Android Development: The App Makers Still Cannot Make Money

Posted:
in General Discussion edited January 2014
Great article:





Quote:

a quote by developer Steve Demeter, who created Trism for the iPhone, "Do I want to be spending 6 months to write the game, and another 6 months making if compatible? If I had Trism available for Android, and there are 50 Android devices and every time one of them crashes (the users) contact me, do I want that?"







http://www.ismashphone.com/2010/10/a...ll-suffer.html
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Comments

  • Reply 1 of 31
    i think this is the real problem about Android, so many companies and different telephone models make developing apps a pain in the a**.

    Clearly is easier for a developer to make apps for a phone like the iphone where he/she knows that if the game works correctly in his developing and testing phone it will work the same way in other phones.

    I usually have to deal with compatibility problems because i am also a developer and trying to make an application that works in windows, MAC and sometimes linux is just crazy.
  • Reply 2 of 31
    MarvinMarvin Posts: 14,223moderator
    When people who don't develop for Android complain about fragmentation and people who do develop for Android say it's not a problem, what does that tell you?



    Look how many desktop versions of an OS there are and how many kernel extensions, peripherals etc you get to change the system configuration. It doesn't put people off developing for those. So long as the frameworks you use remain the same between them, there's no problem.
  • Reply 3 of 31
    daveswdavesw Posts: 406member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Marvin View Post


    When people who don't develop for Android complain about fragmentation and people who do develop for Android say it's not a problem, what does that tell you?



    Look how many desktop versions of an OS there are and how many kernel extensions, peripherals etc you get to change the system configuration. It doesn't put people off developing for those. So long as the frameworks you use remain the same between them, there's no problem.



    There ARE a lot of Android developers complaining about fragmentation AND other issues like payments, purchase choices, the fact that paid Apps for Android Are Only Available in 32 countries, etc.





    App Developers Not Happy With Android



    http://gigaom.com/2009/11/29/android...ers-not-happy/





    Who & What?s to Blame for Developer Woes
    • Developers are concerned that Google Checkout contributes to their low download volumes.

    • 43 percent feel that they would sell more apps if Android used a carrier billing or another simpler billing system.

    • 82 percent of those surveyed feel that the design of the Android Marketplace makes it difficult for apps to be noticed.

    • 68 percent of those surveyed are somewhat or not likely to put further work into their apps, compared with when they first released their app.





    Android developer on Slashdot detailing the Android "fragmentation"



    http://apps.ycombinator.com/item?id=1397941



    "Android Tools Are Horrendous, OS Is Hideous," FB iPhone Dev Joe Hewitt Tweets



    http://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=1633708
  • Reply 4 of 31
    addaboxaddabox Posts: 12,660member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Marvin View Post


    When people who don't develop for Android complain about fragmentation and people who do develop for Android say it's not a problem, what does that tell you?



    Look how many desktop versions of an OS there are and how many kernel extensions, peripherals etc you get to change the system configuration. It doesn't put people off developing for those. So long as the frameworks you use remain the same between them, there's no problem.



    I don't think desktop OS variants are a reasonable point of comparison. Touch handset hardware/software integration is far more critical to the user experience than changing up peripherals or adding extensions to Windows or OS X.



    I also wonder if "developers complaining" is even a very good metric of the problem. At the moment Android is enjoying a very steep growth curve, I would argue largely fueled by a general transition to smart phones by average buyers looking to upgrade their old feature or dumb phones. These are users with no prior experience with a smart phone of any description, and as such probably aren't very alert to compatibility problems. They regard any such as inevitable or just how these phones are.



    So for the time being Android devs can be pretty casual about fragmentation without paying much of a penalty, as along as most of their stuff works most of the time, more or less (and it certainly doesn't hurt that most Android apps are free).



    However, as more people get used to having smart phones this may be an issues for the overall Android market at some point. I don't think most people would be OK with Windows apps that behave erratically or not at all, and if it happened frequently enough it would have a bearing on how they felt about the platform. Critically, for the "this is Windows all over again" crowd, there isn't the hardware price differential to keep people using a less performative platform, if the options are clear and readily available.
  • Reply 5 of 31
    MarvinMarvin Posts: 14,223moderator
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by davesw View Post


    There ARE a lot of Android developers complaining about fragmentation AND other issues like payments, purchase choices, the fact that paid Apps for Android Are Only Available in 32 countries, etc.



