Steve Jobs slams Adobe Flash as unfit for modern era

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  • Reply 121 of 350
    crowleycrowley Posts: 5,991member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by agl82 View Post


    Apple had to release the kernel as open source. They stole it from FreeBSD!



    You can't steal something that's free.



    Quote:
    Originally Posted by agl82 View Post


    Apple only embraces open source when it benefits them. They are truly the most proprietary company on the face of the planet.



    You aren't even being logically consistent in adjacent sentences, let alone with other posts where you claim "Steve Jobs is an egomaniac and a control freak who can't stand the thought of using truly "open" and "free" standards."
    • If they're using them, then Steve can stand them.

    • If they're using them, then they can hardly be the most proprietary company on the face of the planet.

    Please stop with the false hyperbole.



    Further, you still haven't addressed your completely false claim earlier than HTML5 included H.264 in the spec, and that Steve Jobs was therefore a liar. Steve might be a liar, but certainly not for that reason, because it's complete rubbish.
  • Reply 122 of 350
    krreagankrreagan Posts: 218member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by agl82 View Post


    [SIZE="2"]Apple had to release the kernel as open source. They stole it from FreeBSD!



    You can't steel something that's given away lipshitz!



    Read the BSD license. It's not the GPL!



    Apple is under no obligation to return anything to the BSD community!



    KRR
  • Reply 123 of 350
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by John.B View Post


    You believe Flash is open? Really?



    Android... Think before you type....





    Quote:
    Originally Posted by John.B View Post


    You think any of the Flash phones are going to have anything approaching acceptable battery life for a phone? Really?



    Yes... Really...
  • Reply 124 of 350
    agl82agl82 Posts: 15member
    .
  • Reply 125 of 350
    str1f3str1f3 Posts: 573member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Firefly7475 View Post


    Bad form Steve. Part of your new job as "the man" is that once you've gone on a head kicking mission you can't turn back. You're not the "good guy" anymore, nor can you ever be again.



    Just go back to making good products and leave the commentary to those with some credibility.



    Who better to comment on why there is no Flash on iDevices than the CEO of that company?
  • Reply 126 of 350
    stuffestuffe Posts: 391member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by agl82 View Post


    You're delusional if you think I support Adobe. I just enjoy pointing out the irony of Steve Jobs calling Flash a closed standard when every aspect of the entire Apple ecosystem is closed, proprietary, and anti-competitive. You can't develop iPhone applications without using XCode. You can't sell your app for the iPhone unless it's approved by der Führer Jobs himself. You can only use iTunes to transfer your media onto an iPod, iPad, or iPhone. You can't have Flash on your iPad. You can't have an HDMI port or Blu-Ray player on your Mac. It seems Mr. Jobs loves dishing out punishment and his followers are some seriously brainwashed masochists!



    Let me try this:







    Yeah, feels good! Getting kinda dizzy tho...all my thoughts have gotten messed up...
  • Reply 127 of 350
    solipsismsolipsism Posts: 25,726member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by mstone View Post


    Exaggerate much? Flat out lie.



    It's not a lie, Flash is a hog. In my testing of the same exact video files on YouTube Flash 10.1 RC2 still uses 3x to 6x as much processing as the HMTL5 option, depending on the video resolution.
  • Reply 128 of 350
    quadra 610quadra 610 Posts: 6,744member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Firefly7475 View Post


    Bad form Steve. Part of your new job as "the man" is that once you've gone on a head kicking mission you can't turn back. You're not the "good guy" anymore, nor can you ever be again.



    Just go back to making good products and leave the commentary to those with some credibility.



    I think the guy who's always right gets the "credibility."



    When Steve Jobs sneezes, the rest of the industry grabs a Kleenex.



    That might change in the future, but for now, Steve gets to decide where the rest of us are going. That's what happens when you're in a leadership position.
  • Reply 129 of 350
    veblenveblen Posts: 201member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by agl82 View Post


    Apple had to release the kernel as open source. They stole it from FreeBSD!



