the big problem IMO would be renting space. I don't know how many would be willing to work on the top floors after this. Maybe I'm completely off but I think many would fear it</strong><hr></blockquote>
You're not off. They would have a hard time giving away the space. And if someone did rent it, they'd have a world of trouble recruiting people to work there. The original towers were an economic white elephant for almost 30 years. They only just started to show a profit these last few years. I don't know how anything they build, if they build on the same scale, could ever turn a profit. That said, I still would like them to rebuild one tower only. It doesn't have to be the world's tallest but it should be as tall as the original towers were. Give it visual elements of the original buildings, perhaps in the use of materials and the spacing of the mullions, whatever.
Building one tower only would convey both a sense of overcoming and an acknowledgement of what was lost. It's too bad they had to tear down those segments of the curtain wall that were still standing after the collapse. Maybe they could also create a memorial that sculpturally evoked those ruins. Also, I think the sculpture would need to look as though it was covered in white ash. And the names of the victims could be etched, running in long lines up the "walls" of the sculpture.
You're not off. They would have a hard time giving away the space. And if someone did rent it, they'd have a world of trouble recruiting people to work there. The original towers were an economic white elephant for almost 30 years. They only just started to show a profit these last few years. I don't know how anything they build, if they build on the same scale, could ever turn a profit. That said, I still would like them to rebuild one tower only. It doesn't have to be the world's tallest but it should be as tall as the original towers were. Give it visual elements of the original buildings, perhaps in the use of materials and the spacing of the mullions, whatever.
Building one tower only would convey both a sense of overcoming and an acknowledgement of what was lost. It's too bad they had to tear down those segments of the curtain wall that were still standing after the collapse. Maybe they could also create a memorial that sculpturally evoked those ruins. Also, I think the sculpture would need to look as though it was covered in white ash. And the names of the victims could be etched, running in long lines up the "walls" of the sculpture.
Making one great tower is a good idear, perhaps it can be surronded by some less high buildings, why not a circular building around it ?
There should be two memorials instead of one, a memorial for the dead people working in the twins at the level of ground zero and an another one on the top of the tower for the dead peoples who where in the planes (at the exception of the terrorist of course).
Anyway the memorial, have to be in a special place where everybody should go , but in a isolated and a dissumulated aera, where people working in the new buildings are not oblige to pass in front of the monument when they go to work. It will be to scary to work in a tower, if everyday of your life something remind you that you can be killed there.
Lots of good ideas here. I think there should be two towers again. Not as tall as the originals and with stronger, advanced security measures. There should be a prominent memorial too.
I think the fear of working in tall buildings is real...but hell, I don't hear any workers in other cities resigning to work in lower ones. Maybe in NYC right now, but in all things..it will subside.
Also, there will be a lot of bickering over whatever project (remember the firemen statue?). Everyone from City Councils, Real Estates, Victims, Corporations, Government, Unions, Firemen and Police...on and on. Plus NYC has their new "I'm away for the weekend" Mayor...
At the Pentagon, contruction is way ahead of schedule (supposed to be completed by Sept. 11 2002). They have a small hallway memorial within the area the plane had hit. Pretty fast work if you ask me. But of course it all went through military channels.
Let's hope in NYC they'll work out our differences and get things going in the right direction.
Personally, I think the two new towers I spoke of earlier should be precisely one story shorter than the Sears Tower - that is, if 100 stories each isn't good enough.
By the way, glad to see some of you concur with my idea. I think there are two distinct parts to rebuilding and getting things back the way they should be. The emotional part and the show of strength / financial part. The park and memorial speak to the former, the two new towers speak to the latter. You need both to solve the problem of what should be done with the empty space.
It's not surprising either, that the victims' families are being bull-headed. It's hard to grieve and be reasonable at the same time...really hard. But in time many of them will come around. Don't forget too the majority of these people were from New York. New Yorkers are not exactly the easiest people to convince / get along with at times - they're bull-headed from the start.
It's too bad they had to tear down those segments of the curtain wall that were still standing after the collapse. Maybe they could also create a memorial that sculpturally evoked those ruins.<hr></blockquote>
I understand that these pieces have been saved...out at Fresh Kills where they spread the wreckage out to look one more time, they're saving pieces for a memorial. It's not clear that the wrecked facade which survived will be used, but I understand it's still an option.
I'm not into saving everything and turning it into a memorial. But then I have this idea. Take what's left of the structure and cut it up. Send parts if it to any city that wants to put it on display. Boston, Phily, Wash DC Chicago, SF, Detriot ....
