Yes but how many actually sold. 32 bit only intel hardware wasn't around very long.
Quote:
They've been promising it since before the launch of Tiger. It can't be that demanding.
True; mentions of it have been around for a very long time, which then makes one ask what is taking so long. It may not seem to be demanding to us but if that was the case would we not have seen it by now?
I don't think they'll dump the 32bit Intels with Lion. Mah gut feeling.
You're probably right.
Quote:
Originally Posted by wizard69
Yes but how many actually sold. 32 bit only intel hardware wasn't around very long.
Those machines were such a huge improvement over the PowerPC garbage Apple was pushing before that they sold like hotcakes. And as said, they were around for over a year and a half.
Those machines were such a huge improvement over the PowerPC garbage Apple was pushing before that they sold like hotcakes. And as said, they were around for over a year and a half.
I didn't take notice as I didn't buy a Mac until the early 2008 MBP came out. Unfortunately 2008 is a good example of Apple coming out with a major update relatively soon after a minor. It is also why I believe anytime is possible with respect to an iPad update.
As to Lion it will likely be months before Apple unveils the nuts and bolts. Right now what we know about Lion is trivial. So it is still a mystery.
The question of 64 bit only support is interesting but I just don't think Apple will drop 32 bit hardware completely. More likely they will have some features that require modern hardware.
I didn't take notice as I didn't buy a Mac until the early 2008 MBP came out. Unfortunately 2008 is a good example of Apple coming out with a major update relatively soon after a minor. It is also why I believe anytime is possible with respect to an iPad update.
Hardware-wise, the unibodies weren't much better than the Early 2008 models. Sure, the 9600M had the benefit of not being guaranteed to fail unlike the 8600M, but they weren't much faster, just prettier.
I completely disagree on iPad timing. It's an iDevice, meaning once a year, every year.
Hardware-wise, the unibodies weren't much better than the Early 2008 models. Sure, the 9600M had the benefit of not being guaranteed to fail unlike the 8600M, but they weren't much faster, just prettier.
You underestimate just how innovative the Unibodies where when they came out. While I agree the hardware (CPU) wasn't a huge step forward the the serviceability of the new machine was a huge update. Maybe you don't see servicing as a huge thing but changing a HD on the machine is now basically a snap.
Quote:
I completely disagree on iPad timing. It's an iDevice, meaning once a year, every year.
Possibly but on the the other hand Apple knows it has a massive success on its hands and they know that is attracting a lot of admiring eyes from the competition. It would be smart on Apples part to execute moves that keeps those admiring eyes off balance.
Many a company has seen Apples iPod success first hand and are trying very hard to make sure that Apples doesn't have a runaway success with iPad. It is simply to much to give up because iPad does impact laptops and other low end products. Further they know what the coming SoC are like form the likes of TI, Qualcom, NVidia and the like and realize that iPad is very much a Gen one product, with the reasonable possibility that Gen 2 will be much more impressive. They will try very hard to unseat iPad so Apple needs to be aggressive.
Frankly I'd be very disappointed as a stock holder if Apple didn't use its strength to attack the competition.
Thanks to "sequitur" and "Aquatic" for the comments above, with which I agree.
I understand that some people are annoyed by these threads, but it seems like some respondents are being deliberately combative or obtuse. When I started this topic, I never asked or expected anyone to post insider info. I plainly stated that I was using an older computer and simply asked if people believe or expect the current-gen. hardware will be able to support Lion as Lion has been described thus far.
For example, Lion is described as bringing current-gen iOS features "back to the Mac." In that vein, is the current-gen multi-touch trackpad capable of doing everything the current-gen iOS does/requires? If so, great. If not, that means it might be smart to wait until Lion to buy new portable hardware.
This is the type of thing I was asking about -- and, for the record, I've seen *NO* other threads asking about this, contrary to the protests of "wizard69" and "Tallest Skil." Thanks.
