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Adobe unveils Creative Suite 5.5 with subscriptions, iPad tools for Photoshop - Page 2

post #41 of 56
Quote:
Originally Posted by steftheref View Post

I applaud Adobe for not letting its spat with Apple over Flash stop it developing for the Mac platform. That's a good move. Apps on iPad from Adobe will be a natural.

Not sure how much their Apple-hate has faded, if you notice they are using a Xoom tablet and Android phone in the demo. Even though iPad is clearly going to be their largest tablet customer base.

As for pricing, the subscriptions seem to be optional for now (is that correct?), so no need to overreact now!

But if it does become mandatory for all, unless you work for a company or a successful freelancer, who not only can afford to pay these prices, but will pay these prices? At $35 for one software program or upwards of $130 for a suite, that is a heck of a lot of money. If this is their only future option, I'm out on Adobe and will have to find other programs. Not that I use Ps anyway, I mostly use Fireworks, but not paying $35/mth for that either. $10-15/mth max, that's it for me.
post #42 of 56
The reason Adobe has no real competition is patents.
Pages and pages of patents.

Software patents need to have a max 10 year life. That's more then enough time to profit from an idea. It would also push innovation to re-invest the profit from an idea into more idea's. Not to mention the boost to the economy would be furious.
post #43 of 56
Quote:
Originally Posted by addabox View Post

I don't think these are iPad only-- the product video and web page go out of their way to feature Xooms and Galaxy Tabs-- unless you're talking about some earlier apps?

I wish someone like Adobe could bite the bullet and actually release an iPad specific app. The idea that there's a "tablet market" that requires cross-platform apps is still largely a fiction, and you can make a better app by targeting a specific device. Of course, given the bad blood between Apple and Adobe recently, Adobe may feel obliged to pretend like their customers are in the habit of doing field work with a Xoom. Can't see how that makes good business sense, though.

Adobe is going out of their way to be nice to any company which will help them keep Flash relevant.
post #44 of 56
Quote:
Originally Posted by quinney View Post

Adobe is going out of their way to be nice to any company which will help them keep Flash relevant.

I'm often a Flash apologist, however Adobe's new site is an example of all the wrong ways to use Flash. When they first acquired Macromedia, they switched all of their web content to Coldfusion, which was MM's default platform. All well and good since CFM is a decent scripting language, albeit a little slow for enterprise deployments.

I hadn't been to Adobe.com recently but now I see that Coldfusion is all but gone from their site and instead it is all javascript with Flash, clearly developed in Flex replacing all of the dynamic content such as ecommerce. There is absolutely no reason to build all of those forms and drop down lists in Flash when that is actually one of the weakest parts of Flash. If it was cool interactive multimedia, yeah go for it 'cause nothing comes close to Flash for that stuff. But ordering forms, give me a break.

Trying to keep Flash relevant by using it wrong on your own site is a huge mistake. Maybe Flash does need to be sidelined. Sort of like Detroit muscle cars. There will always be a place for both but the mainstream needs to be much more efficient.

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post #45 of 56
Quote:
Originally Posted by AppleInsider View Post

... Photoshop for as little as $35 per month, Adobe Design Premium CS 5.5 for $95 per month, or Adobe Creative Suite 5.5 Master Collection for $129 per month.

WtF ... (that would be, what the fooey...)
Let's see, Photoshop, $35/mo = $420 per year, forever. 60% of MSRP.
Design Suite Premium, $95/mo = $1140 per year, forever. also 60% of MSRP.
etc.

Seems like the Adobe price-gougers figured out a brand new way to suck money from the customers.
This, and the so-called 5.5 mid-cycle, full price new versions.
It just gets worse and worse.
(OK, so you can tell I am a small-software-budget guy)

I guess if you normally pay full list price every year to buy it, this is a 'deal'. But not so much for low budget types.
Good thing there are some decent alternatives.
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post #46 of 56
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bruce Young View Post

WtF ... (that would be, what the fooey...)
Let's see, Photoshop, $35/mo = $420 per year, forever. 60% of MSRP.
Design Suite Premium, $95/mo = $1140 per year, forever. also 60% of MSRP.
etc.

