Hang out a while. You'll learn from the others here that Apple's designs are infallible. Any issue that appears to be a result of an Apple design is merely a user error.
Yep.
And the hockey puck mouse was just misunderstood.
And the Wallstreet PBs never had any hinge problems.
And there was no NVidia replacement needed.
And no one's ever seen a bulging battery.
And....
I think that room must be given for all to express an opinion. Sometimes they are right, sometimes it is apple.
I do buy his explanation about internal antenna placement and attenuation when occluded. He alludes that every phone suffers what the iPhone 4 does which is false.
Except that halfway through his article he starts to change his tune, he even says that it was a design decision by Apple and could not be fixed, which is a nice way of saying it has a design flaw. Yes it is a design flaw because they chose a thinner enclose that forbade an internal (non touchable) antenna.
So after equating other phones that lose a few bars when their antennas are occluded to the iPhone which goes out of service if simply touched in the wrong spot he goes on to link to a youtube video. This video shows an iPhone losing service by placing the iPhone 4 on it's side and laying a key across the antenna gap. That is plain bs, where is a SINGLE video of ANY OTHER PHONE completely going from full strength to no signal by laying a key on it. All it takes is one, just one and then he can say that all phones are affected this way.
So yes I do buy his explanation of antenna attenuation by hand occlusion in all phones, but I flatly refuse to believe that all phone are affected the way the iPhone 4 is by holding it, touching it or laying a key on it.
Yeah that made me wonder about his motivations in the whole thing. First he tries to muddy the water by saying all phones do that, then he claims he is going to buy one.
I did pre-order my iPhone 4, received it Wednesday, returned it to the Apple Store in Greensboro, NC this morning just waiting now on AT&T to cancel my contract upgrade. If I didn't have hundreds invested in iOS software then I would switch to a different platform.
Well he didn't say that laying a key on it would affect all phones. He explained that ALL phones now have the antenna at the bottom. He explains why. He explains the reason the iPhone would loose signal by moving the antenna from the bottom to the sides. He explains if you cover the bands on the sides, you can block the signal.
He never said all phones do that. He said all phones have the antenna at the bottom. Please read it carefully and show me where he says all phones do that. You are reading things into his article that aren't there. He does blame Apple for the design, but also implicates AT&T and the FCC as well.
Don't I wish. All I know is that the bars drop on the call today, day before they didn't, with the 3Gs.
You do realize a single incident of a dropped call under uncontrolled conditions constitutes anecdotal evidence and that this is the most unreliable of all evidence, yes?
That was so wrong. I emailed Thomas and told him how sleazy it was for him to be getting so much praise in the comments for something he ripped off by not attributing it to you!
I just ran a test with my 3G phone and in or out of the case, I found that when I squeezed it very tight, it would frequently not download at all under 3G, although as the below shows, the tests were somewhat inconsistent. Bars were between 4-5 no matter what I did (although I have experienced dropped calls even when I had 5 bars.) All tests were done in the left hand. Overall speeds are so bad because I live in NYC, although I'm currently in one of the boroughs with not so dense population, so it's a bit surprising that it's this bad, but that's AT&T for ya'!
Apple's competitors must be reading these posts with glee. It will be interesting to hear what Steve Jobs has to say tomorrow. The fix may be simple if it's software related. However, it looks more like a hardware problem. If so, the cost will be high...in recalls and lost sales. But there is a silver lining. Maybe this fiasco will force SJ to decide on expanding to other carriers even sooner. Can anyone smell a Verizon iPhone in the air?
I don't think you can until there is some formal report stating it as such. We can theorize that it's significant to all devices sold and hypothesize as to what the cause is and what the resolution will be, but to we cannot reasonably claim that it's a "design flaw" that affects everyone while standing on an anti-Apple soapbox without looking like crazy people on the street spouting Revelations and prophesying the end of the world.
