This leaves me very surprised that Apple did not put a second network connection and at least one eSATA port unless this is merely an interim model that was put out until such time as they can mod the logic board and such. I just can not believe it would have been that hard to add SATA to the whole line.
It would have been nice to have an eSATA/USB combo port...
The server version is DOA. I agree with some of the others.
Its a shot at Windows Home Server and it fails. The form factor truly limits its expandability. Its design is completely counter productive to the server market. Small proprietary cases are not going to cut it.
Its a shame Apple couldn't of read that server thread we had on hear to realize they still aren't doing it right.
Lack of HDMI on the regular mini is also a non-starter considering many many people use it for a set top HTPC.
How on earth did that answer his question? You do NOT NEED dual nics in a SOHO server. It's a nice to have but most SOHO setups aren't laid down for either the redundancy or load balancing.
Also most SOHO setups depend on a hardware firewall (aka their router) and not have a dedicated server for it. EVEN if they did, you sure as hell don't want to dual use your file/app server as your internet facing firewall. Some folks will but it's not optimal.
In 90% of normal offices you aren't going to saturate a GigE based fileshare anyway. For him a few nice FW800 drives that he can use for Time Machine and take home for offsite storage is fine.
Is the new mini a great SOHO server? Eh. You do get cheap access to SLS which is nice if you wanted to run a pure OSX shop. If that's the objective it's a steal.
Versus SLES and RHEL you probably also don't need a dedicated geek to run the thing. Same for managing AD/Exchange/Sharepoint in a Server 2k8. Most SOHOs have one guy quadruple hatted to be the IT guy as well. Unless that person is a linux geek or a former windows IT guy it's just a PITA to go down that route (especially if it's you). Snow Leopard Server with a buncha macs is a lot nicer for a SOHO environment for that poor smuck designated the IT guy.
My suggestion is to buy two of the things though. Not having your files or apps for days even if the data is safe will suck more than the $999 hit up front. Unless you have an Apple Store nearby and they stock the server versions of the mini.
Which they will be out of, of course, when your mini explodes.
So for your office I would buy two mini's and keep one at home for "testing". Actually, that's only half a joke...most stuff you want to try first in a test environment before you deploy. Even Apple's updates. So for SOHO, having a spare at the IT guy's house safeguards all sorts of things.
Yeah, I didn't understand his reply.
The software I'm looking at is Mac based so running a Windows or Linux server isn't a possibility. I need, or would like, an inexpensive Mac server with a simple but effective back up strategy.
I don't need to have 99.99999999999999% up time. I just need to be able to restore the server myself if an issue like a hardware failure or fire occurs.
My needs are different than big enterprise. I'm the CEO, blue collar worker and IT guy all in one. With AIO limitations.
I don't think this is meant to be anything more than a small business or home server. In which case I don't really think the 2nd ethernet port is essential. Most of this target audience is not looking to use it as a firewall/router. They will place it behind their existing router and use it mostly for internal purposes, with the possibility of mail.
I never understand the people that constantly complain when Apple comes out with a great low end product that doesn't have all of the high end features. Take this for what it is priced at, a low end server solution at a great price.
Exactly!
We are a 4-5 user company that needs file and print sharing and this is exactly what we are looking for. Our email is offsite through Fusemail and our website it hosted elsewhere. At times we may have 10 or more users so the Unlimited License in SL 10.6 is a huge benefit. I can't cost justify a Microsoft SBS or W2008 server in this environment. This is an absolute no-brainer.
Why? Honest question not trying to be a smart ass.
I'm looking to move my practice to Mac software and HW. I would like a simple server with two HDDs that mirror in the event one fails. I would also like to have an external drive that I can take off site each day and then cloud back up.
I would think that this would be pretty good back strategy up for my practice. Am I wrong?
Sounds like you have a small number of client machines and limited storage requirements. It should work just fine. I would add an external FireWire 800 HDD and use time machine to automatically backup.
Then, when desired, take this off site and copy it to another drive.
