No surprise that aTV isn't selling, there's no compelling reason to get it and there are competing boxes that offer much more.
I'd probably buy an aTV if it could stream Hulu, abc.com, netflix, and any other web video. I don't even really think dvd ripping (never gonna happen) or even other codec support is that important, on a new i7 machine handbrake can convert an hour show in about six minutes.
At this point, I'd consider something like a PS3 way before an aTV, it can do bluray (which doesn't interest me at all, but I'll probably get into it at some point just because I don't want to buy any more movies in DVD format), stream netflix, and play other video formats. Not to mention I hear it's not a bad game console, all for not much more than the aTV.
aTV isn't a bad hardware box, it just needs to be able to play back a ton more things. Or a price drop to like $99. Or both.
None of the airports have ever appealed to me, don't really get it.
So what's stopping anyone form importing their DVD's? I have 2 TB's of movies almost all of which is from my DVD collection. Get a copy of hanbrake and be done with it.
The typical consumer is going to ask "Why bother?"
Ripping CDs to use on an mp3 player makes sense. It is a portable device. Using mp3s saves you from carrying around a bulky collection of CDs. In addition, there are other advantages such as custom playlists that cannot be done with CDs.
This does not apply to movies. People are much less likely to carry movies around with them (especially on a daily basis) so increased portability is not really a factor and it is unlikely they want to use playlists or to randomize viewing order. Therefore, what is the benefit for the average consumer to make it worth their time, effort and money (cost of HDDs and the AppleTV)?
I have an AppleTV and do like the ability to easily navigate through a list of movies and simply pressing play. However, selecting a DVD off the shelf and inserting it into my DVD player is not really anymore effort.
What in the world are you babbling on about? Standard definition TVs no longer exist. CRT TVs no longer exist. Nobody manufacturers either one any longer. The only type TV you can buy today is HD, regardless of screen size. I see old crt and sd television sets out on the curb for trash pickup every single day. And the people who still have and use them are definitely not interested in any new fangled gadgets anyway. That's why they still have obsolete technology in the first place.
I mean, really, where are you coming from on this? I'd really like to know.
SDTV 's will last for a long long time. They aren't sold, but the number of households that have them in the U.S. is enormous. I have 1 hdtv and 2 sdtvs. I would buy an additional AppleTV if I could connect it to SDTV. I would also buy one for my parents if it supported sdtv.
Sales of Apple's wireless streaming set-top-box are up less than 10 percent in 2009 on a unit-by-unit basis, Steven Baker, vice president of industry analysis at NPD Group, told AppleInsider. But without a definitive product to compare it against, its total market share presence is unknown.
Apple does nothing to push these.
They are fine for what they do but the limitations of what they do, they are pretty much only a simple way to connect your iTunes content to a televsion.
ease of use is nice, what about security? and not just encryption. can you disable SSID broadcasts, enable MAC filtering, lessen broadcasting power to lessen your range and other features that aren't intuitive?
YES,
YES,
YES
If you want to know - look for Airport Network Design PDF under the Apple Support site.
the Apple TV still does not even let you stream from your iTunes purchased library... you still have to select what content you want on each Apple TV in the house from the computer. I would like to see "on-demand" technology from a home iTunes server... how hard can this really be???
ease of use is nice, what about security? and not just encryption. can you disable SSID broadcasts, enable MAC filtering, lessen broadcasting power to lessen your range and other features that aren't intuitive?
This does not apply to movies. People are much less likely to carry movies around with them (especially on a daily basis)...
I think you'd be surprised. I think a fair number of people are already doing it with iPods, and I think we'll see it skyrocket once the tablet ships.
Oh, and forgot to mention before, I'd totally buy a decent TV streaming box to use with my current SDTV. No plans to replace it before it dies, even if that's years from now.
Quote:
Originally Posted by lsngctrl
the Apple TV still does not even let you stream from your iTunes purchased library... you still have to select what content you want on each Apple TV in the house from the computer.
ease of use is nice, what about security? and not just encryption. can you disable SSID broadcasts, enable MAC filtering, lessen broadcasting power to lessen your range and other features that aren't intuitive?