I don't know why I think this would be good <img src="confused.gif" border="0">
I'm not into saving everything and turning it into a memorial. But then I have this idea. Take what's left of the structure and cut it up. Send parts if it to any city that wants to put it on display. Boston, Phily, Wash DC Chicago, SF, Detriot ....
I don't know why I think this would be good <hr></blockquote>
I dunno, something about this seems like it could be a good idea. The trick would be to not make it into a freaky circus thing.
I dunno, something about this seems like it could be a good idea. The trick would be to not make it into a freaky circus thing.</strong><hr></blockquote>
Yea. Chicago has a lot of public art that's just "there". They have room from a bit of the external structure somewhere in the city. Maybe kind of a reminder of how lucky we were not to get hit and that another city did. ...
I understand that these pieces have been saved...out at Fresh Kills where they spread the wreckage out to look one more time, they're saving pieces for a memorial. It's not clear that the wrecked facade which survived will be used, but I understand it's still an option.</strong><hr></blockquote>
Good. In the "plan" I'm thinking about the ruins would occupy the space of the unbuilt tower.
<strong>I like the pillars of light thing they are doing now, clean it up, make it a park and keep the lights.</strong><hr></blockquote>
1.) apparantly it could potentiall cause bird migration problems if left on for good
2.) it costs a hell of a lot of money everyday to produce
3.) It's not really that impressive unless you're in manhatten or right near it. The original plans called for much brighter beams that would be viewable from most of the 5 bouroughs where there was a direct line of view. unfortunately they toned it down and I can't even see it from my house. I just see a very faint glow above the whitestone bridge
A little off topic, but thought I'd mention it. I take the subway to work everyday and the station I use is a big starting off point for tourists. It's in the B'way, Times Square area. Anyway, in the token booth there's a sign that says "Welcome to NYC, for Ground Zero take the N or the R to Rector St. etc."
I'm sure the sign is up there because the poor token clerk has been deluged by tourists asking for directions. I just find it a little strange how many people are making it a big part of their trip here to go down there. I dunno, I kind of understand the people who were either directly or peripherally affected by it, but seeing a subway car full of giddy high schoolers on their class trip going sits kind of funny.
This talk about building the tallest office building in the word brings up another point. The Petronas Towers are the two tallest office buildings in the world, but there's a catch...
They very last floor of the Petronas Tower is actually shorter than the Sears Tower's last floor, and was shorter than the WTC's last floor. The only reason why the Petronas Towers are listed as taller is a technicality involving what constitutes part of the building and what doesn't.
The two radio antennae on the the Sears Tower do not count. The radio antenna that was on the One World Trade Center also did not count. The 'spires' on the Petronas Tower do count...they are ornamental...and not antennae...
<strong>This talk about building the tallest office building in the word brings up another point. The Petronas Towers are the two tallest office buildings in the world, but there's a catch...
They very last floor of the Petronas Tower is actually shorter than the Sears Tower's last floor, and was shorter than the WTC's last floor. The only reason why the Petronas Towers are listed as taller is a technicality involving what constitutes part of the building and what doesn't.
The two radio antennae on the the Sears Tower do not count. The radio antenna that was on the One World Trade Center also did not count. The 'spires' on the Petronas Tower do count...they are ornamental...and not antennae...</strong><hr></blockquote>
yes I've heard of this before. I still think the best way to build tall is to be honest. Just build a tall building with no ornamental spires or anything. It just says "**** you and your stupid ornaments." New York is supposed to be all about business, not ornaments.
<strong>A little off topic, but thought I'd mention it. I take the subway to work everyday and the station I use is a big starting off point for tourists. It's in the B'way, Times Square area. Anyway, in the token booth there's a sign that says "Welcome to NYC, for Ground Zero take the N or the R to Rector St. etc."
I'm sure the sign is up there because the poor token clerk has been deluged by tourists asking for directions. I just find it a little strange how many people are making it a big part of their trip here to go down there. I dunno, I kind of understand the people who were either directly or peripherally affected by it, but seeing a subway car full of giddy high schoolers on their class trip going sits kind of funny.</strong><hr></blockquote>
Not really off topic at all. It's a part of the whole memorial thing...
People go to these memorials/monuments that way, but I would like to see their reactions and emotions when they get there. I went to Ground Zero (or as the Firemen call it; "The Pile") and immediatelly I was overwhelmed...and this was before the public platforms and all. The smells, the emotions of others and the church where all the memorials were displayed was enough for me...
I hope these artifacts are included in some way...there has to be a rebuilding of all this...a renewal of some sort...
