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For Libertarians: Austrian Economics

post #1 of 23
11/13/12 at 2:21am
Thread Starter 

Question: If the Austrian school of Economics is so great, why isn't it in practice in Austria?

 

http://www.aaro.org/aaro-around-the-world/246

 

Quote:

In Austria you can be either 100% covered by the public program or 100% private pay, however you can also get supplementary private insurance for “comfort class” hospitalization which includes flexible visiting hours, private room and your private doctor. Everyone who pays taxes in Austria is financially supporting the public system, whether they participate in the public system or pay for private insurance.

 

Doctors have choices – they can be private, public or both. Doctors want to be part of the public system. There is currently a waiting list for doctors who wish to become part of the public system.

 

We are covered 100% by the public program. Outside of an occasional 4.50 € we pay for a prescription, we have very few out of pocket expenses.

 

 

That sounds pretty damn close to exactly the system I'm in support of for the US.

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post #2 of 23
11/13/12 at 2:31am
  • BR
  • Justified Arrogance

Indeed, I also support such a system.  But I'm guessing that these facts will not dissuade the followers of the ironically named school of economics.  They seem steadfast in their denial of reality.  I'd love to be proven wrong in this case.

 

“The nitrogen in our DNA, the calcium in our teeth, the iron in our blood, the carbon in our apple pies were made in the interiors of collapsing stars. We are made of starstuff.” 
-Sagan
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“The nitrogen in our DNA, the calcium in our teeth, the iron in our blood, the carbon in our apple pies were made in the interiors of collapsing stars. We are made of starstuff.” 
-Sagan
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post #3 of 23
11/13/12 at 3:09am

That little blog blurb has almost no information in it.

The politics of charisma is so Third World. Americans were never going to buy into it for long. - Foudad Ajami
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The politics of charisma is so Third World. Americans were never going to buy into it for long. - Foudad Ajami
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post #4 of 23
11/13/12 at 6:09am
Quote:
Originally Posted by tonton View Post

Question: If the Austrian school of Economics is so great, why isn't it in practice in Austria?

 

Wow. Is that actually a serious question?!

The state is nothing more than a criminal gang writ large.

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The state is nothing more than a criminal gang writ large.

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post #5 of 23
11/13/12 at 7:20am
Quote:
Originally Posted by MJ1970 View Post

 

Wow. Is that actually a serious question?!

 

Sadly, I think it is.

Malo periculosam, libertatem quam quietam servitutem.

(I prefer the tumult of liberty to the quiet of servitude.)

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Malo periculosam, libertatem quam quietam servitutem.

(I prefer the tumult of liberty to the quiet of servitude.)

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post #6 of 23
11/13/12 at 7:24am

tonton, you would do well to educate yourself on the Austrian School of Economics.

 

It astounds me that you don't have a basic understanding of something you are apparently so vehemently opposed to.

Malo periculosam, libertatem quam quietam servitutem.

(I prefer the tumult of liberty to the quiet of servitude.)

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Malo periculosam, libertatem quam quietam servitutem.

(I prefer the tumult of liberty to the quiet of servitude.)

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post #7 of 23
11/13/12 at 3:51pm
Thread Starter 
Clearly the Austrian School skips the lesson on irony. I should have known better than to expect some intelligence on the matter.
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post #8 of 23
11/13/12 at 3:54pm
Thread Starter 
Oh, and MJ, when you preach to trailer trash about the merits of the Austrian School, please make sure they know the difference between Austria and Australia. Not to mention the fact that Austria is a social (read: socialist) democracy.

http://www.buzzfeed.com/jwherrman/37-people-who-say-theyre-moving-to-australia-if-o?s=mobile
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post #9 of 23
11/13/12 at 4:00pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by tonton View Post

Clearly the Austrian School skips the lesson on irony. I should have known better than to expect some intelligence on the matter.

 

The entire premise of your thread is wrong. I invite you to click on the link I provided and educate yourself on the Austrian School of Economics and its origins.

Malo periculosam, libertatem quam quietam servitutem.

(I prefer the tumult of liberty to the quiet of servitude.)

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Malo periculosam, libertatem quam quietam servitutem.

(I prefer the tumult of liberty to the quiet of servitude.)

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post #10 of 23
11/13/12 at 4:04pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by tonton View Post

Clearly the Austrian School skips the lesson on irony. I should have known better than to expect some intelligence on the matter.

 

All you've done is demonstrate your ignorance or a really poor sense of irony and humor.

