Care to offer any reasons Apple would do this just to be dicks?
Perhaps Apple chose not to include in the ATV terms of service that, by the way, if you all don't rent enough TV episodes during a given year--if certain performance and profitability benchmarks are not achieved--the capability will have to be yanked due to the deals we've made with content owners.
So, it's not about being dicks. It's about the ephemeral nature of services, as opposed to physical ownership.
You guys honestly think Apple (aka the company that held firm for the longest time on 99 cent downloads) honestly wanted to get rid of rentals. The reality is the studios are afraid of Apple and Apple is having a hard time getting licensing from the companies. The same thing is happening to Netflix. Netflix is being squeezed for more then twice what it used to be charged for having the same content.
Apple couldn't get licensing from enough companies to make a worth while entry into the market. Studios are trying to protect the revenue they make from companies like Blockbuster DVD rentals, purchases, and cable providers.
Quote:
Originally Posted by AppleLover2
Maybe not just to be dicks. Maybe despite it making them dicks?
Looking forward to reading of your inside knowledge of the reasons behind this 'smelly' action (maybe such as demands from studios?) You clearly know something we don't. Please share.
I worked for a video on demand company recently, as a contractor, and rentals were 10-1 to purchases in terms of units downloaded. Purchases were about 50% of revenue, however.
If the reason is the studios, then apple should say the reason is the studios.
Maybe not just to be dicks. Maybe despite it making them dicks?
Quote:
Originally Posted by stelligent
Maybe ... likely. Arrogance has always been part of their swagger.
On the other hand, are formal announcements for this sort of change a thing of the past?
Yeah, Apple does what they do, but they have reasons even if you don't agree with them. Somebody's going to have to give me something a little more concrete than "because they could" for me to believe that Apple just arbitrarily pulled the plug on TV rentals for the hell of it.
What a pack of lies. If you believe that "people would rather buy tv shows" I've got some ocean front property in Colorado I'm looking to sell. The fact is that people weren't willing to pay Apple's outrageous pricing for HD. I refuse to support iTunes due to the expense of so many of their offerings. At some point people have to use common sense when it comes to wasting their expendable cash. I'd rather just spend 5 mins. on line & reserve a redbox movie, drive to the nearest box, rent a movie for $1 & copy it if I decide it's worth it. The most current tv shows I just watch on one of the numerous websites that stream for "free" & I have more than I can ever watch.
Yeah, Apple does what they do, but they have reasons even if you don't agree with them. Somebody's going to have to give me something a little more concrete than "because they could" for me to believe that Apple just arbitrarily pulled the plug on TV rentals for the hell of it.
Really, what's the upside for Apple? Anyone?
Not sure if anyone is really suggesting Apple did this whimsically. The point is that they should have announced this change. The new AppleTV was sold (even designed) primarily for rented and streamed content. With rental of TV shows removed, where does AppleTV stand? What about those poor sots who purchased multiple units? The answer, interestingly, was hinted at in Fox's statement on this issue: "To further enhance the value of ownership, we are working with Apple to make content available within their new cloud-based service" (http://allthingsd.com/20110826/apple...on-tv-rentals/). The same article, by the way, includes a statement from Apple as well. A bit late, but at least there is a statement. Since Apple worked hard to convince some studios to lower the rental price to $0.99 per episode, the failure of this feature does show once again that not everything Apple touches is gold.
I'd pay .99 to rent if: I wanted to check out a new series (that I forgot to DVR) out of curiosity, but certainly not enough to buy the season, or even an episode for $3; I wanted to rewatch the last episode from last season before the new season airs tomorrow night.
Personally I am far more inclined to rent an episode for .99 than to buy a season from the iTunes Store, or, especially, to buy a single episode. (Why would you ever buy a single episode of a show, other than as an expensive 'rental'?).
I'd pay 3 to buy a single episode of a series if:
* I was taping a series on my DVR and missed a single episode;
and
it's a show that multiple people in the household watch.
Due to different timetables, renting it wouldn't work well.
Could be. But it could also be simply the fallout from a failed program. Apple is not afraid to pull the plug on something. But sometimes they do it without warning. Ping may disappear too soon, with nary a word.
Ping was a stupid idea. So are 99 cent TV show rentals when you can buy the episode and watch it forever for $1.99.
It would be much smarter for Apple TV to have Hulu or something similar. I can live with a few ads, but I'm just not paying for TV. Especially broadcast TV that I can get for free with bunny ears.
Those bastards - they only seem to care about American customers. What are they? An American company or something?
Sir, I'm delighted to award you the coveted "Stupidest Comment on the Entire Web 2011" Award for Outstanding Achievement in the field of Making Stupid Comments on the Web.