Seems like the Adobe price-gougers figured out a brand new way to suck money from the customers.
This, and the so-called 5.5 mid-cycle, full price new versions.
It just gets worse and worse.
(OK, so you can tell I am a small-software-budget guy)

I guess if you normally pay full list price every year to buy it, this is a 'deal'. But not so much for low budget types.
Good thing there are some decent alternatives.

A classic example of "The unfortunate age of entitlement" http://www.seattlepi.com/default/art...of-1232116.php
post #47 of 56
Quote:
Originally Posted by Onhka View Post

Possibly as Adobe has described:


Just like businesses that leases their office equipment, vehicles, premises, etc. Your accountant, auditor, tax consultant (or your wife) could better explain it.

BTW, Upgrade price for Design Premium is $399. Obviously, you would have to be an idiot if you were considering subscribing for something you already own and is upgradeable.

BTW premium POINT FIVE is $399, full version upgrade has gone from $500+ to $600+.

There are already student versions. How many people need professional design software for a month or two but no longer? Trial versions are free.

Do yourself a favor. If you need advice about whether of not a particular tax program is a good deal, ask the guy who does your taxes. If you want to know about design software, ask a professional designer. They may walk you through the math and help you figure out that anyone, after using free trial version of design software to determine they want the actual product, will recoup the cost of one full version, plus the next upgrade for not much more than the one year subscription, which of course is about ONE paying job. Your accountant, auditor, tax consultant (or the gym sock you are currently "dating") probably understands certain marketing practices better than you seem to grasp. Ya see, smart ass, companies with a near monopoly in a particular area and dependent on repeat sales within a saturated mature market often opt to rest on their laurels. Instead of releasing actual updates when they have new features worthy of the price of an upgrade ready for market, be that after 6 months, a year, twowhenever it's 'done cooking' they go the route of regular annual upgradeseven if if the main upgrade consists of a new logo on the startup screen, fixing some bugs that should be free, and offering new pricing schemes that do nothing but fool unknowing morons.


The reason why companies like Adobe are able to keep making money by occasionally shuffling the same crap into different packages and selling it again as if it's something new, is because they can count on customers like you to fall for it, then run around on message boards apologizing for them and attacking their other customers who aren't as gullible. That gives the rest of us who've built a career using their products less leverage to call them on their bullshit. It also means that if enough suckers fall for the new 'subscription' pricing, which is much more expensive than traditional upgrades, they'll switch to that pricing scheme altogether. Hopefully suckers are in the minority.
post #48 of 56
Quote:
Originally Posted by GMHut View Post

BTW premium POINT FIVE is $399, full version upgrade has gone from $500+ to $600+.

There are already student versions. How many people need professional design software for a month or two but no longer? Trial versions are free.

Do yourself a favor. If you need advice about whether of not a particular tax program is a good deal, ask the guy who does your taxes. If you want to know about design software, ask a professional designer. They may walk you through the math and help you figure out that anyone, after using free trial version of design software to determine they want the actual product, will recoup the cost of one full version, plus the next upgrade for not much more than the one year subscription, which of course is about ONE paying job. Your accountant, auditor, tax consultant (or the gym sock you are currently "dating") probably understands certain marketing practices better than you seem to grasp. Ya see, smart ass, companies with a near monopoly in a particular area and dependent on repeat sales within a saturated mature market often opt to rest on their laurels. Instead of releasing actual updates when they have new features worthy of the price of an upgrade ready for market, be that after 6 months, a year, twowhenever it's 'done cooking' they go the route of regular annual upgradeseven if if the main upgrade consists of a new logo on the startup screen, fixing some bugs that should be free, and offering new pricing schemes that do nothing but fool unknowing morons.


The reason why companies like Adobe are able to keep making money by occasionally shuffling the same crap into different packages and selling it again as if it's something new, is because they can count on customers like you to fall for it, then run around on message boards apologizing for them and attacking their other customers who aren't as gullible. That gives the rest of us who've built a career using their products less leverage to call them on their bullshit. It also means that if enough suckers fall for the new 'subscription' pricing, which is much more expensive than traditional upgrades, they'll switch to that pricing scheme altogether. Hopefully suckers are in the minority.

