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Apple launches developer blog for new Swift programming language

post #1 of 30
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Apple's march toward transparency continued on Friday with the launch of the Swift Blog, a new developer-focused blog covering the Swift programming language introduced by the company at WWDC.




In a brief introductory post, Apple said the blog will give developers "a behind-the-scenes look into the design of the Swift language by the engineers who created it, in addition to the latest news and hints to turn you into a productive Swift programmer." As it does with most of its oft-updated content, Apple offers an RSS feed for developers and other interested parties to follow along.

The company then took to the new platform to give an update on Swift compatibility. Swift applications will be compatible with the company's current-generation operating systems -- namely OS X Mavericks and iOS 7 -- as well as future releases, but there does not appear to be any plan to make Swift available on earlier versions.

Because Swift is so new, Apple said applications built on the new language will by default include a copy of the Swift runtime to ensure compatibility. This means developers will need to be careful to build every facet of their application with the same version of Xcode and the Swift compiler for at least "a year or two" while the language stabilizes, and they are cautioned to avoid dependence on pre-built frameworks until then.

Apple unveiled Swift, a long-term replacement for Objective C, at its annual developers conference last month. The language was created over a period of three years by a small team within Apple, led by LLVM inventor Chris Lattner, though it is unclear if Apple plans for Swift to follow LLVM's open-source path.
post #2 of 30
An RSS feed? What the hell use is that since Safari doesn't support them anymore in an attempt to force (admittedly better) push notifications...
post #3 of 30
I am not a developer by any means, but am interested to see what is done with this.
post #4 of 30
Quote:
Originally Posted by Elijahg View Post

An RSS feed? What the hell use is that since Safari doesn't support them anymore in an attempt to force (admittedly better) push notifications...

Browser support isn't the only place to support RSS. I think every developer I know still uses them despite Twitter being a common place to announce new articles. Personally, I found Push Notifications in the browser for sites that offer articles to be annoying so I disabled it.

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post #5 of 30
"An RSS feed? What the hell use is that since Safari doesn't support them anymore in an attempt to force (admittedly better) push notifications..."

Actually they showed that the version that ships with Yosemite can handle RSS in the Shared Links tab in the sidebar during the keynote. it was very briefly mentioned though and easy to miss.

Honestly, I find the push notifications method extremely annoying.
post #6 of 30
Quote:
Originally Posted by SolipsismX View Post

Browser support isn't the only place to support RSS. I think every developer I know still uses them despite Twitter being a common place to announce new articles. Personally, I found Push Notifications in the browser for sites that offer articles to be annoying so I disabled it.

That is very true, but since RSS links to websites, an in-browser RSS reader seems logical to me.

The lack of support on iOS for browser notifications is annoying imo.
post #7 of 30
Quote:
Originally Posted by Elijahg View Post

That is very true, but since RSS links to websites, an in-browser RSS reader seems logical to me.

The lack of support on iOS for browser notifications is annoying imo.

I agree with that. Are there any for Safari's Extensions?

"The real haunted empire?  It's the New York Times." ~SockRolid

"There is no rule that says the best phones must have the largest screen." ~RoundaboutNow

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"The real haunted empire?  It's the New York Times." ~SockRolid

"There is no rule that says the best phones must have the largest screen." ~RoundaboutNow

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post #8 of 30

It was mentioned in the last Keynote that RSS feeds will be supported in "Shared Links" in the next version of Safari.  

 

I too find the push notifications a pain and turned them all off.

post #9 of 30
Quote:
Originally Posted by Elijahg View Post

An RSS feed? What the hell use is that since Safari doesn't support them anymore in an attempt to force (admittedly better) push notifications...

RSS is alive and well. Personally... I'm using RSS now more than ever.

When Google Reader shut down... I switched to Feedly. And now I follow over 150 different blogs and websites.
post #10 of 30
Agree about no feed. I distinctly heard a puppy start crying when I found out. Oh well.

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You did not come into the world to fail. You came into the world to succeed.

- Gordon Hinckley

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post #11 of 30

Until Apple extends Swift to the LLVM/Clang project, I have absolutely zero interest in it.

post #12 of 30
Quote:
Originally Posted by SolipsismX View Post

I agree with that. Are there any for Safari's Extensions?

Not that I could find. Surprising really since it's been years since Apple dropped it.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Michael Scrip View Post

RSS is alive and well. Personally... I'm using RSS now more than ever.

