1 million Apple TV sales seen as 'positive, but fairly immaterial'

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Comments

  • Reply 61 of 82
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by SDW2001 View Post


    Due to the low cost, I went ahead and asked for one from Santa I still don't see why they don't include a blu-ray/dvd/cd player and internal storage. I suppose it's price point. But they could offer an "AppleTVPlus" or something for $299. With a blu-ray player and storage, that would be a steal, and I think doable for them at that price point. The last hurdle is DVR, but that is much tougher as Steve has said (due to the cable industry's business model).



    Apple has a plan, and it is to provide and inexpensive interface between your other "Apple" devices and your TV. I think they realized that people really just want something to get their media on to the TV because they already have all the other things.



    I bought an Apple TV a few days after it was released because we were renovating the bedroom and buying a our first flat panel (a Vizio Razor LED 37 inch) to hang on the wall. I have not really used the Apple TV all that much, but my wife LOVES IT! Seriously, she loves the darn thing! She is very smart, but it is simple to use and she can watch her video podcasts in the bedroom while getting ready in the morning. On Thanksgiving morning we had breakfast in bed, and watched Toy Story 3 streamed wirelessly from the iMac downstairs. I should add that I have Wireless G and not N, and that the iMac is the first of the 17 inch Core Duo (not even core 2), and it was flawless. This is what the Apple TV is all about.



    I have already ripped all of my old VHS tapes to M4V (using the BlackMagic video converter) and will start with the DVD's next (using the Elgato Turbo 264). The BlackMagic works with PPC, but the Elgato requires Intel.



    The idea that I can select any DVD to watch on my TV or iPad means a lot more to me in terms of usability.
  • Reply 62 of 82
    solipsismsolipsism Posts: 25,726member
    Are the same people that bitch about the lack of an xMac and how it sucks to have a monitor built into the PC the same ones who keep saying how a single TV unit with all your HEC components built in would be a viable product for Apple?
  • Reply 63 of 82
    alfiejralfiejr Posts: 1,524member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by al_bundy View Post


    so you're saying that the tens of millions who own consoles don't really want them? they want the crappy games in the app store that get old after a day instead of Call of Duty Black Ops that just hit a billion $$$ in sales in a few months?



    iOS games are nice but no life in them



    yeah, hard core gamers and familes with kids/teens will still want their consoles and use them. but they're an optional add-on (until Sony gets smart and sticks the PS3 chip/BD player inside its HDTV's too). adults' home lives don't revolve around those consoles. many do however revolve around their TV.



    notwithstanding virtual reality, there is no "life" in any game. go to FaceBook for that! (just kidding)
  • Reply 64 of 82
    hill60hill60 Posts: 6,992member
    I wonder why people think you have to have one or the other?



    I have an Apple TV plugged into my TV alongside a DVD player (can't be bothered upgrading to Blue Ray, it doesn't get used enough except for plugging in USB thumbdrives), and a STB with DVR (which I only use for FTA and have never played back anything I recorded on it).



    There seems to be this strange notion that if you buy something then you immediately have to unplug everything else and stow it away in the garage or something along side the VCR's and casette decks.



    Apple TV is a part of the TV viewing experience that you make for yourself depending on your tastes and interests.
  • Reply 65 of 82
    hill60hill60 Posts: 6,992member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Alfiejr View Post


    yeah, hard core gamers and familes with kids/teens will still want their consoles and use them. but they're an optional add-on (until Sony gets smart and sticks the PS3 chip/BD player inside its HDTV's too). adults' home lives don't revolve around those consoles. many do however revolve around their TV.



    notwithstanding virtual reality, there is no "life" in any game. go to FaceBook for that! (just kidding)



    As a parent with teenage kids, the X-box and Playstation 3 I bought for the living room disappeared into the kid's bedrooms, never to be seen again, although the stream of other kids wandering from the front door into said bedrooms leads me to believe that they are being put to good use, I've seen glimpses of Black Ops as I pass and it looks pretty good, too bad I don't have the time to get into it.
  • Reply 66 of 82
    alfiejralfiejr Posts: 1,524member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by hill60 View Post


