miiwtwo

mpantone said:

miiwtwo said:

mpantone said:

miiwtwo said:

with a 3500 starting price, i dont think so, maybe in 2025 or 2026, besides they dont have an AI, comes from google and others   

Which is why the target price increased from $210 to $220, less than a 5% increase.

As for AI, Apple has shipped hardware with it (or more accurately machine learning) since 2017, starting with the A11 SoC in the iPhone X and iPhone 8 series, in the form of the Neural Engine.

There isn't just one path entering the massive machine learning realm. Apple is unsurprisingly taking their own approach to it, different than how Nvidia has entered the machine learning universe.

One thing I guarantee you, Apple isn't going to be shipping their own AI accelerator cards to third parties to shove into datacenter racks. Apple will keep their machine learning hardware for their customers to provide a competitive advantage in the same way they don't sell A-series and M-series chips to outsiders.

It is likely that Apple will release a cheaper sibling to Vision Pro in the future if the platform is viable and shows good growth potential. Remember that the original iPhone (2007) released at a carrier subsidized price of $600. That's in 2007 dollars. But eventually prices came down with future models released that addressed the lower end of the market (iPhone SE, the minis, 5C, etc.).

Without a doubt there are hundreds of Vision prototypes sitting in labs in Cupertino, some of which may see the light of day as a future retail product. Undoubtedly Apple's senior management team understands that not everyone can fork out $3500 for an HMD, especially when the Meta Quest 3 is $500 and the previous generation Quest 2 is $300. Again, somewhere in a lab in Cupertino is a room full of competitors' products. I wouldn't be surprised if the retail price is taped onto the unit as a reminder to everyone.

so you need to release an expensive product to know if will works mmm im not sure sir, press says than meta loses money with the quest 3 so ...

Apple has a long history of jumping into any given market at a premium price point.

Don't you remember CmdrTaco (Rob Malda) of Slashdot's dismissal of the original iPod? "No wireless? Less space than a Nomad? Lame."

Apple entered the MP3 player market with a product more expensive than the competition. They did the same with iPhones and iPads. Same with the Apple Watch. Hell, people still refer to the "Apple tax." Owned the >$1000 PC market for years and years, they still own the premium segment.

Even the iPod shuffle ($79) -- their low end MP3 player -- competed against no-name MP3 players around the $20-25 price point. Maybe Creative had a $30 player.

They always aim for the premium price point, walk away with most of the industry's profits because selling cheap stuff at razor thin margins doesn't turn you into a company with a $3 trillion market cap.

VR/AR is still far from being considered a mature market.

Apple never thinks they need to win on unit sales. They want to clean up on gross margins. Nothing new, this has been their modus operandii for well over twenty years.

mpantone said:

miiwtwo said:

with a 3500 starting price, i dont think so, maybe in 2025 or 2026, besides they dont have an AI, comes from google and others   

Which is why the target price increased from $210 to $220, less than a 5% increase.

As for AI, Apple has shipped hardware with it (or more accurately machine learning) since 2017, starting with the A11 SoC in the iPhone X and iPhone 8 series, in the form of the Neural Engine.

There isn't just one path entering the massive machine learning realm. Apple is unsurprisingly taking their own approach to it, different than how Nvidia has entered the machine learning universe.

One thing I guarantee you, Apple isn't going to be shipping their own AI accelerator cards to third parties to shove into datacenter racks. Apple will keep their machine learning hardware for their customers to provide a competitive advantage in the same way they don't sell A-series and M-series chips to outsiders.

It is likely that Apple will release a cheaper sibling to Vision Pro in the future if the platform is viable and shows good growth potential. Remember that the original iPhone (2007) released at a carrier subsidized price of $600. That's in 2007 dollars. But eventually prices came down with future models released that addressed the lower end of the market (iPhone SE, the minis, 5C, etc.).

Without a doubt there are hundreds of Vision prototypes sitting in labs in Cupertino, some of which may see the light of day as a future retail product. Undoubtedly Apple's senior management team understands that not everyone can fork out $3500 for an HMD, especially when the Meta Quest 3 is $500 and the previous generation Quest 2 is $300. Again, somewhere in a lab in Cupertino is a room full of competitors' products. I wouldn't be surprised if the retail price is taped onto the unit as a reminder to everyone.

tundraboy said:

twolf2919 said:

... I think Apple jumped the shark with this AR "wannabe" VR headset.  I'm not sure why developers - especially small ones - would write software, i.e. potential killer apps, for it when Apple has given no timeline for a device (the vaunted AR glasses) that will have mass market appeal and thus provide a return on their investment.

In 25 plus years of following Apple closely in the pundit space, I think they have "jumped the shark" at least 4 times.  The Pod, the Phone, the Pad, the Watch, and yet here they are still.  Unexplainedly alive and keeping and the most successful tech company in the universe.  Here comes Vision Pro now and darn it, they're water skiing over it again.

The Vision Pro isn't for everyone.  It is a niche product, Apple knows it's a niche product.  But they need to release one to start exploring the headset product space and what it needs to offer if it is to be successful.  For sure they know it needs to be lighter and less bulky.  Few people enjoy having a barnacle stuck on their face.  Obviously the tech isn't there yet but offering a timeline on that is a fool's game for two reasons: First, technological advancements are not that easy to predict --fusion power has been 'just around the corner' for at least 30 years now.  Second, and this problem weighs more on Apple's decision making, even if they have a firm grasp on when the lightweight headset will be realized, announcing a timeline amounts to  telling your potential customers "Don't buy this one, wait a couple of years."  How stupid is that?  

There is no guarantee that Apple will get Vision Pro right but it wasn't until around iPod 4 when sales started to reach mass market levels, likewise around iPhone 4 or 5 for iPhone.  It will take a few more years for Vision Pro to catch on, if it ever catches on.  But if I'm laying a wager on who is going to succeed in making a headset computer a mass market product, I'd say the best bet would be Apple.