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Apple tweaks App Store layout amid developer unrest

post #1 of 35
Thread Starter 
Faced with criticism over the way it's been grouping applications on the digital shelves of the App Store, Apple this week is making some changes to the store's layout aimed at showcasing a broader range of top offerings in each category.

TouchMeme's Krishna Vegesna tipped AppleInsider off to the overnight design tweaks, which "accomplished three important things," according to the iPhone app developer. First, he said, Apple now highlights the most popular applications on each category page.

As part of this new grouping, the Cupertino-based company has also separated the most popular Free Apps -- which previously dominated the most popular listings -- from most popular Paid Apps, breaking each out into separate sidebar modules that flank the general listings for each category. In addition, the new layout is more consistent in design with the AppStore application on the iPhone, Vegesna noted.

"I am excited to see the change. My Apps are listed under the top paid apps for the Travel category," he said. "Flight Status is at No 3 and Currency Exchange is at No 9. Two out of top 10 is not bad, I guess for this category."

Earlier this week, Twitteriffic developer Craig Hockenberry wrote an open letter to Apple chief executive Steve Jobs, pointing out that developers have been lowering their App prices to the lowest possible level in order to obtain favorable placement in the App Store.

"This proliferation of 99 cent 'ringtone apps' is affecting our product development," he said. "We have a lot of great ideas for iPhone applications. Unfortunately, were not working on the cooler (and more complex) ideas. Instead, were working on 99¢ titles that have a limited lifespan and broad appeal. Market conditions [on the App Store] make ringtone apps most appealing."



While Friday's changes may not solve all of developers' problems, Vegesna said he believes Apple "now truly understands the software as a service model and is enhancing the [App Store] every week (in some cases, multiple times a week)."

"AppStore is getting better and the focus is now shifting more towards better apps," he added. "Keep it coming Apple."

post #2 of 35
They really need to break games down into subcategories in my opinion. That category is getting too large.
post #3 of 35
On the user (consumer) end I would like a feature in iTunes where I can arrange the icons and apps on each screen of my device all at one time instead of the hold it down and move the wiggly icons one at a time. Just my two cents.
post #4 of 35
Quote:
Originally Posted by afishertx View Post

On the user (consumer) end I would like a feature in iTunes where I can arrange the icons and apps on each screen of my device all at one time instead of the hold it down and move the wiggly icons one at a time. Just my two cents.

The app store has just become a mess with thousands of apps, 99% of which are either useless, crippled or just plain stupid.

the limited number of good apps just get buried in with the rest.
post #5 of 35
Quote:
Originally Posted by Archipellago View Post

The app store has just become a mess with thousands of apps, 99% of which are either useless, crippled or just plain stupid.

the limited number of good apps just get buried in with the rest.

What may be useless to you is good for someone else.
post #6 of 35
Quote:
Originally Posted by afishertx View Post

On the user (consumer) end I would like a feature in iTunes where I can arrange the icons and apps on each screen of my device all at one time instead of the hold it down and move the wiggly icons one at a time. Just my two cents.

I agree with this idea--the arrangement method on the phone now, while cute, is not user-friendly. I put one icon where I want it and another gets forced away from where I wanted it. It feels like a sliding tile game, except I'm not always interested in playing. \
post #7 of 35
The main thing I don't understand about the App Store is the rating system. Take a look at my application "AirMote" which is a remote control for Front Row, Keynote and such. It has three reviews, a 4 star, a 5 star, and a 4 star. But the "Average Rating" Apple shows is 2.5 stars. What's up with that?
post #8 of 35
Instead of just the #1 spot, I think Apple should display the icons for the top 5 spots under Paid and Free Apps. I imagine the owners of spots 2 thru 4 are making that same argument at this very moment
post #9 of 35
The new design also struck me as a little dull-looking
post #10 of 35
Quote:
Originally Posted by lepton View Post

The main thing I don't understand about the App Store is the rating system. Take a look at my application "AirMote" which is a remote control for Front Row, Keynote and such. It has three reviews, a 4 star, a 5 star, and a 4 star. But the "Average Rating" Apple shows is 2.5 stars. What's up with that?