So is this thing still worthless in the UK? We don't have iTunes in the Cloud yet, but then we didn't have TV Show rentals either. Just seems like Apple's done the job for the US version and then just chucked it out the door internationally.
Nah, we don't need renting TV shows when there're plenty of channels they will likely end up on like Dave, or Five USA+1 or whatever. Plus, main TV channels already have web or app equivalents. Them US is the genuine guinea pig.
So is this thing still worthless in the UK? We don't have iTunes in the Cloud yet, but then we didn't have TV Show rentals either. Just seems like Apple's done the job for the US version and then just chucked it out the door internationally.
It was never worthless. Even though I have a workaround and have access to US iTunes content (not Netflix, sadly), literally 95% or more of what I use my Apple TV for here in Hong Kong is streaming music from iTunes to my living room. It's well worth the price of admission for this one feature alone.
This is the smelly side of how Apple operates. They receive just credits for not being afraid to make drastic changes in their product strategies. But raspberries to them for not always being upfront about it. They may announce a new or replacement program in the future. But pulling the rug from under customers just stinks of arrogance.
The all you can eat subscription idea bothers me greatly I must say. It is a Trojan Horse used to ensure that we are FORCED to watch ads...think about it with me for a moment:
starting with the idea that almost all professional video media other than cinematic film is done with the express intent of selling commercials, there are many people that don't want to give up that channel of communication -- hell, where would the iPad/Phone/whatever be without the early iPod ads 10 years ago and the Mac Vs PC ads...given the big company need to mind control, er I mean advertise to the mind controlled drones, er I mean modern day intelligent and informed consumers...Of course right out of the gate there will be no ads, that would cause instant platform failure, but once the new subscription service is intrenched, they will "get more content deals" and the price will go up -- people will bitch and moan about paying $50/Mo for the 3 or 4 shows they want - why subsidize the other million episodes on there? The answer from on high will come "You can have it for $20 a month if you will put up with a pre roll and a minute o ad break in the middle, and slowly over time that ad break will grow until 5 years from now Apple is the new Comcast, except without control of the physical pipe.
I think Apple is going to make a move where every studios are onboard. All studios are selling's TV shows but Apple didn't include buying things in AppleTV because of the file management mess it creates.
BUT, with the upcoming iCoulds, you could buy anything (TV, movies) and just stream it when watching it from the AppleTV. So with iClouds, there is no need to keep files on your PC or AppleTV and it removes file management. It would still be possible to keep bought files on a PC and stream it from there via home sharing if you don't want to steam from the net. The beauty of iclouds is if you loose a file, you can re-downloaded it at anytime.
There is also a chance we will get some kind of subscription package on a monthly fee. or maybe Hulu will be added. This is far from over...
Apple is not toying with you, they are probably force by studios. Maybe a studio decided to drop the offer (FOX/ABC?) and Apple just remove everything instead of going on with 1/4 studios onboard. The TV/movies studios are very resilient with keeping old business models. It looks like they are still not being pirated enough yet to care. They will choke at some point if nothing is done on the internet side.
What a pack of lies. If you believe that "people would rather buy tv shows" I've got some ocean front property in Colorado I'm looking to sell. The fact is that people weren't willing to pay Apple's outrageous pricing for HD. I refuse to support iTunes due to the expense of so many of their offerings. At some point people have to use common sense when it comes to wasting their expendable cash. I'd rather just spend 5 mins. on line & reserve a redbox movie, drive to the nearest box, rent a movie for $1 & copy it if I decide it's worth it. The most current tv shows I just watch on one of the numerous websites that stream for "free" & I have more than I can ever watch.
Apple has nothing to do with pricing on iTunes... blame the studios for selling a dvd 15$ and selling it on iTunes for 20$. Like I said, studios don't like the internet.The studios don't want to hurt there cash cow business model which is cable. Apple do take a 30% cut, but selling physical media probably means losing the same 30% or more to stores and distributers. Same goes for renting.
Personally I am far more inclined to rent an episode for .99 than to buy a season from the iTunes Store, or, especially, to buy a single episode. (Why would you ever buy a single episode of a show, other than as an expensive 'rental'?). If I want the whole season, I am going to want it on Blu-Ray or DVD. (I have zero interest in attempting to maintain/backup a huge video library on hard-drive... already got my hands full with music, photography, etc.)
Yes, I was renting shows. It was an effective way of watching a missed episode etc.
I've also bought episodes but since I never rewatch them it's not worthwhile to me - and also now my purchase history (including bought "free" episodes) is actually hard to browse through.
Ahh well, hopefully Apple has a new plan somewhere here.
I thought the TV show rental model was the way to go because most TV episodes are only ever watched once. I guess a lot of AppleTV owners either go with the season's pass or get their television from other sources.
