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Google introduces Android-powered Apple TV competitor - Page 3

post #81 of 286
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sofabutt View Post

Finally Apple has some competition in this area. Hopefully it will stimulate some upgrades and enhancements to the Apple TV product.

Oh god I hope so.

Maury
post #82 of 286
I have an AppleTV and have bought movies and TV shows from the iTunes store. However, with the multiple hardware partners I can see GoogleTV becoming the market leader. I am therefore starting to worry about content I have bought as it uses DRM and therefore cannot be played on a non-Apple device.
post #83 of 286
Quote:
Originally Posted by stevetim View Post

Actually the iphone does a great job solving keyboard needs ... apple sells a remote app that connects nicely with appleTV.

Except it's not great, because the iPhone and iPod touch are way too expensive. A touch alone costs more than an Apple TV.
post #84 of 286
Quote:
Originally Posted by stevetim View Post

I thought it would be chrome also. Very clever of them to make it android to strengthen the relevance of that OS. Looking at the brief presentation stories and photos i have seen, this looks like a pretty good first iteration. Not sure I will buy yet ... price is a big factor that they have no released.

Chrome OS is practically a non-entity. It's a browser.

If you've seen the Chrome browser, and you've made it run full-screen, then you've seen Chrome OS.
post #85 of 286
Quote:
Originally Posted by Prof. Peabody View Post

The fact that Android will allow itself to be licenced and built into TV's will inevitably push Apple to make their own TV sets.

Apple to swallow Sony in 3, 2, 1 ...

This will not happen. Buying Sony or making TVs.
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post #86 of 286
Quote:
Originally Posted by stevetim View Post

As an Apple TV owner I can tell you this looks like it will blow apple TV away. I still don't understand the lack of browser support on the apple tv.

If they don't take Apple TV out of hobby status ... they might as well shut it down.

Jup youre right about that. This concept is much better.
post #87 of 286
Quote:
Originally Posted by Prof. Peabody View Post

Chrome OS is practically a non-entity. It's a browser.

If you've seen the Chrome browser, and you've made it run full-screen, then you've seen Chrome OS.

If Chrome OS is just a browser then so is WebOS and neither one would have a Linux kernel, be bootable or be classified as an OS. Using WebKit as the GUI is quite clever, IMO.
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post #88 of 286
Quote:
Originally Posted by robogobo View Post

Both of those things are not at all true. mpeg-4 and pdfs display fine. it's not Apple's fault you're one of 7 people who used jpeg2000.

Uh, it is true. Why don't you read what I said again. JPEG2000 has been a standard since, well, the year 2000.
post #89 of 286
Quote:
They said many people these days end up watching videos on the Web, because it's much easier to find what you're looking for and watch it on your own schedule.

I think this sounds exciting!!! But the above quote is only true for techy geeks (like me)...my mom is definitely not hitting the web to look for tv shows My mom does, however, use a DVR. It's really gotta be stupid simple at the end of the day.
post #90 of 286
Quote:
Originally Posted by Orlando View Post

I like my AppleTV but with multiple hardware partners I can see Google very quickly gaining more market share than the AppleTV. Even if AppleTV adds a web browser and AppStore I don't think Apple has enough of a lead.

RIP AppleTV?

Well considering the Apple TV actually exists, and the Google TV does not, I think Apple has an enormous lead.

That said, I think you hit on the key issues though. ATV needs a browser (and keyboard support of some sort to go with it), and an app store. These really do seem like complete no-brainers.

I would also like to see several hardware options, including a DVD and tuner. I imagine something along the lines of the system having stub launchers for "DVD" and "Live TV" that are normally greyed out, but when you plug in a device it notices it, lights up the option, and offers to load the actual program from the app store. For instance, the Live TV system would notice you plugging in an Elgato box, and offer to download the full version of EyeTV.

I considered hacking my ATV to support my USB stick, but it really seems like so much trouble. If the menus really worked (no "quitting" and other nastyness that it has now) I would have done so and trashed my cable box.