Don't I know it. I just don't like keeping another app running & getting in the way to check RSS feeds. Maybe a little menu extra would be nice.
post #13 of 30
This is good news for Apple developers. What would be even better would be a commitment to standardize the language. I'm not talking open source though that would be nice, but rather a formal standard from which others could build their own versions of Swift. Of course if they are looking at two or more years before the language stabilizes that may be an issue. Even so a commitment to a standard now might get more people on board.

As to feeds and such, id rather they set something up on Reddit.
post #14 of 30
Quote:
Originally Posted by Elijahg View Post

Don't I know it. I just don't like keeping another app running & getting in the way to check RSS feeds. Maybe a little menu extra would be nice.

I don't know how it is on the Mac and Safari since I use Windows and Chrome... but I have Feedly bookmarked on my desktop browser and I use Newsify on my iPhone.

It works well enough for me!
post #15 of 30
Quote:
Originally Posted by Elijahg View Post

Maybe a little menu extra would be nice.

I've been using a Menu Bar-based RSS app for many years. It not what I would call a great app in terms of the developers' abilities but it's exactly the type of un-intrusive yet always in view RSS app that I want.

"The real haunted empire?  It's the New York Times." ~SockRolid

"There is no rule that says the best phones must have the largest screen." ~RoundaboutNow

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"The real haunted empire?  It's the New York Times." ~SockRolid

"There is no rule that says the best phones must have the largest screen." ~RoundaboutNow

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post #16 of 30
Quote:
Originally Posted by mdriftmeyer View Post

Until Apple extends Swift to the LLVM/Clang project, I have absolutely zero interest in it.

I find it interesting even if it doesn't solve some of the strangeness associated with Apple development. Given that I think at the very least the need to commit to a language standard, either like they did with OpenCL or via one of the larger standards bodies. However if they are looking at two years before it becomes stabile that might be a problem right now.

As for wrapping it into LLVM/Clang, that would be nice but there are problems. Number one is that the language obviously isn't done yet. By done here I mean implementing the vision the creator has for it. It may simply be too early to go open source. It wouldn't be the first time core developers got to version one or beyond before open sourcing a project. A second issue would be the runtime which apparently Swift is very dependent upon, would Apple release that and give away the keys to the city.

It might be worth offering up questions like these on the blogs web site. I'm pretty certain others are undecided about Swift for similar reasons.
post #17 of 30
Quote:
Originally Posted by mdriftmeyer View Post

Until Apple extends Swift to the LLVM/Clang project, I have absolutely zero interest in it.

Unless you're an Apple developer you probably wouldn't be that interested in it. If you are an Apple developer and you don't use Swift then it's quite possible that after a number of years you would would find it very difficult to write any apps. Swift is clearly Apple's future development language.
post #18 of 30
Quote:
Originally Posted by wizard69 View Post


I find it interesting even if it doesn't solve some of the strangeness associated with Apple development. Given that I think at the very least the need to commit to a language standard, either like they did with OpenCL or via one of the larger standards bodies. However if they are looking at two years before it becomes stabile that might be a problem right now.

As for wrapping it into LLVM/Clang, that would be nice but there are problems. Number one is that the language obviously isn't done yet. By done here I mean implementing the vision the creator has for it. It may simply be too early to go open source. It wouldn't be the first time core developers got to version one or beyond before open sourcing a project. A second issue would be the runtime which apparently Swift is very dependent upon, would Apple release that and give away the keys to the city.

It might be worth offering up questions like these on the blogs web site. I'm pretty certain others are undecided about Swift for similar reasons.

 

What do you think is released for Objective-C in LLVM/Clang? They need to incubate this within the community for standards and get it prime time seeing as they plan on making it the defacto for OS X and iOS. LLVM/Clang ObjC isn't the GNU ObjC Runtime.

post #19 of 30
Quote:
Originally Posted by KiltedGreen View Post


Unless you're an Apple developer you probably wouldn't be that interested in it. If you are an Apple developer and you don't use Swift then it's quite possible that after a number of years you would would find it very difficult to write any apps. Swift is clearly Apple's future development language.

 

I am and as a NeXT and Apple alum we are already pounding them about releasing it.

post #20 of 30

Everything now is in legal, but like the merging of the ARM64 branch into LLVM/Clang which is now a complete merge of all ARM branches, I would expect The Swift Programming language to be added.

 

It's suicide not to do so.