 

Austrian Economics or the Austrian School is named so simply because a couple of the early economists from this movement started their work while in Vienna (much like the "Chicago school" is called this because that line of thinking originated at the University of Chicago. They were their until Austria went socialist and they were basically booted out.

 

I don't see any irony here at all.

 

But I guess, for liberals, two things that are only tangentially connected where one thing (a country) adopts a form of socialized medicine and the other thing (a school of economic thinking that espouses free market solutions) passes for some form of deep irony.

The state is nothing more than a criminal gang writ large.

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The state is nothing more than a criminal gang writ large.

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post #11 of 23
11/13/12 at 4:05pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by tonton View Post

...trailer trash...

 

How wonderfully "progressive" of you. lol.gif

The state is nothing more than a criminal gang writ large.

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The state is nothing more than a criminal gang writ large.

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post #12 of 23
11/13/12 at 4:34pm
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by MJ1970 View Post

Quote:
Originally Posted by tonton View Post

Clearly the Austrian School skips the lesson on irony. I should have known better than to expect some intelligence on the matter.

All you've done is demonstrate your ignorance or a really poor sense of irony and humor.

Austrian Economics or the Austrian School is named so simply because a couple of the early economists from this movement started their work while in Vienna (much like the "Chicago school" is called this because that line of thinking originated at the University of Chicago. They were their until Austria went socialist and they were basically booted out.

I don't see any irony here at all.

But I guess, for liberals, two things that are only tangentially connected where one thing (a country) adopts a form of socialized medicine and the other thing (a school of economic thinking that espouses free market solutions) passes for some form of deep irony.

I guess British humor goes over your head as well. Personally, I adore John Cleese and think Adam Sandler and Jim Carrey are unfunny idiots, but clearly, we have differences.

Still, despite your unidimensional irony meter, you don't see the irony in the link I sent in my follow-up where trailer trash (yes) say they are leaving the US and moving to Australia? You don't think there's a connection to your philosophy?
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post #13 of 23
11/13/12 at 5:08pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by tonton View Post

I guess British humor goes over your head as well. Personally, I adore John Cleese and think Adam Sandler and Jim Carrey are unfunny idiots, but clearly, we have differences.

 

Okay. 1rolleyes.gif

 

 

Quote:
Originally Posted by tonton View Post

Still, despite your unidimensional irony meter, you don't see the irony in the link I sent in my follow-up where trailer trash (yes) say they are leaving the US and moving to Australia?

 

Ummm. No. What is the irony. Please explain to us poor, simple-minded folks.

 

 

Quote:
Originally Posted by tonton View Post

...trailer trash (yes)...

 

How very "progressive" of you.

 

 

Quote:
Originally Posted by tonton View Post

You don't think there's a connection to your philosophy?

 

I haven't read the link about people whom you call "trailer trash" moving to Australia. I don't know if there is any meaningful link. Perhaps it's only in your imagination.

 

 

What happened to you tonton? I recall better from you. You've come back as a best case of BR.

The state is nothing more than a criminal gang writ large.

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The state is nothing more than a criminal gang writ large.

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post #14 of 23
11/13/12 at 6:18pm
  • BR
  • Justified Arrogance

Have to take the shot, don't you?  

 

“The nitrogen in our DNA, the calcium in our teeth, the iron in our blood, the carbon in our apple pies were made in the interiors of collapsing stars. We are made of starstuff.” 
-Sagan
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“The nitrogen in our DNA, the calcium in our teeth, the iron in our blood, the carbon in our apple pies were made in the interiors of collapsing stars. We are made of starstuff.” 
-Sagan
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post #15 of 23
11/13/12 at 8:59pm
Thread Starter 
Imagine the vitriol and hate the lib'tians would spew if the Austrian School were called the American School. They may even start up a sort of political party whose main message is that any form of social assistance whatsoever is "anti-American".

Oh... wait...

Meanwhile, the rest of the civilized world isn't clueless. That was the point of this thread.
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post #16 of 23
11/13/12 at 9:31pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by tonton View Post

Imagine the vitriol and hate the lib'tians would spew if the Austrian School were called the American School. They may even start up a sort of political party whose main message is that any form of social assistance whatsoever is "anti-American".
Oh... wait...
Meanwhile, the rest of the civilized world isn't clueless. That was the point of this thread.

 

What on earth are you talking about? You appear to be rambling.

 

What hate? What vitriol. The only hate and vitriol I see come from the left and the right. So-called "liberals"/"progressives" and conservatives. Democrats and Republicans.

 

What libertarian or Austrian economist is implying the rest of the world is "clueless?" About what (specifically)? Where? When?