    Nice token open source reference. Here's the truth:



    "With the release of Mac OS X for x86 processors, Apple has chosen to not release source to key components of the OS, such as the kernel and all drivers. This means Darwin/x86 is dead in the water, Darwin/ppc has many closed source components and is a deprecated architecture. One has to wonder why Apple even bothers to release non-GPL'd source at all, if it is unwilling to cooperate with external developers to increase their return on investment and accept external bug fixes and features. Even worse, one has to wonder why people would want to donate their time to such a fruitless and pointless cause. "



    http://www.synack.net/~bbraun/writing/oshistory.html






    Apple only embraces open source when it benefits them. They are truly the most proprietary company on the face of the planet.



    Apple failing to understand open source



    http://www.oreillynet.com/mac/blog/2...rstand_op.html



    Using and then contributing to open source software isn't stealing (FreeBSD). That's what it's there for. I liked your initial posts on this topic, but your flailing around a bit.
  • Reply 130 of 350
    williamgwilliamg Posts: 322member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by John.B View Post


    You believe Flash is open? Really?





    You think any of the Flash phones are going to have anything approaching acceptable battery life for a phone? Really?



    A few 3 minute news videos per day will do nothing appreciable to battery life.
  • Reply 131 of 350
    But, without flash it will never be a complete web browsing experience.



    Point proven when apples video showed flash elements when 'using' the ipad to browse the web.



    It's not being pro flash it's about being pro apple and not wanting someone else to over-take. For John B. I am referring to Android here.
  • Reply 132 of 350
    postulantpostulant Posts: 1,270member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Mark Fearing View Post


    Not sure what you base your claims on. Just your minds dull rumblings when you awake each afternoon? It's a nice collection of completely unsubstantiated guesses. But I like your ability to vent while offering no usefulness.



    I'm sorry but I always get a good laugh from his posts. Sometimes I wonder if he really believes the stuff he writes. If he does, that makes them that much funnier.



    He reminds me of that one guy on every job that's a fanatical conspiracy theorist. Crazy as a bat, and you just can't seem to get enough of their amazing stories.
  • Reply 133 of 350
    rot'napplerot'napple Posts: 1,839member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by bytor View Post


    Hmmmm...



    Which iPhone is he using where there is 10 hours of video playing?



    Why the German Beer Garden Express iPhone 4, of course!
  • Reply 134 of 350
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by agl82 View Post


    You're delusional if you think I support Adobe. I just enjoy pointing out the irony of Steve Jobs calling Flash a closed standard when every aspect of the entire Apple ecosystem is closed, proprietary, and anti-competitive. You can't develop iPhone applications without using XCode. You can't sell your app for the iPhone unless it's approved by der Führer Jobs himself. You can only use iTunes to transfer your media onto an iPod, iPad, or iPhone. You can't have Flash on your iPad. You can't have an HDMI port or Blu-Ray player on your Mac. It seems Mr. Jobs loves dishing out punishment and his followers are some seriously brainwashed masochists!



    There is nothing wrong with being a closed system if its a good system. Steve isn't trying to claim iPod/iPhone/iPad/etc is OPEN. He actually said the opposite. But the WEB is a different story. Flash is a proprietary plugin, no matter how widely used in the web it is, its still "closed". Adobe owns and controls all aspects of Flash development. Apple is saying that the WEB should be open.



    Flash != Open

    iPhone OS != Open

    BUT

    HTML5/CSS/Javascript == Open

    Adobe wants everyone to use their proprietary flash to instead of HTML5/CSS/Javascript.

    Apple wants everyone to use HTML5/CSS/Javascript



    When it comes to the Web, Jobs is right.
  • Reply 135 of 350
    addaboxaddabox Posts: 12,660member
    I like living in the Adobe fantasy world where every mobile device but Apple's runs Flash fine with no degradation of battery life and excellent performance. It's obviously trivially easy to do, since Adobe has had the technology ready to go since the beginning of '09 I mean mid '09 I mean late '09 I mean early '10 I mean mid '10 I mean late '10.