Maury
post #91 of 286
Quote:
Originally Posted by fishstick_kitty View Post

I think this sounds exciting!!! But the above quote is only true for techy geeks (like me)...my mom is definitely not hitting the web to look for tv shows My mom does, however, use a DVR. It's really gotta be stupid simple at the end of the day.

My 9 year old daughter uses youtube for _everything_. She rarely watches "actual tv". I think she would be offended to learn she's being "techy".

I think all us mid-lifers have to realize that we're way behind the curve on this. If you multiply the age of the viewer by the number of hours, that factor is skewing way into the white-hairs now. When they die, broadcast-model TV dies with them.

Maury
post #92 of 286
Quote:
Originally Posted by Prof. Peabody View Post

Chrome OS is practically a non-entity. It's a browser.

If you've seen the Chrome browser, and you've made it run full-screen, then you've seen Chrome OS.

It's more than a browser: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Google_Chrome_OS
post #93 of 286
Quote:
Originally Posted by SpamSandwich View Post

Hopefully, this will spur Apple to get serious or get out of Apple TV altogether. My hope is they buy Netflix.

1) Netflix's "mail the CD" model is nearing end-of-life and they are looking to partner with anyone and everyone for their streaming service. They will almost certainly be on AppleTV soon, but they sure aren't worth buying as they have no distinct IP.

2) Apple TV was only a "hobby" because they were waiting to see which way the market was going to go. Now that it's obvious that Google is preparing an all out assault on all Apple products, you will see them respond rather vigorously.

I wouldn't be surprised if Apple TV had new hardware and was using the iPhone OS very soon. It might even be announced when they announce the next iPhone in a couple of weeks.
post #94 of 286
Quote:
Originally Posted by Foo2 View Post

Except it's not great, because the iPhone and iPod touch are way too expensive. A touch alone costs more than an Apple TV.

Pfttt. There are a few tens of millions of ATV owners, vs. something like 100 million iPhone/iTouch owners. Disproof by example.

Maury
post #95 of 286
Quote:
Originally Posted by stevetim View Post

It's more than a browser: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Google_Chrome_OS

I was probably just being sarcastic.

I guess you could say it's a browser with hardware drivers?

My point was mostly that it has no UI other than what you've already seen in the browser and that it acts, walks, talks, etc. ... like a browser.
post #96 of 286
If it has some sort of DVR capability, I'm in. Otherwise, I don't need any more web browsers in my life.
post #97 of 286
Quote:
Originally Posted by DaveGee View Post

....Just think for a second how useless an iPhone or iPad app would be on an Apple TV.

It could be pretty cool based on using the iPhone remote app with my appletv. It let's you use a remote without looking at the remote, which i think is awesome.
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post #98 of 286
Quote:
Originally Posted by All Day Breakfast View Post

Google has finally done something better than Apple (other than copying). I'm definitely not pleased with Google's general rip off of Apple's iPhone OS with Android etc but on this one they have gone much further than Apple was willing to go and good on them. Apple's vision problem was that they wanted to keep AppleTV tied to iTunes and keep a closed shop. The result is that to really use AppleTV more fully you have to use something like aTV Flash or Boxee or Plex but all of those lack overall integration. IMO Google TV really does seem a lightyear ahead of that. The addition of non-phone specific android apps running on your tellie is a good one.

This isn't the death of Apple or any of that kind of non-sense, but in this particular niche Apple may not be able to catch up unless they're willing to open up AppleTV to let users outside the iTunes walled garden. I'm not sure Apple are eager to do that. But maybe they'll have a good think now if Google is able to attract a large enough market to pique Apple's interest. Otherwise I suspect Apple will turn to the iPad as their device to control tellies.

Boxee, Plex and my awful Sony PS3 as a media centre all seem dead to me.

