I don' think there's anything wrong with the Finder.
When the thing uses 190% CPU on my MacBook Pro doing absolutely nothing, and I can reproduce it, and the problem has existed for years, then yes, there is something very wrong.
When the thing uses 190% CPU on my MacBook Pro doing absolutely nothing, and I can reproduce it, and the problem has existed for years, then yes, there is something very wrong.
Just curious, under which conditions this happens in your system? I remember having seen the Finder tax much the CPU just to preview a Quicktime movie (just select it to preview but not play). Is something similar in your case?
Just curious, under which conditions this happens in your system? I remember having seen the Finder tax much the CPU just to preview a Quicktime movie (just select it to preview but not play). Is something similar in your case?
Yes, a video QuickTime tries and fails to preview. If you cancel this in the meantime, QuickTime will cancel, but Finder will continue to wait for QuickTime, and will use up as CPU as possible doing so, and all you can do is relaunch.
Yes, a video QuickTime tries and fails to preview. If you cancel this in the meantime, QuickTime will cancel, but Finder will continue to wait for QuickTime, and will use up as CPU as possible doing so, and all you can do is relaunch.
I see. As far as bad use (or abuse) of system resources is concerned, the Finder is perhaps the strongest link between the Mac OS X and the older Mac OS 8 or 9 behavior. It needs a massive clean up.
Yes, a video QuickTime tries and fails to preview. If you cancel this in the meantime, QuickTime will cancel, but Finder will continue to wait for QuickTime, and will use up as CPU as possible doing so, and all you can do is relaunch.
I despise when that happens.
Quote:
Originally Posted by PB
I see. As far as bad use (or abuse) of system resources is concerned, the Finder is perhaps the strongest link between the Mac OS X and the older Mac OS 8 or 9 behavior. It needs a massive clean up.
Yes, a video QuickTime tries and fails to preview. If you cancel this in the meantime, QuickTime will cancel, but Finder will continue to wait for QuickTime, and will use up as CPU as possible doing so, and all you can do is relaunch.
I had to disable the preview pane in the window (view?) preferences of Finder because of that happening all the time (I mostly use column view). With large QuickTime movies, Finder waits for ages before showing the preview window...
Same with network volumes on a server that isn't powered on, it takes Finder ages before the error message appears.
I noticed Scott Forstall quietly mentioned there would be finder features in Leopard's version of spotlight. I wouldn't be surprised if they ditched finder as a separate app altogether.
But
In the Time Machine demo he refered to the finder as "a standard finder window" hmmmm maybe they are keeping finder after all with enhancements.
Oh, they'll keep finder I'm sure. Spotlight should never be considered a "replacement" for finder. I use quicksilver a fair amount these days, but even that cannot replace finder completely, and nor should it.
I had to disable the preview pane in the window (view?) preferences of Finder because of that happening all the time (I mostly use column view). With large QuickTime movies, Finder waits for ages before showing the preview window...
Same with network volumes on a server that isn't powered on, it takes Finder ages before the error message appears.
I don't see that on my machine. It could be because of the codec, which requires that QT does certain things like flip4mac, loading it completely into a container.
Finder isn't perfect, no one said that, but trying to throw bugs at or some other thing that may or may not be linked to the finder, is a different matter.
People that say fix it, don't know why it's broken in the first place is just as naive as the maker.
anyone think that "standard finder window" could have just meant "standard finder window"? i mean, such overanalysis of the significance of the word "standard" is really grasping at straws.
I don't see that on my machine. It could be because of the codec, which requires that QT does certain things like flip4mac, loading it completely into a container.
Finder isn't perfect, no one said that, but trying to throw bugs at or some other thing that may or may not be linked to the finder, is a different matter.
If you had read my response to Chucker's post in the context, instead of calling anybody naive, you would have realised that I was confirming the Finder's weird behaviour in a certain situation that Chucker was telling us about. I don't see why describing something (that in my case worked well a few revisions of the OS / Finder ago - long before 10.4.7 - and that now doesn't work any more as it used to) AND also posting a solution to the same problem should be called throwing bugs. But perhaps that's just me.
Fact is: the Finder can be completely unresponsive in certain situations, whatever the cause is, and that should be fixed. Period. Same thing with network volume time-outs, they are just set too long.
Quote:
People that say fix it, don't know why it's broken in the first place is just as naive as the maker.
If you could please let us know what you really wanted to tell us by this sentence? People who say (...) are just as naive as who?!?
Integrate iTunes features into the Finder such as:
1. In list view, highlight every other row in a light blue.
2. In list view, allow adding/changing metadata by clicking twice (like in iTunes).
3. In list view, allow adding custom columns of metadata. Also, add size to fit option in right click menu.
4. Make left sidebar the same light blue color used in iTunes.
Also,
5. Make folders stay at the top in all views. This could be a global option.
6. Fix problem with stalls when using network shares.
7. Add more information to copy/move dialogs. Also make them smarter. If a file name already exists, tell me if their file size is the same. There are many potential improvements with those dialogs.