Disabling SSID broadcasts is like dummy-locking your tool shed, it seems to be more secure but won't deter the guy who you are trying to keep out in the first place. Anyone with half a clue would be able to pick out your SSID from the airwaves using freely available software. Likewise, anyone can spoof a MAC address (most routers even have this built-in to fool early attempts by ISPs to needlessly sell additional IP addresses) . If the appearance of these type of "security features" keeps someone from encrypting their router traffic with WPA2, then it's actually counterproductive to securing their home or small business networks.
I think the best feature in the newer AEB is the guest network, which segregates a publicly available network (depending on configuration) from the secured, internal network. OBTW, configuration of this is ridiculously easy using the built-in Airport software. Your mother-in-law could configure it without your help.
Having never owned an Airport router of any kind, I have to ask those with experience: Are there really any functional advantages to Apple's routers (like ease of setup) that justify the much higher prices?
No.
Routers are complex, you have to know what your doing beforehand or else have issues later on.
Airport or Apple can't simplify the process, so it's no use paying more if it doesn't deliver.
It's been my experience working with Airport/Airport software that's it's more trouble and less reliable. Something about it being updated through Software Update just screws up it's world.
I used a off the shelf router, it came with step by step instructions and once I updated the firmware and hardened it, it hasn't given me a lick of trouble for years now.
This has not been my experience
The software is easy to use and has not missed a beat and the Software updates have worked flawlessly. I suppose this just goes to the old " your mileage may vary " adage.
Apple just doesn't get it with this product. The reason is that they are used to telling consumers what they want but in the case of this product, that is not going to work.
Consumers are telling Apple they want a DVR and TV tuner and web access. Apple has not listened, therefore the product will be nothing but a niche.
As long as I get to view programs on Hulu.com, I'm not going to pay .99 per episode.
Airports would sell better if they included just a single LAN port. Not every computer has wireless. The Mac Pro, for example and a lot of other desktops, especially older ones.
The Apple Airport Extreme router is not suitable to the UK market at all.
The majority of all broadband UK residents have PPPoA ADSL. The UK market is completely dominated by Wireless Modem/Router boxes. Every manufacturer makes them (with the exception of Apple) and it is hard to buy a stand-alone modem - or stand alone router.
To make use of the Apple router - consumers need to find a modem - which can do PPPoA to PPPoE conversion. There is only one such product that I know of (The Draytek Vigor 120) and that costs as much as a standalone modem/router.
Disabling SSID broadcasts is like dummy-locking your tool shed, it seems to be more secure but won't deter the guy who you are trying to keep out in the first place. Anyone with half a clue would be able to pick out your SSID from the airwaves using freely available software. Likewise, anyone can spoof a MAC address (most routers even have this built-in to fool early attempts by ISPs to needlessly sell additional IP addresses) . If the appearance of these type of "security features" keeps someone from encrypting their router traffic with WPA2, then it's actually counterproductive to securing their home or small business networks.
I think the best feature in the newer AEB is the guest network, which segregates a publicly available network (depending on configuration) from the secured, internal network. OBTW, configuration of this is ridiculously easy using the built-in Airport software. Your mother-in-law could configure it without your help.
that's all true but the simplest part of security is to reduce the attack surface area and make it as hard as possible
most of the big security headaches of the last few years have been because people don't follow the simple rules and instead believe the high tech ones will keep them safe. i even go as far as limiting the number of DHCP addresses my router will assign to the number of devices in my home
it's not even about the hacker in the street, you can have a kiddie porn surfing neighbor or someone may decide to share their music/movie collection via your wifi and invite a RIAA lawsuit. keeping your wifi to yourself may prevent legal headaches
Apple TV is a bit long on needing a vibrant upgrade. in my belief it needs
1- Larger hard drive 500gb+ option, also ability to add extra storage externally via USB, Firewire or ESata.
2- upgrade 1080p programming to hdtv
3- Open up the Apple TV - allow third party programs and developers, allow Netflix, Amazon, Blockbuster, Vudu and others to stream/download content to the device.
4- Apple TV app store- have it be able to be used for alot more. let developers create games, apps and so much more for
5- Videoconferencing - add ability for people to add a cam, hell apple could make a cam. so people can do video calls not just on their computer. but allow it to be used not only with ichat/aol chats, ie Skype app to use it. and who knows. other corporate ways. let Cisco create a app to use on it.