I simply can't imagine buying a television show. I remember getting 3 seasons of a favourite show on DVD as a Christmas gift. Years later the boxes are still in their shrink wrap. I rarely watch movies more than once, but have a large collection of DVDs because young kids will watch the same thing over and over until the entire family can quote every line.
Please don't flame me on this but isn't this sort of bait and switch sort of illegal? They have taken a key feature away from a product.
I Dont know but have you read the service agreement? (Itunes)
These kind of things happen all the time but apple is NOT typical in that kind. Usually they integrate that functionality into something else which does the same thing. Nokia ie is an example of changing or deleting the whole service after a year. So you cant trust them because they keep changing course all the time.
Comments
Care to offer any reasons Apple would do this just to be dicks?
Perhaps Apple chose not to include in the ATV terms of service that, by the way, if you all don't rent enough TV episodes during a given year--if certain performance and profitability benchmarks are not achieved--the capability will have to be yanked due to the deals we've made with content owners.
So, it's not about being dicks. It's about the ephemeral nature of services, as opposed to physical ownership.
Apple couldn't get licensing from enough companies to make a worth while entry into the market. Studios are trying to protect the revenue they make from companies like Blockbuster DVD rentals, purchases, and cable providers.
Maybe not just to be dicks. Maybe despite it making them dicks?
Looking forward to reading of your inside knowledge of the reasons behind this 'smelly' action (maybe such as demands from studios?) You clearly know something we don't. Please share.
I worked for a video on demand company recently, as a contractor, and rentals were 10-1 to purchases in terms of units downloaded. Purchases were about 50% of revenue, however.
If the reason is the studios, then apple should say the reason is the studios.
Maybe not just to be dicks. Maybe despite it making them dicks?
Maybe ... likely. Arrogance has always been part of their swagger.
On the other hand, are formal announcements for this sort of change a thing of the past?
Yeah, Apple does what they do, but they have reasons even if you don't agree with them. Somebody's going to have to give me something a little more concrete than "because they could" for me to believe that Apple just arbitrarily pulled the plug on TV rentals for the hell of it.
Really, what's the upside for Apple? Anyone?
I'd actually use my AppleTV for more than Netflix then.
Yeah, Apple does what they do, but they have reasons even if you don't agree with them. Somebody's going to have to give me something a little more concrete than "because they could" for me to believe that Apple just arbitrarily pulled the plug on TV rentals for the hell of it.
Really, what's the upside for Apple? Anyone?
Not sure if anyone is really suggesting Apple did this whimsically. The point is that they should have announced this change. The new AppleTV was sold (even designed) primarily for rented and streamed content. With rental of TV shows removed, where does AppleTV stand? What about those poor sots who purchased multiple units? The answer, interestingly, was hinted at in Fox's statement on this issue: "To further enhance the value of ownership, we are working with Apple to make content available within their new cloud-based service" (http://allthingsd.com/20110826/apple...on-tv-rentals/). The same article, by the way, includes a statement from Apple as well. A bit late, but at least there is a statement. Since Apple worked hard to convince some studios to lower the rental price to $0.99 per episode, the failure of this feature does show once again that not everything Apple touches is gold.
I'd pay .99 to rent if: I wanted to check out a new series (that I forgot to DVR) out of curiosity, but certainly not enough to buy the season, or even an episode for $3; I wanted to rewatch the last episode from last season before the new season airs tomorrow night.
Personally I am far more inclined to rent an episode for .99 than to buy a season from the iTunes Store, or, especially, to buy a single episode. (Why would you ever buy a single episode of a show, other than as an expensive 'rental'?).
I'd pay 3 to buy a single episode of a series if:
* I was taping a series on my DVR and missed a single episode;
and
it's a show that multiple people in the household watch.
Due to different timetables, renting it wouldn't work well.
Could be. But it could also be simply the fallout from a failed program. Apple is not afraid to pull the plug on something. But sometimes they do it without warning. Ping may disappear too soon, with nary a word.
Ping was a stupid idea. So are 99 cent TV show rentals when you can buy the episode and watch it forever for $1.99.
It would be much smarter for Apple TV to have Hulu or something similar. I can live with a few ads, but I'm just not paying for TV. Especially broadcast TV that I can get for free with bunny ears.
Those bastards - they only seem to care about American customers. What are they? An American company or something?
Sir, I'm delighted to award you the coveted "Stupidest Comment on the Entire Web 2011" Award for Outstanding Achievement in the field of Making Stupid Comments on the Web.
So is this thing still worthless in the UK? We don't have iTunes in the Cloud yet, but then we didn't have TV Show rentals either. Just seems like Apple's done the job for the US version and then just chucked it out the door internationally.
Nah, we don't need renting TV shows when there're plenty of channels they will likely end up on like Dave, or Five USA+1 or whatever. Plus, main TV channels already have web or app equivalents. Them US is the genuine guinea pig.