    As a parent with teenage kids, the X-box and Playstation 3 I bought for the living room disappeared into the kid's bedrooms, never to be seen again, although the stream of other kids wandering from the front door into said bedrooms leads me to believe that they are being put to good use, I've seen glimpses of Black Ops as I pass and it looks pretty good, too bad I don't have the time to get into it.



    yeah, i can't get into war and gore, but really enjoy Burnout Paradise! (the iPad lite version, Hot Pursuit, is a very very pale spin off. except for two person races.)
  • Reply 67 of 82
    pt123pt123 Posts: 696member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by al_bundy View Post


    so you're saying that the tens of millions who own consoles don't really want them? they want the crappy games in the app store that get old after a day instead of Call of Duty Black Ops that just hit a billion $$$ in sales in a few months?



    iOS games are nice but no life in them



    Yeah! Call of Duty Black Ops, $1 billion in sales already. The Modern Warfare 2 surpassed $1 billion too. Incredible games. But Solitaire on the iPod is nice too.
  • Reply 68 of 82
    pt123pt123 Posts: 696member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by hill60 View Post


    I wonder why people think you have to have one or the other?



    I have an Apple TV plugged into my TV alongside a DVD player (can't be bothered upgrading to Blue Ray, it doesn't get used enough except for plugging in USB thumbdrives), and a STB with DVR (which I only use for FTA and have never played back anything I recorded on it).



    There seems to be this strange notion that if you buy something then you immediately have to unplug everything else and stow it away in the garage or something along side the VCR's and casette decks.



    Apple TV is a part of the TV viewing experience that you make for yourself depending on your tastes and interests.



    I totally agree. I have AppleTV and Blu-ray. I don't understand why some people say one means the other will be dead. I own disc, they aren't going anywhere no matter how successful streaming is. And streaming isn't killing disc purchases, rentals (Netflix) are. Blu-ray makers are adding streaming support for one reason, to sell more boxes. Even AppleTV added Netflix streaming to sell more boxes.
  • Reply 69 of 82
    pt123pt123 Posts: 696member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by SockRolid View Post


    And just exactly why would any Blu-Ray player have streaming as well as optical disc playback? Because the manufacturers know that Blu-Ray is just an interim step toward that "streaming-only age." They're hedging their bets. Future-proofing a product that consumers resisted by adding forward-looking technology to it. Think of Apple TV as not being burdened with the backward compatibility problem of supporting DVDs and Blu-Ray discs.



    Streaming is hardly forward looking technology. It has been around for a while. AppleTV added Netflix streaming it helps sell note boxes. And backward compatibility is nit a burden, it is a feature.
  • Reply 70 of 82
    solipsismsolipsism Posts: 25,726member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by pt123 View Post


    Streaming is hardly forward looking technology. It has been around for a while. AppleTV added Netflix streaming it helps sell note boxes. And backward compatibility is nit a burden, it is a feature.



    A technology having been around doesn?t mean it?s not ?forward-looking?. As it?s been pointed out ad nauseam streaming of media will get faster, include more media from more sources and encompass more devices that all interact with other in some fashion. This is where the development and innovation is heading. If you look at what Apple is doing with AirPlay, what the carriers are doing with LTE and HSPA+, and what even cheap HEC equipment is trying to do by including streaming capabilities you?ll see this true.
  • Reply 71 of 82
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by lantzn View Post




    I just bought a ATV2 and am thinking about hacking the ATV into a mini Mac to see what it can do.



    Sounds neat, how would you do that? ATV1 or 2?
  • Reply 72 of 82
    mactelmactel Posts: 1,275member
    My company is giving me one for the extra work I put in a month ago. I'm excited to get one. We have a Wii in our upstairs media room that has Netflix on it. The AppleTV will go nice on our downstairs entertainment center.



    I do expect Apple to extend the App store to the AppleTV. They need more content providers too. Hulu Plus, the Safari browser to get to the other networks for free, and games would be on my list of things to make the AppleTV perfect.
  • Reply 73 of 82
    pt123pt123 Posts: 696member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by solipsism View Post


    A technology having been around doesn?t mean it?s not ?forward-looking?. As it?s been pointed out ad nauseam streaming of media will get faster, include more media from more sources and encompass more devices that all interact with other in some fashion. This is where the development and innovation is heading. If you look at what Apple is doing with AirPlay, what the carriers are doing with LTE and HSPA+, and what even cheap HEC equipment is trying to do by including streaming capabilities you?ll see this true.



