What an outstanding value. I think Apple would be crazy not to start delivering some AMD solutions next year with Llano. I like Intel as much as anyone but truth be told a lot of my work leads to the computer sitting here waiting on me. I think AMD certainly delivers a lot of processing power per buck. I'm content to let the "I gotta have the fastest computer available" people spend a premium on Intel based Macs. I'm more of a system balance kind of guy. Which is why I like SSD and will like faster GPU when they represent more than just increased fps in games.
The most impressive of all, Thuban runs even more efficiently than Intel i7 demonstrated in the table below. It also runs much cooler than i7's clocking at 30C under 100% CPU load running prime stress test on air with $25 OCZ cpu cooler. AMD did a hell of a job on their current 45nm SOI process.
CPU + R5870........IDLE (Balanced).........Idle (High perf)......100% CPU
The most impressive of all, Thuban runs even more efficiently than Intel i7 demonstrated in the table below.
That is very good to hear. Supposedly Intel will have a new spin on it's 32nm process layer this year.
Quote:
It also runs much cooler than i7's clocking at 30C under 100% CPU load running prime stress test on air with $25 OCZ cpu cooler. AMD did a hell of a job on their current 45nm SOI process.
Well yeah it is good but how much of that is related to AMDs architecture? That is one thing AMD had going for them is a cooler architecture for a given process.
Quote:
CPU + R5870........IDLE (Balanced).........Idle (High perf)......100% CPU
The numbers aren't bad but niether are they excessively impressive. The real deal is performance per watt which these numbers do not address.
That being said the power numbers here mean this processor would be ideal for a Mac discussed elsewhere. That is right the XMac. Especially if Apple could see even lower power numbers via a lower clocked CPU. I'd be perfectly willing to give up 2-300 MHz for a 6 core machine that could idle well below 85 watts. Well as long as we don't give up to much in the way of compute performance.
The first page was interesting but it was followed up with pages of overclocker mentality. I don't expect Apple to go that route nor do I need such a machine. What I want is a reasonable fast machine that sits between a Mac Pro and a Mini. That would be performance wise.
I possibly missed some power consumption numbers, but is there any chance to see a 6-core iMac next year? The AMD prices obviously make this possible but what about heat? Probably the 27" model could stand it?
No not exactly what I'm saying here is that it has become clear that people are willing to give up certain technologies to get an extremely mobile PC. An Optical drive being one thing people find that they don't need.
I believe that most people still want a full featured machine, where they can burn Cd's and DVDs. Several years from now that might change.
Quote:
Think of it as a device that corrects the mistakes made on AIR! In fact that is a very good way to look at it. It would be a laptop where what can be deleted is, but the stuff that many of us believe is important is still there. The machine would stress good performance and battery life.
Dave
The AIR seems to be pretty popular with the business crowd, who usually have their machines maintained by IT, so they don't need n optical drive (and IT likely doesn't want them installing any more software on their own).
But most computers are bought by the public these days, and an internal drive is far more convenient than having to go and buy an external one. Netbooks are much smaller, and people are willing to give it up for that. The iPad is smaller yet, and well, it's obvious.
No, he's comparing them to the 13" CULV powered machines like the Thinkpad Edge, HP DM3, and others that use 1.2-1.6Ghz Intel and AMD CPUs and deliver performance halfway between a netbook and a full sized notebook like a Macbook Pro. What he neglects to account for is that the current Macbook Pro delivers better battery life than any of them while being around the same weight with significantly more power. Again, this is an example of the machine a user wants existing and being readily available from anyone but Apple.
Assuming you're right, I don't see much of a comparison there. People are already complaining that the MB and MBPs aren't powerful enough.
I believe that most people still want a full featured machine, where they can burn Cd's and DVDs. Several years from now that might change.
Seriously; people are going without optical drives and doing fine in some of these ultra mobile laptops. Ask most people today to choose between a 13" laptop with an Optical or a higher performance GPU and many will go for the higher performance machine. Optical drives simply aren't used to the extent that they where in the past thus an external drive is a more acceptable solution.
