Oppenheimer: Bing deal could bring Apple more risk than reward

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  • Reply 101 of 127
    freediverxfreediverx Posts: 1,407member
    "AT&T is on the losing end because it does not receive any of the revenue associated with software on the App Store, yet is the use of many of those applications that has resulted in poor network quality."



    That's a load of horseshit.



    The biggest selling iPhone apps are games, and I doubt they generate that much network traffic. The bulk of iPhone traffic is likely coming from Mobile Safari, whose brilliant UI made mobile web browsing usable for the first time in history. Yeah, you make something easy to use and more people will use it - go figure!



    AT&T's poor network quality is the result of AT&T failing to upgrade their network early enough and quickly enough to handle the increased demand. The fact that other wireless carriers across the globe have had no such problems supporting the iPhone underscores the fact that AT&T have only themselves to blame. And let's not even get into their delay in offering MMS and tethering (still missing in action.)



    AT&T's chances of getting a slice of Apple's App Store revenue are about as good as the music industry's chances of getting a slice of iPod sales revenue. The only reason AT&T could be said to be on the losing end of this deal is because of their own shortsightedness and negligence.





    .
  • Reply 102 of 127
    Bing has nothing to do with Windows. End of story.
  • Reply 103 of 127
    dluxdlux Posts: 666member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Stormchild View Post


    Bing has nothing to do with Windows.



    Instead, it has everything to do with Silverlight.



    Quote:

    End of story.



    The end of yours, anyway.
  • Reply 104 of 127
    dluxdlux Posts: 666member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by iGenius View Post


    Yes. Whatever Apple decides for us will be the best choice. They will choose a search engine for us based on the user experience that is best for us - not based on what makes them the most money.



    Quote:

    Steve will choose for us, and we will see that it is good.



    Quote:

    Yeah, but Apple doesn't give customers what they want, it gives customers what is best for them.



    Quote:

    You'll see - the new mapping application will be ssssssoooooooooo great!



    Quote:

    Precisely. When they decide which new search engine we will use, it will be the best decision that they could possibly have made.



    Quote:

    But when Apple finally figures out how to do it, well, we'll all be falling all over ourselves with delight at how well it is done! I can't wait!



    Quote:

    The Safari interface is practically perfect. The search box is done amazingly well.



    Quote:

    Don't worry. If they remove it you'll soon realize that it was the best thing to do, and you will thank then for it.



    (ad nauseam)



    What are you, a snottier version of Teckstud?
  • Reply 105 of 127
    icyfogicyfog Posts: 338member
    If Apple makes Bing the default, and I can't change back to Google, then the iPhone is not for me.
  • Reply 106 of 127
    os2babaos2baba Posts: 262member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by iGenius View Post


    It is seamless to switch apps on the iPhone - it is pretty much just like multitasking. So why not just leave Safari running in the background and use the Google window?



    ROTFL.



    It is nothing like multitasking - even with Apple apps that run in the background. I can't switch back and forth between two apps. I have to go to the deck where the other app is. I have to restart it. If it's also an Apple app that runs in the background, then state is maintained. Else I have to start from scratch to get to the view that I was previously on. The lack of multitasking is really ruining the user experience.



    I think you will realize this when iPhone OS finally adds real multi-tasking and real task-switching. This is the single biggest reason why I just can't go back to the iPhone any more after Android. My understanding from web articles is that PalmOS does task task switching even better than the Android. Unfortunately since no one I know has a device, I haven't been able to see how they have implemented it.
  • Reply 107 of 127
    ivan.rnn01ivan.rnn01 Posts: 1,822member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Stormchild View Post


    Bing has nothing to do with Windows. End of story.