We are trying. Actually I'm making a point to limit my usage of the internet a bit. On vacation and all you know!
By the way if you guys want to expand your minds a bit do get yourselves to St. Petersburg Florida and go to the Salvador Dali museum! Well don't do that until after 1/11/2011 as a whole new museum opens up, I got stuck with the old one. In any event hook with one of the tours, certainly the best I've ever experienced.
Quote:
Thanks to "sequitur" and "Aquatic" for the comments above, with which I agree.
I understand that some people are annoyed by these threads, but it seems like some respondents are being deliberately combative or obtuse.
No not at all. I challenge you to go back and look at your original posting and read it as a third person and then explain to us how you could answer it.
Quote:
When I started this topic, I never asked or expected anyone to post insider info. I plainly stated that I was using an older computer and simply asked if people believe or expect the current-gen. hardware will be able to support Lion as Lion has been described thus far.
But that isn't what you asked. You asked about future hardware and software.
As you have stated above the questions is fairly easy to respond to. That is simply that it would be highly improbable for Apple to issue a Mac OS/X update that doesn't work on current shipping hardware. However works and supports new Lion features is another thing.
Quote:
For example, Lion is described as bringing current-gen iOS features "back to the Mac." In that vein, is the current-gen multi-touch trackpad capable of doing everything the current-gen iOS does/requires? If so, great. If not, that means it might be smart to wait until Lion to buy new portable hardware.
Here we go again, how can we possibly comment on hardware and software that is not shipping?
As to the features described so far they are trivial.
Quote:
This is the type of thing I was asking about -- and, for the record, I've seen *NO* other threads asking about this, contrary to the protests of "wizard69" and "Tallest Skil." Thanks.
Maybe because no body else has been foolish enough to ask about unreleased software and hardware especially when it comes to speculating about what features are or aren't in Lion. There is not problem with wanting to discuss possibilities, probabilities or even announced features. The problem is this is not a discussion on your part, you are ASKING US TO TELL YOU WHAT THE NEW PLATFORMS WILL BE LIKE! We can't do that, we can only discuss what might be in the systems.
I really don't think you grasp the tone of your message thus the suggestion to reread it. I wouldn't even get excited about that if it wasn't that previous experience has shown that people that post like you have simply don't grasp the difference between a speculative discussion and a discussion based on fact. When the subject at hand finally debuts and comes up short in any regards then you come back here mad at everybody for being "wrong". It is very very annoying to those of us that have been on the forum for more than a couple of years. Especially when it happens again and again.
As an example we could discuss one element of the new machines. That would be the possibility of the new MBPs supporting SSD. There are a number of ways that Apple could go about supporting a flash boot disk but no body knows which avenue Apple will take if the bother at all. Until the hardware is released it is all speculation.
The new version of the MacBook Pro will definitely support Lion. The Lion demos were all done on currently shipping hardware. It didn't appear that there were any earth-shattering new features that require additional horsepower than what's currently shipping. Apple may have something else up their sleeve, as they sometimes do, but thus far, it doesn't look as though Lion is going to increase hardware requirements.
but thus far, it doesn't look as though Lion is going to increase hardware requirements.
The "thus far" says it all. We really won't know much about Lion until the next WWDC. Which brings up another point it may be late fall before Lion is even released. Usually the secrets are revealed for developers at the WWDC and then the actual OS is released some time later.
Otherwise I agree Lion will work on current hardware to some extent or another.
I think Apple's probably lining up for a feature-complete beta release of Lion for the Worldwide Developer's Conference in the spring. This will give developers a few months to make changes or tweaks in their apps to take advantage of any new APIs or features in Lion, before it goes on sale & becomes available later in the summer.
I think Apple's probably lining up for a feature-complete beta release of Lion for the Worldwide Developer's Conference in the spring. This will give developers a few months to make changes or tweaks in their apps to take advantage of any new APIs or features in Lion, before it goes on sale & becomes available later in the summer.