So is this thing still worthless in the UK? We don't have iTunes in the Cloud yet, but then we didn't have TV Show rentals either. Just seems like Apple's done the job for the US version and then just chucked it out the door internationally.
It was never worthless. Even though I have a workaround and have access to US iTunes content (not Netflix, sadly), literally 95% or more of what I use my Apple TV for here in Hong Kong is streaming music from iTunes to my living room. It's well worth the price of admission for this one feature alone.
This is the smelly side of how Apple operates. They receive just credits for not being afraid to make drastic changes in their product strategies. But raspberries to them for not always being upfront about it. They may announce a new or replacement program in the future. But pulling the rug from under customers just stinks of arrogance.
"Arrogance"?
Are you sure that is the right word?
99c purchases of course would negate the loss. The Cloud version though wil need to be an addition not a lifetime strait jacket.
starting with the idea that almost all professional video media other than cinematic film is done with the express intent of selling commercials, there are many people that don't want to give up that channel of communication -- hell, where would the iPad/Phone/whatever be without the early iPod ads 10 years ago and the Mac Vs PC ads...given the big company need to mind control, er I mean advertise to the mind controlled drones, er I mean modern day intelligent and informed consumers...Of course right out of the gate there will be no ads, that would cause instant platform failure, but once the new subscription service is intrenched, they will "get more content deals" and the price will go up -- people will bitch and moan about paying $50/Mo for the 3 or 4 shows they want - why subsidize the other million episodes on there? The answer from on high will come "You can have it for $20 a month if you will put up with a pre roll and a minute o ad break in the middle, and slowly over time that ad break will grow until 5 years from now Apple is the new Comcast, except without control of the physical pipe.
BUT, with the upcoming iCoulds, you could buy anything (TV, movies) and just stream it when watching it from the AppleTV. So with iClouds, there is no need to keep files on your PC or AppleTV and it removes file management. It would still be possible to keep bought files on a PC and stream it from there via home sharing if you don't want to steam from the net. The beauty of iclouds is if you loose a file, you can re-downloaded it at anytime.
There is also a chance we will get some kind of subscription package on a monthly fee. or maybe Hulu will be added. This is far from over...
Apple is not toying with you, they are probably force by studios. Maybe a studio decided to drop the offer (FOX/ABC?) and Apple just remove everything instead of going on with 1/4 studios onboard. The TV/movies studios are very resilient with keeping old business models. It looks like they are still not being pirated enough yet to care. They will choke at some point if nothing is done on the internet side.
What a pack of lies. If you believe that "people would rather buy tv shows" I've got some ocean front property in Colorado I'm looking to sell. The fact is that people weren't willing to pay Apple's outrageous pricing for HD. I refuse to support iTunes due to the expense of so many of their offerings. At some point people have to use common sense when it comes to wasting their expendable cash. I'd rather just spend 5 mins. on line & reserve a redbox movie, drive to the nearest box, rent a movie for $1 & copy it if I decide it's worth it. The most current tv shows I just watch on one of the numerous websites that stream for "free" & I have more than I can ever watch.
Apple has nothing to do with pricing on iTunes... blame the studios for selling a dvd 15$ and selling it on iTunes for 20$. Like I said, studios don't like the internet.The studios don't want to hurt there cash cow business model which is cable. Apple do take a 30% cut, but selling physical media probably means losing the same 30% or more to stores and distributers. Same goes for renting.
Personally I am far more inclined to rent an episode for .99 than to buy a season from the iTunes Store, or, especially, to buy a single episode. (Why would you ever buy a single episode of a show, other than as an expensive 'rental'?). If I want the whole season, I am going to want it on Blu-Ray or DVD. (I have zero interest in attempting to maintain/backup a huge video library on hard-drive... already got my hands full with music, photography, etc.)
Yes, I was renting shows. It was an effective way of watching a missed episode etc.
I've also bought episodes but since I never rewatch them it's not worthwhile to me - and also now my purchase history (including bought "free" episodes) is actually hard to browse through.
Ahh well, hopefully Apple has a new plan somewhere here.
I simply can't imagine buying a television show. I remember getting 3 seasons of a favourite show on DVD as a Christmas gift. Years later the boxes are still in their shrink wrap. I rarely watch movies more than once, but have a large collection of DVDs because young kids will watch the same thing over and over until the entire family can quote every line.
Please don't flame me on this but isn't this sort of bait and switch sort of illegal? They have taken a key feature away from a product.
I Dont know but have you read the service agreement? (Itunes)
These kind of things happen all the time but apple is NOT typical in that kind. Usually they integrate that functionality into something else which does the same thing. Nokia ie is an example of changing or deleting the whole service after a year. So you cant trust them because they keep changing course all the time.