Apple sues "inferior quality" iPod, iPhone and iPad accessory makers

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Comments

  • Reply 21 of 95
    chris_cachris_ca Posts: 2,543member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Wiggin View Post


    These aren't suppliers. They are accessory makers. This would be like Dell going after someone who made a shoddy mouse pad. Apple really has no business going after these companies unless they are claiming "made for iPod" as some have suggested, but aren't official members of Apple's "Made for iPod" branding/marketing scheme.



    Still can't find the court filings but here is a bit more info -> Apple Sues Companies Over Knockoff IPod, IPad Gear

    "In the complaint, Cupertino, California-based Apple said the unauthorized products are infringing as many as 10 patents and violating its trademarks.



    ?They are trying to control all aspects of their devices,? said Mark Kesslen, chairman of the intellectual property group at Lowenstein Sandler PC, a law firm in New York. ?They are using the various licensing agreements, partner agreements and brand management to make sure that it stays within their high standard.?



    Implied Endorsement



    Kesslen, who has represented clients seeking licensing agreements with Apple, said it?s trying to prevent unauthorized products from being marketed as endorsed by the company because these sales could harm its brand."
  • Reply 22 of 95
    crankycranky Posts: 163member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by a_greer View Post


    Dear Apple, please stop damaging your own goddamn reputation and FIX THE FUCKING PROXIMITY SENSOR ALREADY!

    </rant>



    <cogent thought>

    Good, There is nothing worse than seeing people like my mom who doesnt know or care about apple's licensed accessory program get a crappy experiance with cheap ass accessories



    Real people dont know or care about licensed accessory makers like Belkin or Griffin, they care about Apple, and iPod/iPad/iPhone brand and if a package says compatible with iphone, and it is 50% cheaper than the apple certified accessory, then people buy it. Apple should have started doing this in the early ipod days.



    This is exactly why the AppleInsider posting guidelines advise that you not post while angry. You usually end up sounding less than intelligent.
  • Reply 23 of 95
    anakin1992anakin1992 Posts: 283member
    i have an apple brand bumper for iphone 4 for about a month and now there are some black marks spreading around the antenna band. no ideas on how it could get into it. no water or other chemical ever get close to it.
  • Reply 24 of 95
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Sofabutt View Post


    I don't mind paying $15 for a charging cable for my Macbook when Apple's version lasts 1 year and their replacement offer is $80 bucks.



    This is true. With the new white MacBooks, Apple fixed a fatal flaw in the design of the Magsafe adapter that caused the adapters on frequently moved laptops to fray near the connector, leading to a possibly dangerous short-circuit, and rendering the adapter unusable. I have no idea whatsoever why Apple hasn't made the new design available for the MacBook Pro, except that they want to sell more overpriced adapters to replace broken ones.



    *EDIT It seems Apple is finally shipping the redesigned Magsafe adapters with the latest MacBook Pro revision. The new design is also shown on the Apple online store website. I'm not sure if local resellers have the new adapters yet. Last time I checked they didn't.



    It also appears as though you can ask for a replacement Magsafe through Apple service, even if yours is out of warranty. I'll try this with my White MacBook adapter, perhaps next week.
  • Reply 25 of 95
    brucepbrucep Posts: 2,823member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Sofabutt View Post


    I'd gladly play a little with my money to find an alternative to Apple's overpriced cables and accesories. I don't mind paying $3 for a cable that works with only two of my three battery back-ups for my iPhoe instead of an Apple approved $30 accesory. I don't mind paying $15 for a charging cable for my Macbook when Apple's version lasts 1 year and their replacement offer is $80 bucks.



    Apple is not looking out for its consumers, it's looking out for its own interests and the interests of it's stockholders.



    Monoprice dot com is kicking Apple's butt in prices and accesories. It has saved me about $100 bucks so far.



    yes and no

    sutpid is as stupid does

    you RISK !!!!!>>>> thousands of $ worth of equipment with faulty market rejected bargain basement chinese made junk . goofy luck dude ..

    and i saved 100 bucks !!!! he yuk

    just fooling dude

    ok all fooling aside

    so sites like owc won't hurt you

    so be careful when buying cheap 3rd part stuff

    and my fire wire plugs all still charge all my pods



    i have so many of them

    there all white







    drops glass and runs out of room
  • Reply 26 of 95
    quadra 610quadra 610 Posts: 6,745member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by a_greer View Post


    Dear Apple, please stop damaging your own goddamn reputation



    Stop? When did they START?