Later in the summer being October, right? You know Apple; release dates are suggestions, not deadlines.
For example, Lion is described as bringing current-gen iOS features "back to the Mac." In that vein, is the current-gen multi-touch trackpad capable of doing everything the current-gen iOS does/requires? If so, great. If not, that means it might be smart to wait until Lion to buy new portable hardware.
Quote:
Originally Posted by wizard69
Here we go again, how can we possibly comment on hardware and software that is not shipping?
And you're asking me to re-read my comments? Good grief.
Please re-read the above. I'm not asking about future hardware; I'm asking about the current-gen trackpad and the current-gen iOS. Answering this shouldn't require speculation at all, so I don't know why you keep getting so worked up about it.
It is just Apples way of late. It would be great for Apple to release final quickly but that seldom serves the greater good. The greater good being developers that have to update their software and the associated bug report/bug fix cycles.
As it is to justify the cost of a paid update Mac OS/X will need a lot more than a minor layer of iOS look alike features. Since we really don't know what those features are we can't really say how difficult it will be for developers to update to LION, if thy need to.
Hello all ... Longtime lurker, first-time poster, etc., etc.
I know this site needs another "next-gen MBP" thread like it needs a DoS attack, but I have a question that I haven't seen discussed much, if at all:
I'm using a very old Apple laptop and I'm hoping for an MacBook Pro refresh (esp. the 17-inch) soon after Sandy Bridge is released. (Personally, I believe Apple is likely to issue such a refresh ASAP since it's been 9 months since the last refresh.)
That said, I'm also well aware that Mac OS X Lion is due in 2011, and I'm wondering if Lion is expected to have hardware implications for the MBP. I know the theme is "Back to the Mac" and that Lion will bring iOS features to the Mac OS, which is great, but what are people's best guesses re: the hardware implications? If a refreshed MBP is released in Jan. or Feb. 2011, are those machines likely to be fully compatible with (and capable of performing/utilizing all features of) Mac OS X Lion (except maybe for Lightpeak), or are larger hardware issues expected?
Thanks very much for all feedback.
Quote:
Originally Posted by jsk173
I'm not expecting an Apple engineer to come here and answer. I'm asking people who have followed the Lion info. if Lion is likely to have a hardware impact. (Apple has released some info. on Lion, right? I'm not asking for inside info. or pure speculation.)
Quote:
Originally Posted by jsk173
This forum is weird. What's the point of having a "Future Hardware" forum if simple questions about future hardware are met with such juvenile replies?
(My thanks to the people above who actually tried to answer the question.)
Quote:
Originally Posted by jsk173
And you're asking me to re-read my comments? Good grief.
Please re-read the above. I'm not asking about future hardware; I'm asking about the current-gen trackpad and the current-gen iOS. Answering this shouldn't require speculation at all, so I don't know why you keep getting so worked up about it.
You would have done well to have reread your previous posts. It is quite annoying when posters deny saying what they clearly said. From your OP to your most recent post, you have been persistent in your questions about Lion and its implications to future Mac hardware. This is hardly surprising as this is the Future Hardware area of the forum. If you were interested in current hardware, then most members assume that you would have posted your question in the Current Hardware area. Two points:
MacOS X 10.7 will fully support all hardware configurations that it can be installed on. However, the new OS cannot enable features that the hardware does not support.
MacOS X 10.7 will have no hardware implications. Apple's practice is to introduce major hardware revisions powered by special builds of a mature OS. It will follow sometime later with a new point release that incorporates support for the new hardware as well as for old hardware going back five years more or less. I can recall no instance where Apple introduced new hardware that was designed exclusively for a brand new OS--brand new hardware categories notwithstanding.
What this means is that if major hardware revisions to the Mac are coming, then they will come at least several months prior to the release of Lion.
Comments
I have to wonder how many of the early Intel Macs where 32 bit only.