6- Blu-Ray - it is long overdue for apple to support Blu-Ray properly. to be a proper computer company it can't block technology which "competes" with itunes. Mac OS X must be open, as should all of Apple's products. sad to see things end up being more closed and well restricted to what Apple approves only.
7- Bluetooth - have the ability to add alot of extra add on's via this great tech. from headsets, to keyboards and gaming controllers
8- USB port fully functional - if you can add a camera, and external mic and more... why stop there... allow companies to add all sorts of extra devices and be able to build out a properly functional media center / computer apple tv.
9- full internet capability - yes, all my thoughts about making Apple tv capable require full internet capabilities and the ability for it to do oh so much more.
I would be alot happier if i could use my apple tv as a place for all the blu-Ray digital copies i have or maybe even a place to store movies i buy from apple itunes movie store. but do NOT want to keep on my laptop because it would take up too much room in my laptop. or even desktop.
Anyway, it would be awesome to really make more of this device as a proper home media center and computing entertainment center.
Apple just doesn't get it with this product. The reason is that they are used to telling consumers what they want but in the case of this product, that is not going to work.
Consumers are telling Apple they want a DVR and TV tuner and web access. Apple has not listened, therefore the product will be nothing but a niche.
As long as I get to view programs on Hulu.com, I'm not going to pay .99 per episode.
i agree on opening up the device for full internet abiliy.
Apple TV is a bit long on needing a vibrant upgrade. in my belief it needs
1- Larger hard drive 500gb+ option, also ability to add extra storage externally via USB, Firewire or ESata.
2- upgrade 1080p programming to hdtv
3- Open up the Apple TV - allow third party programs and developers, allow Netflix, Amazon, Blockbuster, Vudu and others to stream/download content to the device.
4- Apple TV app store- have it be able to be used for alot more. let developers create games, apps and so much more for
5- Videoconferencing - add ability for people to add a cam, hell apple could make a cam. so people can do video calls not just on their computer. but allow it to be used not only with ichat/aol chats, ie Skype app to use it. and who knows. other corporate ways. let Cisco create a app to use on it.
6- Blu-Ray - it is long overdue for apple to support Blu-Ray properly. to be a proper computer company it can't block technology which "competes" with itunes. Mac OS X must be open, as should all of Apple's products. sad to see things end up being more closed and well restricted to what Apple approves only.
7- Bluetooth - have the ability to add alot of extra add on's via this great tech. from headsets, to keyboards and gaming controllers
8- USB port fully functional - if you can add a camera, and external mic and more... why stop there... allow companies to add all sorts of extra devices and be able to build out a properly functional media center / computer apple tv.
I would be alot happier if i could use my apple tv as a place for all the blu-Ray digital copies i have or maybe even a place to store movies i buy from apple itunes movie store. but do NOT want to keep on my laptop because it would take up too much room in my laptop. or even desktop.
Anyway, it would be awesome to really make more of this device as a proper home media center and computing entertainment center.
I definietly agree, those are all very good ideas. I'd add to that the ability to read email and use a web browser. The easiest & quickest way to do all that would be to just add screen sharing back to your mac.
But most of all it needs a DVR function or it is a dead end product!
Although Time Machine backups don't give you a directly bootable solution, you can combine an OSX reinstall with a TM restore.
That's true, but depending solely upon Time Machine you have more points of potential failure from getting back to a working machine right away.
Dead boot drive, dead Superdrive or dead OS X install disk or necessary drivers for video cards (MacPro) that are not on the OS X install disk, so the machine won't boot a screen without reinstalling the factory equipment.
Quote:
The other use for Time Machine backup is the pseudo-point-in-time recoverability for those who may not know which version of a file they need to revert to or exactly when a file was deleted. This is more along the lines of archival recovery for inadvertent data loss and is a different problem from a catastrophic failure.
Did people forget to "Save As" all of a sudden?