I also noticed that this week.
Personally I think it's a bug or something wrong with the rating system.
post #11 of 35
Quote:
Originally Posted by ktappe View Post

I agree with this idea--the arrangement method on the phone now, while cute, is not user-friendly. I put one icon where I want it and another gets forced away from where I wanted it. It feels like a sliding tile game, except I'm not always interested in playing. \

Never thought of it that way. Apple should capitalize on that. "Every iPhone and iPod Tough comes with a free Tile Game App".
I too have looked at my iPhone thinking, "Boy, I need to cleen up and organize my screens", then a second later thought, "I can live with it for now. Don't have the time or patience for the tile game."
post #12 of 35
Quote:
Originally Posted by lepton View Post

The main thing I don't understand about the App Store is the rating system. Take a look at my application "AirMote" which is a remote control for Front Row, Keynote and such. It has three reviews, a 4 star, a 5 star, and a 4 star. But the "Average Rating" Apple shows is 2.5 stars. What's up with that?

First, the average rating is country based. Second. It is combined from review ratings and the ratings you can give when you remove an app directly on your iPhone. The latter most likely pulled your rating down (and up in the canadian store, from one star from the lone reviewer to one a half average). Apparently nobody from Germany tried your app, there is no rating at all yet..
post #13 of 35
edited....
post #14 of 35
They need three separate categories:

(1) Top free

(2) Top $1 apps

(3) Top apps for above $1


In the main app store page and within each category. This shouldn't be hard to do, but it makes too much sense - so I don't see Apple ever doing it!

Within the top paid page, they need new two categories:

(1) Top $1 apps
and

(2) Top apps for above $1
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post #15 of 35
The above quote from the article (at the end) makes me scratch my head. What does the App Store have to do with "software as a service?" And how could rearranging how "top apps" are displayed possibly showcase that Apple understands it?
post #16 of 35
Quote:
Originally Posted by gmaletic View Post

The above quote from the article (at the end) makes me scratch my head. What does the App Store have to do with "software as a service?" And how could rearranging how "top apps" are displayed possibly showcase that Apple understands it?

Just a dev. licking Apple's ass, nothing more.
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post #17 of 35
Quote:
Originally Posted by gmaletic View Post

The above quote from the article (at the end) makes me scratch my head. What does the App Store have to do with "software as a service?" And how could rearranging how "top apps" are displayed possibly showcase that Apple understands it?

it shows that Apple is paying attention to the moaning from folks that wanna make some money and are sick of the freebies getting the most downloads.

it's a proven fact that many people buy based off top lists, some obsessively. take the New York Times bestselling books. they do it based on units not cost so publishers give bookstores huge breaks to sell new books at a way cheap price (30-40% off generally) so they will have huge units and get high on the list. because folks believe that is a sign that the book is good and go and buy it.

developers don't want their good, but pricey apps buried under a bunch of free "I did it for fun, not profit" apps.

personally I like the split because I prefer to go check out the free apps first and then go to the paid if I don't find a free one that does what I want. so splitting them makes it easier for me to find the free ones.

A non tech's thoughts on Apple stuff 

(She's family so I'm a little biased)

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A non tech's thoughts on Apple stuff 

(She's family so I'm a little biased)

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post #18 of 35
Quote:
Originally Posted by charlituna View Post

it shows that Apple is paying attention to the moaning from folks that wanna make some money and are sick of the freebies getting the most downloads.

No, I understand why what Apple is doing now is better than what it was doing before...but I didn't understand how the term "software as a service" has any relevancy to the App Store. iPhone apps aren't services. The App Store's not a service either, unless you consider absolutely every online store a service (thereby reducing the term to meaninglessness.)

I just think it's a sloppy use of a recent buzzword, and I think AppleInsider was a little sloppy passing it along without questioning it.
post #19 of 35
Quote:
Originally Posted by gmaletic View Post

No, I understand why what Apple is doing now is better than what it was doing before...but I didn't understand how the term "software as a service" has any relevancy to the App Store. iPhone apps aren't services. The App Store's not a service either, unless you consider absolutely every online store a service (thereby reducing the term to meaninglessness.)