    What are you talking about?
  • Reply 27 of 95
    jragostajragosta Posts: 10,473member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by anantksundaram View Post


    Do you think this may have something to do with Apple's customers having complained about these products? And the fact that they have not sued all accessory makers?



    If it was anti-consumer, Apple should have gone after lots of them, not just the 'inferior' ones, no?



    Actually, there's no evidence that Apple has gone after only some. Apple regularly goes after companies that do not have licenses to produce products involving proprietary Apple technology. This is only the latest group.



    The affected products allegedly violate Apple patents. For example, Apple has a patent on MagSafe. No one can make a MagSafe product without a license.



    Other ones are a duplicate of Apple products and are being sold in misleading ways. I fell for this myself at one point - I bought a power adapter for my MBP on eBay (I wanted an extra one for when I travel). It was advertised as an Apple MBP power supply, but turned out to be a cheap fake.



    Apple has every right to defend their patents and brand. In the end, that is PRO-consumer (at least, if you believe in capitalism where people should be able to benefit from their inventions).



    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Wiggin View Post


    These aren't suppliers. They are accessory makers. This would be like Dell going after someone who made a shoddy mouse pad.



    Nonsense. More like Dell going after someone for selling "Dell replacement power supplies for Latitude computers" which violate Dell's patents. Please learn the facts before posting nonsense.
  • Reply 28 of 95
    mazda 3smazda 3s Posts: 1,578member
    To tell you the truth, I think that Apple waited too damn long to do anything about this. Third-party manufacturers have been around for Apple products for YEARS. I NEVER buy Apple-branded accessories because they are always outrageously priced.



    Over the years, I've had:



    5G iPod 30GB

    5.5 iPod 60GB

    1G iPod touch 32GB

    2G iPod touch 32GB

    iPhone 3GS

    iPhone 4

    13" MacBook Pro



    For every single one of them, I've used third party accessories. I have a sh!tload of USB sync cables laying around that I got for roughly a dollar a piece (from companies like Itrimming, Everyday Source, etc.) compared to $19 for an Apple USB sync cable. Who the hell pays $19 for a USB cable? Who does Apple think they are, Monster Cable? Making a USB cable is not rocket science.



    So I've got 6' USB sync cables next to my nightstand for charging/operating my iPhone in bed and my wife has a 6' USB cable on her side of the bed as well for her iPhone. I've got one at my desk in my study, one downstairs on the island in the kitchen where I work a lot of the times, and a USB wall charger in every piece of luggage that I carry. Then my wife and I each have one third-party USB charger in our cars.



    If I had purchased these cables from Apple, I would have been charged an arm and a leg.



    Same goes for my MagSafe adapters for my MacBook Pro. I'll be damned if I'm gonna pay Apple $80 per MagSafe adapter. My original factory charger is upstairs at my desk, but I have two third-party chargers that I bought from eBay (one by my nightstand and one at the kitchen island) for $18 a piece with free shipping.



    I'm sorry, but there wouldn't be a market for these accessories if Apple wasn't gouging the hell out of us on pricing for their stuff.



    Oh and BTW, all of my third-party accessories still work -- even the ones that I bought for my original 5G iPod.
  • Reply 29 of 95
    jragostajragosta Posts: 10,473member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Mazda 3s View Post


    To tell you the truth, I think that Apple waited too damn long to do anything about this. Third-party manufacturers have been around for Apple products for YEARS. I NEVER buy Apple-branded accessories because they are always outrageously priced.



    What does that have to do with anything?



    There are two issues:



    1. If the third parties do not have permission to use patented or trademarked technology, then they are stealing. It's no wonder they're cheap - they're not paying for what they're using. If, OTOH, they are licensed, then you're free to buy from them if you wish.