 

What the **** are you babbling about?

The state is nothing more than a criminal gang writ large.

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The state is nothing more than a criminal gang writ large.

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post #17 of 23
11/14/12 at 7:06am
Quote:
Originally Posted by tonton View Post

Meanwhile, the rest of the civilized world isn't clueless. That was the point of this thread.

 

The point of this thread was to troll libertarians.

Malo periculosam, libertatem quam quietam servitutem.

(I prefer the tumult of liberty to the quiet of servitude.)

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Malo periculosam, libertatem quam quietam servitutem.

(I prefer the tumult of liberty to the quiet of servitude.)

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post #18 of 23
11/14/12 at 7:07am
Quote:
Originally Posted by jazzguru View Post

The point of this thread was to troll libertarians.

 

Please tell me that he hasn't resorted to that. That he has some actual, lucid point.

 

I don't believe you...yet.

The state is nothing more than a criminal gang writ large.

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The state is nothing more than a criminal gang writ large.

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post #19 of 23
11/14/12 at 7:16am
Quote:
Originally Posted by MJ1970 View Post

 

Please tell me that he hasn't resorted to that. That he has some actual, lucid point.

 

I don't believe you...yet.

 

Well I've tried twice to direct him to information on the origins and history of the Austrian School, but he's either ignoring it or maybe doesn't understand it.

 

He persists in the original, flawed premise of his thread, so the only conclusion I can draw is that he's trolling libertarians.

Malo periculosam, libertatem quam quietam servitutem.

(I prefer the tumult of liberty to the quiet of servitude.)

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Malo periculosam, libertatem quam quietam servitutem.

(I prefer the tumult of liberty to the quiet of servitude.)

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post #20 of 23
11/15/12 at 1:25am
Thread Starter 
Guys, I know what the Austrian School of Economics is. I know the premise and philosophy. I know the origins. I know the strengths and I know the limitations (do you know the limitations?) I know the modern supporters and I know the modern critics. And I knew all that before I started this thread. Now give me an answer. If the Austrian School is such a great answer, why has it never been put into practice? Why, even in the place of its origin, is an opposite philosophy in practice? Why has the entire civilized world, aside from the US, embraced social policy for the fundamental necessities of humanity?

The answer, of course, is that in macroeconomic context, the Austrian School's philosophy works. In and individual, human context, however, it results in social Darwinism. People get left behind in the trail of "progress". Most people aren't willing to accept that kind of trade-off, because they believe in not leaving anyone behind.
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post #21 of 23
11/15/12 at 5:59am
Quote:
Originally Posted by tonton View Post

If the Austrian School is such a great answer, why has it never been put into practice?

 

Well I was going to give an answer...but then I realized it was just a rhetorical question...

 

 

Quote:
Originally Posted by tonton View Post

The answer, of course, is that in macroeconomic context, the Austrian School's philosophy works. In and individual, human context, however, it results in social Darwinism. People get left behind in the trail of "progress". Most people aren't willing to accept that kind of trade-off, because they believe in not leaving anyone behind.

 

With the wrong answer. Surprise.

The state is nothing more than a criminal gang writ large.

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post #22 of 23
11/15/12 at 7:16am
Quote:
Originally Posted by tonton View Post

Guys, I know what the Austrian School of Economics is. I know the premise and philosophy. I know the origins. I know the strengths and I know the limitations (do you know the limitations?) I know the modern supporters and I know the modern critics. And I knew all that before I started this thread. Now give me an answer. If the Austrian School is such a great answer, why has it never been put into practice? Why, even in the place of its origin, is an opposite philosophy in practice? Why has the entire civilized world, aside from the US, embraced social policy for the fundamental necessities of humanity?
The answer, of course, is that in macroeconomic context, the Austrian School's philosophy works. In and individual, human context, however, it results in social Darwinism. People get left behind in the trail of "progress". Most people aren't willing to accept that kind of trade-off, because they believe in not leaving anyone behind.

 

It is obvious to me that you are not really interested in hearing our answers. Let me know when you are.

Malo periculosam, libertatem quam quietam servitutem.

(I prefer the tumult of liberty to the quiet of servitude.)

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Malo periculosam, libertatem quam quietam servitutem.

(I prefer the tumult of liberty to the quiet of servitude.)

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post #23 of 23
11/15/12 at 7:24am

Just relax, MJ and company.  This is just another thread where tonton tries to proselytize on bringing true socialism to U.S..   Nothing to see here.  

To save time, assume I know everything.
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To save time, assume I know everything.
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