I just think it's a sloppy use of a recent buzzword, and I think AppleInsider was a little sloppy passing it along without questioning it.

Good point, well made.

Welcome to AI, hope you stick around.
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post #20 of 35
Quote:
Originally Posted by ktappe View Post

I agree with this idea--the arrangement method on the phone now, while cute, is not user-friendly. I put one icon where I want it and another gets forced away from where I wanted it. It feels like a sliding tile game, except I'm not always interested in playing. \

When you choose to move an item between two objects, in order to put it there they would have to make room for the object in the middle. How else would you suggest to implement a way to move an object and not cause the object that is already there to move out of the way? Are you suggesting a stacking UI?
post #21 of 35
I'm in Australia, the featured and Top 25 Applications don't seem to change very fast (if at all), things I downloaded weeks ago are still there.

Where are all the new big name games that are coming out?

I've found I've had to use the search function after researching various sites on the web or subscribing to a few email lists.

That seems to be the only way to keep up to date.

Edit:-

I have also used seven and a half screens and am rapidly running out of space, what I would love to have are folders so I can clean up my desktops.

What would be totally awesome is a games folder with a feature similar to cover flow, where you could flick through your titles and select them.
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post #22 of 35
Quote:
Originally Posted by afishertx View Post

Never thought of it that way. Apple should capitalize on that. "Every iPhone and iPod Tough comes with a free Tile Game App".
I too have looked at my iPhone thinking, "Boy, I need to cleen up and organize my screens", then a second later thought, "I can live with it for now. Don't have the time or patience for the tile game."

Right!! Once a screen fills, if I want another screen of "like" Apps to come next, I have to slide screen after screen worth over. This should all be manipulatable in a much more robust way. If not in iTunes, which seems easiest to me but strikes me as not in Jobs' master plan, at least give me more on the device.

My Touch is now a mess. So what happens? I don't use many of the Apps. And since I don't use those, why would I pay for more of them just to not use? C'mon, Apple. Think Different.....
post #23 of 35
Quote:
Originally Posted by lepton View Post

The main thing I don't understand about the App Store is the rating system. Take a look at my application "AirMote" which is a remote control for Front Row, Keynote and such. It has three reviews, a 4 star, a 5 star, and a 4 star. But the "Average Rating" Apple shows is 2.5 stars. What's up with that?

I'm assuming that you have more sales than reviews.

As Apple now allows people to review an app when they remove it from their phone, perhaps that's affecting your ratings, because possibly, for some reason, those reviews don't show up.
post #24 of 35
How can an app in the Free Sports Section with 1.5 Stars be rated #14 Plum Caddy Golf Mapping & Scoring Application?

I paid $9.95 for this TERRIBLE application because of it's so called GPS capability. It has a couple of Golf courses and hasn't been upgraded in ages.

I didn't trust the rating before and I I trust it even less now.

Apple should allow trial software.

This one application alone has kept me from purchasing ANY other software.
Apples no return policy is a joke as well especially if you can't demo the software first and a few screen shots isn't enough to know if the App works as advertised.

Obviously if this app is free now and once charged $9.95 has 1.5 stars and is still rated 14 within the sports section there has got to be problems or favoritism going on.
post #25 of 35
Quote:
Originally Posted by MacOldTimer View Post

How can an app in the Free Sports Section with 1.5 Stars be rated #14 Plum Caddy Golf Mapping & Scoring Application?

I paid $9.95 for this TERRIBLE application because of it's so called GPS capability. It has a couple of Golf courses and hasn't been upgraded in ages.

I didn't trust the rating before and I I trust it even less now.

Apple should allow trial software.

This one application alone has kept me from purchasing ANY other software.
Apples no return policy is a joke as well especially if you can't demo the software first and a few screen shots isn't enough to know if the App works as advertised.

Obviously if this app is free now and once charged $9.95 has 1.5 stars and is still rated 14 within the sports section there has got to be problems or favoritism going on.

You're too much of a conspiracy theorist.

