asdasd

steve_jobs said:

 That's what "globalization" is all about.

Good globalisation - when US capitalists get richer at the expense of workers. 

Beats said:

Rayz2016 said:

Thought I’d post this because by the way some people here talk, I think they’ve forgotten that China has actual human beings living there  

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/stories-53566460

I hate the Chinese government and their attack on American IP. That has nothing to do with the working citizen earnings his/her hard earned pay.

Yet this hate is very recent. Wasn’t Russia the monster last year? Then Libya before that. Iran all the time. Then Iraq, Syria, Venezuela. Anywhere the empire is challenged. This time though there are conflicting elite interests. A war against Iraq doesn’t harm US industry all that much or even trade sanctions with Iran or whomever. This trade war could cripple US industry, and the US is also at trade war with the EU. Therefore expect industry pushback. None of this would bring jobs home. Applying tariffs to Foxconn unless they assemble in the US might have helped but this isn’t about that, it’s about “national security” or sabre rattling.

tmay said:

Rayz2016 said:

Thought I’d post this because by the way some people here talk, I think they’ve forgotten that China has actual human beings living there  

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/stories-53566460

That's cool,

Now, show some stories of Uyghur families that have been brought back together, or young Uyghur women who weren't sterilized, or those that weren't send to reeducation camps.

https://www.justsecurity.org/71615/chinas-forced-sterilization-of-uyghur-women-violates-clear-international-law/

How about involuntary organ harvesting;

https://www.healtheuropa.eu/forced-organ-harvesting/91152/

Generally whenever the US empire is on the warpath it monsters its enemies. None of this stuff was reported in any major fashion until the recent trade war. In the opposite side though, once the US leaves a country in misery the flow of information stops. So nothing about the slave markets in Libya. 

GeorgeBMac said:

asdasd said:

GeorgeBMac said:

asdasd said:

GeorgeBMac said:

firelock said:

viclauyyc said:

markbyrn said:

Not mentioned of course is the fact that China has long banned all Google apps, Twitter, Facebook,, etc.  This order should have come long ago and strictly as a matter of reciprocity.  

Do American has to set their standards this low? Comparing with China is not much better than comparing Nazi.

It makes no sense for the United States to allow another country to block our biggest tech companies from operating, yet not apply the same standard to them. When China starts acting like a free market then we can happily do business with them. 

But, that's the trouble:   China DID start acting like a free market and beat us at it:  They made (and make) things better, faster and cheaper.   So, the free markets migrated there.   It's just how free markets work.   We should know that.   We knew that.   But we forgot after we got fat, spoiled and lazy.

In no sense is China a free market. Sure it became more market orientated since Mao but the state and particularly the state owned banks dictate a lot of policy. I’m not knocking it, the fully free market has had its day. 

All globalisation has to be agreed to. It’s not an inevitable fact of nature, as some say. The US And the West had to agree to allow Japan and China trade freely. The former was allowed for Cold War reasons, the latter because of the greed of capitalists. Moving manufacturing to china isn’t inevitable, the Germans have tried to protect industry, as have the Japanese who don’t outsource to China. Nor does china outsource much itself. 

Sorry, but that's how free markets work:   The work and the business go to those who do it better, faster and cheaper.

Now that we got beat at that game we want to make excuses and change the rules.    It's really pretty sad.

The work and business can only go to countries if there is a trade agreement. Clearly. 

You are confusing the terms “free market” and globalisation. The former describes an economic system with little government interference (particularly little or no government ownership of production, all capitalist countries have social welfare and anti monopoly laws). The second is the ideology that everybody benefits if tariffs are reduced worldwide. You can have the former without the latter - the US was highly unregulated in the 19C but was behind a huge tariff wall. You can have the latter without the former if you let non market countries compete in global markets, which is where China sits. 

LOL...  That's what happens when you ignore (or never knew) history!

History is clear:

1)   Our basic industries that had been hugely profitable were being challenged by Japan because they were doing it better, cheaper and faster.   

2)  We tried to protect those industries with protective tariffs.  The effort failed.  Industry was fleeing the country left and right.

3)   Globalization stepped in to save what was left of American industry.

4)   Now we are going back to step #2 because people are believing a populist charlatan who tells them "I will save you!   And, only I can save you!"   And, just like the desperate, displaced workers believed Hitler 90 years ago, scared, humiliated, desperate displaced workers believe the same spiel from the current day Hitler.

The idea that I know less than you is quite amusing. You were using the free market as a synonym for globalisation until schooled. 

GeorgeBMac said:

asdasd said:

GeorgeBMac said:

firelock said:

viclauyyc said:

markbyrn said:

Not mentioned of course is the fact that China has long banned all Google apps, Twitter, Facebook,, etc.  This order should have come long ago and strictly as a matter of reciprocity.  

Do American has to set their standards this low? Comparing with China is not much better than comparing Nazi.

It makes no sense for the United States to allow another country to block our biggest tech companies from operating, yet not apply the same standard to them. When China starts acting like a free market then we can happily do business with them. 

But, that's the trouble:   China DID start acting like a free market and beat us at it:  They made (and make) things better, faster and cheaper.   So, the free markets migrated there.   It's just how free markets work.   We should know that.   We knew that.   But we forgot after we got fat, spoiled and lazy.

In no sense is China a free market. Sure it became more market orientated since Mao but the state and particularly the state owned banks dictate a lot of policy. I’m not knocking it, the fully free market has had its day. 

All globalisation has to be agreed to. It’s not an inevitable fact of nature, as some say. The US And the West had to agree to allow Japan and China trade freely. The former was allowed for Cold War reasons, the latter because of the greed of capitalists. Moving manufacturing to china isn’t inevitable, the Germans have tried to protect industry, as have the Japanese who don’t outsource to China. Nor does china outsource much itself. 

Sorry, but that's how free markets work:   The work and the business go to those who do it better, faster and cheaper.

Now that we got beat at that game we want to make excuses and change the rules.    It's really pretty sad.

The work and business can only go to countries if there is a trade agreement. Clearly.