Are you referring to me?

Disclaimer [As previously posted]: Former owner of an Advertising Agency/Graphic Design Studio/Print and Electronic Production House. Tons of Macs [First one, Day 1, January, 1984] and software from Aldus, Quark, Microsoft and Adobe. Whatever was needed to get the best out of my creative/production staff cost effectively. My accountant wasn't too pleased. However, he loved the house, pool and boat that I made it possible for him to have.
post #49 of 56
Quote:
Originally Posted by Onhka View Post

Are you referring to me?

Disclaimer [As previously posted]: Former owner of an Advertising Agency/Graphic Design Studio/Print and Electronic Production House. Tons of Macs [First one, Day 1, January, 1984] and software from Aldus, Quark, Microsoft and Adobe. Whatever was needed to get the best out of my creative/production staff cost effectively. My accountant wasn't too pleased. However, he loved the house, pool and boat that I made it possible for him to have.

I quoted your smart ass comment. Who do you think I was referring to? I think I know why you're the former owner of whatever failed business you no longer operate.
post #50 of 56
Quote:
Originally Posted by GMHut View Post

I quoted your smart ass comment. Who do you think I was referring to? I think I know why you're the former owner of whatever failed business you no longer operate.

Well my 'you' to which you commented on was not directed towards you. You asked and I responded. And I say it again, "Obviously, [one] would have to be an idiot if [one] were considering subscribing for something [one] already own and is upgradeable. {Aside on how Adobe is positionning it.]

On the other hand, it does appear you have a comprehension issue. And your concluding assumption is so totally off-base, I can only conclude that you are a total first three letters.
post #51 of 56
Quote:
Originally Posted by Onhka View Post

Why are you so concerned? You already own the product. Simply upgrade if you want to. Why would you ever consider a Subscription service?

For those who don't already have Photoshop and have reason to want to use it, at just over a buck a day doesn't seem exorbitant to me.

By the way, there are companies and services that will finance software. At a cost of course.

I'm not concerned. It's more that I'm amused over how eager many are to pay substantially more for the privilege of paying in installments. There really isn't a scenario in which going the subscription route is the smart way to go and yet if Adobe is offering this option at this price point, surely some research has been done and a market of sorts identified.

Incredible amounts of money are wasted on virtually nothing by otherwise intelligent people. It's one of those quirks that make us humans so endearing.
post #52 of 56
Quote:
Originally Posted by Onhka View Post

Well my 'you' to which you commented on was not directed towards you. You asked and I responded. And I say it again, "Obviously, [one] would have to be an idiot if [one] were considering subscribing for something [one] already own and is upgradeable. {Aside on how Adobe is positionning it.]

On the other hand, it does appear you have a comprehension issue. And your concluding assumption is so totally off-base, I can only conclude that you are a total first three letters.

'You' quoted my post, so yes it was directed at me. I comprehend just fine. You however, do not. I commented on the subscription service beyond something applied to people who already license the software (no one 'owns' any Adobe software, except Adobe, Inc.).

Here's the deal, asshat. If you make unprovoked attacks on other posters, don't be such a thin-skinned pussy. If you can't take it, don't dish it out. And for Pete's sake, if you insist on 'bringin' it' make sure what you bring isn't so stupid next time. Capiche?
post #53 of 56
Quote:
Originally Posted by Carmissimo View Post

I'm not concerned. It's more that I'm amused over how eager many are to pay substantially more for the privilege of paying in installments. There really isn't a scenario in which going the subscription route is the smart way to go and yet if Adobe is offering this option at this price point, surely some research has been done and a market of sorts identified.

Incredible amounts of money are wasted on virtually nothing by otherwise intelligent people. It's one of those quirks that make us humans so endearing.

I would suggest that it be made clear that the Adobe Subscription is not an Installment plan. Just as renting a car for a weekend or a month or a year isn't.