Comments
<strong>
the big problem IMO would be renting space. I don't know how many would be willing to work on the top floors after this. Maybe I'm completely off but I think many would fear it</strong><hr></blockquote>
You're not off. They would have a hard time giving away the space. And if someone did rent it, they'd have a world of trouble recruiting people to work there. The original towers were an economic white elephant for almost 30 years. They only just started to show a profit these last few years. I don't know how anything they build, if they build on the same scale, could ever turn a profit. That said, I still would like them to rebuild one tower only. It doesn't have to be the world's tallest but it should be as tall as the original towers were. Give it visual elements of the original buildings, perhaps in the use of materials and the spacing of the mullions, whatever.
Building one tower only would convey both a sense of overcoming and an acknowledgement of what was lost. It's too bad they had to tear down those segments of the curtain wall that were still standing after the collapse. Maybe they could also create a memorial that sculpturally evoked those ruins. Also, I think the sculpture would need to look as though it was covered in white ash. And the names of the victims could be etched, running in long lines up the "walls" of the sculpture.
[ 03-12-2002: Message edited by: roger_ramjet ]</p>
<strong>
You're not off. They would have a hard time giving away the space. And if someone did rent it, they'd have a world of trouble recruiting people to work there. The original towers were an economic white elephant for almost 30 years. They only just started to show a profit these last few years. I don't know how anything they build, if they build on the same scale, could ever turn a profit. That said, I still would like them to rebuild one tower only. It doesn't have to be the world's tallest but it should be as tall as the original towers were. Give it visual elements of the original buildings, perhaps in the use of materials and the spacing of the mullions, whatever.
Building one tower only would convey both a sense of overcoming and an acknowledgement of what was lost. It's too bad they had to tear down those segments of the curtain wall that were still standing after the collapse. Maybe they could also create a memorial that sculpturally evoked those ruins. Also, I think the sculpture would need to look as though it was covered in white ash. And the names of the victims could be etched, running in long lines up the "walls" of the sculpture.
[ 03-12-2002: Message edited by: roger_ramjet ]</strong><hr></blockquote>
Making one great tower is a good idear, perhaps it can be surronded by some less high buildings, why not a circular building around it ?
There should be two memorials instead of one, a memorial for the dead people working in the twins at the level of ground zero and an another one on the top of the tower for the dead peoples who where in the planes (at the exception of the terrorist of course).
Anyway the memorial, have to be in a special place where everybody should go , but in a isolated and a dissumulated aera, where people working in the new buildings are not oblige to pass in front of the monument when they go to work. It will be to scary to work in a tower, if everyday of your life something remind you that you can be killed there.
I think the fear of working in tall buildings is real...but hell, I don't hear any workers in other cities resigning to work in lower ones. Maybe in NYC right now, but in all things..it will subside.
Also, there will be a lot of bickering over whatever project (remember the firemen statue?). Everyone from City Councils, Real Estates, Victims, Corporations, Government, Unions, Firemen and Police...on and on. Plus NYC has their new "I'm away for the weekend" Mayor...
At the Pentagon, contruction is way ahead of schedule (supposed to be completed by Sept. 11 2002). They have a small hallway memorial within the area the plane had hit. Pretty fast work if you ask me. But of course it all went through military channels.
Let's hope in NYC they'll work out our differences and get things going in the right direction.
By the way, glad to see some of you concur with my idea. I think there are two distinct parts to rebuilding and getting things back the way they should be. The emotional part and the show of strength / financial part. The park and memorial speak to the former, the two new towers speak to the latter. You need both to solve the problem of what should be done with the empty space.
It's not surprising either, that the victims' families are being bull-headed. It's hard to grieve and be reasonable at the same time...really hard. But in time many of them will come around. Don't forget too the majority of these people were from New York. New Yorkers are not exactly the easiest people to convince / get along with at times - they're bull-headed from the start.
<img src="graemlins/smokin.gif" border="0" alt="[Chilling]" />
<strong><a href="http://home.no.net/toretors/bilder/New World Trade Center_s.jpg" target="_blank">Press here</a> <img src="graemlins/smokin.gif" border="0" alt="[Chilling]" /> </strong><hr></blockquote>
Even though that is satire...it's sickening. Thanks Norway for your idiotic contribution.
<strong><a href="http://home.no.net/toretors/bilder/New World Trade Center_s.jpg" target="_blank">Press here</a>
<img src="graemlins/smokin.gif" border="0" alt="[Chilling]" /> </strong><hr></blockquote>
I don't find that funny at all.