Quote:
For those who don't care to be bothered about backups or recovery (and recovery is the real issue), Time Machine backups provide a pretty good integrated solution for most people, and does a pretty reasonable job of tackling both recover-ability scenarios. Certainly better than is otherwise accessible to the masses.
I agree it's better than nothing and for most, a waste of a perfectly good hard drive when one can't boot from it.
Comments
I'd probably buy an aTV if it could stream Hulu, abc.com, netflix, and any other web video. I don't even really think dvd ripping (never gonna happen) or even other codec support is that important, on a new i7 machine handbrake can convert an hour show in about six minutes.
At this point, I'd consider something like a PS3 way before an aTV, it can do bluray (which doesn't interest me at all, but I'll probably get into it at some point just because I don't want to buy any more movies in DVD format), stream netflix, and play other video formats. Not to mention I hear it's not a bad game console, all for not much more than the aTV.
aTV isn't a bad hardware box, it just needs to be able to play back a ton more things. Or a price drop to like $99. Or both.
None of the airports have ever appealed to me, don't really get it.
So what's stopping anyone form importing their DVD's? I have 2 TB's of movies almost all of which is from my DVD collection. Get a copy of hanbrake and be done with it.
The typical consumer is going to ask "Why bother?"
Ripping CDs to use on an mp3 player makes sense. It is a portable device. Using mp3s saves you from carrying around a bulky collection of CDs. In addition, there are other advantages such as custom playlists that cannot be done with CDs.
This does not apply to movies. People are much less likely to carry movies around with them (especially on a daily basis) so increased portability is not really a factor and it is unlikely they want to use playlists or to randomize viewing order. Therefore, what is the benefit for the average consumer to make it worth their time, effort and money (cost of HDDs and the AppleTV)?
I have an AppleTV and do like the ability to easily navigate through a list of movies and simply pressing play. However, selecting a DVD off the shelf and inserting it into my DVD player is not really anymore effort.
What in the world are you babbling on about? Standard definition TVs no longer exist. CRT TVs no longer exist. Nobody manufacturers either one any longer. The only type TV you can buy today is HD, regardless of screen size. I see old crt and sd television sets out on the curb for trash pickup every single day. And the people who still have and use them are definitely not interested in any new fangled gadgets anyway. That's why they still have obsolete technology in the first place.
I mean, really, where are you coming from on this? I'd really like to know.
SDTV 's will last for a long long time. They aren't sold, but the number of households that have them in the U.S. is enormous. I have 1 hdtv and 2 sdtvs. I would buy an additional AppleTV if I could connect it to SDTV. I would also buy one for my parents if it supported sdtv.
Sales of Apple's wireless streaming set-top-box are up less than 10 percent in 2009 on a unit-by-unit basis, Steven Baker, vice president of industry analysis at NPD Group, told AppleInsider. But without a definitive product to compare it against, its total market share presence is unknown.
Apple does nothing to push these.
They are fine for what they do but the limitations of what they do, they are pretty much only a simple way to connect your iTunes content to a televsion.
No DVR, DVD, easy way to get DVDs copied onto it.
Sales of Apple's wireless streaming set-top-box
What "streaming" does it do?
ease of use is nice, what about security? and not just encryption. can you disable SSID broadcasts, enable MAC filtering, lessen broadcasting power to lessen your range and other features that aren't intuitive?
YES,
YES,
YES
If you want to know - look for Airport Network Design PDF under the Apple Support site.
ease of use is nice, what about security? and not just encryption. can you disable SSID broadcasts, enable MAC filtering, lessen broadcasting power to lessen your range and other features that aren't intuitive?
Yes to all of the above
RTFM
This does not apply to movies. People are much less likely to carry movies around with them (especially on a daily basis)...
I think you'd be surprised. I think a fair number of people are already doing it with iPods, and I think we'll see it skyrocket once the tablet ships.
Oh, and forgot to mention before, I'd totally buy a decent TV streaming box to use with my current SDTV. No plans to replace it before it dies, even if that's years from now.
the Apple TV still does not even let you stream from your iTunes purchased library... you still have to select what content you want on each Apple TV in the house from the computer.
Is that right?
ease of use is nice, what about security? and not just encryption. can you disable SSID broadcasts, enable MAC filtering, lessen broadcasting power to lessen your range and other features that aren't intuitive?