Quote:
The AIR seems to be pretty popular with the business crowd, who usually have their machines maintained by IT, so they don't need n optical drive (and IT likely doesn't want them installing any more software on their own).
The lack of an internal drive won't stop people from installing their software.
Quote:
But most computers are bought by the public these days, and an internal drive is far more convenient than having to go and buy an external one.
Not if you have to carry around an external drive due to the lack of internal disk space on most laptops. The reality is you could easily put 2 HDD or SSD drives into a 13" laptop and still have space for a real GPU and a larger battery.
Quote:
Netbooks are much smaller, and people are willing to give it up for that.
They aren't so small that the 13" machine doesn't compete with them. That is why I'm more focused on this machine than other larger models. People like the light weight of these machines as much as anything, so if Apple can tune the weight of the 13" to the lighter side it becomes even more competitive.
Quote:
The iPad is smaller yet, and well, it's obvious.
IPad doesn't effectively replace a laptop of any sort so it isn't worth our time to even discuss it.
Frankly I see an optical free 13" MBP as a machine that could have been what the AIR should have been.
Seriously; people are going without optical drives and doing fine in some of these ultra mobile laptops. Ask most people today to choose between a 13" laptop with an Optical or a higher performance GPU and many will go for the higher performance machine. Optical drives simply aren't used to the extent that they where in the past thus an external drive is a more acceptable solution.
Really, we keep talking past each other. I've been saying from the beginning, that for those very small machines, lack of optical drives is accepted. But a MB and for a MBP it won't be. Those are not "ultra mobile laptops".
Quote:
The lack of an internal drive won't stop people from installing their software.
Yes, it just makes it a lot more difficult.
Quote:
Not if you have to carry around an external drive due to the lack of internal disk space on most laptops. The reality is you could easily put 2 HDD or SSD drives into a 13" laptop and still have space for a real GPU and a larger battery.
Most people don't need that much space. Not everyone has tens of thousands of songs, hundreds of Tv shows, and dozens of movies on their laptops all at once. For the few that do, well, I feel sorry they feel the need to do so.
Quote:
They aren't so small that the 13" machine doesn't compete with them. That is why I'm more focused on this machine than other larger models. People like the light weight of these machines as much as anything, so if Apple can tune the weight of the 13" to the lighter side it becomes even more competitive.
They are notably smaller, and weigh a good pound or more less. If Apple wants to compete there, it will be with a new machine.
Quote:
IPad doesn't effectively replace a laptop of any sort so it isn't worth our time to even discuss it.
You are completely wrong there, and so, you're right, we shouldn't discuss it.
Quote:
Frankly I see an optical free 13" MBP as a machine that could have been what the AIR should have been.
This is becoming a much bigger reality than many realize. I was in Fry's last night and there were even more notebooks that were without and optical drive than I noticed at Xmas. These are 13" with 2.5" HDD and non-CULV processors. Like many things in computing I doubt it will be standard until Apple puts their weight behind it and I don't think that is too far off specially seeing that even store bought software has taken notice.
AMD's upcoming Llano processors would be a natural fit in the Macbook and Mac mini. A two-chip solution like Apple requires (for space issues) with an excellent integrated GPU (rumored to be equivalent to the Radeon 5600 series).
AMD's upcoming Llano processors would be a natural fit in the Macbook and Mac mini. A two-chip solution like Apple requires (for space issues) with an excellent integrated GPU (rumored to be equivalent to the Radeon 5600 series).
How are they on power consumption compared to Intel's upcoming Sandy Bridge? Everything I've seen shows Intel far ahead of AMD in terms of power efficiency.
How are they on power consumption compared to Intel's upcoming Sandy Bridge? Everything I've seen shows Intel far ahead of AMD in terms of power efficiency.
Llano is estimated to be from 25 -59 Watts TDP for the whole die which is pretty damn good.
