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  • Compared: 14-inch MacBook Pro vs. 13-inch M1 MacBook Pro vs. Intel 13-inch MacBook Pro

    tht said:
    So if the 4x claim is true, what is a plausible explanation? 
    It’s on the website:

    Prerelease Cinema 4D S25 real-time 3D performance tested using a 1.98GB scene. 

    Prerelease Cinema 4D S25 and prerelease Redshift v3.0.54 tested using a 1.32GB scene.

    Tested with prerelease Affinity Photo 1.10.2.263 using the built-in benchmark version 11021. 

    These all are 4x (M1 Max) and 2x (M1 Pro) over the 5600M.
    Right, it's 4x faster than the 5600M but what I'm trying to say is that we cannot use the GeekBench numbers as a guide, which would match the M1 Max up to a 20+ TeraFLOPS AMD Radeon Pro W6900X. But the M1 Max clear match the top AMD or NVIDA mobile chips, using 40% less power.

    One more chip to go! The M1 Max Extreme or whatever they call it. If it's a 64-core GPU it will match the top card but to match the dual cards it will have to be 128-cores. That's going to be one big wafer. If the power saving scale up, it's going to be a game changer.
    watto_cobra
  • Compared: 14-inch MacBook Pro vs. 13-inch M1 MacBook Pro vs. Intel 13-inch MacBook Pro

    From the article: "[M1 Pro] GPU performance is twice as fast as before. Then there's the M1 Max processor. Apple says it provides up to four times faster GPU performance than the M1."

    That's not even close to correct. Apple is making a MUCH STRONGER claim. They claimed 2x and 3.5x faster... but faster than what?

    Apple's comparison was not against an M1, but rather against the top-upgrade 5600m from the previous intel 16". That GPU is generally a LOT faster than the M1's- ranging from 40% to over 150% faster. Metal scores are, IIRC, about 100% faster. If you go with a (very!) conservative 50% faster, then you get the M1 Pro being 3x faster than the M1, not 2x. And you get the M1 Max being 5.25x faster than the M1.

    This is interesting, because among other things it tells us that the cores in the M1Pro/Max are almost certainly NOT the same cores as in the M1, since performance vs. M1 is scaling better than linearly with core count. They are, as expected, the cores from the A15. In other words, the M1 Pro/Max is really what we were all thinking of as an M2.

    The performance can't be coming just from higher clock speed, given the power envelope. It's conceivable it could be coming from slightly higher clocks plus better non-core logic but that seems... extremely far-fetched. Even taking into account the SLC, which would be in this context function equivalently to AMD's "Infinity cache".
    You're correct. Apple compared the M1 Max against the 5600M GPU. I'm certain there has been some improvements to the GPU core, but nothing that explains 4x performance over the 5600M.

    The general assumption is that the 32-core would be 4x as fast as the the M1 but that would only be 2x as fast as the 5600M using the GeekBench Metal score. If the 32-core GPU is 4x times the 5600 that would give it a GeekBench Metal sore of 170,000. That equals the top GPU Metal score for a desecrate GPU in the MacPro (AMD Radeon Pro W6900X). I serious doubt the performance of each core was doubled to accomplish that or that the M1 Max GPU could match that dGPU, that just doesn't sound plausible, when the M1 Max is only rate at 10 TeraFLOPS, half the 20+ TeraFLOPS of the AMD Radeon Pro W6900X.

    So if the 4x claim is true, what is a plausible explanation? 

    My guess is the 4x claim is not peak but SUSTAINED performance compared to the 16" MBP with a 5600M; they say it right on the chart. The biggest difference between the two is the thermal envelope and the extreme difference in the available memory, bandwidth, memory bandwidth and cache sizes. I'm guessing the M1 Max can go fully throttle through a task that would throttle a 5600M. There are also some other difference too, if you take the dedicated encoding engines into account too.

    We'll just have to wait for the tests to see how this shakes out.

    "The packaging for the M1 Max changes slightly in that it’s bigger – the most obvious change is the increase of DRAM chips from 2 to 4, which also corresponds to the increase in memory interface width from 256-bit to 512-bit. Apple is advertising a massive 400GB/s of bandwidth, which if it’s LPDDR5-6400, would possibly be more exact at 409.6GB/s. This kind of bandwidth is unheard of in an SoC, but quite the norm in very high-end GPUs...

    The additional two 128-bit LPDDR5 blocks are evident, and again it’s interesting to see here that they’re also increasing the number of SLC blocks along with them. If indeed at 16MB per block, this would represent 64MB of on-chip generic cache for the whole SoC to make use of. Beyond the obvious GPU uses, I do wonder what the CPUs are able to achieve with such gigantic memory bandwidth resources." - Anandtech

    https://www.anandtech.com/show/17019/apple-announced-m1-pro-m1-max-giant-new-socs-with-allout-performance


    watto_cobra
  • Apple unveils 16-inch MacBook Pro with M1 Pro, M1 Max starting at $2499

    No new iMac.
    No new Mac Mini.
    So disappointing.
    We re desktop people.
    lol oh jeeze. iMac and Mini already got M1 upgrades last time. MBP line is being completed since the low end was the first a year ago. Larger iMac likely next next. 
    Nobody seem to notice that 4x the 5600M GPU makes the M1 as fast as the highest GPU in the MacPro, while consuming 50% power. 168,783 is the highest Metal benchmark on GeekBench and 4x the 5600M is 170,000. That's insane. It's probably no sustained due tot he thermals but, it might be due to the unified memory.

    The M1, M1 Pro and M1 Max pretty much cover everything up to but not including the MacPro. Whatever is going into the MacPro will be insane. M1 Extreme?


    docno42williamlondonargonautwatto_cobra
  • Apple unveils 16-inch MacBook Pro with M1 Pro, M1 Max starting at $2499

    Appleish said:
    The casing looks just like my MBP from about 12 years ago.
    The keyboard assemble is difference. It appears the the keyboard is now separate from the case but in back aluminum and the keys have a slightly different shape and appear to be slight closer together. I expect to see this on the next generation of 13" models along with mini-LED and all the other improvements, minus the HDMI / Card Reader ports. I'm guess the foot print of the next 13" will decrease slightly too, which is why they tightened the keyboard.

    Other than that or changing the color, I don't really see what there is to improve visually.
    williamlondonwatto_cobra
  • Apple unveils 16-inch MacBook Pro with M1 Pro, M1 Max starting at $2499

    There is simply no PC laptop that comes close to this beast. Basically, double the power/performance. Any PC laptop build to match it would be much bigger, heavier, and sound like a leaf blower, not to mention the short battery life.

    If the M1 Max really is x4 faster than the 5600M GPU, then it's as fast as the fastest dedicated GPU in the MacPro. That's insane. That's probably peak performance and the sustained is a bit less, but that's still insane. At 4x is would have a Metal score of 170.

    And this is all at the very same price point of the INTEL Macs that this beast is shredding!  :D

    Their is simply nothing comparable on the PC laptop side of the equation.


    docno42williamlondonGG1patchythepirateargonautwatto_cobra