    2. There's really no such thing as 'outrageously priced'. The seller sets a price. You decide to buy or not to buy. If the price is too high, you don't buy - and the seller either has to find another buyer or lower the price. It's really quite simple. No one is making you buy. If you can find another legally produced product of equal quality for less, go ahead and buy it. Whining about prices is just silly.
  • Reply 30 of 95
    mazda 3smazda 3s Posts: 1,578member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by jragosta View Post


    What does that have to do with anything?



    There are two issues:



    1. If the third parties do not have permission to use patented or trademarked technology, then they are stealing. It's no wonder they're cheap - they're not paying for what they're using. If, OTOH, they are licensed, then you're free to buy from them if you wish.



    2. There's really no such thing as 'outrageously priced'. The seller sets a price. You decide to buy or not to buy. If the price is too high, you don't buy - and the seller either has to find another buyer or lower the price. It's really quite simple. No one is making you buy. If you can find another legally produced product of equal quality for less, go ahead and buy it. Whining about prices is just silly.



    1) That's Apple's problem, not the customer's problem. The customer is free to buy whatever they want that's freely available on the market. My point was, since Apple has waited so damn long to do anything about it, they've let the "monster" grow to the point where it's kind of hard to topple it now (third-parties selling cheap accessories). Until eBay starts cracking down on Accstation, Everyday Source, etc, your average eBay customer looking for cheap iPhone accessories wouldn't know the difference between whether it was "illegal" or legal. The only people that even follow those kinds of legal dustups are diehards like us.



    2) You're right, I've decided not to buy their high-priced accessories (as I stated in my post with examples). Let me ask you, do you pay $20 for a USB printer cable from Staples or Best Buy? Do you buy $30 HDMI cables from Best Buy? Hell no, you go to Monoprice to get the cheap stuff that works. Only the ill-informed would be gullible enough to pay that much for a simple cable.



    The bottom line is, eBay is the great equalizer when it comes to electronics accessories. The sheer size of the market shows how willing people are to bypass the OEM to find cheaper alternatives. And they SHOULD be cheap -- it's not like it takes a lot to put them together or much thought to produce them.
  • Reply 31 of 95
    dr millmossdr millmoss Posts: 5,403member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Mazda 3s View Post


    1) That's Apple's problem, not the customer's problem. The customer is free to buy whatever they want that's freely available on the market. My point was, since Apple has waited so damn long to do anything about it, they've let the "monster" grow to the point where it's kind of hard to topple it now (third-parties selling cheap accessories). Until eBay starts cracking down on Accstation, Everyday Source, etc, your average eBay customer looking for cheap iPhone accessories wouldn't know the difference between whether it was "illegal" or legal. The only people that even follow those kinds of legal dustups are diehards like us.



    You can't assume that Apple has never gone after unauthorized accessory makers before, simply because you're only reading about this now on AI. Yes, the customer can buy whatever they like, but a manufacturer can't claim compatibility and use the "made for" label when they have no license, and especially if it's not true.
  • Reply 32 of 95
    robin huberrobin huber Posts: 3,297member
    A few weeks back someone posted a very witty and well crafted sarcastic essay that said basically that we don't need trolls to criticize Apple for its shortcomings because Apple fanboys are the most vicious critics of all. I wanted to compliment the author and perhaps even submit the piece for the annual Bulwer-Lytton award. Does anyone remember this or claim it?
  • Reply 33 of 95
    jragostajragosta Posts: 10,473member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Mazda 3s View Post


    1) That's Apple's problem, not the customer's problem. The customer is free to buy whatever they want that's freely available on the market. My point was, since Apple has waited so damn long to do anything about it, they've let the "monster" grow to the point where it's kind of hard to topple it now (third-parties selling cheap accessories). Until eBay starts cracking down on Accstation, Everyday Source, etc, your average eBay customer looking for cheap iPhone accessories wouldn't know the difference between whether it was "illegal" or legal. The only people that even follow those kinds of legal dustups are diehards like us.



    2) You're right, I've decided not to buy their high-priced accessories (as I stated in my post with examples). Let me ask you, do you pay $20 for a USB printer cable from Staples or Best Buy? Do you buy $30 HDMI cables from Best Buy? Hell no, you go to Monoprice to get the cheap stuff that works. Only the ill-informed would be gullible enough to pay that much for a simple cable.