Perhaps a perusal from folks more informed will help clarify the issue. For example, from ARS,
Quote:
Some people may balk at “renting” Photoshop, but as someone who paid $3,500 just to get access to the $750 yearly fee to the Autodesk Maya subscription, I can tell you those prices with no up-front cost seem very reasonable. It doesn't quite function as a payment plan towards the full price, but you can get upgrade pricing on new versions if you do subscribe. "The subscription offering is not a payment plan, so you would not be able to simply pay off the remainder of a suite’s or application’s price if you’ve owned a subscription for a certain amount of time," an Adobe spokesperson told Ars. "However, a customer is eligible to pay upgrade pricing for a new version of a Suite or application if they’ve completed a one-year subscription plan, or a six month monthly subscription plan."

Or from TUAW
Quote:
Adobe has announced a mid-cycle update to its Creative Suite, dubbed Adobe CS 5.5. As CNET notes, Adobe CS 5.5 doesn't provide significant updates for Photoshop, Illustrator or Fireworks, but what has been updated in Adobe's Creative Suite seems particularly focused on smartphone platforms. Adobe says the CS update is focused on "enabling designers and developers to target popular and emerging smartphone and tablet platforms," and provides "substantive advances to HTML5, Flash authoring, digital publishing and video tools as well as new capabilities that kick-start the integration of tablets into creative workflows."

According to Adobe, the company plans to change up its development cycle for Creative Suite, offering "milestone" upgrades every 24 months and (presumably yearly) mid-cycle releases like CS 5.5 providing relatively smaller advances of the feature set.

Perhaps more significantly, Adobe has also introduced subscription-based pricing

Links to above and more… http://www.google.com/search?q=adobe...be03e6833a46ef

P.S. Adobe has offered an option for acquiring one of the most professionally used software products on the market. It is not for everyone to even consider.

However, before making final judgement, it would be prudent to talk to our banks, accountant, tax consultant before throwing it under the bus.

In addition, if it doesn't fit one's financial situation it is not a reason to trash it. And if my accountant were to overtly condemn it as some have done here, it would be his last time I would seek his advice. Brother-in-law or not.
post #54 of 56
Quote:
Originally Posted by Onhka View Post

I would suggest that it be made clear that the Adobe Subscription is not an Installment plan. Just as renting a car for a weekend or a month or a year isn't.

Perhaps a perusal from folks more informed will help clarify the issue. For example, from ARS,


Or from TUAW


Links to above and more http://www.google.com/search?q=adobe...be03e6833a46ef

P.S. Adobe has offered an option for acquiring one of the most professional used software products on the market. It is not for everyone to even consider.

However, before making final judgement, it would be prudent to talk to our banks, accountant, tax consultant before throwing it under the bus.

In addition, if it doesn't fit one's financial situation it is not a reason to trash it. And if my accountant were to overtly condemn it as some have done here, it would be his last time I would seek his advice. Brother-in-law or not.

I think it sounds reasonable for many, especially when you consider the way most businesses allocate funds for their departments. This would also allow Adobe to get more users on-board with newer versions of their products without people and businesses holding onto 7yo copies of the SW simply because they want to keep putting off paying that lump sum expenditure.
Dick Applebaum on whether the iPad is a personal computer: "BTW, I am posting this from my iPad pc while sitting on the throne... personal enough for you?"
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Dick Applebaum on whether the iPad is a personal computer: "BTW, I am posting this from my iPad pc while sitting on the throne... personal enough for you?"
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post #55 of 56
And if you support Adobe or buy their products you really are!
post #56 of 56
Quote:
Originally Posted by mac_dog View Post

i sure hope there's an upgrade price for existing users, because $1140 for the CSP is a shit-load of money when, in the past, i'd pay $660 and change for an entire upgrade.

serious fail as far as i'm concerned.

and, to add insult to injury, they probably haven't even fixed bugs in their current suite.

The only people I see paying for this are Photoshop fanboys. A subscription model doesn't make sense. Especially if you have already purchased CS5. If you need photo editing and basic graphic design I would us Photoshop Essentials http://www.softwarecrew.com/2011/03/...app-purchases/. Btw, it's free and you don't have to worry about getting raped for a monthly service charge.
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