I currently use a Mini as a Home Media Server to 7 Macs and an AppleTV. The Mini has 2 2TB external FireWire drives.
1 external HDD Contains a composite iPhoto library and a composite iTunes Library of 10,000 songs and 700 videos (a poor man's Kalidescape) including irreplaceable home pictures and home movies.
The second is a Time Machine backup of the first which I periodically backup and take to off site storage.
Does anyone know or can speculate whether the mini server will include the actual install DVD in case a reinstall is required? I don't know, it seems likely but with its lack of an optical drive who knows... What's the situation with Macbook Air in that regard?
The server version is DOA. I agree with some of the others.
Its a shot at Windows Home Server and it fails. The form factor truly limits its expandability. Its design is completely counter productive to the server market. Small proprietary cases are not going to cut it.
Its a shame Apple couldn't of read that server thread we had on hear to realize they still aren't doing it right.
Lack of HDMI on the regular mini is also a non-starter considering many many people use it for a set top HTPC.
It's more than than a shot at Windows Home Server it murders it in features.
With WHS I'm stuck with managing only 10 clients. Volume management is basically pooling all the storage and creating a bunch of folders. There is no Exchange/Outlook paradigm.
I have none of those limitations with a mini running Snow Leopard. The form factor really doesn't matter that much. Bladesystems don't have much expandability on the blades themselves because that expandability is managed elsewhere with storage, networking and more. Typically administrators will install the NOS on a mirrored pair of drives and then use an external array direct attached or move to a NAS/SAN.
With the amount of low cost NAS boxes from Thecus, Iomega, QNAP and more all supporting iSCSI the need for internal storage just isn't there. This is going to be a very popular box. I'll guarantee it. It's barely more expensive than a Mediasmart server but it offers so much more.
Does anyone know or can speculate whether the mini server will include the actual install DVD in case a reinstall is required? I don't know, it seems likely but with its lack of an optical drive who knows... What's the situation with Macbook Air in that regard?
It would be really odd if Apple didn't include an install DVD (as they do for all pre-installed software).
You can Install over external DVD drive, FireWire, and possibly WiFi from another computer.
Does anyone know or can speculate whether the mini server will include the actual install DVD in case a reinstall is required? I don't know, it seems likely but with its lack of an optical drive who knows... What's the situation with Macbook Air in that regard?
Both come with restore DVDs. To reinstall the OS is very simple. You can use another Mac?s optical drive over a network, or just one of the local ports connected to the OS.
For Mac OS X Server software support of Xserves, Apple charges from $5,995.00 ("Select") to $19,995.00 ("Preferred") to $49,995.00 ("Alliance"). I don't know what the term is, whether that's per year.
Software support from Apple might cost from 6X to 50X the price of the new mini server.
First off I agree with the post that having a server with a single GigE port is useless.
Second, actually having a DroboPro, I can state categorically that the device is too slow unless it is run over iSCSI, which means using the only GigE port.
There is no possible configuration using a switch that can solve this.
The DroboPro cannot operate with the iSCSI connection on the LAN subnet.
There is nothing magical about this upgrade, its been a popular mod for months now.
I do agree that the inclusion of Snow Leopard Server is compelling but for me personally, a server with a single NIC is completely useless...
My DroboPro is getting returned and I will buy a Qnap 809 Pro instead...
First off I agree with the post that having a server with a single GigE port is useless.
Second, actually having a DroboPro, I can state categorically that the device is too slow unless it is run over iSCSI, which means using the only GigE port.
There is no possible configuration using a switch that can solve this.
The DroboPro cannot operate with the iSCSI connection on the LAN subnet.
There is nothing magical about this upgrade, its been a popular mod for months now.
I do agree that the inclusion of Snow Leopard Server is compelling but for me personally, a server with a single NIC is completely useless...
My DroboPro is getting returned and I will buy a Qnap 809 Pro instead...
ET
So how do you explain the fact that people have been building server farms out of Mac minis? Must not be as useless as you claim, IMHO.
There is nothing magical about this upgrade, its been a popular mod for months now.