I'm not sure Flash is that big a deal though, esp with the timeline Google laid out essentially making summer 2011 the real launch date. HTML 5 for streaming video is rapidly gathering steam as provider after provider is announcing HTML5 solutions. I think GoogleTV's strengths are elsewhere.

I think you are absolutely right. Google TV will be light years ahead of the current Apple TV. There is currently no product on the market that does all of what they showed in the keynote in such a seamlessly integrated way.

Google TV is integrating the full internet (websites, web apps, feeds, movies, videos, audio) and apps (android marketplace) with your TV and they make it easy to find using Google search through manual input (typing) or using your voice.

I think they are only tolerating flash for now and view it as a bridge technology until HTML5 fully comes to maturity.

Google TV looks very promising and looks like it will be very successful.

I think though, that from all the companies out there, Apple is uniquely positioned to challenge them in this space. However, like you said, the only way they can will be to open up Apple TV to users outside of the iTunes ecosystem. Instead, integration with the iTunes ecosystem can be a plus and a point of differentiation.

Apple has all the pieces they need such as the iPhone OS, a sweet custom processor, the App Store, iTunes and Webkit. Their purchase of Siri can also come into play here.

It's going to be interesting to see how this all shapes out over the next year.
post #99 of 286
Quote:
Originally Posted by solipsism View Post

If Chrome OS is just a browser then so is WebOS ...

I was probably being too mean, but I disagree with this comparison.

WebOS has a distinct, well-thought out UI in my opinion. Chrome OS might be more than a browser, but it has no UI distinct from a browser. It acts, looks, and works like a browser, whereas WebOS doesn't work or look anything like a web browser.
post #100 of 286
Quote:
Originally Posted by anantksundaram View Post

(ii) Allow for @tv to record programs from cable on to its hard drive (in HD);

No, use a separate box that plugs into the ATV for this. You definitely don't want to load it's processor and HD with encoding, there's not enough power to do this AND use it for watching a program. You're going to need another box for this anyway, the tuner, so package all of this into that box and then sync the completed recording if and when the ATV is not busy.

Quote:
Originally Posted by anantksundaram View Post

(iii) Come with a built-in disc player (preferably Blu-Ray.

Again, this is MUCH better handled by an external box. Just repackage the drive for the MBAir and there you go. Better yet, support AirDisk and then you can just pop the disk into your local Mac and stream it.

Yes, BD support would be great, but it's pretty clear they're not going to support BD.

Maury
post #101 of 286
Quote:
Originally Posted by Prof. Peabody View Post

I wouldn't be surprised if Apple TV had new hardware and was using the iPhone OS very soon. It might even be announced when they announce the next iPhone in a couple of weeks.

I hope this happens but i doubt it. Not a good idea to mislead your share holders by calling apple tv a hobby and then surprising everyone by releasing an apple tv device with iphoneOS.

However to support your point, Apple TV runs on Tiger (10.4 ish). It's a bit old and due for an upgrade or an extermination (a la newton).
post #102 of 286
Quote:
Originally Posted by solipsism View Post

1) I called this a year ago but I thought it would be Chrome OS, not Android.

2) These will likely all be very shitty implementations for a long time to come. Just look at current internet-ready TVs. However, it's even more imperative that Apple get a viable media extender appliance to market.

Google Video failed too. I liked it for uploads but they shut it down in favor of YouTube. As a place to buy video it was ugly.
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post #103 of 286
Quote:
Originally Posted by clickmyface View Post

Is this competition for Apple TV?

Apple TV connects to the largest online TV/Music/Movie media store in the world and where users can buy content direct. Your Apple TV can replace your cable subscription.

Google TV, if I understand correctly, connects to the internet and to a cable box, and does not sell any content to users. You can consume A) free web content or B) content from your cable subscription. This does not, in any way, replace your cable subscription.

They compete in name only.

Google's critique actually seems to be against the user interface of DVR/Cable set-top-boxes. To solve that, they would need Motorola and other set-top box hardware/software manufacturers to adopt this TV-flavored Android. Then, of course, Comcast etc. would have to adopt those boxes.