8. In column view, add option to auto fit to largest sized item.
9. In thumbnail/icon view, add size slider in the main window so it's easier to scale them. Remember the setting in each folder. Also add Finder option to globally set the size (overwrites custom sizes).
10. Add breadcrumbs similar to Pathfinder in details and thumbnail views. This should be an option, on by default.
11. Add tabs. This should be an option, off by default.
12. Make adding metadata easier. I want to click on a folder and be able to add a copywrite note or add keywords or add author to all files contained in the folder quickly and easily. Or, select multiple files and add metadata to them in one step. This one is a pipe dream of mine.
This is a good start. There are a lot more things I'd like to see but that'll do it for now.
Someone did already ask exactly the same question, but since this forum's search is still broken, I guess it's not your fault that you didn't know that.
My $0.02 can be found from that thread here, and I've got some additional things I'd like (some from ideas that I've seen suggested elsewhere):
1.) Alternate line colourings for List View and Column View.
2.) Possibility to set your own colours for labels.
3.) The "get info" window should look a lot more like iTunes' get info window, to allow for better editing of metadata, and including the option of adding your own tags. The window should have the green window control widget to switch between Finder's current Get Info window style and this new suggested style.
4.) Update the appearance of Finder windows to bring it inline with iLife 06.
5.) FTP with write ability.
6.) When you press command-f, a window that looks like this appears:
Quite why that is the default, I don't know. It is possible to change the default behaviour to something you'd prefer, but Apple should expose that possibililty to the GUI. It isn't only advanced users who get sick of changing a Finder Search window to what they want it to be every single time they open a search window.
7.) Sticking with the Finder Search, I have my default set up like this:
But when the window is invoked, the search bar in the window's toolbar is highlighted and given focus. So if I start typing, I'll get a search by content and file name, rather than just by file name. Still, having to make the name contains box the focus is less annoying than having to make the other changes I'd have to make if I didn't know about the default_smart.plist trick.
You may wonder what happens if you remove the search box from the toolbar. It adds a "search for" box to the search bar, which, you guessed it, searches by content and file name, and cannot be removed.
Hello Apple! Yes, I get it, Spotlight is amazing and fast and can search the contents of all my files in a flash, but sometimes - actually, most of the time - I don't want to search by content, and I should be able to easily set that as a default.
8.) I submitted this one as a bug report and unbelievably they told me that it "works as intended".
Take a look at the screen shots of this finder search window at different sizes:
The third shot shows the window with all elements of the window visible. The first two shots demonstrate an appallingly sloppy approach that I would expect from Microsoft, not Apple. In the first, how is the user supposed to know that any elements are missing? Nothing looks wrong or amiss.
In the second shot, it just looks ugly.
This problem has already been encountered and properly solved elsewhere in OS X, even in the Finder. For example, make a Finder Window too small to display the full contents of the Toolbar, and a double arrow appears indicating that content is missing:
Why don't they do the same for search-bar buttons?
9.) Stick that in your "there's nothing wrong with the Finder" pipe and smoke it!
I'm convinced they are re-doing the whole thing. It has become a huge ball of spaghetti just like the Classic Finder was. Since it is just an app like any other app, it can just be dropped in whenever they want.
Cocoa has such powerful APIs that they could re-do the whole thing using Core Data and all the other good stuff, and not get stuck in the Carbon patching that painted them into a corner.
Just when Vista finishes looking like Tiger, Leopard WON'T look like Tiger.
Spotlight is a great feature but those screenshots are more proof that it needs to evolve a lot. Apple doesn't seem sure if Spotlight and the Finder should meld into one or stay seperate programs. I hope they get that figured out in Leopard.
They probably brushed off your bug submission because they don't want to work on a problem that isn't going to exist in the next major revision (I hope).
On another subject, the Leopard preview has the "quick look" feature. I am not sure how it's supposed to be better than preview. Are they intending it to replace preview eventually? Currently, the quick look requires you to right click on a file and move the cursor to the quick look selection and then left click. Preview is a quicker double-click on the file. On my machine, quick look is no faster than preview. I'm not sure what the advantage of quick look is. What are they planning here? Quick look is definately nicer looking than preview, especially with it's new hideous looking lozenge buttons.
Spotlight is a great feature but those screenshots are more proof that it needs to evolve a lot. Apple doesn't seem sure if Spotlight and the Finder should meld into one or stay seperate programs. I hope they get that figured out in Leopard.
They probably brushed off your bug submission because they don't want to work on a problem that isn't going to exist in the next major revision (I hope).