 

By the way, the run-time isn't the keys to the company. It's a run-time. The Cocoa Frameworks are the keys and those are public with private APIs. It's what you do with the tools that are the crowning jewels.

 

Clang would be DOA if it weren't publicly expanded.

post #21 of 30

I can't stand much about Google, but they weren't stupid when Developing Go or DART by keeping it limited to Chrome.

post #22 of 30

Awesome. Moves like this will encourage even more developer support. This is the right approach to take. It's pretty incredible where Apple was a few years ago, compared to where they are now, when it comes to developers. 

post #23 of 30
"It generates very fast code," said Tom, Swiftly.
"Swift generally gets you to the right way much quicker." - auxio -
"He who laughs, lasts!" - Mary Pettibone Poole -
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"Swift generally gets you to the right way much quicker." - auxio -
"He who laughs, lasts!" - Mary Pettibone Poole -
Reply
post #24 of 30
Quote:
Originally Posted by SolipsismX View Post

I've been using a Menu Bar-based RSS app for many years. It not what I would call a great app in terms of the developers' abilities but it's exactly the type of un-intrusive yet always in view RSS app that I want.

Oh that's pretty nice, thanks for that.
post #25 of 30
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dick Applebaum View Post

"It generates very fast code," said Tom, Swiftly.

Ohh... you're showing you age with that one, Tom said revealingly...
"That (the) world is moving so quickly that iOS is already amongst the older mobile operating systems in active development today." — The Verge
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"That (the) world is moving so quickly that iOS is already amongst the older mobile operating systems in active development today." — The Verge
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post #26 of 30

Apple should modify the Swift bird app logo.

 

Right now it looks like the bird is crashing down.

 

It'd be better to make it fly up from the bottom left to the up right corner.

post #27 of 30
Quote:
Originally Posted by mr O View Post
 

Apple should modify the Swift bird app logo.

 

Right now it looks like the bird is crashing down.

 

It'd be better to make it fly up from the bottom left to the up right corner.

 

That's what I said to myself a second after they revealed the logo. Design is nice, but orientation seems wrong. 

post #28 of 30
Quote:
Originally Posted by mr O View Post

Apple should modify the Swift bird app logo.

Right now it looks like the bird is crashing down.

It'd be better to make it fly up from the bottom left to the up right corner.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Slurpy View Post

That's what I said to myself a second after they revealed the logo. Design is nice, but orientation seems wrong. 

Hey guys... birds fly up and down.

Maybe the bird is swooping down to catch some prey... swiftly.

1biggrin.gif
post #29 of 30
Quote:
Originally Posted by mdriftmeyer View Post

What do you think is released for Objective-C in LLVM/Clang? They need to incubate this within the community for standards and get it prime time seeing as they plan on making it the defacto for OS X and iOS. LLVM/Clang ObjC isn't the GNU ObjC Runtime.
If they give the community too much leverage, it will become a mess like Javascript as it goes form being elegant to "this isn't C++ enough, let's make it harder to use so no newbies will not want to use it" that has happened to Javascript, Perl, and PHP

I prefer C, there's nothing terribly wrong with OBJC, or C++, but I find there is a lot of "OOP for the sake of OOP" and not OOP because it makes sense in many projects. This is why you see frameworks layered upon frameworks, because nobody likes how anyone else codes, so they wrap the frameworks they are using first with their own preferred style.

Hell I've seen this happen to my own code multiple times, which is why I don't care too much for politically charged(eg GPL) open source projects.
post #30 of 30
Quote:
Originally Posted by mr O View Post

Apple should modify the Swift bird app logo.

Right now it looks like the bird is crashing down.

It'd be better to make it fly up from the bottom left to the up right corner.

I think the reason that the swift is pictures as flying downward is because it hunts insects from above.
Quote:
Swifts are the most aerial of birds. Larger species are amongst the fastest fliers in the animal kingdom, with the white-throated needletail having been reported flying at up to 169 km/h (105 mph).[6] Even the common swift can cruise at a maximum speed of 31 metres per second (112 km/h, 70 mph). In a single year the common swift can cover at least 200,000 km.[7]

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Swift
"Swift generally gets you to the right way much quicker." - auxio -
"He who laughs, lasts!" - Mary Pettibone Poole -
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"Swift generally gets you to the right way much quicker." - auxio -
"He who laughs, lasts!" - Mary Pettibone Poole -
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