Disabling SSID broadcasts is like dummy-locking your tool shed, it seems to be more secure but won't deter the guy who you are trying to keep out in the first place. Anyone with half a clue would be able to pick out your SSID from the airwaves using freely available software. Likewise, anyone can spoof a MAC address (most routers even have this built-in to fool early attempts by ISPs to needlessly sell additional IP addresses) . If the appearance of these type of "security features" keeps someone from encrypting their router traffic with WPA2, then it's actually counterproductive to securing their home or small business networks.
I think the best feature in the newer AEB is the guest network, which segregates a publicly available network (depending on configuration) from the secured, internal network. OBTW, configuration of this is ridiculously easy using the built-in Airport software. Your mother-in-law could configure it without your help.
Having never owned an Airport router of any kind, I have to ask those with experience: Are there really any functional advantages to Apple's routers (like ease of setup) that justify the much higher prices?
No.
Routers are complex, you have to know what your doing beforehand or else have issues later on.
Airport or Apple can't simplify the process, so it's no use paying more if it doesn't deliver.
No.
It's been my experience working with Airport/Airport software that's it's more trouble and less reliable. Something about it being updated through Software Update just screws up it's world.
I used a off the shelf router, it came with step by step instructions and once I updated the firmware and hardened it, it hasn't given me a lick of trouble for years now.
This has not been my experience
The software is easy to use and has not missed a beat and the Software updates have worked flawlessly. I suppose this just goes to the old " your mileage may vary " adage.
Consumers are telling Apple they want a DVR and TV tuner and web access. Apple has not listened, therefore the product will be nothing but a niche.
As long as I get to view programs on Hulu.com, I'm not going to pay .99 per episode.
The majority of all broadband UK residents have PPPoA ADSL. The UK market is completely dominated by Wireless Modem/Router boxes. Every manufacturer makes them (with the exception of Apple) and it is hard to buy a stand-alone modem - or stand alone router.
To make use of the Apple router - consumers need to find a modem - which can do PPPoA to PPPoE conversion. There is only one such product that I know of (The Draytek Vigor 120) and that costs as much as a standalone modem/router.
Whoever called this a fanboy product is right.
(of course, I have one)
C.
Disabling SSID broadcasts is like dummy-locking your tool shed, it seems to be more secure but won't deter the guy who you are trying to keep out in the first place. Anyone with half a clue would be able to pick out your SSID from the airwaves using freely available software. Likewise, anyone can spoof a MAC address (most routers even have this built-in to fool early attempts by ISPs to needlessly sell additional IP addresses) . If the appearance of these type of "security features" keeps someone from encrypting their router traffic with WPA2, then it's actually counterproductive to securing their home or small business networks.
I think the best feature in the newer AEB is the guest network, which segregates a publicly available network (depending on configuration) from the secured, internal network. OBTW, configuration of this is ridiculously easy using the built-in Airport software. Your mother-in-law could configure it without your help.
that's all true but the simplest part of security is to reduce the attack surface area and make it as hard as possible
most of the big security headaches of the last few years have been because people don't follow the simple rules and instead believe the high tech ones will keep them safe. i even go as far as limiting the number of DHCP addresses my router will assign to the number of devices in my home
it's not even about the hacker in the street, you can have a kiddie porn surfing neighbor or someone may decide to share their music/movie collection via your wifi and invite a RIAA lawsuit. keeping your wifi to yourself may prevent legal headaches
1- Larger hard drive 500gb+ option, also ability to add extra storage externally via USB, Firewire or ESata.
2- upgrade 1080p programming to hdtv
3- Open up the Apple TV - allow third party programs and developers, allow Netflix, Amazon, Blockbuster, Vudu and others to stream/download content to the device.
4- Apple TV app store- have it be able to be used for alot more. let developers create games, apps and so much more for
5- Videoconferencing - add ability for people to add a cam, hell apple could make a cam. so people can do video calls not just on their computer. but allow it to be used not only with ichat/aol chats, ie Skype app to use it. and who knows. other corporate ways. let Cisco create a app to use on it.