Really, we keep talking past each other. I've been saying from the beginning, that for those very small machines, lack of optical drives is accepted. But a MB and for a MBP it won't be. Those are not "ultra mobile laptops".
The 13" could very well play effectively against those machines. It is just about the minimal size for a notebook for many people so why not make it a light a possible.
Quote:
Yes, it just makes it a lot more difficult.
The only software I've recently installed, via a CD optical disk on my MBP, came from Apple. Everything else is downloaded and installed from the net. Of course part of that is due to my using open source software but purchasing software over the net is not unheard of either.
At work it is much the same much of what I need to install on my Windows PC can be downloaded from the net. If not the original install the updates can be.
The point is the optical doesn't need to be in the laptop everyday.
Quote:
Most people don't need that much space. Not everyone has tens of thousands of songs, hundreds of Tv shows, and dozens of movies on their laptops all at once. For the few that do, well, I feel sorry they feel the need to do so.
It is so nice of you to feel sorry for those that take a different approach in life.
In any event It doesn't take much effort to burn up a lot of disk space with software. Just install XCode, Eclipse or even Open Office and see your free space drift away. Besides those of us into content consumption via their PC's aren't the only ones needing space, if you are into content production the more disk space you have the better. Of course if you are into content production you will most likely have a larger laptop with a built in optical.
Quote:
They are notably smaller, and weigh a good pound or more less. If Apple wants to compete there, it will be with a new machine.
Of course it would be a new machine, the deletion of the optical just allows for a thinner machine when it comes to a redesign.
Quote:
You are completely wrong there, and so, you're right, we shouldn't discuss it.
If I thought I was wrong I wouldn't have brought it up. The iPad might be a better choice for some people but it will not replace a laptop for people that need a laptop. In fact their is little overlap.
Quote:
Complete waste at this time.
In my estimation the AIR was a waste of time. A lighter, higher performance, 13" MBP would be very attractive to a number of users.
The only software I've recently installed, via a CD optical disk on my MBP, came from Apple.
I have moved to an optical-less system for restoring Mac OS X and Repairing Disk from Disk Utility. This only became possible (without hacks) with Snow Leopard. You can copy your Restore Disk to any external drive you wish (USB flash drive, SD card, internal HDD, or external HDD) using Disk Utility. it makes for a very, very fast installation over any DVD. If you go with any of the external drives can even use it to fix any Mac without having to get a FW cable and use two Macs in Target Disk Mode.
This is becoming a much bigger reality than many realize. I was in Fry's last night and there were even more notebooks that were without and optical drive than I noticed at Xmas. These are 13" with 2.5" HDD and non-CULV processors. Like many things in computing I doubt it will be standard until Apple puts their weight behind it and I don't think that is too far off specially seeing that even store bought software has taken notice.
My trips to computer stores have been limited of late but this reflects what I think is a real trend. In part it is likely because of the move to really compact laptops. I also suspect it is driven by consumer demands as they realize that the drive just doesn't get used that much. Further when used, the optical is at times a very frustrating device from the reliability standpoint.
It is sometimes a joke at work if you ask somebody for a CD. They often smartly respond what is that. In many ways it is old technology much like the floppy disk. Younger people especially view it that way. A CD is often seen as undesirable.
Further when used, the optical is at times a very frustrating device from the reliability standpoint.
I read that ODDs are where most HW issues occur and the issues tend to happen well within their warranty. If this is the case, then Apple could potentially save a lot of money of shipping, fixing and user satisfaction by removing one of the last remaining components with moving parts.
I read that ODDs are where most HW issues occur and the issues tend to happen well within their warranty. If this is the case, then Apple could potentially save a lot of money of shipping, fixing and user satisfaction by removing one of the last remaining components with moving parts.
With Apples CNC based manufacturing technique it ought to be easy to build a 13 inch laptops with two different unibody frames. One for the model with the CD and one without. It shouldn't be much more than a machining challenge for the machinist/engineer. That way both sides of tis argument can be happy.