    App Developers Not Happy With Android



    http://gigaom.com/2009/11/29/android...ers-not-happy/



    Survey of 30 developers. Add the two at the end of your post = 32 developers. I wouldn't call that lots. Android has 100,000 apps so the best information you have to go with these stats is that 0.032% of developers have some sort of issues developing for Android. I'm sure you could find 32 developers with similar issues developing for iOS.



    Quote:
    Originally Posted by davesw View Post
    • Developers are concerned that Google Checkout contributes to their low download volumes.

    • 43 percent feel that they would sell more apps if Android used a carrier billing or another simpler billing system.

    • 82 percent of those surveyed feel that the design of the Android Marketplace makes it difficult for apps to be noticed.

    • 68 percent of those surveyed are somewhat or not likely to put further work into their apps, compared with when they first released their app.




    The App Store marketplace is difficult to find apps too and the last item could be said about anything.



    If developing for Android is such a pain, developers will stop building apps and we won't see much more than 100k apps. Time will reveal all.
  • Reply 6 of 31
    daveswdavesw Posts: 406member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Marvin View Post


    Survey of 30 developers. Add the two at the end of your post = 32 developers. I wouldn't call that lots. Android has 100,000 apps so the best information you have to go with these stats is that 0.032% of developers have some sort of issues developing for Android. I'm sure you could find 32 developers with similar issues developing for iOS.





    No need to project some sort of a "fair and balanced" stance on this issue.





    Fact #1: there are LOTS of people complaining about this issue.



    Fact #2: 99.999999999% of Android app developers are not making money.

    -App market is crap

    -Payments suck

    -Piracy/app cracking

    -Google=free mindset. android users ARE NOT Buying apps.

    -Google does not care.













    dozens of people complaining about android fragmentation and other issues.



    http://apps.ycombinator.com/item?id=1397941





    Read 500+ comments, mostly negative comments about Android (fragmentation, etc.)



    http://news.slashdot.org/comments.pl...4&cid=32426078



    575+ comments, mostly negative comments about Android fragmentation, crappy OS/device/marketplace, etc.



    http://www.reddit.com/r/programming/...the_so_called/







    People not happy about the Android marketplace. App cracking, piracy, multiple app stores.



    http://techcrunch.com/2010/10/28/and...-on-the-fritz/
  • Reply 7 of 31
    daveswdavesw Posts: 406member
    here's one comment from an Android developer from one of the links i posted.





    Quote:

    Yep. I used to work as a J2ME porter; this sounds exactly like what the author is describing. Hundreds of phones, each one with a different screen size, each one with radically different performance and memory, each one with a different bug somewhere in the framework. For most of these problems, the only way to make your app work across the majority of devices is to buy each and every one of them.



    You are completely right that Google's control over the platform could curb this. They could enforce it easily by restricting the Android trademark and marketplace. They could have enforced hardware acceleration and minimum memory requirements per resolution (and not just for games, but to make a snappy UI that competes with the iPhone.) Unfortunately they just don't care. The more this goes on, the more I think they aren't really smartphones at all; they are just the new shitty feature-phones to replace J2ME.



    I am not looking forward to doing Android development. They still don't allow Canadian merchants for undisclosed reasons so my decision is kind of made for me right now; maybe they should keep it this way.



  • Reply 8 of 31
    MarvinMarvin Posts: 14,223moderator
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by davesw View Post


    here's one comment from an Android developer from one of the links i posted.



    The sentence "I am not looking forward to doing Android development" suggests he's one of the many non-Android developers fearful of how bad the situation is but is only going by how it's portrayed.



    The fact that apps even work across vastly different screen sizes is an improvement over iOS, which just pixel-doubles iPhone apps on the iPad and blocks iPad apps from the iPhone. There are just 10,000 iPad apps and although it runs iPhone apps, like I say they are pixel-doubled.



    If you buy an Android app, at least it's designed to buy once and work on anything. Even if it doesn't work right every time, at least they let you do it.
  • Reply 9 of 31
    daveswdavesw Posts: 406member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Marvin View Post


    The sentence "I am not looking forward to doing Android development" suggests he's one of the many non-Android developers fearful of how bad the situation is but is only going by how it's portrayed.



    The fact that apps even work across vastly different screen sizes is an improvement over iOS, which just pixel-doubles iPhone apps on the iPad and blocks iPad apps from the iPhone. There are just 10,000 iPad apps and although it runs iPhone apps, like I say they are pixel-doubled.