It's too bad they had to tear down those segments of the curtain wall that were still standing after the collapse. Maybe they could also create a memorial that sculpturally evoked those ruins.<hr></blockquote>
I understand that these pieces have been saved...out at Fresh Kills where they spread the wreckage out to look one more time, they're saving pieces for a memorial. It's not clear that the wrecked facade which survived will be used, but I understand it's still an option.
I don't know why I think this would be good <img src="confused.gif" border="0">
I'm not into saving everything and turning it into a memorial. But then I have this idea. Take what's left of the structure and cut it up. Send parts if it to any city that wants to put it on display. Boston, Phily, Wash DC Chicago, SF, Detriot ....
I don't know why I think this would be good
I dunno, something about this seems like it could be a good idea. The trick would be to not make it into a freaky circus thing.
<strong>
I dunno, something about this seems like it could be a good idea. The trick would be to not make it into a freaky circus thing.</strong><hr></blockquote>
Yea. Chicago has a lot of public art that's just "there". They have room from a bit of the external structure somewhere in the city. Maybe kind of a reminder of how lucky we were not to get hit and that another city did. ...
I hate overdone though.
<strong>
I understand that these pieces have been saved...out at Fresh Kills where they spread the wreckage out to look one more time, they're saving pieces for a memorial. It's not clear that the wrecked facade which survived will be used, but I understand it's still an option.</strong><hr></blockquote>
Good. In the "plan" I'm thinking about the ruins would occupy the space of the unbuilt tower.
<strong>I like the pillars of light thing they are doing now, clean it up, make it a park and keep the lights.</strong><hr></blockquote>
1.) apparantly it could potentiall cause bird migration problems if left on for good
2.) it costs a hell of a lot of money everyday to produce
3.) It's not really that impressive unless you're in manhatten or right near it. The original plans called for much brighter beams that would be viewable from most of the 5 bouroughs where there was a direct line of view. unfortunately they toned it down and I can't even see it from my house. I just see a very faint glow above the whitestone bridge
I'm sure the sign is up there because the poor token clerk has been deluged by tourists asking for directions. I just find it a little strange how many people are making it a big part of their trip here to go down there. I dunno, I kind of understand the people who were either directly or peripherally affected by it, but seeing a subway car full of giddy high schoolers on their class trip going sits kind of funny.
They very last floor of the Petronas Tower is actually shorter than the Sears Tower's last floor, and was shorter than the WTC's last floor. The only reason why the Petronas Towers are listed as taller is a technicality involving what constitutes part of the building and what doesn't.
The two radio antennae on the the Sears Tower do not count. The radio antenna that was on the One World Trade Center also did not count. The 'spires' on the Petronas Tower do count...they are ornamental...and not antennae...
<strong>This talk about building the tallest office building in the word brings up another point. The Petronas Towers are the two tallest office buildings in the world, but there's a catch...
They very last floor of the Petronas Tower is actually shorter than the Sears Tower's last floor, and was shorter than the WTC's last floor. The only reason why the Petronas Towers are listed as taller is a technicality involving what constitutes part of the building and what doesn't.
The two radio antennae on the the Sears Tower do not count. The radio antenna that was on the One World Trade Center also did not count. The 'spires' on the Petronas Tower do count...they are ornamental...and not antennae...</strong><hr></blockquote>
yes I've heard of this before. I still think the best way to build tall is to be honest. Just build a tall building with no ornamental spires or anything. It just says "**** you and your stupid ornaments." New York is supposed to be all about business, not ornaments.
<strong>Don't get me started on those pussy Petronas Towers.</strong><hr></blockquote>
No, lets not Pussy + Towers = Sexual Content?
...next?
<strong>A little off topic, but thought I'd mention it. I take the subway to work everyday and the station I use is a big starting off point for tourists. It's in the B'way, Times Square area. Anyway, in the token booth there's a sign that says "Welcome to NYC, for Ground Zero take the N or the R to Rector St. etc."
I'm sure the sign is up there because the poor token clerk has been deluged by tourists asking for directions. I just find it a little strange how many people are making it a big part of their trip here to go down there. I dunno, I kind of understand the people who were either directly or peripherally affected by it, but seeing a subway car full of giddy high schoolers on their class trip going sits kind of funny.</strong><hr></blockquote>
Not really off topic at all. It's a part of the whole memorial thing...
People go to these memorials/monuments that way, but I would like to see their reactions and emotions when they get there. I went to Ground Zero (or as the Firemen call it; "The Pile") and immediatelly I was overwhelmed...and this was before the public platforms and all. The smells, the emotions of others and the church where all the memorials were displayed was enough for me...
I hope these artifacts are included in some way...there has to be a rebuilding of all this...a renewal of some sort...