    Come on, Apple, get with the program!
  • Reply 136 of 350
    asciiascii Posts: 5,941member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by agl82 View Post


    I just enjoy pointing out the irony of Steve Jobs calling Flash a closed standard when every aspect of the entire Apple ecosystem is closed, proprietary, and anti-competitive. You can't develop iPhone applications without using XCode.



    You can write iPhone apps completely in HTML5. There are even a few special tags (optional) you can use on your page to get the same kind of fancy transitions as a full on Objective C app has.



    So Apple gives you two dev kits for the iPhone in effect, and one of them is fully open. Remember when the iPhone first came out, the HTML apps were the only kind you could do!
  • Reply 137 of 350
    mstonemstone Posts: 11,510member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by solipsism View Post


    It's not a lie, Flash is a hog. In my testing of the same exact video files on YouTube Flash 10.1 RC2 still uses 3x to 6x as much processing as the HMTL5 option, depending on the video resolution.



    The lie is a blank Flash document uses 120%. Even my most complex Flash apps start out at maybe 50% on launch and run at a sustained 20%. I can make HTML5 canvas tag use a sustained 77% on a quad core Mac Pro. I have a stupid test page that I wrote just to see if I could max it out. I was able to bring the machine to a crawl using a really bad javascript loop but the browser is smart enough to stop the script and open an alert box. But with just piling on canvas tags (6) and animating them, HTML5 becomes very CPU intensive just like Flash.
  • Reply 138 of 350
    addaboxaddabox Posts: 12,660member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by agl82 View Post


    You're delusional if you think I support Adobe. I just enjoy pointing out the irony of Steve Jobs calling Flash a closed standard when every aspect of the entire Apple ecosystem is closed, proprietary, and anti-competitive. You can't develop iPhone applications without using XCode. You can't sell your app for the iPhone unless it's approved by der Führer Jobs himself. You can only use iTunes to transfer your media onto an iPod, iPad, or iPhone. You can't have Flash on your iPad. You can't have an HDMI port or Blu-Ray player on your Mac. It seems Mr. Jobs loves dishing out punishment and his followers are some seriously brainwashed masochists!



    Yep, you've made it clear that you don't understand the differences among things like "closed" and "proprietary" and "free", or things like "platforms", "operating systems", and "the web", so it's not surprising that many things would strike you as ironic. Being massively clueless will do that.
  • Reply 139 of 350
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by addabox View Post


    I like living in the Adobe fantasy world where every mobile device but Apple's runs Flash fine with no degradation of battery life and excellent performance. It's obviously trivially easy to do, since Adobe has had the technology ready to go since the beginning of '09 I mean mid '09 I mean late '09 I mean early '10 I mean mid '10 I mean late '10.



    Come on, Apple, get with the program!



    In the future. Not right now. I work at a digital agency we're developing on both Android and Iphone. Which means for an ongoing comparison. Iphone still leads in my opinion but the gap is really closing.



    Web browsing on Android is solidly improving. The UX is getting to a par with Apple, and now they offer the choice of drag and drop of files, usable flash (I say usable because windows mobile included it but it didn't matter because it wasn't usable). Basically within 12 months all of the strengths and none of the weaknesses. This can be spotted and addressed if Apple want to.
  • Reply 140 of 350
    crowleycrowley Posts: 5,991member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by agl82 View Post


    You're delusional if you think I support Adobe. I just enjoy pointing out the irony of Steve Jobs calling Flash a closed standard when every aspect of the entire Apple ecosystem is closed, proprietary, and anti-competitive. You can't develop iPhone applications without using XCode. You can't sell your app for the iPhone unless it's approved by der Führer Jobs himself. You can only use iTunes to transfer your media onto an iPod, iPad, or iPhone. You can't have Flash on your iPad. You can't have an HDMI port or Blu-Ray player on your Mac. It seems Mr. Jobs loves dishing out punishment and his followers are some seriously brainwashed masochists!



    There's truth in this, and it's a truth that Apple users have to like or lump. But the web is a different story.



    Apple's ecosystem, Apple controls it.

    No party should have as much influence over the web as Adobe does right now. The stance that Apple is taking had helped to revise that power, whether that was their ultimate intention or not.
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