I read that ODDs are where most HW issues occur and the issues tend to happen well within their warranty. If this is the case, then Apple could potentially save a lot of money of shipping, fixing and user satisfaction by removing one of the last remaining components with moving parts.
Really? Where did you read that? I've never had an optical drive fail on any of my machines, any of my companies machines, and even in the Board of Ed. here, that's a rare occurrence, except for elementary schools, where the kids do all sorts of things. But it's fairly rare there as well.
With Apples CNC based manufacturing technique it ought to be easy to build a 13 inch laptops with two different unibody frames. One for the model with the CD and one without. It shouldn't be much more than a machining challenge for the machinist/engineer. That way both sides of tis argument can be happy.
I was going to say that I don't think Apple wouldn't do such a thing but they have with the Mac Mini Server. I would prefer for the right side edge be used for ports instead of left blank. Using this pic I tried to see it both HDD could be placed in the ODD space thus allowing for the battery to go from end to end. It seems the only way that would be possible is with a redesigned motherboard.
I was going to say that I don't think Apple wouldn't do such a thing but they have with the Mac Mini Server.
Yes and I believe that is on a machine that required hard tooling. I'm not saying the Mini Server was a good idea but the point is it was a minor modification to serve a small segment of the Mini clientele.
Quote:
I would prefer for the right side edge be used for ports instead of left blank.
Loosing ports would be very bad indeed.
Quote:
Using *** I tried to see it both HDD could be placed in the ODD space thus allowing for the battery to go from end to end. It seems the only way that would be possible is with a redesigned motherboard.
I'd like to see the motherboard redesigned anyways. The idea would be to support a real GPU in the machine. Hopefully with the right components we could double GPU performance again and still maintain good battery life. Honestly I'd like to see the motherboard on the left side the drives in the middle and the battery to the right. This would mean one entire side becomes available for I/O, making room for a "card" expansion port, room for the SD slot and maybe even light peak.
Comments
What an outstanding value. I think Apple would be crazy not to start delivering some AMD solutions next year with Llano. I like Intel as much as anyone but truth be told a lot of my work leads to the computer sitting here waiting on me. I think AMD certainly delivers a lot of processing power per buck. I'm content to let the "I gotta have the fastest computer available" people spend a premium on Intel based Macs. I'm more of a system balance kind of guy. Which is why I like SSD and will like faster GPU when they represent more than just increased fps in games.
The most impressive of all, Thuban runs even more efficiently than Intel i7 demonstrated in the table below. It also runs much cooler than i7's clocking at 30C under 100% CPU load running prime stress test on air with $25 OCZ cpu cooler. AMD did a hell of a job on their current 45nm SOI process.
CPU + R5870........IDLE (Balanced).........Idle (High perf)......100% CPU
890GX + X4 965 ..........75 ........................... 96......................164
890FX + X6 1055T........85 ........................... 104.....................183
890FX + X6 1095T........87 ........................... 107.....................187
H55 +Core i7 870.........115...........................170..... ............... 218
X58 + Core i7 980X......139...........................150....... ............. 272
The full review from guru3d can be found here:
http://www.guru3d.com/article/phenom...1090t-review/5
The most impressive of all, Thuban runs even more efficiently than Intel i7 demonstrated in the table below.
That is very good to hear. Supposedly Intel will have a new spin on it's 32nm process layer this year.
It also runs much cooler than i7's clocking at 30C under 100% CPU load running prime stress test on air with $25 OCZ cpu cooler. AMD did a hell of a job on their current 45nm SOI process.
Well yeah it is good but how much of that is related to AMDs architecture? That is one thing AMD had going for them is a cooler architecture for a given process.
CPU + R5870........IDLE (Balanced).........Idle (High perf)......100% CPU
890GX + X4 965 ..........75 ........................... 96......................164
890FX + X6 1055T........85 ........................... 104.....................183
890FX + X6 1095T........87 ........................... 107.....................187
H55 +Core i7 870.........115...........................170..... ............... 218
X58 + Core i7 980X......139...........................150....... ............. 272
The numbers aren't bad but niether are they excessively impressive. The real deal is performance per watt which these numbers do not address.