I do agree that the inclusion of Snow Leopard Server is compelling but for me personally, a server with a single NIC is completely useless...
My DroboPro is getting returned and I will buy a Qnap 809 Pro instead...
ET
Drobo has never delivered the type of performance that NAS competion like Synology or QNAP deliver and that's sad because they're raison d'être is "drop dead simplicity" but that comes at the cost of performance.
I wouldn't say anyone thinks a Mac mini server is magical but it does create a "blessed" config for Apple servers at under $1k. We all know plenty of people who rolled their own but the key here is what Apple will support. They didn't support OS X Server on the mini until this announcement and that and the ability to ship many more copies of OS X server are what is good here IMO.
Drobo has never delivered the type of performance that NAS competion like Synology or QNAP deliver and that's sad because they're raison d'être is "drop dead simplicity" but that comes at the cost of performance.
I wouldn't say anyone thinks a Mac mini server is magical but it does create a "blessed" config for Apple servers at under $1k. We all know plenty of people who rolled their own but the key here is what Apple will support. They didn't support OS X Server on the mini until this announcement and that and the ability to ship many more copies of OS X server are what is good here IMO.
Good points. Apple reps have been selling the Minis for just this sort of use for some time now and the company is finally starting to catch up with the real world use of these things. Having a "blessed" system did not particularly matter to the larger edu customers who are pretty much supported on whatever they do under the service agreements, but means a great deal for smaller customers.
Still, it is sad that there is not a second NIC port on the server model and an eSATA port across the line.
The one thing that is encouraging about this product release is that it was not accompanied with a great dog and pony show scheduled for some time that has nothing to do with when the product was ready. Perhaps, just perhaps, Apple is beginning to realize that it should intro a product line when it is "good to go".
Personally, I remain very disappointed that at least one eSATA port was not included with the new Minis as it severely limits the uses I had envisioned for it as a HTPC and/or home server.
Comments
This leaves me very surprised that Apple did not put a second network connection and at least one eSATA port unless this is merely an interim model that was put out until such time as they can mod the logic board and such. I just can not believe it would have been that hard to add SATA to the whole line.
It would have been nice to have an eSATA/USB combo port...
Its a shot at Windows Home Server and it fails. The form factor truly limits its expandability. Its design is completely counter productive to the server market. Small proprietary cases are not going to cut it.
Its a shame Apple couldn't of read that server thread we had on hear to realize they still aren't doing it right.
Lack of HDMI on the regular mini is also a non-starter considering many many people use it for a set top HTPC.
How on earth did that answer his question? You do NOT NEED dual nics in a SOHO server. It's a nice to have but most SOHO setups aren't laid down for either the redundancy or load balancing.
Also most SOHO setups depend on a hardware firewall (aka their router) and not have a dedicated server for it. EVEN if they did, you sure as hell don't want to dual use your file/app server as your internet facing firewall. Some folks will but it's not optimal.
In 90% of normal offices you aren't going to saturate a GigE based fileshare anyway. For him a few nice FW800 drives that he can use for Time Machine and take home for offsite storage is fine.
Is the new mini a great SOHO server? Eh. You do get cheap access to SLS which is nice if you wanted to run a pure OSX shop. If that's the objective it's a steal.
Versus SLES and RHEL you probably also don't need a dedicated geek to run the thing. Same for managing AD/Exchange/Sharepoint in a Server 2k8. Most SOHOs have one guy quadruple hatted to be the IT guy as well. Unless that person is a linux geek or a former windows IT guy it's just a PITA to go down that route (especially if it's you). Snow Leopard Server with a buncha macs is a lot nicer for a SOHO environment for that poor smuck designated the IT guy.
My suggestion is to buy two of the things though. Not having your files or apps for days even if the data is safe will suck more than the $999 hit up front. Unless you have an Apple Store nearby and they stock the server versions of the mini.
Which they will be out of, of course, when your mini explodes.
