JustSomeGuy1

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  • Apple's 2019 Mac Pro is now three PCIe revisions behind

    JustSomeGuy1JustSomeGuy1
    DuhSesame said:
    To answer one of the questions posted here: Thunderbolt (TB3, specifically) is not tied to a version of PCIe. It is *roughly* equivalent to a PCIe3 x4 link, in bandwidth - 40gbps vs 32gbps. But you can use it with any PCIe.

    And further about the Mac: If you're sticking with Intel chips, you don't have any option for PCIe >3 yet. Though that will change in the next few months with Sapphire Rapids, and if Apple really does release another Intel Mac Pro, it will likely use that, bringing it up to PCIe5. Of course, they could have used AMD, and indeed I think they absolutely should have. Using Zen2, they'd have had PCIe4. And they'd still have that now, with Zen 3... which still puts them only one generation behind.

    There are plenty of problems with the Mac Pro, but this PCIe nonsense is a meaningless sideshow.
    Right, can you list all the problems then?  Zen 2 aren't that reliable back then.
    That's not true. Zen 2 was great, and it basically rewrote the rules for desktop and server. There were minor USB issues that affected some users on the desktop; that's about it, and very easily worked around, if Apple cared, given the 128 lanes of PCIe4 coming from each chip (64 each usable in two-chip systems, still 128 total).

    And no, I won't make a list, it's been done to death here in the past including by me. However in brief - the Mac Pro was competitive and a class leader for Intel systems, but grossly uncompetitive against AMD systems. The SSD setup is some serious engineering but brings relatively few benefits compared to the repairability drawbacks. The lack of nVIDIA drivers, while possibly not Apple's fault, still holds them back significantly in some applications.

    But the biggest problem with the Mac Pro is new since then... which is that it's not new since then. There have been no revisions. That's an appalling error, which they should know better than committing AGAIN after the last decades-long (seemingly, it was actually six years - which is ridiculous anyway) period of stagnation. If SuperMicro (for example) can bring out two dozen new motherboards every year or two for Intel processors, Apple can certainly bring out ONE new motherboard for their Mac Pro. And yet...

    it's my sense that, due to stagnation in the server chip business through 2021 on the Intel side, Apple hasn't yet totally lost all relevance, but they're hanging on by a thread. The M2-based Pro presumably due this year (or perhaps still M1-based, if they're using a four-way symmetrical mirror of the M1 Max) will prevent that, but they will still lose a big chunk of what's left of their market without an x64 system, as much of the Pro software won't be available for the Mx chips yet, and many people will avoid Rosetta despite its overall good performance. So it's still reasonably likely that they will come out with a Sapphire Rapids based Intel Mac Pro this year, along with whatever Mx-based Pro (or iMac Pro) they ship. (And that would be a predictable shame, as an AMD Zen3 system would still be better.) We'll see soon enough.
    thtelijahg

  • Apple's 2019 Mac Pro is now three PCIe revisions behind

    JustSomeGuy1JustSomeGuy1
    To answer one of the questions posted here: Thunderbolt (TB3, specifically) is not tied to a version of PCIe. It is *roughly* equivalent to a PCIe3 x4 link, in bandwidth - 40gbps vs 32gbps. But you can use it with any PCIe.

    And further about the Mac: If you're sticking with Intel chips, you don't have any option for PCIe >3 yet. Though that will change in the next few months with Sapphire Rapids, and if Apple really does release another Intel Mac Pro, it will likely use that, bringing it up to PCIe5. Of course, they could have used AMD, and indeed I think they absolutely should have. Using Zen2, they'd have had PCIe4. And they'd still have that now, with Zen 3... which still puts them only one generation behind.

    There are plenty of problems with the Mac Pro, but this PCIe nonsense is a meaningless sideshow.
    williamlondonwatto_cobra

  • Apple's 2019 Mac Pro is now three PCIe revisions behind

    JustSomeGuy1JustSomeGuy1
    This article is an embarrassment to AI. The first sentence is a lie.