    The bottom line is, eBay is the great equalizer when it comes to electronics accessories. The sheer size of the market shows how willing people are to bypass the OEM to find cheaper alternatives. And they SHOULD be cheap -- it's not like it takes a lot to put them together or much thought to produce them.



    1. Apple has every right to go after companies that infringe their patents or cause trademark confusion. Why do you think it's fair for companies to be able to steal IP just so you can get a cheaper product?



    2. You don't have any idea what I'd choose. If it's a proprietary product, I most often buy name brand products. I don't buy Monster Cables because there's no value, but (as one example) when my daughter needed a new cell phone charger, I bought a Motorola charger for her Motorola phone - because I had 2 generic chargers fail and I don't want to spend all my time chasing down inferior goods. I generally buy Apple chargers. Sure, I can buy a cheapo charger for half the price, but when a large number of them have to be returned, it's false economy in some cases.



    eBay is a great system - I buy and sell a lot on eBay. But you're actually pointing out one of its major deficiencies. It's too easy to sell goods on eBay which the seller has no right to sell - either stolen outright or involving infringed patents, violated trademarks, etc. The goods are cheap both because they're crappy quality (such as the two failed cell phone chargers I received from one vendor) or because they're stealing someone else's design and innovations. Sorry, but i don't support that.
  • Reply 34 of 95
    Many of the comments here are downright silly. The issue of quality of 3rd-party accessories is only a smokescreen. In reality it has nothing to do with the legal action, and if this is brought up in court, all the lawyers and the judge will yawn or check their text messages while this is going on, because they all know that they all know that this is just to make it seem to the public like this isn't what it really is.



    This is only about Apple's intellectual property and copyrights.



    Apple has the legal right to demand royalty payments from anyone making a product that uses Apple's proprietary dock connector. I do not know whether they have the legal right to say who is and who is not permitted to make such products, but certainly at least they have the right to collect royalties from companies who do. These rights extend to proprietary protocols running over non-proprietary physical-layer interfaces. The notable exception, which does not truly apply to non-proprietary physical interfaces, is when the licensing terms of the physical interface prohibit the collection of royalties in connection with proprietary protocols running over that physical connection.



    So Apple has the right to go after anyone who is making dock connector stuff and not paying up. They also have the right to go after anyone who is using an Apple trademark, e.g., "Made for iPod", without Apple's permission.



    All this can possibly be about is companies making dock connector stuff, or using the trademark, without permission.



    No matter how much anyone might dislike paying the premium for cables and chargers and whatnot, this is a part of the total Apple experience. If you don't like their practices, you have the right to let them know, by not buying their stuff. If you like their stuff, then this is the price you pay.



    The minute that you decided to buy a product with a proprietary physical connector, you implicitly agreed to pay Apple every time you bought anything that would connect via that proprietary physical connector. Most other companies put a USB port on their devices even when the device has other connectors, and they design the device so that it can be charged through the USB connector. Apple chose not to do that. It would be ludicrous to suggest that when they made this decision that they were not fully aware that, by requiring that the device be charged through the proprietary connector, they would receive significant additional revenue.



    Apple is in business for the same reason that any other company is in business: to make profit. And like every other company, they aggressively pursue legal strategies for maximizing profit. They are exceedingly good at this. The key to making it all work is to make stuff that people want more than they want other people's stuff. But don't ever be so dishonest as to pretend that when you first saw the word "proprietary" together with the words "dock connector" than you did not fully understand what this meant, or that you did not implicitly agree to what it meant when you decided to make the purchase.
  • Reply 35 of 95
    mazda 3smazda 3s Posts: 1,578member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by jragosta View Post


    1. Apple has every right to go after companies that infringe their patents or cause trademark confusion. Why do you think it's fair for companies to be able to steal IP just so you can get a cheaper product?