You do what you would do with any software, which is to look for legitimate reviews first. Consumer reviews, unless there are dozens of them, are never reliable. Don't forget that in the beginning, Apple was relying on people's honesty in the reviews. You didn't have to buy a program to review it. Now you do, so that's some help.

Apple doesn't allow for trial software because of the billing methods, which work well.

But many have offered free versions of their programs along with the paid ones.

Unless I don't care about losing the few bucks these programs cost, I wait until enough people have reviewed it, so that it matters, or, I look for more professional reviews on the sites that offer reviews of iPhone software.

As for how well it's now "selling" despite it's now poor reviews, well, it costs nothing to download free software.
post #26 of 35
Quote:
Originally Posted by dguisinger View Post

They really need to break games down into subcategories in my opinion. That category is getting too large.

My god, not just games, but *each and every* category needs to be broken down into subcategories on the iPhone app store. At the moment, they are WAY to broad and baring searching by keyword (which is not always possible), It can take forever to find certain apps!
post #27 of 35
Quote:
Originally Posted by melgross View Post

You're too much of a conspiracy theorist.

You do what you would do with any software, which is to look for legitimate reviews first. Consumer reviews, unless there are dozens of them, are never reliable. Don't forget that in the beginning, Apple was relying on people's honesty in the reviews. You didn't have to buy a program to review it. Now you do, so that's some help.

Apple doesn't allow for trial software because of the billing methods, which work well.

But many have offered free versions of their programs along with the paid ones.

Unless I don't care about losing the few bucks these programs cost, I wait until enough people have reviewed it, so that it matters, or, I look for more professional reviews on the sites that offer reviews of iPhone software.

As for how well it's now "selling" despite it's now poor reviews, well, it costs nothing to download free software.

So to make your long story short. Don't trust Apple's App Store & do your homework to know if the software is worth buying.

I trust BestBuy, I shop there and if I'm not happy with my purchase I return it.

Is that too much to ask. Your theory doesn't explain why there is no return policy & it doesn't take a conspiracy to know MANY are unhappy with the app store and Apple changing policy on a weekly basis.

Say it's new and Apple is just learning. They should have done their homework from Amazon where if you are unhappy with a purchase you can return it.

The store is full of useless software and games. Not being a gamer I'm extremely sad that Apple has made a great phone into a toy.
post #28 of 35
Quote:
Originally Posted by MacOldTimer View Post

So to make your long story short. Don't trust Apple's App Store & do your homework to know if the software is worth buying.

I trust BestBuy, I shop there and if I'm not happy with my purchase I return it.

Is that too much to ask. Your theory doesn't explain why there is no return policy & it doesn't take a conspiracy to know MANY are unhappy with the app store and Apple changing policy on a weekly basis.

Say it's new and Apple is just learning. They should have done their homework from Amazon where if you are unhappy with a purchase you can return it.

The store is full of useless software and games. Not being a gamer I'm extremely sad that Apple has made a great phone into a toy.

Selling boxed merchandise is very different from selling software downloads.

Also, when the average price of the software is around $3, most people will be willing to take the plunge. Only a fool complains when they buy something that isn't properly reviewed, or knows people who bought it and are happy, before spending money on it, and only afterwards, complains.

One reason why Apple can do this at all, is that the method for selling and billing is so simple. Once they get into a model where they have to refund money and use the kill switch to wipe the program from your phone, things become much more complex, and expensive. It's also rare to be able to get your money back on software if you aren't happy.

I've bought a few programs from the app store that weren't very good when I bought them. but they were so cheap, that it was worth the risk. most of them have gotten much better over time though, which has made their purchase much more worthwhile. Sometimes, it just takes time. There will always be losers though. You have to expect that though.

If you try a new flavor of ice cream at you local store, and you don't like it, you don't expect to get your money back, unless it's spoiled.

It's tough to claim that most software is spoiled though, because I'm interested to see that even for software that most people don't seem to like, there are enough others who do like it.

But, going back to my original point, the onus is on the purchaser, as usual, to find out if the product is good. There's no need to rush to buy something when it first comes out. If you wait a while, you'll get a better idea as to how good something is.

Otherwise, consider the $10 to be a possible loss.