    Well, then you could say companies are hedging their bets by adding forward looking technology like Blu-ray since more companies are selling and renting Blu-ray, and more titles are added as time goes by.
  • Reply 74 of 82
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by hill60 View Post


    I wonder why people think you have to have one or the other?



    I have an Apple TV plugged into my TV alongside a DVD player (can't be bothered upgrading to Blue Ray, it doesn't get used enough except for plugging in USB thumbdrives), and a STB with DVR (which I only use for FTA and have never played back anything I recorded on it).



    There seems to be this strange notion that if you buy something then you immediately have to unplug everything else and stow it away in the garage or something along side the VCR's and casette decks.



    Apple TV is a part of the TV viewing experience that you make for yourself depending on your tastes and interests.



    well that really depends on how many ports your telly has and how many you've already used. Its also because people have to justify the price, at £99 its not exactly cheap compared to what else is out there.
  • Reply 75 of 82
    sdw2001sdw2001 Posts: 18,015member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by charlituna View Post


    no blu/DVD because they set up all that download stuff and see that and streaming as the future. They tried the whole storage thing and it didn't sell plus DVR etc would require licensing of tech.



    How did they try "the whole storage thing?" Not with this product.



    Quote:



    Despite what mr Wu says, one million units of this 'toy' in a quarter is still impressive. Especially if it continues at even half that rate. The point of this item is to push Apple's rentals etc. If they can show volume then they can get more networks on board push for a lower price or even a subscription of some kind (say like a season rental pass for $15 for SD instead of the $22 it would cost you one by one). Showing usage might also convince the nets to loosen up the rental restrictions. And who knows perhaps this would help them get their heads out of their butts and start crediting show buy back with proceeds from rentals and buys online rather than continuing to only look at the antiquated Nielsen system. Then fewer decent scripted shows would bite it two eps in.



    The problem I have with that is it's antithetical to their stated iPod/iTunes strategy. They look at iTunes as a way to sell iPods. Are you saying it's the opposite for AppleTV? That seems odd to me.







    Quote:
    Originally Posted by thompr View Post


    Apple's decisions - even the seemingly small ones - are not arbitrary. On the contrary, they are very deliberate, and can usually be seen to be consistent with an overall goal. Steve likes consistency and focused goals.



    When did anyone claim their decisions were arbitrary? You sound an awful lot like the "Shut Up, Apple Knows What It's Doing" crowd.



    Quote:



    There is a ton of evidence which suggests that one of Apple's goals is to kill off physical media and move entirely to digital distribution of all content. (Movies, music, software, etc.) Putting any type of disk reader on the Apple TV would not be inline with that goal. Not going to happen.



    Thompson



    I agree there is a lot of evidence. However, as I've stated twice now, that is the exact opposite of their stated iPod/iTunes strategy.



    Quote:
    Originally Posted by gcom006 View Post


    Meanwhile, Blu-Ray players going for around the same price as Apple TV with similar internet capabilities in addition to backwards compatibility are really still doing quite okay...



    http://news.yahoo.com/s/yblog_techne...lu-ray-players



    Blu-Ray is an outstanding transition format. It covers DVD's of yesterday, Blu-Rays of today and streaming of tomorrow. It covers a lot of bases and truly offers the best audio and video experience of any format out there right now. It won't be going away anytime soon. Blu-Ray is a bona fide hit among consumers, being adopted at a rate faster than DVD players were ever adopted. Netflix is a huge part of that, again, for discs that work today and streaming for tomorrow.



    Not so bad for a "bag of hurt..."



    I still think Blu-Ray is a great product that only stands to gain more ground now that pricing has truly come down to consumer-friendly levels. Apparently I'm not the only one.



    http://broadcastengineering.com/hdtv...ext-year-0720/



    Get back to me when Apple TV hits 10% of those numbers. Until then, Apple's VERY smart to keep it a hobby.



    Agreed. Two more points:



    1. Blu-Ray still offers the best picture and sound quality available.

    2. Many items are not offered on iTunes at all. Many.







    Quote:
    Originally Posted by [email protected] View Post


    Apple has a plan, and it is to provide and inexpensive interface between your other "Apple" devices and your TV. I think they realized that people really just want something to get their media on to the TV because they already have all the other things.



