Agree, they can't be physically bundled, but what about from a licensing standpoint?
I'd be surprised if that is allowed either. It would be like Microsoft saying if you buy Windows, you have to buy a copy of Office as well, and I'm not sure that's legal (though I don't know for sure).
See my comments above - I don't think that is technically possible (at least, not without being fantastically expensive).
if not the same silicon then what about the same circuit board? they will sell you the board, Atom CPU and the communications chips on one board with one low bundled price.
Intel had their shot. They used to produce ARM processors under the XScale brand. Then they divested that business and now they are disappointed that smartphone vendors left & right are choosing low power ARM over Atom? It's called spilled milk.
IF they do that it would be one hell of a technical achievement. The RF portion of such a device creates a hell of a lot of electrical noise, which a digital processor just can't cope with, so trying to put them together in the same package (let alone the same piece of semiconductor material), is incredibly hard to achieve.
I don't know for sure about Infineon, but most RF devices are made using Gallium Arsenide as the base material. Processors and the like use silicon. Whilst you can make a processor on GaAs, it's not nearly as cost effective as using silicon, since GaAs is more expensive to buy in the first place, and is much more difficult to manufacture on.
Stokes, over at ars thinks Intel might be planning to do RF processing (and the rest of the baseband processing) on the same application processing chip.
if not the same silicon then what about the same circuit board? they will sell you the board, Atom CPU and the communications chips on one board with one low bundled price.
They could do that, the only problem is, in the mobile space (where obviously this is all intended for), size and flexibility is key. If Intel sold this PCB with two chips side by side, you can guarantee it wouldn't package into a lot of peoples phones. If you look at a PCB from an Apple teardown, things are not nearly as uniformly laid out as they used to be, and the lack of flexibility would hurt this a lot.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tulkas
Stokes, over at ars thinks Intel might be planning to do RF processing (and the rest of the baseband processing) on the same application processing chip.
Many thanks for the link, it's an interesting article.
I'm agree that I'm sure they will be planning to try and do RF processing and application processing on the same chip, but I still maintain for them to do it will be a hell of a technical achievement. Getting the RF portion to perform well on silicon would be a hell of a battle, and making an application processor on GaAs would be expensive.
I think GaAs is only available in upto 6" wafers, so the cost per die is way higher than the same die on a 12" wafer which is any advanced silicon fab.
Good luck to them though. If they can achieve it, it will have benefits in cost, packaging size and power consumption, and if anyone can overcome the technical hurdles it will be Intel. Say what you like about the x86 architecture, they are tremendous at manufacturing, have a lot of clever people and possibly most importantly when trying to overcome technical hurdles like this, they have a lot of money!
I think I have a different take as it relates to Apple. Maybe Apple is dumping Infineon, which gives them an incentive to get acquired. Do Qualcom and Infineon compete in that particular space?
Or perhaps Apple believes that it can dump Infineon if needed... I can't believe that Apple would allow an important supplier to fall into the hands of a company that is a quasi-competitor without having a back-up plan.
Apple always stays close to its core values. Could you imagine it buying Infineon? Sure it uses the chips but that's probably a hefty section to manage full of contracts with other companies. Apple usually cuts off everything when it acquires. Probably not so easy to do with Infineon.
Comments
Agree, they can't be physically bundled, but what about from a licensing standpoint?
I'd be surprised if that is allowed either. It would be like Microsoft saying if you buy Windows, you have to buy a copy of Office as well, and I'm not sure that's legal (though I don't know for sure).
See my comments above - I don't think that is technically possible (at least, not without being fantastically expensive).
if not the same silicon then what about the same circuit board? they will sell you the board, Atom CPU and the communications chips on one board with one low bundled price.
oops, that may hinder the swith to amd...
Gee I wonder who else said the same thing?
IF they do that it would be one hell of a technical achievement. The RF portion of such a device creates a hell of a lot of electrical noise, which a digital processor just can't cope with, so trying to put them together in the same package (let alone the same piece of semiconductor material), is incredibly hard to achieve.
I don't know for sure about Infineon, but most RF devices are made using Gallium Arsenide as the base material. Processors and the like use silicon. Whilst you can make a processor on GaAs, it's not nearly as cost effective as using silicon, since GaAs is more expensive to buy in the first place, and is much more difficult to manufacture on.
Stokes, over at ars thinks Intel might be planning to do RF processing (and the rest of the baseband processing) on the same application processing chip.
if not the same silicon then what about the same circuit board? they will sell you the board, Atom CPU and the communications chips on one board with one low bundled price.
They could do that, the only problem is, in the mobile space (where obviously this is all intended for), size and flexibility is key. If Intel sold this PCB with two chips side by side, you can guarantee it wouldn't package into a lot of peoples phones. If you look at a PCB from an Apple teardown, things are not nearly as uniformly laid out as they used to be, and the lack of flexibility would hurt this a lot.
Stokes, over at ars thinks Intel might be planning to do RF processing (and the rest of the baseband processing) on the same application processing chip.
Many thanks for the link, it's an interesting article.
I'm agree that I'm sure they will be planning to try and do RF processing and application processing on the same chip, but I still maintain for them to do it will be a hell of a technical achievement. Getting the RF portion to perform well on silicon would be a hell of a battle, and making an application processor on GaAs would be expensive.
I think GaAs is only available in upto 6" wafers, so the cost per die is way higher than the same die on a 12" wafer which is any advanced silicon fab.
Good luck to them though. If they can achieve it, it will have benefits in cost, packaging size and power consumption, and if anyone can overcome the technical hurdles it will be Intel. Say what you like about the x86 architecture, they are tremendous at manufacturing, have a lot of clever people and possibly most importantly when trying to overcome technical hurdles like this, they have a lot of money!
I think I have a different take as it relates to Apple. Maybe Apple is dumping Infineon, which gives them an incentive to get acquired. Do Qualcom and Infineon compete in that particular space?
Or perhaps Apple believes that it can dump Infineon if needed... I can't believe that Apple would allow an important supplier to fall into the hands of a company that is a quasi-competitor without having a back-up plan.
Gee I wonder who else said the same thing?
Great minds think alike (and occasionally promote self accordingly, lol.)