While you're right that we can't be 100% sure until a formal report, we are also getting a good idea where this is going. Every tech site and iPhone-centric site except for Wired has reported a problem. There have been reports from Germany and England of people suffering the same issue. What's clear is that this is not just about a bad batch. A bad batch would probably only affect 1% of users and probably in a certain region. The problems too widespread. It is seeming much more likely that users who are not having problems are relatively close to a tower. If one finger alone can drop the signal it is indicative of a problem. That is not an issue with previous iPhones.
This does not help the fact that Apple is blaming the end user. I've been using Apple products since I was seven years old (now 33) when Apple computers didnt have mice and a floppy disk was really floppy. I've never seen this kind of statement come out of Apple or Jobs.
Ah yes, the TROLLS have come out for this one. Ignorant that any cell phone can have reception issues when held because the human body is CONDUCTIVE. My original iPhone fluctuated in signal strength, especially when the lower plastic portion was obstructed. My Moto Razr V3 did the same thing because the entire phone was metal.
Did you know you can take your keyless remote for your vehicle and press against your chin to improve signal strength? Try it.
I can confirm that the iPhone 4 has far better reception than the original iPhone. I work in a rural city outside Los Angeles. My original iPhone would get 1 bar on Edge, and many lost signals throughout the day. My iPhone 4 has 4-5 bars on 3G and never loses the signal.
The only time I can get the signal to drop is if I take my thumb and index finger and cover the two seams at the bottom edge of the phone. Of course no one would hold the phone that way. If you hold it normally around the middle, no signal loss. So when you hold the phone, don't block the seams. It is not that hard to figure out, but based on some comments, perhaps it is really hard for some of you.
Plus, I don't know of anyone that doesn't buy a case for their phone. I am considering the bumper because it will raise the phone off the desk to protect the rear glass and camera lens. Now I just need to find a belt clip case that can hold the phone with the bumper.
I just got my hands on one a few minutes ago. Girl in the office pre ordered one. I tested the antenna issue and here is my experience.
If I hold it normally with the left palm touching the area of concern it dropped from 5 bars to 4 after about 10-15 seconds. I was holding it gently not pressing hard into my palm. However if I pressed my thumb quite firmly across the seam it would drop the bars down to 2. I found that with normal use where you touch the sensitive location somewhat off and on during a call you should be ok, but if you are applying a lot of pressure as to make full skin contact for a sustained length of time you may affect the reception.
I think this is the important issue. First of all, completely wrapping your hands around the phone in the "death grip" hold, is completely artificial. I suspect any phone would have a problem if you did that with its antenna. What matters is actually how you hold the phone when using it, which obviously can vary with a smartphone, depending on what you are doing. So, a slight drop from a casual "shorting" of the antennae is probably not a big deal. If you have to actually firmly place a finger or thumb across the seam to cause it to drop out completely, again, an artificial situation, that probably isn't a big deal since it's not likely to happen in real world usage. I certainly don't see that happening during a call when you have the phone to your ear. It could be problematic if you are holding it in your hand to work with it, if that can cause enough contact with the base of your thumb to "short" it out.
I'm not an antenna expert by any means, but I'd guess the seam is located where it is because they wanted a certain length and/or shape to the antennae. It does seem to me to be something of a design problem to have the seam exactly where it is, but that may have been dictated by any number of other constraints. How big a problem that is depends on how much it affects real world use, not how it behaves in "death grips" or when deliberately making it happen by "shorting" the antennae across the seam. So, that you can make it lose signal isn't as important as whether you do make it lose signal when you are using it, as opposed to trying to make it lose signal.
The, "happens to some phones not others," thing could also just as easily be, "happens to some people not others," or, "happens in some locations and not others." There certainly don't seem to be adequate reports to determine which it is. But, so far, what we seem to have is that it can be made to happen, by some people on some phones at some locations, which is entirely too many variables to know what the exact nature of the problem is.
So, if people are going to post reports that, "it happens with my phone," or, "it doesn't happen with mine," it would be more useful if you describe: under what circumstances (real or artificial), whether you can reproduce it with other phones (iPhone 4 that is, if possible), if you can reproduce it with various other people (I would guess that each body could have a different effect, depending on any number of factors) doing what you did, if you can reproduce it at different locations, and other more exact details.