In short, I can be flooded with advertisements from Google or from my cable provider.

Wow!
post #104 of 286
For all of you who think Google TV competes with ATV, here's a couple things to consider.
  • ATV streams music, video and puchased items directly to your TV from you computer, It's not a stand alone system, just an accessory. It has Itunes Store built in and that's about it. It has no interface with your TV programming.
  • GTV is basically the Android Phone OS scaled to a TV, with a UI Twist + a dash of traditional TV interface as well. It has the capability of integrating your existing TV programming to enhance your living room entertainment.

When you look at what each actually does, you'll see how different these two ideas are. So can we all take a break from the name calling and accusations of stealing ideas please?


now for my other thoughts...

Google TV
I think what Google has come up with is very interesting. We've already seen what Android has done for the Phone industry, which is practically save the smartphone business from being totally monopolized by Apple. This is not a critique but an observation. I'm an iPhone User and loving it BTW...
Anyway, i think GTV will be very successful if they start opening it up to more manufacturers and hold to the standards they propose to the OS. My only fear is that it will be dominated by Crap Apps and will make the end user suffer by Google's "open-ness". There is something to be appreciated with Apple's closed system for apps.
Many bloggers here are right by saying it should go further and become a DVR/Cable box replacement rather than an accessory integraged OS.

Apple TV
As stated above, i don't think this compares at all (in strategy) with GTV. ATV is about 50% of what it should be (buy most people's ideas). If they just took the iPad OS (which it basically the iPhone/Touch OS) and combined that with the current ATV OS, you'd really have a product that is so compelling that it would explode the Market (which is basically dominated by Cable/SATV companies and TiVo). That (IMO) would put the ATV at about 90% there.
I think the major problem Apple has by doing this, is the fact that putting a web browser in the ATV would essential negate the necessity of the iTunes Store completely. Why purchase content on iTunes when you have a web browser that can go to ABC.com and watch LOST free Streaming?
So, in a way if Apple did this they would be shooting themselves in the foot. Therefore, What Google is doing now is what Apple (IMO) cannot do now, which is open the Apple TV to the web, because they would be taking money out of thier own pockets. But now, with GTV coming out, they almost are forced to do this to keep the ATV as a viable alternate accessory device for Living Room entertainment.

Now, with the advent of the iPad, this may open the door to updates for ATV. Apple seems to take it's time developing products. And when they release them, there is a huge compelling reason for consumers to purchase one. As a side note, i think the iPad might have come too soon, because it's not quite what it should be (IMO). Even though sales are going well, people will realized that they are not quite as conviented as an alternative to the netbook as everyone states. They work very well as an alternative to the Nook or Kindle, but the average Kindle/Nook User still prefurs the light weight, long battery and most importantly the eInk Screen of those devices. But that's a different blog. Back to the topic, if you look at the history of the mobile OS Apple has produced over the years, you'll see that it grew quite gradually. And i think the ATV will be then next big thing, but not for a couple more years. I think SJ's swansong before final retirement will the Apple TV in a phoenix-like resurection the next time you see it on the main page of the Apple Store website.

Thoughts?
post #105 of 286
Quote:
Originally Posted by Maury Markowitz View Post

Pfttt. There are a few tens of millions of ATV owners, vs. something like 100 million iPhone/iTouch owners. Disproof by example.

A nice thought, but I doubt the overlap or convenience would be high enough. Apple will need an Android controller app, as well, to reach as broad a market this way.

Is this how Apple sells it? "Oh, and by the way, the web browser in our ATV actually becomes useful--better than the GTV!--if you already own an iPhone/touch or double the price to get one." "When you're on a phone call and want to change channels, just put the caller on hold, open the ATV app and search for your content; then go back to your call. It's that simple!"
post #106 of 286
Quote:
Originally Posted by stevetim View Post

Actually the iphone does a great job solving keyboard needs ... apple sells a remote app that connects nicely with appleTV.