All of the Core Solo and Core Duo computers.
One possibility is resolution independence. That would likely be demanding on the GPU not the CPU.
They've been promising it since before the launch of Tiger. It can't be that demanding.
All of the Core Solo and Core Duo computers.
Yes but how many actually sold. 32 bit only intel hardware wasn't around very long.
They've been promising it since before the launch of Tiger. It can't be that demanding.
True; mentions of it have been around for a very long time, which then makes one ask what is taking so long. It may not seem to be demanding to us but if that was the case would we not have seen it by now?
Yes but how many actually sold. 32 bit only intel hardware wasn't around very long.
First was sold in January 2006. Last was sold in August 2007. That's a fair bit of time.
I don't think they'll dump the 32bit Intels with Lion. Mah gut feeling.
You're probably right.
Yes but how many actually sold. 32 bit only intel hardware wasn't around very long.
Those machines were such a huge improvement over the PowerPC garbage Apple was pushing before that they sold like hotcakes. And as said, they were around for over a year and a half.
You're probably right.
Those machines were such a huge improvement over the PowerPC garbage Apple was pushing before that they sold like hotcakes. And as said, they were around for over a year and a half.
I didn't take notice as I didn't buy a Mac until the early 2008 MBP came out. Unfortunately 2008 is a good example of Apple coming out with a major update relatively soon after a minor. It is also why I believe anytime is possible with respect to an iPad update.
As to Lion it will likely be months before Apple unveils the nuts and bolts. Right now what we know about Lion is trivial. So it is still a mystery.
The question of 64 bit only support is interesting but I just don't think Apple will drop 32 bit hardware completely. More likely they will have some features that require modern hardware.
I didn't take notice as I didn't buy a Mac until the early 2008 MBP came out. Unfortunately 2008 is a good example of Apple coming out with a major update relatively soon after a minor. It is also why I believe anytime is possible with respect to an iPad update.
Hardware-wise, the unibodies weren't much better than the Early 2008 models. Sure, the 9600M had the benefit of not being guaranteed to fail unlike the 8600M, but they weren't much faster, just prettier.
I completely disagree on iPad timing. It's an iDevice, meaning once a year, every year.
Hardware-wise, the unibodies weren't much better than the Early 2008 models. Sure, the 9600M had the benefit of not being guaranteed to fail unlike the 8600M, but they weren't much faster, just prettier.
You underestimate just how innovative the Unibodies where when they came out. While I agree the hardware (CPU) wasn't a huge step forward the the serviceability of the new machine was a huge update. Maybe you don't see servicing as a huge thing but changing a HD on the machine is now basically a snap.
I completely disagree on iPad timing. It's an iDevice, meaning once a year, every year.
Possibly but on the the other hand Apple knows it has a massive success on its hands and they know that is attracting a lot of admiring eyes from the competition. It would be smart on Apples part to execute moves that keeps those admiring eyes off balance.
Many a company has seen Apples iPod success first hand and are trying very hard to make sure that Apples doesn't have a runaway success with iPad. It is simply to much to give up because iPad does impact laptops and other low end products. Further they know what the coming SoC are like form the likes of TI, Qualcom, NVidia and the like and realize that iPad is very much a Gen one product, with the reasonable possibility that Gen 2 will be much more impressive. They will try very hard to unseat iPad so Apple needs to be aggressive.
Frankly I'd be very disappointed as a stock holder if Apple didn't use its strength to attack the competition.
Thanks to "sequitur" and "Aquatic" for the comments above, with which I agree.
I understand that some people are annoyed by these threads, but it seems like some respondents are being deliberately combative or obtuse. When I started this topic, I never asked or expected anyone to post insider info. I plainly stated that I was using an older computer and simply asked if people believe or expect the current-gen. hardware will be able to support Lion as Lion has been described thus far.