    Spare us a little more understanding. Fanbois are now just lost a bit. The whole thing is quite surprising.
  • Reply 108 of 127
    iladilad Posts: 39member
    Apple has finally lost it's mind!! Perhaps it's jobs. This not the first time as he was booted out for "loosing it". A deal with Microsoft only tells the world that it's products are superior and that Apple is just full of it. Google has the best services and if they take that away then I will never buy an iPhone. I have been waiting 3 yrs for them to get the device to where it needs to be, but it looks like it's going way south. I guess I'm gonna wait and perhaps support android and google. Funny ain't it google is now what apple used to be. Think different ...please! Yes apple you are right with the way you have been going with all your products, this 25yr die hard supporter now actually has to think different. Oh well all good things come to an end.
  • Reply 109 of 127
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by iLad View Post


    Apple has finally lost it's mind!! Perhaps it's jobs. This not the first time as he was booted out for "loosing it". A deal with Microsoft only tells the world that it's products are superior and that Apple is just full of it. Google has the best services and if they take that away then I will never buy an iPhone. I have been waiting 3 yrs for them to get the device to where it needs to be, but it looks like it's going way south. I guess I'm gonna wait and perhaps support android and google. Funny ain't it google is now what apple used to be. Think different ...please! Yes apple you are right with the way you have been going with all your products, this 25yr die hard supporter now actually has to think different. Oh well all good things come to an end.



    I think Your reaction is exaggerated. I'm in IT-business for many years and I have seen a lot of "partner-issues".



    The fact is that Google was a premium partner and got iPhone OS details weeks or month ahead others. That's a common practice.



    Then they used this knowledge to get in a competition position.

    So they will drop from a premium partner to a normal partner and they were aware of this before.

    I doubt they still have the VIP status at iPhone OS 4 presentation they had at previous events.



    I don't know if Steve Jobs is pissed, but I would be, although I'm aware that this kind of change in relationship is a common issue.



    P.S.: I don't believe that Google provides an outstanding level of service quality. Their services have a great mindshare (Apple pushed them a lot) and they are free.
  • Reply 110 of 127
    djrumpydjrumpy Posts: 1,116member
    Another reason I refuse to use Bing. MS is pushing it's agenda via their search engine. I prefer real results that actually relate to what I'm searching for.



    Search each for "Why is Windows So Expensive" and this is what you get



    http://www.bing.com/search?q=%22Why+...H&qs=n&sc=1-40



    http://www.google.com/#hl=en&source=...d6ef47431c6a4a
  • Reply 111 of 127
    igeniusigenius Posts: 1,240member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Dlux View Post


    (ad nauseam)



    What are you, a snottier version of Teckstud?



    Maybe. I'm just trying to sound like everybody else.
  • Reply 112 of 127
    cmf2cmf2 Posts: 1,427member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by DJRumpy View Post


    Another reason I refuse to use Bing. MS is pushing it's agenda via their search engine. I prefer real results that actually relate to what I'm searching for.



    Search each for "Why is Windows So Expensive" and this is what you get



    http://www.bing.com/search?q=%22Why+...H&qs=n&sc=1-40



    http://www.google.com/#hl=en&source=...d6ef47431c6a4a



    Have you checked those links lately?
  • Reply 113 of 127
    djrumpydjrumpy Posts: 1,116member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by cmf2 View Post


    Have you checked those links lately?



    I checked them just before I posted them this morning. I'm guessing you aren't hitting the U.S. servers? There have been reports that users in Canada aren't seeing the same thing as folks in the U.S.



    If you're not in the U.S., this is the first result returned here: Link
  • Reply 114 of 127
    jeffdmjeffdm Posts: 12,946member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by cmf2 View Post


    Have you checked those links lately?



    Seems to give me the same general set results I've seen reported elsewhere.
  • Reply 115 of 127
    djrumpydjrumpy Posts: 1,116member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by JeffDM View Post


    Seems to give me the same general set results I've seen reported elsewhere.



    And here's a screenshot of the exact thing that I see. The first search result doesn't even have the quoted phrase I searched for.



    Link To Bing Result Screenshot
  • Reply 116 of 127
    djrumpydjrumpy Posts: 1,116member
    And yet another odd one.