    That is what I'm saying. It depends on what it wants AppleTV to be. I think it go further and even start replacing all of the "other things." But, the price then goes up. It depends on what their goals are. I'm really fine with whatever way they decide to go. I just think it would be great to have an Apple STB that is has DVR, Blu-Ray and Streaming. That would mean all I'd need is a high def signal.



    Quote:

    I bought an Apple TV a few days after it was released because we were renovating the bedroom and buying a our first flat panel (a Vizio Razor LED 37 inch) to hang on the wall. I have not really used the Apple TV all that much, but my wife LOVES IT! Seriously, she loves the darn thing! She is very smart, but it is simple to use and she can watch her video podcasts in the bedroom while getting ready in the morning. On Thanksgiving morning we had breakfast in bed, and watched Toy Story 3 streamed wirelessly from the iMac downstairs. I should add that I have Wireless G and not N, and that the iMac is the first of the 17 inch Core Duo (not even core 2), and it was flawless. This is what the Apple TV is all about.



    I have already ripped all of my old VHS tapes to M4V (using the BlackMagic video converter) and will start with the DVD's next (using the Elgato Turbo 264). The BlackMagic works with PPC, but the Elgato requires Intel.



    The idea that I can select any DVD to watch on my TV or iPad means a lot more to me in terms of usability.



    But that's the problem. Most people don't want to spend hours ripping their DVD content or their Blu-Ray content. In my case, I don't have a desktop, which means I'd have to fire up the laptop next to me in order to stream. It doens't have a Blu-Ray drive, so I'd need an external drive. And I'd still have to spend the time doing it. I've ripped DVDs before, and it's a time consuming process even on a fast machine. It would be a lot easier to either store or play said discs on an AppleTV. At least for most people.
  • Reply 76 of 82
    gqbgqb Posts: 1,934member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by mstone View Post


    I am still not convinced of the accuracy of the analysis in that article. Does not make sense to me.



    I have not rented anything from iTunes with my aTV but have watched several Netflix titles and they stream immediately. Bears mentioning that I use my office's DNS servers on my home network, not my cable provider's DNS. Either way I don't see how Google or OpenDNS should affect Akami's proxy or load balancing configuration. It appears that Akami uses only their own DNS not remotely cached zone transfers.



    Because Akamai is doing more than load balancing and proxying. That's a common misunderstanding.

    Think of Akamai as an internet worm hole. It uses the location of your DNS server along with its elaborate routing tables to determine which portal to send the data to. Using your local DNS server results in a drop-off near you here in the Milky Way. If you use Google or Open DNS (fine services thought they are), you're quite possibly telling Akamai to drop it off in Andromeda.



    In any event, all I know is that the moment I went from OpenDNS back to my (yecchh) Comcast DNS servers, download times went from 30 hours to a few minutes.

    Pretty empirical evidence to me.

    (And yes, I had the same issue with Apple TV 1 downloading quickly, and Apple TV2 being slow. That just indicates to me that Apple has baked in Akamai intelligence to the device.)
  • Reply 77 of 82
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by SockRolid View Post


    And just exactly why would any Blu-Ray player have streaming as well as optical disc playback? Because the manufacturers know that Blu-Ray is just an interim step toward that "streaming-only age." They're hedging their bets. Future-proofing a product that consumers resisted by adding forward-looking technology to it. Think of Apple TV as not being burdened with the backward compatibility problem of supporting DVDs and Blu-Ray discs.





    "The market" consists of average TV viewers. And a large portion of them never learned to set the time on their VCRs. The very mention of "outputting files" makes them cringe. Simple is better in the home entertainment market. Apple has moved Apple TV past the bleeding-edge early-adopter fringe to the mainstream. (And as we'll see very soon, Google TV will suffer in part because Google didn't move beyond that techno-fringe market, but that's a whole different "bag of hurt" than Blu-Ray.)





    What you're saying is that Apple TV isn't conventional enough to appeal to the mass market. I disagree. I think simpler is better, and Apple TV certainly is simple. When Apple brings the simplicity of iOS apps, especially games, to Apple TV, it will really take off.



    After all, that's one reason why Apple went to the trouble of replacing the old Apple TV's Mac-based hardware and software complexity with iOS device simplicity, no? So it can run iOS apps. That's Apple TV's true killer feature, and it's sold well despite not having it yet.