That being said the power numbers here mean this processor would be ideal for a Mac discussed elsewhere. That is right the XMac. Especially if Apple could see even lower power numbers via a lower clocked CPU. I'd be perfectly willing to give up 2-300 MHz for a 6 core machine that could idle well below 85 watts. Well as long as we don't give up to much in the way of compute performance.
The full review from guru3d can be found here:
http://www.guru3d.com/article/phenom...1090t-review/5
The first page was interesting but it was followed up with pages of overclocker mentality. I don't expect Apple to go that route nor do I need such a machine. What I want is a reasonable fast machine that sits between a Mac Pro and a Mini. That would be performance wise.
Dave
the 12-core AMD machine would be cheaper than a 6-core Intel so in terms of performance-per-dollar, the AMD offering will win in most cases.
Ding ding ding! We have a winner!
No not exactly what I'm saying here is that it has become clear that people are willing to give up certain technologies to get an extremely mobile PC. An Optical drive being one thing people find that they don't need.
I believe that most people still want a full featured machine, where they can burn Cd's and DVDs. Several years from now that might change.
Think of it as a device that corrects the mistakes made on AIR! In fact that is a very good way to look at it. It would be a laptop where what can be deleted is, but the stuff that many of us believe is important is still there. The machine would stress good performance and battery life.
Dave
The AIR seems to be pretty popular with the business crowd, who usually have their machines maintained by IT, so they don't need n optical drive (and IT likely doesn't want them installing any more software on their own).
But most computers are bought by the public these days, and an internal drive is far more convenient than having to go and buy an external one. Netbooks are much smaller, and people are willing to give it up for that. The iPad is smaller yet, and well, it's obvious.
No, he's comparing them to the 13" CULV powered machines like the Thinkpad Edge, HP DM3, and others that use 1.2-1.6Ghz Intel and AMD CPUs and deliver performance halfway between a netbook and a full sized notebook like a Macbook Pro. What he neglects to account for is that the current Macbook Pro delivers better battery life than any of them while being around the same weight with significantly more power. Again, this is an example of the machine a user wants existing and being readily available from anyone but Apple.
Assuming you're right, I don't see much of a comparison there. People are already complaining that the MB and MBPs aren't powerful enough.
I believe that most people still want a full featured machine, where they can burn Cd's and DVDs. Several years from now that might change.
Seriously; people are going without optical drives and doing fine in some of these ultra mobile laptops. Ask most people today to choose between a 13" laptop with an Optical or a higher performance GPU and many will go for the higher performance machine. Optical drives simply aren't used to the extent that they where in the past thus an external drive is a more acceptable solution.
The AIR seems to be pretty popular with the business crowd, who usually have their machines maintained by IT, so they don't need n optical drive (and IT likely doesn't want them installing any more software on their own).
The lack of an internal drive won't stop people from installing their software.
But most computers are bought by the public these days, and an internal drive is far more convenient than having to go and buy an external one.
Not if you have to carry around an external drive due to the lack of internal disk space on most laptops. The reality is you could easily put 2 HDD or SSD drives into a 13" laptop and still have space for a real GPU and a larger battery.
Netbooks are much smaller, and people are willing to give it up for that.
They aren't so small that the 13" machine doesn't compete with them. That is why I'm more focused on this machine than other larger models. People like the light weight of these machines as much as anything, so if Apple can tune the weight of the 13" to the lighter side it becomes even more competitive.
The iPad is smaller yet, and well, it's obvious.
IPad doesn't effectively replace a laptop of any sort so it isn't worth our time to even discuss it.
Frankly I see an optical free 13" MBP as a machine that could have been what the AIR should have been.