But that's not spotlight, it's Finder Search (invoked by pressing command-f in Finder). I would agree that spotlight needs work, but they did mention it at WWDC. Don't know if it's a proper application now so that spotlight windows have a parent.
The problem with the search bar is evident in all places that it is used, for example iTunes:
Comments
I don' think there's anything wrong with the Finder.
Believe me, there are plenty of things wrong with the finder.
I don' think there's anything wrong with the Finder.
When the thing uses 190% CPU on my MacBook Pro doing absolutely nothing, and I can reproduce it, and the problem has existed for years, then yes, there is something very wrong.
When the thing uses 190% CPU on my MacBook Pro doing absolutely nothing, and I can reproduce it, and the problem has existed for years, then yes, there is something very wrong.
Just curious, under which conditions this happens in your system? I remember having seen the Finder tax much the CPU just to preview a Quicktime movie (just select it to preview but not play). Is something similar in your case?
Just curious, under which conditions this happens in your system? I remember having seen the Finder tax much the CPU just to preview a Quicktime movie (just select it to preview but not play). Is something similar in your case?
Yes, a video QuickTime tries and fails to preview. If you cancel this in the meantime, QuickTime will cancel, but Finder will continue to wait for QuickTime, and will use up as CPU as possible doing so, and all you can do is relaunch.
Yes, a video QuickTime tries and fails to preview. If you cancel this in the meantime, QuickTime will cancel, but Finder will continue to wait for QuickTime, and will use up as CPU as possible doing so, and all you can do is relaunch.
I see. As far as bad use (or abuse) of system resources is concerned, the Finder is perhaps the strongest link between the Mac OS X and the older Mac OS 8 or 9 behavior. It needs a massive clean up.
Yes, a video QuickTime tries and fails to preview. If you cancel this in the meantime, QuickTime will cancel, but Finder will continue to wait for QuickTime, and will use up as CPU as possible doing so, and all you can do is relaunch.
I despise when that happens.
I see. As far as bad use (or abuse) of system resources is concerned, the Finder is perhaps the strongest link between the Mac OS X and the older Mac OS 8 or 9 behavior. It needs a massive clean up.
I agree.
Yes, a video QuickTime tries and fails to preview. If you cancel this in the meantime, QuickTime will cancel, but Finder will continue to wait for QuickTime, and will use up as CPU as possible doing so, and all you can do is relaunch.
I had to disable the preview pane in the window (view?) preferences of Finder because of that happening all the time (I mostly use column view). With large QuickTime movies, Finder waits for ages before showing the preview window...
Same with network volumes on a server that isn't powered on, it takes Finder ages before the error message appears.
But
In the Time Machine demo he refered to the finder as "a standard finder window" hmmmm maybe they are keeping finder after all with enhancements.
I had to disable the preview pane in the window (view?) preferences of Finder because of that happening all the time (I mostly use column view). With large QuickTime movies, Finder waits for ages before showing the preview window...
Same with network volumes on a server that isn't powered on, it takes Finder ages before the error message appears.
I don't see that on my machine. It could be because of the codec, which requires that QT does certain things like flip4mac, loading it completely into a container.
Finder isn't perfect, no one said that, but trying to throw bugs at or some other thing that may or may not be linked to the finder, is a different matter.
People that say fix it, don't know why it's broken in the first place is just as naive as the maker.
People that say fix it, don't know why it's broken in the first place is just as naive as the maker.
Ah, but the reverse could be true also. I'm not sure you know why it's *not* broken.
I don't see that on my machine. It could be because of the codec, which requires that QT does certain things like flip4mac, loading it completely into a container.
Finder isn't perfect, no one said that, but trying to throw bugs at or some other thing that may or may not be linked to the finder, is a different matter.
If you had read my response to Chucker's post in the context, instead of calling anybody naive, you would have realised that I was confirming the Finder's weird behaviour in a certain situation that Chucker was telling us about. I don't see why describing something (that in my case worked well a few revisions of the OS / Finder ago - long before 10.4.7 - and that now doesn't work any more as it used to) AND also posting a solution to the same problem should be called throwing bugs. But perhaps that's just me.
Fact is: the Finder can be completely unresponsive in certain situations, whatever the cause is, and that should be fixed. Period. Same thing with network volume time-outs, they are just set too long.
People that say fix it, don't know why it's broken in the first place is just as naive as the maker.
If you could please let us know what you really wanted to tell us by this sentence? People who say (...) are just as naive as who?!?
1. In list view, highlight every other row in a light blue.
2. In list view, allow adding/changing metadata by clicking twice (like in iTunes).
3. In list view, allow adding custom columns of metadata. Also, add size to fit option in right click menu.
4. Make left sidebar the same light blue color used in iTunes.
Also,
5. Make folders stay at the top in all views. This could be a global option.
6. Fix problem with stalls when using network shares.
7. Add more information to copy/move dialogs. Also make them smarter. If a file name already exists, tell me if their file size is the same. There are many potential improvements with those dialogs.