For example, Lion is described as bringing current-gen iOS features "back to the Mac." In that vein, is the current-gen multi-touch trackpad capable of doing everything the current-gen iOS does/requires? If so, great. If not, that means it might be smart to wait until Lion to buy new portable hardware.
This is the type of thing I was asking about -- and, for the record, I've seen *NO* other threads asking about this, contrary to the protests of "wizard69" and "Tallest Skil." Thanks.
...for the record, I've seen *NO* other threads asking about this, contrary to the protests of "wizard69" and "Tallest Skil." Thanks.
Don't recall saying anything about other threads. Don't recall this thread being something that other people would've posted about ad infinitum yet.
Hope everyone is enjoying the holidays.
We are trying. Actually I'm making a point to limit my usage of the internet a bit. On vacation and all you know!
By the way if you guys want to expand your minds a bit do get yourselves to St. Petersburg Florida and go to the Salvador Dali museum! Well don't do that until after 1/11/2011 as a whole new museum opens up, I got stuck with the old one. In any event hook with one of the tours, certainly the best I've ever experienced.
Thanks to "sequitur" and "Aquatic" for the comments above, with which I agree.
I understand that some people are annoyed by these threads, but it seems like some respondents are being deliberately combative or obtuse.
No not at all. I challenge you to go back and look at your original posting and read it as a third person and then explain to us how you could answer it.
When I started this topic, I never asked or expected anyone to post insider info. I plainly stated that I was using an older computer and simply asked if people believe or expect the current-gen. hardware will be able to support Lion as Lion has been described thus far.
But that isn't what you asked. You asked about future hardware and software.
As you have stated above the questions is fairly easy to respond to. That is simply that it would be highly improbable for Apple to issue a Mac OS/X update that doesn't work on current shipping hardware. However works and supports new Lion features is another thing.
For example, Lion is described as bringing current-gen iOS features "back to the Mac." In that vein, is the current-gen multi-touch trackpad capable of doing everything the current-gen iOS does/requires? If so, great. If not, that means it might be smart to wait until Lion to buy new portable hardware.
Here we go again, how can we possibly comment on hardware and software that is not shipping?
As to the features described so far they are trivial.
This is the type of thing I was asking about -- and, for the record, I've seen *NO* other threads asking about this, contrary to the protests of "wizard69" and "Tallest Skil." Thanks.
Maybe because no body else has been foolish enough to ask about unreleased software and hardware especially when it comes to speculating about what features are or aren't in Lion. There is not problem with wanting to discuss possibilities, probabilities or even announced features. The problem is this is not a discussion on your part, you are ASKING US TO TELL YOU WHAT THE NEW PLATFORMS WILL BE LIKE! We can't do that, we can only discuss what might be in the systems.
I really don't think you grasp the tone of your message thus the suggestion to reread it. I wouldn't even get excited about that if it wasn't that previous experience has shown that people that post like you have simply don't grasp the difference between a speculative discussion and a discussion based on fact. When the subject at hand finally debuts and comes up short in any regards then you come back here mad at everybody for being "wrong". It is very very annoying to those of us that have been on the forum for more than a couple of years. Especially when it happens again and again.
As an example we could discuss one element of the new machines. That would be the possibility of the new MBPs supporting SSD. There are a number of ways that Apple could go about supporting a flash boot disk but no body knows which avenue Apple will take if the bother at all. Until the hardware is released it is all speculation.
but thus far, it doesn't look as though Lion is going to increase hardware requirements.
The "thus far" says it all. We really won't know much about Lion until the next WWDC. Which brings up another point it may be late fall before Lion is even released. Usually the secrets are revealed for developers at the WWDC and then the actual OS is released some time later.
Otherwise I agree Lion will work on current hardware to some extent or another.
I think Apple's probably lining up for a feature-complete beta release of Lion for the Worldwide Developer's Conference in the spring. This will give developers a few months to make changes or tweaks in their apps to take advantage of any new APIs or features in Lion, before it goes on sale & becomes available later in the summer.