    If you buy an Android app, at least it's designed to buy once and work on anything. Even if it doesn't work right every time, at least they let you do it.





    ROFL ok now i know you're just trolling
  • Reply 10 of 31
    emacs72emacs72 Posts: 356member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by sheldon25 View Post


    I usually have to deal with compatibility problems because i am also a developer and trying to make an application that works in windows, MAC and sometimes linux is just crazy.



    design patterns will help in the porting effort.
  • Reply 11 of 31
    MarvinMarvin Posts: 14,223moderator
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by davesw View Post


    ROFL ok now i know you're just trolling



    Ok so they have the same stance as Apple for cross-device apps:



    http://www.guardian.co.uk/technology...ility-question



    If anything, this is where their fragmentation is going to become an issue because the tablets won't sell in nearly as large a volume from individual manufacturers so they will get far less software support.
  • Reply 12 of 31
    daveswdavesw Posts: 406member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Marvin View Post


    Ok so they have the same stance as Apple for cross-device apps:



    http://www.guardian.co.uk/technology...ility-question



    If anything, this is where their fragmentation is going to become an issue because the tablets won't sell in nearly as large a volume from individual manufacturers so they will get far less software support.



    Android tablets are not going to be able to run Android (phone) apps? WOW.
  • Reply 13 of 31
    MarvinMarvin Posts: 14,223moderator
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by davesw View Post


    Android tablets are not going to be able to run Android (phone) apps? WOW.



    It's not that far fetched, after all we do run desktop systems that scale from 1024 x 768 to 2560 x 1440 and beyond and apps don't have to be specifically compiled for both. There's no real reason why they can't use a scalable UI, even if it means bundling a couple of UI files in each app.
  • Reply 14 of 31
    It's not like there isn't precedent for many devices, one OS. Like... the Mac computer you are reading this on. Or Windows. Or linux, FreeBSD, OpenBSD, etc. In fact, having a dynamic, scalable UI is an advantage. It allows me to run Chrome on an 800x480 screen right now, or on my 1680x1050 monitor on me desk, or at 1440x900 on my MBP.



    And being linux based, I would think Scalable Vector Graphics (SVG) would be trivial. The libraries necessary were written over a decade ago.



    Quote:

    I usually have to deal with compatibility problems because i am also a developer and trying to make an application that works in windows, MAC and sometimes linux is just crazy.



    I can imagine that would be one heck of a task. I'm amazed by developers of software like Firefox, Chrome, VLC, Transmission, MPlayer, Open Office, AbiWord, Maya, etc, at how well their teams handle the various platforms, toolkits, libraries etc. But Android is one toolkit, and one OS, so I'm not sure where the comparison is going(?).



    Quote:

    ROFL ok now i know you're just trolling



    Yes, the global forum moderator, who has been here at least 3 years longer than you, is a troll.
  • Reply 15 of 31
    MarvinMarvin Posts: 14,223moderator
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by 1337_5L4Xx0R View Post


    Yes, the global forum moderator, who has been here at least 3 years longer than you, is a troll.



    I think it's because I occasionally try to discount some his many negative threads and posts about Android/Google:



    Android Development: The App Makers Still Cannot Make Money

    http://forums.appleinsider.com/showthread.php?t=114183



    NYTimes: SECURITY ALERT: Android App Forwards Private Text Messages

    http://forums.appleinsider.com/showthread.php?t=114219



    DEVELOPERS BEHOLD!!! .....the OPEN Android Architecture.

    http://forums.appleinsider.com/showthread.php?t=113950



    Google in Big trouble in China

    http://forums.appleinsider.com/showthread.php?t=114056



    "Google's revenue from Android = ZERO"

    http://forums.appleinsider.com/showp...8&postcount=22



    Signature: ANDROID SECURITY ALERT: Android wallpaper app that steals your data was downloaded by millions

    http://www.appleinsider.com/articles...theft_app.html



    Android apps caught covertly sending GPS data to advertisers

    http://forums.appleinsider.com/showthread.php?t=113506



    Google scrambling to revrse shrinking China market share

    http://forums.appleinsider.com/showthread.php?t=113186



    Facebook iPhone Dev: The more I work with Android the more it reminds me of Windows.

    http://forums.appleinsider.com/showthread.php?t=112480



    "wouldn't surprise me, the typical Android users are pimple-faced ugly geeks wearing braces."

    http://forums.appleinsider.com/showp...8&postcount=39



    Android users cant get laid: iPhone owners have sex 2x than Android users

    http://forums.appleinsider.com/showthread.php?t=112060



    Nasty and Expensive SMS-sending Android Trojan reported

    http://forums.appleinsider.com/showthread.php?t=112042



    Google now admits to being in talks with Verizon. GOOGLE = EVIL.

    http://forums.appleinsider.com/showthread.php?t=111974



    "admit to being a troll" - to some talking positively about Android

    http://forums.appleinsider.com/showp...&postcount=173



    "Android is insecure for the same reason Windows is insecure.