8. In column view, add option to auto fit to largest sized item.
9. In thumbnail/icon view, add size slider in the main window so it's easier to scale them. Remember the setting in each folder. Also add Finder option to globally set the size (overwrites custom sizes).
10. Add breadcrumbs similar to Pathfinder in details and thumbnail views. This should be an option, on by default.
11. Add tabs. This should be an option, off by default.
12. Make adding metadata easier. I want to click on a folder and be able to add a copywrite note or add keywords or add author to all files contained in the folder quickly and easily. Or, select multiple files and add metadata to them in one step. This one is a pipe dream of mine.
This is a good start. There are a lot more things I'd like to see but that'll do it for now.
My $0.02 can be found from that thread here, and I've got some additional things I'd like (some from ideas that I've seen suggested elsewhere):
1.) Alternate line colourings for List View and Column View.
2.) Possibility to set your own colours for labels.
3.) The "get info" window should look a lot more like iTunes' get info window, to allow for better editing of metadata, and including the option of adding your own tags. The window should have the green window control widget to switch between Finder's current Get Info window style and this new suggested style.
4.) Update the appearance of Finder windows to bring it inline with iLife 06.
5.) FTP with write ability.
6.) When you press command-f, a window that looks like this appears:
Quite why that is the default, I don't know. It is possible to change the default behaviour to something you'd prefer, but Apple should expose that possibililty to the GUI. It isn't only advanced users who get sick of changing a Finder Search window to what they want it to be every single time they open a search window.
7.) Sticking with the Finder Search, I have my default set up like this:
But when the window is invoked, the search bar in the window's toolbar is highlighted and given focus. So if I start typing, I'll get a search by content and file name, rather than just by file name. Still, having to make the name contains box the focus is less annoying than having to make the other changes I'd have to make if I didn't know about the default_smart.plist trick.
You may wonder what happens if you remove the search box from the toolbar. It adds a "search for" box to the search bar, which, you guessed it, searches by content and file name, and cannot be removed.
Hello Apple! Yes, I get it, Spotlight is amazing and fast and can search the contents of all my files in a flash, but sometimes - actually, most of the time - I don't want to search by content, and I should be able to easily set that as a default.
8.) I submitted this one as a bug report and unbelievably they told me that it "works as intended".
Take a look at the screen shots of this finder search window at different sizes:
The third shot shows the window with all elements of the window visible. The first two shots demonstrate an appallingly sloppy approach that I would expect from Microsoft, not Apple. In the first, how is the user supposed to know that any elements are missing? Nothing looks wrong or amiss.
In the second shot, it just looks ugly.
This problem has already been encountered and properly solved elsewhere in OS X, even in the Finder. For example, make a Finder Window too small to display the full contents of the Toolbar, and a double arrow appears indicating that content is missing:
Why don't they do the same for search-bar buttons?
9.) Stick that in your "there's nothing wrong with the Finder" pipe and smoke it!
Cocoa has such powerful APIs that they could re-do the whole thing using Core Data and all the other good stuff, and not get stuck in the Carbon patching that painted them into a corner.
Just when Vista finishes looking like Tiger, Leopard WON'T look like Tiger.
Spotlight is a great feature but those screenshots are more proof that it needs to evolve a lot. Apple doesn't seem sure if Spotlight and the Finder should meld into one or stay seperate programs. I hope they get that figured out in Leopard.
They probably brushed off your bug submission because they don't want to work on a problem that isn't going to exist in the next major revision (I hope).
On another subject, the Leopard preview has the "quick look" feature. I am not sure how it's supposed to be better than preview. Are they intending it to replace preview eventually? Currently, the quick look requires you to right click on a file and move the cursor to the quick look selection and then left click. Preview is a quicker double-click on the file. On my machine, quick look is no faster than preview. I'm not sure what the advantage of quick look is. What are they planning here? Quick look is definately nicer looking than preview, especially with it's new hideous looking lozenge buttons.
Spotlight is a great feature but those screenshots are more proof that it needs to evolve a lot. Apple doesn't seem sure if Spotlight and the Finder should meld into one or stay seperate programs. I hope they get that figured out in Leopard.
They probably brushed off your bug submission because they don't want to work on a problem that isn't going to exist in the next major revision (I hope).
But that's not spotlight, it's Finder Search (invoked by pressing command-f in Finder). I would agree that spotlight needs work, but they did mention it at WWDC. Don't know if it's a proper application now so that spotlight windows have a parent.
The problem with the search bar is evident in all places that it is used, for example iTunes:
But that's not spotlight, it's Finder Search (invoked by pressing command-f in Finder).
Which is implemented through Spotlight. Finder Search in 10.3 did not have these problems.