When I had my Palm phones, I bought a fair number of programs, and the same problem occurred. Even though some of the software had a trial period, often, after a week of use, after I had ended up buying the program, I realized that it wasn't as useful, or as good, as it looked in the beginning, when I was enthusiastic about it. I couldn't get my money back either, and those programs averaged $20 apiece, not $5.

I don't know just what the term "many" means here.

Obviously, with over 300 million downloads taking place on just maybe 12 to 15 million phones, "most" people are VERY happy indeed. And if the 50% being paid apps is continuing, then that's a good 150 million apps being bought since the 3G came out, an amazing record!

I firmly believe that as usual, those who are not happy tend to exaggerate the numbers of those who are unhappy with them.

We do know that most of the rearranging of the store is being done at the developers insistence, so as to make paid apps easier to see, and buy. But that has nothing to do with consumers, though Apple seems to be trying out how to improve that side as well.

As a consumer of four screens of apps so far, I would like to see more subcategories, and apps placed more appropriately. Sometimes, an app isn't where one would expect it to be, which now, with all the apps there, makes things difficult to find.

But, I have to say that the number of apps so far exceeds my expectation at this time, that I'm sure Apple is overwhelmed.
post #29 of 35
Quote:
Originally Posted by melgross View Post

Selling boxed merchandise is very different from selling software downloads.

Also, when the average price of the software is around $3, most people will be willing to take the plunge. Only a fool complains when they buy something that isn't properly reviewed, or knows people who bought it and are happy, before spending money on it, and only afterwards, complains.

One reason why Apple can do this at all, is that the method for selling and billing is so simple. Once they get into a model where they have to refund money and use the kill switch to wipe the program from your phone, things become much more complex, and expensive. It's also rare to be able to get your money back on software if you aren't happy.

I've bought a few programs from the app store that weren't very good when I bought them. but they were so cheap, that it was worth the risk. most of them have gotten much better over time though, which has made their purchase much more worthwhile. Sometimes, it just takes time. There will always be losers though. You have to expect that though.

If you try a new flavor of ice cream at you local store, and you don't like it, you don't expect to get your money back, unless it's spoiled.

It's tough to claim that most software is spoiled though, because I'm interested to see that even for software that most people don't seem to like, there are enough others who do like it.

But, going back to my original point, the onus is on the purchaser, as usual, to find out if the product is good. There's no need to rush to buy something when it first comes out. If you wait a while, you'll get a better idea as to how good something is.

Otherwise, consider the $10 to be a possible loss.

When I had my Palm phones, I bought a fair number of programs, and the same problem occurred. Even though some of the software had a trial period, often, after a week of use, after I had ended up buying the program, I realized that it wasn't as useful, or as good, as it looked in the beginning, when I was enthusiastic about it. I couldn't get my money back either, and those programs averaged $20 apiece, not $5.

I don't know just what the term "many" means here.

Obviously, with over 300 million downloads taking place on just maybe 12 to 15 million phones, "most" people are VERY happy indeed. And if the 50% being paid apps is continuing, then that's a good 150 million apps being bought since the 3G came out, an amazing record!

I firmly believe that as usual, those who are not happy tend to exaggerate the numbers of those who are unhappy with them.

We do know that most of the rearranging of the store is being done at the developers insistence, so as to make paid apps easier to see, and buy. But that has nothing to do with consumers, though Apple seems to be trying out how to improve that side as well.

As a consumer of four screens of apps so far, I would like to see more subcategories, and apps placed more appropriately. Sometimes, an app isn't where one would expect it to be, which now, with all the apps there, makes things difficult to find.

But, I have to say that the number of apps so far exceeds my expectation at this time, that I'm sure Apple is overwhelmed.


You do a lot to support the App Store (as most Apple fans blindly do) but you have yet to answer my orignal question.

HOW CAN AN APP IN THE SPORTS SECTION WITH 1.5 STARS THAT STARTED AT $9.95 AND IS NOW FREE BE RATED #14.

I Just checked the app store and in the free section there are 100 Free Sports applications.
Spot checking in about 5 minutes I found 20 apps that were rated higher than 1.5 stars that are rated LOWER than #14.