So for your office I would buy two mini's and keep one at home for "testing". Actually, that's only half a joke...most stuff you want to try first in a test environment before you deploy. Even Apple's updates. So for SOHO, having a spare at the IT guy's house safeguards all sorts of things.
Yeah, I didn't understand his reply.
The software I'm looking at is Mac based so running a Windows or Linux server isn't a possibility. I need, or would like, an inexpensive Mac server with a simple but effective back up strategy.
I don't need to have 99.99999999999999% up time. I just need to be able to restore the server myself if an issue like a hardware failure or fire occurs.
My needs are different than big enterprise. I'm the CEO, blue collar worker and IT guy all in one. With AIO limitations.
It would have been nice to have an eSATA/USB combo port...
Yea, I have an external enclosure with one of those "combo" ports. They are "cooler than the under side of a pillow".
I don't think this is meant to be anything more than a small business or home server. In which case I don't really think the 2nd ethernet port is essential. Most of this target audience is not looking to use it as a firewall/router. They will place it behind their existing router and use it mostly for internal purposes, with the possibility of mail.
I never understand the people that constantly complain when Apple comes out with a great low end product that doesn't have all of the high end features. Take this for what it is priced at, a low end server solution at a great price.
Exactly!
We are a 4-5 user company that needs file and print sharing and this is exactly what we are looking for. Our email is offsite through Fusemail and our website it hosted elsewhere. At times we may have 10 or more users so the Unlimited License in SL 10.6 is a huge benefit. I can't cost justify a Microsoft SBS or W2008 server in this environment. This is an absolute no-brainer.
Why? Honest question not trying to be a smart ass.
I'm looking to move my practice to Mac software and HW. I would like a simple server with two HDDs that mirror in the event one fails. I would also like to have an external drive that I can take off site each day and then cloud back up.
I would think that this would be pretty good back strategy up for my practice. Am I wrong?
Sounds like you have a small number of client machines and limited storage requirements. It should work just fine. I would add an external FireWire 800 HDD and use time machine to automatically backup.
Then, when desired, take this off site and copy it to another drive.
I currently use a Mini as a Home Media Server to 7 Macs and an AppleTV. The Mini has 2 2TB external FireWire drives.
1 external HDD Contains a composite iPhoto library and a composite iTunes Library of 10,000 songs and 700 videos (a poor man's Kalidescape) including irreplaceable home pictures and home movies.
The second is a Time Machine backup of the first which I periodically backup and take to off site storage.
The server version is DOA. I agree with some of the others.
Its a shot at Windows Home Server and it fails. The form factor truly limits its expandability. Its design is completely counter productive to the server market. Small proprietary cases are not going to cut it.
Its a shame Apple couldn't of read that server thread we had on hear to realize they still aren't doing it right.
Lack of HDMI on the regular mini is also a non-starter considering many many people use it for a set top HTPC.
It's more than than a shot at Windows Home Server it murders it in features.
With WHS I'm stuck with managing only 10 clients. Volume management is basically pooling all the storage and creating a bunch of folders. There is no Exchange/Outlook paradigm.
I have none of those limitations with a mini running Snow Leopard. The form factor really doesn't matter that much. Bladesystems don't have much expandability on the blades themselves because that expandability is managed elsewhere with storage, networking and more. Typically administrators will install the NOS on a mirrored pair of drives and then use an external array direct attached or move to a NAS/SAN.
With the amount of low cost NAS boxes from Thecus, Iomega, QNAP and more all supporting iSCSI the need for internal storage just isn't there. This is going to be a very popular box. I'll guarantee it. It's barely more expensive than a Mediasmart server but it offers so much more.
Does anyone know or can speculate whether the mini server will include the actual install DVD in case a reinstall is required? I don't know, it seems likely but with its lack of an optical drive who knows... What's the situation with Macbook Air in that regard?
It would be really odd if Apple didn't include an install DVD (as they do for all pre-installed software).
You can Install over external DVD drive, FireWire, and possibly WiFi from another computer.
*
Does anyone know or can speculate whether the mini server will include the actual install DVD in case a reinstall is required? I don't know, it seems likely but with its lack of an optical drive who knows... What's the situation with Macbook Air in that regard?