Later in the summer being October, right? You know Apple; release dates are suggestions, not deadlines.
No, I'd say Lion will hit the streets in late August, like the 26th.
I'd suggest late September or October. Likely to coincide with a laptop refresh.
For example, Lion is described as bringing current-gen iOS features "back to the Mac." In that vein, is the current-gen multi-touch trackpad capable of doing everything the current-gen iOS does/requires? If so, great. If not, that means it might be smart to wait until Lion to buy new portable hardware.
Here we go again, how can we possibly comment on hardware and software that is not shipping?
And you're asking me to re-read my comments? Good grief.
Please re-read the above. I'm not asking about future hardware; I'm asking about the current-gen trackpad and the current-gen iOS. Answering this shouldn't require speculation at all, so I don't know why you keep getting so worked up about it.
Dave you're such a pessimist haha.
It is just Apples way of late. It would be great for Apple to release final quickly but that seldom serves the greater good. The greater good being developers that have to update their software and the associated bug report/bug fix cycles.
As it is to justify the cost of a paid update Mac OS/X will need a lot more than a minor layer of iOS look alike features. Since we really don't know what those features are we can't really say how difficult it will be for developers to update to LION, if thy need to.
Hello all ... Longtime lurker, first-time poster, etc., etc.
I know this site needs another "next-gen MBP" thread like it needs a DoS attack, but I have a question that I haven't seen discussed much, if at all:
I'm using a very old Apple laptop and I'm hoping for an MacBook Pro refresh (esp. the 17-inch) soon after Sandy Bridge is released. (Personally, I believe Apple is likely to issue such a refresh ASAP since it's been 9 months since the last refresh.)
That said, I'm also well aware that Mac OS X Lion is due in 2011, and I'm wondering if Lion is expected to have hardware implications for the MBP. I know the theme is "Back to the Mac" and that Lion will bring iOS features to the Mac OS, which is great, but what are people's best guesses re: the hardware implications? If a refreshed MBP is released in Jan. or Feb. 2011, are those machines likely to be fully compatible with (and capable of performing/utilizing all features of) Mac OS X Lion (except maybe for Lightpeak), or are larger hardware issues expected?
Thanks very much for all feedback.
I'm not expecting an Apple engineer to come here and answer. I'm asking people who have followed the Lion info. if Lion is likely to have a hardware impact. (Apple has released some info. on Lion, right? I'm not asking for inside info. or pure speculation.)
This forum is weird. What's the point of having a "Future Hardware" forum if simple questions about future hardware are met with such juvenile replies?
(My thanks to the people above who actually tried to answer the question.)
And you're asking me to re-read my comments? Good grief.
Please re-read the above. I'm not asking about future hardware; I'm asking about the current-gen trackpad and the current-gen iOS. Answering this shouldn't require speculation at all, so I don't know why you keep getting so worked up about it.
You would have done well to have reread your previous posts. It is quite annoying when posters deny saying what they clearly said. From your OP to your most recent post, you have been persistent in your questions about Lion and its implications to future Mac hardware. This is hardly surprising as this is the Future Hardware area of the forum. If you were interested in current hardware, then most members assume that you would have posted your question in the Current Hardware area. Two points:
- MacOS X 10.7 will fully support all hardware configurations that it can be installed on. However, the new OS cannot enable features that the hardware does not support.
- MacOS X 10.7 will have no hardware implications. Apple's practice is to introduce major hardware revisions powered by special builds of a mature OS. It will follow sometime later with a new point release that incorporates support for the new hardware as well as for old hardware going back five years more or less. I can recall no instance where Apple introduced new hardware that was designed exclusively for a brand new OS--brand new hardware categories notwithstanding.
What this means is that if major hardware revisions to the Mac are coming, then they will come at least several months prior to the release of Lion.