Nothing could be further from the truth - the Remote app is practically useless. All it does is start or stop media that you already have. You cannot, or I'm too stupid to figure it out, search in YouTube for instance. Of particular annoyance is the inability to find movies in the iTunes Store.

Maury
post #107 of 286
Quote:
Originally Posted by Maury Markowitz View Post

Nothing could be further from the truth - the Remote app is practically useless. All it does is start or stop media that you already have. You cannot, or I'm too stupid to figure it out, search in YouTube for instance. Of particular annoyance is the inability to find movies in the iTunes Store.

Maury

I use it to search for utube all the time. works great. comes with the iphone keyboard and you just type it right in. When you navigate to youtube click on the search field on top of the remote. It opens up the apple keyboard.
post #108 of 286
Quote:
Originally Posted by Maury Markowitz View Post

Nothing could be further from the truth - the Remote app is practically useless. All it does is start or stop media that you already have. You cannot, or I'm too stupid to figure it out, search in YouTube for instance. Of particular annoyance is the inability to find movies in the iTunes Store.

Maury

I also use the app to type in my password for itunes purchasing and finding apple movies. Give it another chance it's a good clean application.
post #109 of 286
Quote:
Originally Posted by str1f3 View Post

The issue really isn't that simple. Hulu will eventually block this because they want users to watch it live for ratings. Watching a couple of clips is cool but there really isn't a solution here. Most will use YouTube which is already available on the AppleTV. The ultimate goal has been to move TV to the web where it should be. Windows Media Center still is another alternative that ha been around for awhile now (with more features).

The only box that I'd purchase is the Roku player for watching Netflix. The AppleTV is still not there nor is the product from Google. I can just hook up my MBP, use Boxee and get the same kind of experience (with the Apple Remote).

Why would Hulu block it? The viewing experience is the same as in your web browser on your desktop or laptop. Google TV has Chrome seamlessly integrated, allowing you to access all the sites you would on your computer.

Roku and Boxee set top can compete with the Google TV. It's way ahead of them. Since Google is open-sourcing it, some of their partners at the Keynote already mentioned how they will be using it. They mentioned direct integration into some Sony tvs, some Blu-Ray players, and set-top manufacturers could build their own devices with it.

Apple has the pieces the make Apple TV a very strong competitor though.
post #110 of 286
Quote:
Originally Posted by Prof. Peabody View Post

I was probably being too mean, but I disagree with this comparison.

WebOS has a distinct, well-thought out UI in my opinion. Chrome OS might be more than a browser, but it has no UI distinct from a browser. It acts, looks, and works like a browser, whereas WebOS doesn't work or look anything like a web browser.

That's by design. It was designed to work with traditional PCs and people as a whole don't understand computers, but they have a basic idea of what a web browser is and how to use it. The entire point of Chrome OS was to give people a simple OS that did exactly what they needed it to do.

It's potentially a great idea for the future of low cost computing that a standard Linux distro can't compete with. Google saying it's for netbooks is really the first step and red herring, IMO, for Google to capitalize on the emerging markets that Microsoft has dominated for decades. While MS might give away their OS to emerging markets there is a still a certain level of HW requirements that will be well above Windows.
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post #111 of 286
Quote:
Originally Posted by mistergsf View Post

I really don't want or need Google on my HDTV and home theater.

Don't want it? Don't buy it. It's simple
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post #112 of 286
The title should read "Google introduces online media TV product into completely vacant market where no other product has been introduced"

That my friends is an enormous typo
post #113 of 286
Quote:
Originally Posted by AppDev View Post

Why would Hulu block it?

because studios and networks are making them
post #114 of 286
Quote:
Originally Posted by anantksundaram View Post

If Apple can do just three things on top of what @tv currently does: (i) Make @tv stream anything that is on my desktop/laptop/iPad screen on my TV screen; (ii) Allow for @tv to record programs from cable on to its hard drive (in HD); (iii) Come with a built-in disc player (preferably Blu-Ray), it will blow away just about everything else in the home entertainment media market, let alone this vaporware Google product.