Dave
Seriously; people are going without optical drives and doing fine in some of these ultra mobile laptops. Ask most people today to choose between a 13" laptop with an Optical or a higher performance GPU and many will go for the higher performance machine. Optical drives simply aren't used to the extent that they where in the past thus an external drive is a more acceptable solution.
Really, we keep talking past each other. I've been saying from the beginning, that for those very small machines, lack of optical drives is accepted. But a MB and for a MBP it won't be. Those are not "ultra mobile laptops".
The lack of an internal drive won't stop people from installing their software.
Yes, it just makes it a lot more difficult.
Not if you have to carry around an external drive due to the lack of internal disk space on most laptops. The reality is you could easily put 2 HDD or SSD drives into a 13" laptop and still have space for a real GPU and a larger battery.
Most people don't need that much space. Not everyone has tens of thousands of songs, hundreds of Tv shows, and dozens of movies on their laptops all at once. For the few that do, well, I feel sorry they feel the need to do so.
They aren't so small that the 13" machine doesn't compete with them. That is why I'm more focused on this machine than other larger models. People like the light weight of these machines as much as anything, so if Apple can tune the weight of the 13" to the lighter side it becomes even more competitive.
They are notably smaller, and weigh a good pound or more less. If Apple wants to compete there, it will be with a new machine.
IPad doesn't effectively replace a laptop of any sort so it isn't worth our time to even discuss it.
You are completely wrong there, and so, you're right, we shouldn't discuss it.
Frankly I see an optical free 13" MBP as a machine that could have been what the AIR should have been.
Dave
Complete waste at this time.
AMD's upcoming Llano processors would be a natural fit in the Macbook and Mac mini. A two-chip solution like Apple requires (for space issues) with an excellent integrated GPU (rumored to be equivalent to the Radeon 5600 series).
How are they on power consumption compared to Intel's upcoming Sandy Bridge? Everything I've seen shows Intel far ahead of AMD in terms of power efficiency.
How are they on power consumption compared to Intel's upcoming Sandy Bridge? Everything I've seen shows Intel far ahead of AMD in terms of power efficiency.
Llano is estimated to be from 25 -59 Watts TDP for the whole die which is pretty damn good.
Really, we keep talking past each other. I've been saying from the beginning, that for those very small machines, lack of optical drives is accepted. But a MB and for a MBP it won't be. Those are not "ultra mobile laptops".
The 13" could very well play effectively against those machines. It is just about the minimal size for a notebook for many people so why not make it a light a possible.
Yes, it just makes it a lot more difficult.
The only software I've recently installed, via a CD optical disk on my MBP, came from Apple. Everything else is downloaded and installed from the net. Of course part of that is due to my using open source software but purchasing software over the net is not unheard of either.
At work it is much the same much of what I need to install on my Windows PC can be downloaded from the net. If not the original install the updates can be.
The point is the optical doesn't need to be in the laptop everyday.
Most people don't need that much space. Not everyone has tens of thousands of songs, hundreds of Tv shows, and dozens of movies on their laptops all at once. For the few that do, well, I feel sorry they feel the need to do so.
It is so nice of you to feel sorry for those that take a different approach in life.
In any event It doesn't take much effort to burn up a lot of disk space with software. Just install XCode, Eclipse or even Open Office and see your free space drift away. Besides those of us into content consumption via their PC's aren't the only ones needing space, if you are into content production the more disk space you have the better. Of course if you are into content production you will most likely have a larger laptop with a built in optical.
They are notably smaller, and weigh a good pound or more less. If Apple wants to compete there, it will be with a new machine.
Of course it would be a new machine, the deletion of the optical just allows for a thinner machine when it comes to a redesign.
You are completely wrong there, and so, you're right, we shouldn't discuss it.
If I thought I was wrong I wouldn't have brought it up. The iPad might be a better choice for some people but it will not replace a laptop for people that need a laptop. In fact their is little overlap.
Complete waste at this time.
In my estimation the AIR was a waste of time. A lighter, higher performance, 13" MBP would be very attractive to a number of users.
Dave
The only software I've recently installed, via a CD optical disk on my MBP, came from Apple.