    1st paragraph: Obviously. You act as if this is a bad thing? As if they know they're screwed? Hardly. Blu-Ray is still the highest quality media format out there today and it will be the strongest for a good 5 more years at least. Maybe even longer if the countless interests can't find a common interest to sort out the ever-problematic licensing war. People still own too many DVD's. And at the same time, people love Netflix. A box that does all is going to smoke a box that does one thing ahead of it's time until, well, it's time actually arrives. It's still too early.



    And burden? Please. As a consumer, I love avoiding the burden of having to use separate boxes for streaming and optical discs. I now have one player that does it all sans cable TV.



    And hell, the one nice idea behind Google TV was that Sony Blu-Ray that would've even solved that issue. Too bad Google can't create a market-ready product to save their lives.



    2nd paragraph: The market most interested in streaming technology in a box like Apple TV is video/technophiles. They get it, know how it all works and they're anxious to use this technology. Unfortunately, they don't take Apple TV seriously because it compromises the user experience by being limited to 720P and non-HD sound. They want it all, and sadly, it would've been easy for Apple to make this happen. If you can't get the hardcores excited about a product, you're not likely to have a hit on your hands. In the HEC market, you need to get the techies first and the consumers will follow.



    Google TV is failing because the interface sucks, the content providers are blocking everything and it requires updates immediately that take forever to download. People are returning them before they even use them. It has nothing to do with focusing on the techno-fringe. That's Apple fanboy malarky. What the hell do you think an Apple fanboy is for that matter??? It all boils down to the fact that it's just a very poorly executed product; wholly unrefined. Oh yeah, and they're idiots for not working more with content providers long before launch. "See very soon?" No, it's already happening. Can't say it enough: Google is a joke of a company.



    3rd paragraph: Until Apple actually unleashes the ability to use apps on the Apple TV, it's a moot point discussing it as a killer feature. Consumers know Apple TV exists. They're not oblivious. 99% of them would rather have a Blu-Ray player though right now. That's not going to change real soon, and even apps might not change that if it came down to one or the other. The streaming-only age is absolutely coming, and I personally can't wait, but it's absolutely not even close to arriving yet.



    What you need to consider is that simple is better, and in saying that, are you aware of how many consumers have no idea what wi-fi actually is let alone whether or not they have it? But does every consumer and their mother and their grandmother know how to put a disc in a tray and press play? Yep. No iTunes accounts, Netflix accounts, etc...disc. Tray. Play. That's why Blu-Ray players are such a great transition product. They cover every base, and that "burden" you refer to is going to be the thing that allows streaming to eventually become mainstream. Apple TV's eventual success will piggyback off of On-Demand cable boxes and Blu-Ray players with streaming capabilities. That's where the market on whole is learning what streaming is all about.
  • Reply 78 of 82
    mstonemstone Posts: 11,510member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by GQB View Post


    Because Akamai is doing more than load balancing and proxying. That's a common misunderstanding.

    Think of Akamai as an internet worm hole. It uses the location of your DNS server along with its elaborate routing tables to determine which portal to send the data to.



    Please explain in technical terms how Akami can detect which DNS server other than their own can be identified in a request. It appears as if you are definitively saying that Akami allows zone transfers to other cacheing DNS servers. I cannot verify that and as far as I can see is appears that they do not allow it, at least according to their DNS dig info.
  • Reply 79 of 82
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by charlituna View Post


    It may not have anything to do with iTunes or the AppleTV. Others have pointed out the whole DNS issue. But there is also the question of your ISP throttling large downloads. Some of them are doing it under the assumption that you are doing bit torrents etc. The notion that it could be a totally legal download escaped their brains when they set up their computers to jack speeds down on you.



    Thanks, gave that a shot. Get way further in the movie now, to 16 minutes in before it locks. And locks hard, no previews, no accessing the store.



    Brought up a speed test just after the crash, internet is fine, so thinking a Apple TV or streaming server issue.



    I can report that customer service at Apple was great when I contacted them, they put the movie back in my queue.
  • Reply 80 of 82
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by lkrupp View Post


    Why do people always assume their personal experience is the norm? Apple doesn't need to improve service. You need to fix your problem.



    It's the norm here.
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