Right now, while I'm inclined to think there could be a problem, at least with some phones, or for some people, there's just way too much noise and way too little detail to judge how significant the issue is, or if it's significant at all
EDIT: I would also add two other points:
1. I think the response from Apple of, "don't hold it like that," was seriously bad PR.
2. I really think they need to be less passive on this issue, or it's really going to spin completely out of control for them. This isn't like other recent issues where they could just quietly address them on a case by case basis. I understand that companies don't like to make statements about issues like these as they are unfolding, but silence in this case, in their highest profile launch in years, is not going to help them.
That was so wrong. I emailed Thomas and told him how sleazy it was for him to be getting so much praise in the comments for something he ripped off by not attributing it to you!
I don't mind. I didn't do it for attention. I did it to point it out is all. But yeah, he could have said he found the image somewhere at least.
This does not help the fact that Apple is blaming the end user. I've been using Apple products since I was seven years old (now 33) and I've never seen this kind of statement come out of Apple or Jobs.
Apparently you missed the report when people claimed the inline remote was defective for the 2nd Gen iPod. People were not properly inserting the headphone cord and blaming Apple for a defective product. Apple released a knowledge base article explaining how to properly insert a headphone cord. What a concept. People were not fully inserting the cable and blaming Apple for it. Once they learned how to fully insert the cable, the remote worked. In the case of the iPhone 4, learn how to hold the iPhone and don't block the seams at the bottom, or buy a case if you are incapable of doing so. I am guessing most of the people commenting don't even have the phone in the first place.
Comments
http://www.engadget.com/2010/06/25/h...ding-it-wrong/
You must be new here.
Hang out a while. You'll learn from the others here that Apple's designs are infallible. Any issue that appears to be a result of an Apple design is merely a user error.
Yep.
And the hockey puck mouse was just misunderstood.
And the Wallstreet PBs never had any hinge problems.
And there was no NVidia replacement needed.
And no one's ever seen a bulging battery.
And....
I think that room must be given for all to express an opinion. Sometimes they are right, sometimes it is apple.
I do buy his explanation about internal antenna placement and attenuation when occluded. He alludes that every phone suffers what the iPhone 4 does which is false.
Except that halfway through his article he starts to change his tune, he even says that it was a design decision by Apple and could not be fixed, which is a nice way of saying it has a design flaw. Yes it is a design flaw because they chose a thinner enclose that forbade an internal (non touchable) antenna.
So after equating other phones that lose a few bars when their antennas are occluded to the iPhone which goes out of service if simply touched in the wrong spot he goes on to link to a youtube video. This video shows an iPhone losing service by placing the iPhone 4 on it's side and laying a key across the antenna gap. That is plain bs, where is a SINGLE video of ANY OTHER PHONE completely going from full strength to no signal by laying a key on it. All it takes is one, just one and then he can say that all phones are affected this way.
So yes I do buy his explanation of antenna attenuation by hand occlusion in all phones, but I flatly refuse to believe that all phone are affected the way the iPhone 4 is by holding it, touching it or laying a key on it.
Yeah that made me wonder about his motivations in the whole thing. First he tries to muddy the water by saying all phones do that, then he claims he is going to buy one.
I did pre-order my iPhone 4, received it Wednesday, returned it to the Apple Store in Greensboro, NC this morning just waiting now on AT&T to cancel my contract upgrade. If I didn't have hundreds invested in iOS software then I would switch to a different platform.
Well he didn't say that laying a key on it would affect all phones. He explained that ALL phones now have the antenna at the bottom. He explains why. He explains the reason the iPhone would loose signal by moving the antenna from the bottom to the sides. He explains if you cover the bands on the sides, you can block the signal.
He never said all phones do that. He said all phones have the antenna at the bottom. Please read it carefully and show me where he says all phones do that. You are reading things into his article that aren't there. He does blame Apple for the design, but also implicates AT&T and the FCC as well.