I have moved to an optical-less system for restoring Mac OS X and Repairing Disk from Disk Utility. This only became possible (without hacks) with Snow Leopard. You can copy your Restore Disk to any external drive you wish (USB flash drive, SD card, internal HDD, or external HDD) using Disk Utility. it makes for a very, very fast installation over any DVD. If you go with any of the external drives can even use it to fix any Mac without having to get a FW cable and use two Macs in Target Disk Mode.
This is becoming a much bigger reality than many realize. I was in Fry's last night and there were even more notebooks that were without and optical drive than I noticed at Xmas. These are 13" with 2.5" HDD and non-CULV processors. Like many things in computing I doubt it will be standard until Apple puts their weight behind it and I don't think that is too far off specially seeing that even store bought software has taken notice.
My trips to computer stores have been limited of late but this reflects what I think is a real trend. In part it is likely because of the move to really compact laptops. I also suspect it is driven by consumer demands as they realize that the drive just doesn't get used that much. Further when used, the optical is at times a very frustrating device from the reliability standpoint.
It is sometimes a joke at work if you ask somebody for a CD. They often smartly respond what is that. In many ways it is old technology much like the floppy disk. Younger people especially view it that way. A CD is often seen as undesirable.
Further when used, the optical is at times a very frustrating device from the reliability standpoint.
I read that ODDs are where most HW issues occur and the issues tend to happen well within their warranty. If this is the case, then Apple could potentially save a lot of money of shipping, fixing and user satisfaction by removing one of the last remaining components with moving parts.
I read that ODDs are where most HW issues occur and the issues tend to happen well within their warranty. If this is the case, then Apple could potentially save a lot of money of shipping, fixing and user satisfaction by removing one of the last remaining components with moving parts.
With Apples CNC based manufacturing technique it ought to be easy to build a 13 inch laptops with two different unibody frames. One for the model with the CD and one without. It shouldn't be much more than a machining challenge for the machinist/engineer. That way both sides of tis argument can be happy.
I read that ODDs are where most HW issues occur and the issues tend to happen well within their warranty. If this is the case, then Apple could potentially save a lot of money of shipping, fixing and user satisfaction by removing one of the last remaining components with moving parts.
Really? Where did you read that? I've never had an optical drive fail on any of my machines, any of my companies machines, and even in the Board of Ed. here, that's a rare occurrence, except for elementary schools, where the kids do all sorts of things. But it's fairly rare there as well.
They are far more reliable than HDD's.
With Apples CNC based manufacturing technique it ought to be easy to build a 13 inch laptops with two different unibody frames. One for the model with the CD and one without. It shouldn't be much more than a machining challenge for the machinist/engineer. That way both sides of tis argument can be happy.
I was going to say that I don't think Apple wouldn't do such a thing but they have with the Mac Mini Server. I would prefer for the right side edge be used for ports instead of left blank. Using this pic I tried to see it both HDD could be placed in the ODD space thus allowing for the battery to go from end to end. It seems the only way that would be possible is with a redesigned motherboard.
I was going to say that I don't think Apple wouldn't do such a thing but they have with the Mac Mini Server.
Yes and I believe that is on a machine that required hard tooling. I'm not saying the Mini Server was a good idea but the point is it was a minor modification to serve a small segment of the Mini clientele.
I would prefer for the right side edge be used for ports instead of left blank.
Loosing ports would be very bad indeed.
Using *** I tried to see it both HDD could be placed in the ODD space thus allowing for the battery to go from end to end. It seems the only way that would be possible is with a redesigned motherboard.
I'd like to see the motherboard redesigned anyways. The idea would be to support a real GPU in the machine. Hopefully with the right components we could double GPU performance again and still maintain good battery life. Honestly I'd like to see the motherboard on the left side the drives in the middle and the battery to the right. This would mean one entire side becomes available for I/O, making room for a "card" expansion port, room for the SD slot and maybe even light peak.
Dave