It's so simple, Apple; c'mon, you can do it.

Don't need web browsing on my TV. Thanks.

Google TV isn't vaporware. If you watched the keynote you would see them using it live on stage. They said it will be coming out this fall since they already have partners who are building it into their technologies. Specifically they mentioned Sony Bravia TVs, a Blu-Ray player and a set-top box.
post #115 of 286
I have an Apple TV, with the latest software and it is very good.
As well as buying/renting TV, Movies and Music from ITunes you can :-
- play music , see photos etc etc from your own network
- access any photo account at Flickr
- listen to many radio stations (but not BBC that needs a Real player)
- watch YouTube
all wirelessly on your HDMI TV with a simple and elegant remote.

It would be even better if it allowed competitive content like Hulu and other
internet sites but seems unlikely. Still a very solid product at a pretty good price. ($200)
If you want everything via your TV right now you could consider buying a MAC MIni.
its a real computer in a small box. Unfortunately its over twice the price.

Still having some competition from Google can only be a good thing over time.
My guess is Apple will be taking this market seriously very soon and produce a single unit
with a HD TV and an in-built Apple TV or Mac Mini. I want one when they do.
post #116 of 286
I want an APPLE SEARCH ENGINE!!!!
post #117 of 286
This seems more of a play like Boxee. It runs on PVRs and/or hardware devices. Boxee is trys to have streaming media as well have the ability to play your downloads. Boxee is also a platform that people create widgets/apps for.
post #118 of 286
Quote:
Originally Posted by AppDev View Post

Why would Hulu block it? The viewing experience is the same as in your web browser on your desktop or laptop. Google TV has Chrome seamlessly integrated, allowing you to access all the sites you would on your computer.

Roku and Boxee set top can compete with the Google TV. It's way ahead of them. Since Google is open-sourcing it, some of their partners at the Keynote already mentioned how they will be using it. They mentioned direct integration into some Sony tvs, some Blu-Ray players, and set-top manufacturers could build their own devices with it.

Apple has the pieces the make Apple TV a very strong competitor though.

Hulu will block it because that box directly competes with the networks own viewership ratings. This is why they blocked Boxee (because of the AppleTV).

Who cares if open-sourcing it? They are open sourcing a software that is viewing proprietary content. Viacom will do the same with their content. It is more important to these companies that their content is viewed on cable/OTA than it it is over the net.

Google is doing this for the ad revenues(100% btw) and those companies are doing the same. The only difference is the networks get paid more.

The only potential play here so far is iAds (not fanboy comment). Because they are charging so much for ads, it can potentially replace the network solution. Google is trying to do an end-around and bypass network ad revenue by using the web.

EDIT: The networks already knew what Google was attempting to do. They already blocked a more rewarding situation with Apple. There is no way in he'll that these networks will allow their content to be displayed over a TV screen without their approval.
post #119 of 286
Quote:
Originally Posted by Graham Reeves View Post

I have an Apple TV, with the latest software and it is very good.

I agree with this but apparently apple does not. It used to be upper right product photo on the apple store. Now it is a tiny text link for, of all things, buried under an iPod enhancement? Go check it out. Apple totally doesn't care about merchandising the current device. Sales must be crap.
post #120 of 286
AppleTV is a "hobby" because Apple chose to not integrate DVR functionality. End of story.

If AppleTV had a built in DVR, they would sell millions of them. Instead, you have to kludge it into your hometheater setup and juggle inputs between the TiVo and the AppleTV. It's just confusing to many TV watchers (not you or me or others on this forum, but it's difficult for your mother in law or grandmother).

It's not too late for Apple to add DVR. The extra hardware sales will offset the incremental loss in iTunes downloads for TV Shows.
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