    2. You don't have any idea what I'd choose. If it's a proprietary product, I most often buy name brand products. I don't buy Monster Cables because there's no value, but (as one example) when my daughter needed a new cell phone charger, I bought a Motorola charger for her Motorola phone - because I had 2 generic chargers fail and I don't want to spend all my time chasing down inferior goods. I generally buy Apple chargers. Sure, I can buy a cheapo charger for half the price, but when a large number of them have to be returned, it's false economy in some cases.



    eBay is a great system - I buy and sell a lot on eBay. But you're actually pointing out one of its major deficiencies. It's too easy to sell goods on eBay which the seller has no right to sell - either stolen outright or involving infringed patents, violated trademarks, etc. The goods are cheap both because they're crappy quality (such as the two failed cell phone chargers I received from one vendor) or because they're stealing someone else's design and innovations. Sorry, but i don't support that.



    1) I agree completely with you. Apple has every right to go after them. I'm just saying that the market has grown to gargantuan levels, especially now that everything is coming out of China anyway.



    2) If you want to purchase Apple chargers at full retail, that's well within your rights. I just personally have a problem with paying Apple $19 for a simple USB sync cable. There's nothing special about it at all. You can get them for $1.00 or less (if you watch Slickdeals.net).



    Same goes for a USB wall charger -- it cost $30 from Apple plus the $19 for the plain USB sync cable. $50 for a wall charger for a $200 phone.



    THIS is why the market exists.



    As for quality, I only get chargers from eBay sellers I trust -- namely the ones labeled in the suit (Accstation, Eforcity Corporation, Everydaysource, Itrimming) and I have never once had a problem with quality. And even if I did, it's just a dollar or two.
  • Reply 36 of 95
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Mazda 3s View Post


    1) That's Apple's problem, not the customer's problem. The customer is free to buy whatever they want that's freely available on the market. My point was, since Apple has waited so damn long to do anything about it, they've let the "monster" grow to the point where it's kind of hard to topple it now (third-parties selling cheap accessories). Until eBay starts cracking down on Accstation, Everyday Source, etc, your average eBay customer looking for cheap iPhone accessories wouldn't know the difference between whether it was "illegal" or legal. The only people that even follow those kinds of legal dustups are diehards like us.



    2) You're right, I've decided not to buy their high-priced accessories (as I stated in my post with examples). Let me ask you, do you pay $20 for a USB printer cable from Staples or Best Buy? Do you buy $30 HDMI cables from Best Buy? Hell no, you go to Monoprice to get the cheap stuff that works. Only the ill-informed would be gullible enough to pay that much for a simple cable.



    The bottom line is, eBay is the great equalizer when it comes to electronics accessories. The sheer size of the market shows how willing people are to bypass the OEM to find cheaper alternatives. And they SHOULD be cheap -- it's not like it takes a lot to put them together or much thought to produce them.



    Except, when your Apple device breaks as a result of inferior quality accessories, people like you will be the first in line wailing to Apple about having to fix it, e.g., through Applecare, Genius Bars, returns, complaining loudly in forums like this, etc.



    That, in turn, ends up imposing a long-run cost on the rest of us, thus, it also becomes the customers' problem.
  • Reply 37 of 95
    zoetmbzoetmb Posts: 2,490member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Chris_CA View Post


    Actually, it seems as if it's third party vendors only if they using Made for iPod without Apple's permission.



    That would make sense, however, in that case it's not about going after inferior quality - it's about going after companies who violate Apple's trademarks.



    And if they're going after licensed vendors who make inferior products, that would be okay.



    But if they're going after non-licensed vendors who don't use "Made for iPod" on the packaging, then I think they're over-reaching.



    After all, Sony doesn't sue the Joe Blow cable company if they make an inferior RCA audio cable or mini-to-mini stereo phone jack. It's buyer beware.



    And I do agree with those who feel that Apple vastly overcharges for their cables, although so does Belkin, Monster and other suppliers.



    And whatever happened to the "universal charger" and standard connections that was being pushed by the EU and that Apple promised to support? I realize the final implementation date is not until January 2012, but you would think that the more advanced companies would implement in advance of that date.



    Quote:

    17 February 2009, Barcelona, Spain



    The GSMA and 17 leading mobile operators and manufacturers today announced that they are committed to implementing a cross-industry standard for a universal charger for new mobile phones. The aim of the initiative, led by the GSMA, is to ensure that the mobile industry adopts a common format for mobile phone charger connections and energy-efficient chargers resulting in an estimated 50 per cent reduction in standby energy consumption, the potential elimination of up to 51,000 tonnes of duplicate chargers1 and the enhancement of the customer experience by simplifying the charging of mobile phones.