Don't I wish. All I know is that the bars drop on the call today, day before they didn't, with the 3Gs.
You do realize a single incident of a dropped call under uncontrolled conditions constitutes anecdotal evidence and that this is the most unreliable of all evidence, yes?
I was so confused about this issue till Mr. Jobs told me what to think.
hold different
classic funny
Engagdet are using my screenshot compilation.
http://www.engadget.com/2010/06/25/h...ding-it-wrong/
I expect more sites to start using it.
~Callum
Engagdet are using my screenshot compilation.
http://www.engadget.com/2010/06/25/h...ding-it-wrong/
That was so wrong. I emailed Thomas and told him how sleazy it was for him to be getting so much praise in the comments for something he ripped off by not attributing it to you!
Out of case held normally: 134/30
Out of case squeezed tight 0/24
In case held normally 56/51
In case squeezed tight 0/31
In case held normally 84/55
Waited a few minutes:
In case held normally: 52/34
In case squeezed tight: 137/27
Out of case held normally: 81/41
Out of case squeezed tight: 398/18
Mozilla/5.0 (iPhone; U; CPU iPhone OS 4_0 like Mac OS X; en-us) AppleWebKit/532.9 (KHTML, like Gecko) Version/4.0.5 Mobile/8A293 Safari/6531.22.7
So if you are trying to target the larger pixel screen you will have to do differently by getting the Javascript window.screen object.
I don't think you can until there is some formal report stating it as such. We can theorize that it's significant to all devices sold and hypothesize as to what the cause is and what the resolution will be, but to we cannot reasonably claim that it's a "design flaw" that affects everyone while standing on an anti-Apple soapbox without looking like crazy people on the street spouting Revelations and prophesying the end of the world.
While you're right that we can't be 100% sure until a formal report, we are also getting a good idea where this is going. Every tech site and iPhone-centric site except for Wired has reported a problem. There have been reports from Germany and England of people suffering the same issue. What's clear is that this is not just about a bad batch. A bad batch would probably only affect 1% of users and probably in a certain region. The problems too widespread. It is seeming much more likely that users who are not having problems are relatively close to a tower. If one finger alone can drop the signal it is indicative of a problem. That is not an issue with previous iPhones.
This does not help the fact that Apple is blaming the end user. I've been using Apple products since I was seven years old (now 33) when Apple computers didnt have mice and a floppy disk was really floppy. I've never seen this kind of statement come out of Apple or Jobs.
A bit off subject but for those of you who care about user agent strings, there is no difference between iPhone 4 and iPhone 3Gs with the latest iOS.
Mozilla/5.0 (iPhone; U; CPU iPhone OS 4_0 like Mac OS X; en-us) AppleWebKit/532.9 (KHTML, like Gecko) Version/4.0.5 Mobile/8A293 Safari/6531.22.7
So if you are trying to target the larger pixel screen you will have to do differently by getting the Javascript window.screen object.
You should use probably use CSS media queries...
Did you know you can take your keyless remote for your vehicle and press against your chin to improve signal strength? Try it.
I can confirm that the iPhone 4 has far better reception than the original iPhone. I work in a rural city outside Los Angeles. My original iPhone would get 1 bar on Edge, and many lost signals throughout the day. My iPhone 4 has 4-5 bars on 3G and never loses the signal.
The only time I can get the signal to drop is if I take my thumb and index finger and cover the two seams at the bottom edge of the phone. Of course no one would hold the phone that way. If you hold it normally around the middle, no signal loss. So when you hold the phone, don't block the seams. It is not that hard to figure out, but based on some comments, perhaps it is really hard for some of you.
Plus, I don't know of anyone that doesn't buy a case for their phone. I am considering the bumper because it will raise the phone off the desk to protect the rear glass and camera lens. Now I just need to find a belt clip case that can hold the phone with the bumper.
I expect more sites to start using it.