    It says the Mac Pro "is now several generations behind what's currently available". The VERY FIRST PCIe5 machines, using Intel's Alder Lake, came out in late 2021. All servers in the world that currently exist are PCIe4. (Well, except for POWER10 IBM servers, which started shipping late 2021, but they are inconsequential.) Equally importantly, there aren't any PCIe5 devices to plug into your PCIe5 slots yet. Maybe this week, if the SSDs announced last week at CES actually ship. PCIe6, as admitted at the end of the article, will not ship AT THE EARLIEST until this time next year - though realistically, it's unlikely to be anywhere near that soon. And it'll be even longer until you can buy cards that use it.

    So, being generous to the author, the Mac Pro is about to be two generations behind... though by that reading, every other server on the planet is one generation behind. By no definition of the word is it "several".

    The sad thing is, there are legitimate and strong complaints to be made about the Mac Pro. That's what the author should have done.
    williamlondonmuthuk_vanalingamtokyojimuwatto_cobra

  • Apple's 'For All Mankind' tops USA Today's best TV of 2021

    JustSomeGuy1JustSomeGuy1
    "For All Mankind" -- Haven't watched it and don't plan to.

    Landing a man on the moon, despite enormous cost in energy, money and human lives, was an enormous triumph not only for the U.S. but for all of mankind:  "One tiny step for man...."  And, at the same time, the world agreed to keep space open for all without military rivalries or interventions.

    No, rewrite of that history can improve on what was accomplished there.
    The reality is far superior to any fiction.  I prefer to cherish the reality.  The hope and opportunity that it promised has shaped my life and that of others -- such as Steve Jobs who also grew up in that era where even the sky was no longer the limit.
    The reality was truly better than fiction... until it wasn't. The will to be great died in the early 70s, and it took some unbalanced and maniacally egotistical billionaire entrepreneurs 45 years to bring it back.

    But whatever you think about the past and present, FAM is an interesting and well-told story and I'm enjoying it greatly so far, even though I have terrible distrust for the creator ("Battlestar Galactica" was one of the worst f*ckups and cheats in the history of SF).
    (and it was all done with paper, pencil and slide rules (even the emergency rescue of Apollo 13) -- computers (even calculators) barely existed back then.  [...]
    Are you ignorant, or exaggerating for effect? That's false, though the computers they used certainly were primitive, and they did do a lot by hand. (In fact, computer technology was driven forward tremendously by the moon shot.)
    williamlondonviclauyyc

  • Tile says AirTags helped its business, still says Apple is 'unfair'

    JustSomeGuy1JustSomeGuy1
    tundraboy said:
    fred1 said:
    Unbelievable. Apple was under no obligation to sell Tiles and they have every right to stop selling them. Quit whining and find a solution. Likewise Apple has every right to change its OS to favor its own products. Welcome to capitalism and competition.
    True, Apple's not obligated to sell Tiles. Their whining about that is a waste of breath.

    On the other hand, it's been established for many decades now that a monopoly platform company can be forced to open that platform to others. 
    Umm, Apple doesn't have a monopoly platform in iOS.

    With Android as a not insignificant competitor, iOS isn't even a dominant platform like Microsoft had with Windows before Mac sales got some traction after the Intel switch.

    So all your succeeding examples touting the case of Microsoft Windows is totally inapplicable.

    BTW, gaining market share is not evidence of monopoly.  If it's evidence for anything at all, it's that more and more consumers like your product.  When customers liking your product makes you a monopoly, that's the end of the free enterprise system.
    I mostly agree with you. I don't think Apple holds a monopoly. However they unquestionably have significant market power and that's been enough to get targeted in the past, sometimes. More to the point, the fact that I agree with you doesn't means that courts always will. Apple won a significant victory against Epic recently, but the judge was very noncommittal in addressing that question - she basically said that Apple might be a monopoly, but that hadn't been demonstrated. And note that even without establishing that Apple is a monopoly, she ruled against them in part, which reinforces what I said first - you don't have to be a monopoly to come under scrutiny (and perhaps enforcement).

    You seem to have missed my other point. It's not at all unlikely that Apple will be subjected to new laws by a hostile government, before being subject to application of existing monopoly laws. There's no requirement of a monopoly finding, or really anything else, in such a case. Congress regulates interstate commerce, and the courts are generally not going to get in the way of that.
    muthuk_vanalingamMplsP