    The group has set an ambitious target that by 2012 a universal charging solution (UCS) will be widely available in the market worldwide and will use Micro-USB as the common universal charging interface. The group agreed that by the 1st January 2012, the majority of all new mobile phone models available will support a universal charging connector and the majority of chargers shipped will meet the high efficiency targets set out by the OMTP (Open Mobile Terminal Platform), the industry body who developed the technical requirements behind UCS.



    The question is how will Apple handle this. My guess is that they simply change the USB jack on their chargers to a micro-USB and they don't change the Apple dock on their devices, which kind of misses the point. That would enable another phone to use the Apple charger, but it wouldn't enable another charger to charge an Apple phone without having to buy a micro-USB to Apple dock connector.
  • Reply 38 of 95
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Mazda 3s View Post


    1)..... I have never once had a problem with quality. And even if I did, it's just a dollar or two.



    Look up the word 'externality' (the negative kind).
  • Reply 39 of 95
    brucepbrucep Posts: 2,823member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Mazda 3s View Post


    To tell you the truth, I think that Apple waited too damn long to do anything about this. Third-party manufacturers have been around for Apple products for YEARS. I NEVER buy Apple-branded accessories because they are always outrageously priced.



    Over the years, I've had:



    5G iPod 30GB

    5.5 iPod 60GB

    1G iPod touch 32GB

    2G iPod touch 32GB

    iPhone 3GS

    iPhone 4

    13" MacBook Pro



    For every single one of them, I've used third party accessories. I have a sh!tload of USB sync cables laying around that I got for roughly a dollar a piece (from companies like Itrimming, Everyday Source, etc.) compared to $19 for an Apple USB sync cable. Who the hell pays $19 for a USB cable? Who does Apple think they are, Monster Cable? Making a USB cable is not rocket science.



    So I've got 6' USB sync cables next to my nightstand for charging/operating my iPhone in bed and my wife has a 6' USB cable on her side of the bed as well for her iPhone. I've got one at my desk in my study, one downstairs on the island in the kitchen where I work a lot of the times, and a USB wall charger in every piece of luggage that I carry. Then my wife and I each have one third-party USB charger in our cars.



    If I had purchased these cables from Apple, I would have been charged an arm and a leg.

    .



    smart guy except apple runs its MBP chargers at 85 watts .

    SO why risk it all over 20 bucks ..



    careful dude



    really from the heart



    peace





    9
  • Reply 40 of 95
    lowededwookielowededwookie Posts: 1,000member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Mazda 3s View Post


    I just personally have a problem with paying Apple $19 for a simple USB sync cable. There's nothing special about it at all.



    Umm actually there is because Apple invented the Dock Connector and the Dock Connector port. It is not a simple USB charging cable because there are all sorts of things to take into account. For example pin layouts according to the type of device is being hooked up to.



    For example I have the Apple media cable which has USB and RCAs to allow me to hook up to my TV. There has to be pin layouts to compensate for the USB as well as the video signals. These are not standard USB. Only 4 pins of the 30 are for USB.



    Apple has changed the Dock Connector at least once before when they moved the power to different pins to compensate for HD video being sent out the Dock Connector. Therefore the cheap cables aren't necessarily going to work. I have a Belkin cigarette lighter adapter for my car that won't work on my iPhone because it was designed for the old Classic iPods.



    I prefer to buy Apple products because I know for 100% certainty that they will work and be guaranteed to work with my Apple products. To me that is worth far more than saving a few dollars on a cheap product. Now if it's something that I need that Apple doesn't make (cigarette adapter for car for example) I will buy third party but only the brands I know and trust which are generally not that much cheaper than Apple.



    You want to cheap out then all you'll get are cheap products and that's fine if you don't mind that but quality costs.



    But I agree with the posters saying Apple is only going after those using the "Made For iPod" labels when they are not part of the program. Essentially they would had to have reverse engineered the Dock Connector to get pin layouts and that means you have no guarantee that they got it right. This will ALWAYS come back on Apple not the product manufacturer so Apple has to go after these cowboys just to distance themselves.
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