It's on the front page of reddit, digg, all those news sites now. I only posted the images to AI.
I just got my hands on one a few minutes ago. Girl in the office pre ordered one. I tested the antenna issue and here is my experience.
If I hold it normally with the left palm touching the area of concern it dropped from 5 bars to 4 after about 10-15 seconds. I was holding it gently not pressing hard into my palm. However if I pressed my thumb quite firmly across the seam it would drop the bars down to 2. I found that with normal use where you touch the sensitive location somewhat off and on during a call you should be ok, but if you are applying a lot of pressure as to make full skin contact for a sustained length of time you may affect the reception.
I think this is the important issue. First of all, completely wrapping your hands around the phone in the "death grip" hold, is completely artificial. I suspect any phone would have a problem if you did that with its antenna. What matters is actually how you hold the phone when using it, which obviously can vary with a smartphone, depending on what you are doing. So, a slight drop from a casual "shorting" of the antennae is probably not a big deal. If you have to actually firmly place a finger or thumb across the seam to cause it to drop out completely, again, an artificial situation, that probably isn't a big deal since it's not likely to happen in real world usage. I certainly don't see that happening during a call when you have the phone to your ear. It could be problematic if you are holding it in your hand to work with it, if that can cause enough contact with the base of your thumb to "short" it out.
I'm not an antenna expert by any means, but I'd guess the seam is located where it is because they wanted a certain length and/or shape to the antennae. It does seem to me to be something of a design problem to have the seam exactly where it is, but that may have been dictated by any number of other constraints. How big a problem that is depends on how much it affects real world use, not how it behaves in "death grips" or when deliberately making it happen by "shorting" the antennae across the seam. So, that you can make it lose signal isn't as important as whether you do make it lose signal when you are using it, as opposed to trying to make it lose signal.
The, "happens to some phones not others," thing could also just as easily be, "happens to some people not others," or, "happens in some locations and not others." There certainly don't seem to be adequate reports to determine which it is. But, so far, what we seem to have is that it can be made to happen, by some people on some phones at some locations, which is entirely too many variables to know what the exact nature of the problem is.
So, if people are going to post reports that, "it happens with my phone," or, "it doesn't happen with mine," it would be more useful if you describe: under what circumstances (real or artificial), whether you can reproduce it with other phones (iPhone 4 that is, if possible), if you can reproduce it with various other people (I would guess that each body could have a different effect, depending on any number of factors) doing what you did, if you can reproduce it at different locations, and other more exact details.
Right now, while I'm inclined to think there could be a problem, at least with some phones, or for some people, there's just way too much noise and way too little detail to judge how significant the issue is, or if it's significant at all
EDIT: I would also add two other points:
1. I think the response from Apple of, "don't hold it like that," was seriously bad PR.
2. I really think they need to be less passive on this issue, or it's really going to spin completely out of control for them. This isn't like other recent issues where they could just quietly address them on a case by case basis. I understand that companies don't like to make statements about issues like these as they are unfolding, but silence in this case, in their highest profile launch in years, is not going to help them.
That was so wrong. I emailed Thomas and told him how sleazy it was for him to be getting so much praise in the comments for something he ripped off by not attributing it to you!
I don't mind. I didn't do it for attention. I did it to point it out is all. But yeah, he could have said he found the image somewhere at least.
This does not help the fact that Apple is blaming the end user. I've been using Apple products since I was seven years old (now 33) and I've never seen this kind of statement come out of Apple or Jobs.
Apparently you missed the report when people claimed the inline remote was defective for the 2nd Gen iPod. People were not properly inserting the headphone cord and blaming Apple for a defective product. Apple released a knowledge base article explaining how to properly insert a headphone cord. What a concept. People were not fully inserting the cable and blaming Apple for it. Once they learned how to fully insert the cable, the remote worked. In the case of the iPhone 4, learn how to hold the iPhone and don't block the seams at the bottom, or buy a case if you are incapable of doing so. I am guessing most of the people commenting don't even have the phone in the first place.