SpamSandwichSpamSandwich Posts: 33,408member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Hobbes


    You can apparently add as many Spaces as you want.



    Holy cow, I am gonna be lovin' Leopard. Yowza!
  • Reply 140 of 176
    vineavinea Posts: 5,585member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Keda




    I was excited by the possibilities of Core Animation. If these 3D effects are being applied in real time, then it seems like a big step toward a 3D OS environment. Did any of you pick up on this during the 'iTunes' commercial demo? The app was showing album details in real-time...and in a composited 3D environment. Just imagine how else this could be applied. If data are streamed, then many possibilities are presented. Very cool.



    Yes, but not for leopard. It requires a paradigm shift away from the desktop metaphor. There should be some cool apps though and some good exploration of 3D UI techniques.



    Vinea
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