6- Blu-Ray - it is long overdue for apple to support Blu-Ray properly. to be a proper computer company it can't block technology which "competes" with itunes. Mac OS X must be open, as should all of Apple's products. sad to see things end up being more closed and well restricted to what Apple approves only.
7- Bluetooth - have the ability to add alot of extra add on's via this great tech. from headsets, to keyboards and gaming controllers
8- USB port fully functional - if you can add a camera, and external mic and more... why stop there... allow companies to add all sorts of extra devices and be able to build out a properly functional media center / computer apple tv.
9- full internet capability - yes, all my thoughts about making Apple tv capable require full internet capabilities and the ability for it to do oh so much more.
I would be alot happier if i could use my apple tv as a place for all the blu-Ray digital copies i have or maybe even a place to store movies i buy from apple itunes movie store. but do NOT want to keep on my laptop because it would take up too much room in my laptop. or even desktop.
Anyway, it would be awesome to really make more of this device as a proper home media center and computing entertainment center.
Apple just doesn't get it with this product. The reason is that they are used to telling consumers what they want but in the case of this product, that is not going to work.
Consumers are telling Apple they want a DVR and TV tuner and web access. Apple has not listened, therefore the product will be nothing but a niche.
As long as I get to view programs on Hulu.com, I'm not going to pay .99 per episode.
i agree on opening up the device for full internet abiliy.
but Hulu... won't be free for too much longer.
Apple TV is a bit long on needing a vibrant upgrade. in my belief it needs
1- Larger hard drive 500gb+ option, also ability to add extra storage externally via USB, Firewire or ESata.
2- upgrade 1080p programming to hdtv
3- Open up the Apple TV - allow third party programs and developers, allow Netflix, Amazon, Blockbuster, Vudu and others to stream/download content to the device.
4- Apple TV app store- have it be able to be used for alot more. let developers create games, apps and so much more for
5- Videoconferencing - add ability for people to add a cam, hell apple could make a cam. so people can do video calls not just on their computer. but allow it to be used not only with ichat/aol chats, ie Skype app to use it. and who knows. other corporate ways. let Cisco create a app to use on it.
6- Blu-Ray - it is long overdue for apple to support Blu-Ray properly. to be a proper computer company it can't block technology which "competes" with itunes. Mac OS X must be open, as should all of Apple's products. sad to see things end up being more closed and well restricted to what Apple approves only.
7- Bluetooth - have the ability to add alot of extra add on's via this great tech. from headsets, to keyboards and gaming controllers
8- USB port fully functional - if you can add a camera, and external mic and more... why stop there... allow companies to add all sorts of extra devices and be able to build out a properly functional media center / computer apple tv.
I would be alot happier if i could use my apple tv as a place for all the blu-Ray digital copies i have or maybe even a place to store movies i buy from apple itunes movie store. but do NOT want to keep on my laptop because it would take up too much room in my laptop. or even desktop.
Anyway, it would be awesome to really make more of this device as a proper home media center and computing entertainment center.
I definietly agree, those are all very good ideas. I'd add to that the ability to read email and use a web browser. The easiest & quickest way to do all that would be to just add screen sharing back to your mac.
But most of all it needs a DVR function or it is a dead end product!
Although Time Machine backups don't give you a directly bootable solution, you can combine an OSX reinstall with a TM restore.
That's true, but depending solely upon Time Machine you have more points of potential failure from getting back to a working machine right away.
Dead boot drive, dead Superdrive or dead OS X install disk or necessary drivers for video cards (MacPro) that are not on the OS X install disk, so the machine won't boot a screen without reinstalling the factory equipment.
The other use for Time Machine backup is the pseudo-point-in-time recoverability for those who may not know which version of a file they need to revert to or exactly when a file was deleted. This is more along the lines of archival recovery for inadvertent data loss and is a different problem from a catastrophic failure.
Did people forget to "Save As" all of a sudden?
For those who don't care to be bothered about backups or recovery (and recovery is the real issue), Time Machine backups provide a pretty good integrated solution for most people, and does a pretty reasonable job of tackling both recover-ability scenarios. Certainly better than is otherwise accessible to the masses.
I agree it's better than nothing and for most, a waste of a perfectly good hard drive when one can't boot from it.