knowitall

proctow said:

sdw2001 said:

javacowboy said:

Honest question:  Have any of you actually tried Surfaces, for work or otherwise?

What are you impressions?  What are the distinct pros and cons?

My employer (school) is replacing our old Dell laptops with Surfaces this year.  I don't know what model, but I have to assume it's the detachable screen laptop one.  I'm sort of interested to try it, but I have a host of major concerns, mostly related to compatibility and connectivity.  I don't even use my laptop for my primary work device....I'm on a personal MacBook Pro.  

I teach music, so I really need an optical drive (I can certainly buy one, I guess).  We also project everything onto smart boards, but I think the new devices may not support it (rumor is they've declared the boards obsolete).   This is a problem, because ALL of my visual aids are in the Smart Notebook software and likely can't be converted.  I think they may have a wireless projection solution.  I will say that at least it will have Bluetooth.  My current windows machine either doesn't have it, or it's not enabled.   

I do have a sinking feeling that I'm going to go back to using the Mac as not only my main administrative and creative machine, but my instructional one as well.  That Surface may become a paperweight.  Don't even get me started on how we all already have iPads, and I can't my Mac on the actual full-access wireless network!  

rattlhed said:

javacowboy said:

Honest question:  Have any of you actually tried Surfaces, for work or otherwise?

What are you impressions?  What are the distinct pros and cons?

I've been using the Surface Pro 4 at work for about 2 years now.  It's not a good machine.  It's buggy, even using Microsoft Office, Excel crashes at least a couple times a week.  Using an external monitor is hit and miss.  Sometimes upon boot it won't recognize the monitor without multiple restarts.  Mapping network drives is a constant struggle as it fails to remember which drives I have mapped.  It's slow and heats up quite often.  Our company was pretty excited about the potential of these machines, but has already started phasing them out in favor of HP laptops which are performing much better.  I have not experience the product after the 4th generation so I don't know if they have improved, but based on my experience I would not recommend them.

GeorgeBMac said:

knowitall said:

rob53 said:

"It was the lack of any modern manufacturing culture, including the schools and apprenticeships needed to train specialized mechanical engineers. " I continue to say that this is the biggest problem and liability corporate American and the United States in general has. Because too much emphasis is placed on generalized testing, pushing students to worthless degrees like MBAs and JDs, and not enough emphasis is placed on teaching students starting in kindergarten how to use their hands and brains to build things is what's causing the USA to fall behind other countries in manufacturing. Americans are lazy and want an easy desk job without getting their hands dirty. Schools need to bring back the arts as well as vocational education. There's nothing wrong with being a plumber, contractor or laborer, except in the minds of lazy people who were never taught how to use a hammer, saw or even a paint roller. I can't see someone wanting to become an engineer is they've never been given the chance to play with toys they've made instead of simply watching TV or exercising their thumbs on their phones. Parents needs to introduce their kids to building things instead of simply buying prebuilt toys. I started out building my toys, learned how to work on a car, basically taught myself electronics and computerized systems (I'm older so we didn't have the classes kids have now) and was taught woodworking by my grandfather, which I really enjoy. 

Before everyone blames Apple for going to China to have things built, look in the mirror and ask yourself whether you have the ability or desire to do it. For many on this forum the answer will be yes but ask your family and friends the same question and I bet the answers will overwhelmingly be NO.


DED: what happened to your https://roughlydraftedbeta.com website? Is it in production?

I agree completely.
Only, I think the real question is can it currently be done in the USA and in a competitive way.
And the answer is yes, as Musks Tesla mega factories demonstrate.  
When you don't try the answer is always no.
Skill sets can rapidly be generated, for example by hands-on training at the workplace and special learn/work classes.
In general industry complains about the level and type of education and the answer is do it (educate) yourself. 
With great result as is shown in Teslas case.
How do you think China got is ‘skilled workforce’, this is a military style operation, factory's select the people actually already being able to do the tasks at hand. This is possible because they can choose from millions of people. So no education is involved at all ...

That is quite obviously true. 
But still, obstacles remain.   One is the 'tomato syndrome' (nobody wants to pick tomatoes).   Another is education (we graduated generations of workers from our schools who could barely read).  Another is corporate greed (where they do not want to divert money from their bonuses and buybacks to invest in their own workers), and another is the industrial infrastructure (the steel mills didn't stand by themselves, they had a network of satellite support operations).   Another is the health of the workforce (too many are fat and sick from pizza, beer and BigMacs).  Another is the switch to managed corporations owned by disinterested owners (Part of the cause of the Great Recession was investment banks had switched from partner owners running the business to remote stock holders putting their faith in managers who were mostly interested in their quarterly bonuses rather than growing the business).

Yes, it CAN be done.
But Tesla may not be the best example:  their ultra high selling prices can hide a lot of inefficiencies.   And, even if all cars were made here that way, to be able to afford the cars they make the factories would need to be paying exorbitant salaries.

We have never really come to grips with WHY basic American industry died.   Essentially, Japan came in with better, newer factories, better management and better workers and not even protective tariffs could protect American industry from the competition.  Our answer to the superior competition was globalization (NAFTA, etc.) and competing with those things that we did best.   Globalization wasn't the cause of the demise of American industry, it was the response.    Instead of taking a good, hard look at ourselves and what we did wrong (and there were many things on all sides) we try to blame 'the other' (management blames the worker, the worker blames management and everybody blames the government) -- while continuing to believe we are the mightiest in the world.   I think like any addict we will need to hit rock bottom before seeking to pull ourselves up to once again reach our full potential.

Added:  When was the last time you heard of a major Chinese corporation being shut down with a strike -- and having to pay out billions in pension costs?   And, even the settlement continues to shut down U.S. plants -- and then replace thousands of highly paid workers with hundreds of minimum wage (well, $15/hr) workers.   It's a sign that the U.S. is simply adjusting to the fact that it cannot have its cake and eat it to.