Where is the conspiracy when this is clearly wrong and misleading? If the Sold Apps are given the same inconsistency in their rating placement then Apple is misleading the end consumer.
post #30 of 35
Quote:
Originally Posted by MacOldTimer View Post

You do a lot to support the App Store (as most Apple fans blindly do) but you have yet to answer my orignal question.


HOW CAN AN APP IN THE SPORTS SECTION WITH 1.5 STARS THAT STARTED AT $9.95 AND IS NOW FREE BE RATED #14.

I Just checked the app store and in the free section there are 100 Free Sports applications.
Spot checking in about 5 minutes I found 20 apps that were rated higher than 1.5 stars that are rated LOWER than #14.

Where is the conspiracy when this is clearly wrong and misleading? If the Sold Apps are given the same inconsistency in their rating placement then Apple is misleading the end consumer.

You think like a child when you call people fanboys when you are so obviously ignorant of that person. When you grow up, come back.

I've already answered your questions.
post #31 of 35
Quote:
Originally Posted by melgross View Post

You think like a child when you call people fanboys when you are so obviously ignorant of that person. When you grow up, come back.

I've already answered your questions.

Read more carefully MODERATOR!

I did not call you a fanboy. My quote was "Apple fans" If you are going to insult me in your own room then get the quotes straight.

My observation would be you've been called a "FanBoy" too many times are a little sensitive. But that's just an observation of your lack of respect to my post.
post #32 of 35
Quote:
Originally Posted by MacOldTimer View Post

Read more carefully MODERATOR!

I did not call you a fanboy. My quote was "Apple fans" If you are going to insult me in your own room then get the quotes straight.

My observation would be you've been called a "FanBoy" too many times are a little sensitive. But that's just an observation of your lack of respect to my post.

"You do a lot to support the App Store (as most Apple fans blindly do) but you have yet to answer my orignal question."

If that isn't a roundabout way of calling someone a fanboy, then I don't know what is.

I tried very hard to answer your posts. I didn't give a quick one line flip of an answer, as you know.

But between that, and not seeing that I DID answer your questions, only goes to show that you didn't bother reading my answers carefully.

So, don't say I didn't respect your post, because I spent some time in trying to give a good, detailed answer. The fact that you don't realize that is not my fault.

You don't have to agree with what I said, but you should at least acknowledge that I did, indeed, give a serious reply. Calling someone a fanboy because they don't agree with your angry assumptions is not helpful in any way.

Who's not respecting who's post?
post #33 of 35
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ireland View Post

They need three separate categories:

](1) Top free

(2) Top $1 apps

(3) Top apps for above $1


In the main app store page and within each category. This shouldn't be hard to do, but it makes too much sense - so I don't see Apple ever doing it!

Within the top paid page, they need new two categories:

(1) Top $1 apps
and

(2) Top apps for above $1

I think even better -- put these Apps under a category called "Budget" or "Bargain Bin" so that they are properly highlighted as to what they are.

No doubt that will cause some flamage but we need to get the prices up in the App Store or developers are only going to make quick and dirty applications. I'd rather see 500 good apps then 10,000 quick & dirty applications.

-mark=
post #34 of 35
The iPhone desktop needs folders IMO. The "tile game" would be irrelevant then.
post #35 of 35
Quote:
Originally Posted by lepton View Post

The main thing I don't understand about the App Store is the rating system. Take a look at my application "AirMote" which is a remote control for Front Row, Keynote and such. It has three reviews, a 4 star, a 5 star, and a 4 star. But the "Average Rating" Apple shows is 2.5 stars. What's up with that?

Reviews aren't the same as ratings. A user can rate an app without having to review it. I think the OS asks you if you want to rate an app when you delete it.

Quote:
Originally Posted by MacOldTimer View Post

So to make your long story short. Don't trust Apple's App Store & do your homework to know if the software is worth buying.

I trust BestBuy, I shop there and if I'm not happy with my purchase I return it.

Have you actually returned software? The return policies that I see basically say no returns on software. They generally only offer exchanges for same title if the media is bad.
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