    Android = Windows of mobile."

    http://forums.appleinsider.com/showp...8&postcount=44



    "News to DEVELOPERS:

    Android users are cheap Penny Pinching FreeLoaders. THEY DONT BUY APPS.

    Good luck wasting your time developing and selling your apps to these people."

    http://forums.appleinsider.com/showt...53#post1687253



    Skyagent: potentially-rogue binary present on ALL HTC EVO 4G

    http://forums.appleinsider.com/showthread.php?t=111236



    Wallstreet: Google is a one trick pony. lost $58 Billion in stock value.

    http://forums.appleinsider.com/showthread.php?t=111180



    AT&T bans non-Market Android apps due to security concerns

    http://forums.appleinsider.com/showthread.php?t=111063



    Google bows down to China. Removes redirect. Is Google evil and gutless?

    http://forums.appleinsider.com/showthread.php?t=110963



    Google: We will delete your Android Apps

    http://forums.appleinsider.com/showthread.php?t=110872



    Android phones should not be allowed in the Enterprise

    http://forums.appleinsider.com/showthread.php?t=110862



    Report: A fifth of Android apps expose private data

    http://forums.appleinsider.com/showthread.php?t=110770



    Report confirms Google Wi-Fi code collected UNAUTHORIZED PERSONAL DATA

    http://forums.appleinsider.com/showthread.php?t=110354



    Now Everyone's Cutting Their Google Estimates -- No Wonder The Stock Has Tanked

    http://forums.appleinsider.com/showthread.php?t=110495



    There might be a trend in there somewhere . Everyone's entitled to their opinion of course, I just feel that people are trying too hard to keep Google's efforts down because they took a lot of their ideas from Apple without crediting them for it and now hope to gain from it at Apple's expense.



    Like I've said before though, Apple doesn't do high volume because they don't lower their prices to hit that volumes of consumers so the alternative is that Microsoft, RIM, Nokia step in to take that place and dominate. I'd rather it was Google than anyone else - they do need to stop taking some cheap marketing shots at Apple but if they are evil, they are the lesser of 4 or more evils.



    They consistently push people to iPhone and Android development, they have eliminated Windows from their offices, they make improvements to open source code and back open source movements and industry standards. Google and Apple would make better friends than enemies. If anything, their arguments seem like a smokescreen to keep the FTC out of the picture.



    Ultimately, they will come to the realisation that both systems have to co-exist and have their respective flaws.
  • Reply 16 of 31
    daveswdavesw Posts: 406member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by 1337_5L4Xx0R View Post


    Yes, the global forum moderator, who has been here at least 3 years longer than you, is a troll.







    That's one of the perks of being a moderator
  • Reply 17 of 31
    daveswdavesw Posts: 406member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Marvin View Post


    I think it's because I occasionally try to discount some his many negative threads and posts about Android/Google:





    just because they're negative doesn't mean they're not true. THEY'RE ALL TRUE.



    GOOGLE IS THE DEVIL.
  • Reply 18 of 31
    daveswdavesw Posts: 406member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by davesw View Post


    just because they're negative doesn't mean they're not true. THEY ARE.



    GOOGLE IS THE DEVIL.





    actually,



    - Steve Jobs is Jesus Christ.



    - Microsoft is the Devil.



    - Google is the False Prophet.



    bragging about freedom with their Android OS while they censor(ed) search results in China (for 4 years) and 28 other countries. HYPOCRITES!



    http://seekingalpha.com/article/1995...er-products-in



    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Criticism_of_Google
  • Reply 19 of 31
    daveswdavesw Posts: 406member
    [QUOTE=Marvin;1744115

    Ultimately, they will come to the realisation that both systems have to co-exist and have their respective flaws.[/QUOTE]





    oh yeah iOS and Android can co-exist alright. doesn't mean Android doesnt SUCK!



  • Reply 20 of 31
    edit: wasting my breath.
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