    Search Bing for: "why ipod is better than zune"



    The Bing first search result is: "10 Reason Why the Zune is Better Than the iPod"



    http://www.bing.com/search?q=%22why+...form=QBLH&qs=n



    Amazing technology...



    At least this one has the phrase you searched for in it.
  • Reply 117 of 127
    macgregormacgregor Posts: 1,434member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by RadicalxEdward View Post


    and they want their cd's back.







    Excellent, but how long will it be before that joke no longer makes sense.
  • Reply 118 of 127
    docno42docno42 Posts: 3,296member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Roc Ingersol View Post


    What's the real threat from Google?



    Apple has been wildly successful delivering premium products and Google's whole existence is predicated on free services that push search ads.



    Who cares if Google has Android? It seems to be racing against itself to fall into the Windows Mobile trap - with dozens of slightly different OS versions and hardware configurations in the wild, snapping up niches to be sure, but not offering a compelling 'switch' case to Apple's core market.



    Who cares if Google has Chrome? It's, once again, aimed directly at commodity hardware and the internet. It's not going to offer the integrated, consistent experience that Apple creates and sells for a premium. And Google's not going to be nearly as strict with its suppliers as Apple, leading to many of the same inconsistent performance and expectation problems of the Windows market. These are core features to Apple's market and they're not going to leave for Chrome any more than they'll leave for Windows 7.



    I bet the Google/Apple 'split' -- evidenced by nothing more than Schmidt leaving Apple's board -- had far more to do with the FTC investigation than any rift or rivalry. The Google Voice thing is a red herring. Google Voice has reliability issues. It mucks up expectations (see: SMS/MMS routing). Did the relationship chill, or did Apple simply not want to see the press filled with people blaming Apple for the slightly-kludgy system and inconsistent performance?



    Excellent post and analysis. The whole "feud" has been a manufactured story based on baseless speculation from day one.
  • Reply 119 of 127
    docno42docno42 Posts: 3,296member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by satcomer View Post


    I would to without paying the high price the GPS maps are charging. Those Maps need some competition.



    Sometimes you get what you pay for



    I've compared a friend with an Android phone and the google navigation with my Tom Tom app and the Tom Tom app consistently provides better routes.



    Part of the map data you are paying for is advanced routing hints and optimizations. That's information that helps the routing algorithms build the routes, and that information has value which is why I am happy to purchase it.



    If you are a casual user of GPS and were never going to own a UPS anyway, that's one thing. If you really rely on GPS, the tradition makers (Garmin, Magellan, Tom Tom, etc.) do add value. Then again I don't know why I am bothering, I know the "but it's FREEE" crowd will never admit it
  • Reply 120 of 127
    docno42docno42 Posts: 3,296member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Zep View Post


    i would actually like to see those tests and see if the specs they used were exactly the same. in theory, the same exact same specs should show the exact same numbers.



    But you can never get the exact same components. Apple does their own motherboard design, and they use EFI instead of the older BIOS. We know they are detail oriented. Decisions about trace path length and placement affect performance. You are talking about thousands of interconnected parts, many of which are timing sensitive.



    I don't think it's unreasonable to expect similary speced systems to run at different speeds even if they are using identical chipsets and other components. Heck, you see this in the PC industry all the time! Performance hardware sites will test motherboards with the same chipsets, CPU's, controllers and RAM and find wildly different results depending on the quality of the board design to the quality of the BIOS/Firmware on the board. Detail matters - especially in electronics and detail costs money!



    There have been multiple articles (at least four different ones) from prominent magazines as well as enthusiast web sites where you have similarly specd machines and the Apple hardware routinely outperforms it. If you google search around you will find multiple bloggers gushing enthusiastically how their Mac is the best windows box they have ever owned. It's been going on every since Apple switched to Intel and running Windows on a Mac was possible, but for the last two years the frequency of related chatter has really picked up.



    You can choose to believe it or not, I don't care and I'm not about to go googling to give you examples when there are plenty out there (including older stories here on AI) but suffice it to say it's not an unreasonable premise in the least.
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