Both come with restore DVDs. To reinstall the OS is very simple. You can use another Mac?s optical drive over a network, or just one of the local ports connected to the OS.
It would be really odd if Apple didn't include an install DVD (as they do for all pre-installed software).
You can Install over external DVD drive, FireWire, and possibly WiFi from another computer.
WiFi works too, though it?s slower. Faster just to use a HDD/SSD/Flash drive connected to FW or USB.
Lack of HDMI on the regular mini is also a non-starter considering many many people use it for a set top HTPC.
That shouldn't stop you. DVI<--->HDMI adapters are cheap and easily available. Monoprice.com is your friend
Software support from Apple might cost from 6X to 50X the price of the new mini server.
Sweet!
http://www.threelionstech.com/blog/index.php/32
Second, actually having a DroboPro, I can state categorically that the device is too slow unless it is run over iSCSI, which means using the only GigE port.
There is no possible configuration using a switch that can solve this.
The DroboPro cannot operate with the iSCSI connection on the LAN subnet.
There is nothing magical about this upgrade, its been a popular mod for months now.
I do agree that the inclusion of Snow Leopard Server is compelling but for me personally, a server with a single NIC is completely useless...
My DroboPro is getting returned and I will buy a Qnap 809 Pro instead...
ET
First off I agree with the post that having a server with a single GigE port is useless.
Second, actually having a DroboPro, I can state categorically that the device is too slow unless it is run over iSCSI, which means using the only GigE port.
There is no possible configuration using a switch that can solve this.
The DroboPro cannot operate with the iSCSI connection on the LAN subnet.
There is nothing magical about this upgrade, its been a popular mod for months now.
I do agree that the inclusion of Snow Leopard Server is compelling but for me personally, a server with a single NIC is completely useless...
My DroboPro is getting returned and I will buy a Qnap 809 Pro instead...
ET
So how do you explain the fact that people have been building server farms out of Mac minis? Must not be as useless as you claim, IMHO.
There is nothing magical about this upgrade, its been a popular mod for months now.
I do agree that the inclusion of Snow Leopard Server is compelling but for me personally, a server with a single NIC is completely useless...
My DroboPro is getting returned and I will buy a Qnap 809 Pro instead...
ET
Drobo has never delivered the type of performance that NAS competion like Synology or QNAP deliver and that's sad because they're raison d'être is "drop dead simplicity" but that comes at the cost of performance.
I wouldn't say anyone thinks a Mac mini server is magical but it does create a "blessed" config for Apple servers at under $1k. We all know plenty of people who rolled their own but the key here is what Apple will support. They didn't support OS X Server on the mini until this announcement and that and the ability to ship many more copies of OS X server are what is good here IMO.
Drobo has never delivered the type of performance that NAS competion like Synology or QNAP deliver and that's sad because they're raison d'être is "drop dead simplicity" but that comes at the cost of performance.
I wouldn't say anyone thinks a Mac mini server is magical but it does create a "blessed" config for Apple servers at under $1k. We all know plenty of people who rolled their own but the key here is what Apple will support. They didn't support OS X Server on the mini until this announcement and that and the ability to ship many more copies of OS X server are what is good here IMO.
Good points. Apple reps have been selling the Minis for just this sort of use for some time now and the company is finally starting to catch up with the real world use of these things. Having a "blessed" system did not particularly matter to the larger edu customers who are pretty much supported on whatever they do under the service agreements, but means a great deal for smaller customers.
Still, it is sad that there is not a second NIC port on the server model and an eSATA port across the line.
The one thing that is encouraging about this product release is that it was not accompanied with a great dog and pony show scheduled for some time that has nothing to do with when the product was ready. Perhaps, just perhaps, Apple is beginning to realize that it should intro a product line when it is "good to go".
Personally, I remain very disappointed that at least one eSATA port was not included with the new Minis as it severely limits the uses I had envisioned for it as a HTPC and/or home server.