Vegetarianism

xionja

I was wondering how many Apple users are vegetarians, and what there reasons are for it. Personally I am disgusted by the e-coli outbreak from Conagra from Greeley, Colorado. I visited Greeley on a research trip with my dad after reading the book "Fast Food Nation,

The Dark Side of the All-American Meal"

By ERIC SCHLOSSER (recomened reading)



<a href="http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/ASIN/0060938455/102-7970698-7219335"; target="_blank">http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/ASIN/0060938455/102-7970698-7219335</a>;



The entire town stinks of industrial products. There are countless meat packing plants there. Everything is greasy and gross. The also produce windex in Greeley, do you want that in your big mac? I have been a vegetarian since kindergarten and once I was old enough to come up with my own reason for it, I concluded that it was becuase I could never kill a cow or a pig or anything. I just couldn't kill it. . . I think eating meat is justifyied if you kill the animal your self, I respect hunters, who hunt for their own food. I think it is nasty that so many americans eat the animal before even knowing what it is. I love meat(well the fake stuff that is) and am a recent convert to Quorn <a href="http://quorn.com"; target="_blank">http://quorn.com</a>; Its really healthy and yummy, they really get the texture down too. I guess it would be cool if people put down there own opinions about vegetarianism and reason for being or not being a vegetarian.

squash

I used to be...was for like 5 years of my life. Finally decided chicken and fish were not that bad for me. I honestly got sick of the limited choices of eating out without fish or chicken at least in my diet.



I do eat beef now once and awhile, but I keep it pretty limited.

matsu

There is no good reason to be a vegetarian. Go get yourself a rifle, kill it and cook it. All natural, the way nature intended. Never forget that the Human species is by design a predatory one. Perhaps not with the physical perfection of a cat, but in most other ways. We need meat. What we don't need are breads/grains (at least not in the quantities we eat them) Meat, fish, about ten times the vegetables and fruits most people eat, and a little (very little grain) is all you need.



As a matter of priniciple I don't like waste, so we shouoldn't eat too high on the food chain all the time. But any non-human is fair game at least sometimes.

evo

I've been a pseudo vegetarian all my life. I eat chicken, turkey, and eggs, but that's it. I never eat pork, beef, or seafood (I just hate the taste of it). I guess it's because of the way I was raised. My parents, who are vegetarians, chose to raise me as one also, and I'm glad. Scientists say vegetarians live longer, healthier lives. Because we have long, slow digestive systems, meat that we eat tends to stay in the body for a long time and rots... which isn't exactly healthy.



Because I don't eat much variety of foods in general, I find it hard to go through a day without at least eating chicken, which is why I eat it. It DOES give me protein and other nutrients I would have a hard time finding somewhere else. If I had an appetite for a wider selection of foods, I'd probably go off meat altogether.



I'm an environmentally conscious person, and I think that humans over-exploit animals. Americans certainly don't need to be eating as many greasy burgers as we do. Yet, we continue to do so (the percentage of overweight children continues to increase), and, [sarcasm] strangly we see more and more McDonald's and Burger Kings everywhere [/sarcasm] (both of which fast food joints I completely avoid).



I don't think American diets will change though, as fast food companies have a tractor beam on our stomachs with unrelenting, ubiquitous, and powerful burger marketing. [sarcasm]I guess we can thank the great prescription drug companies for releasing pills to help us reduce cholestorol and help us with our diet, that'll sure get to the root of the problem.[/sarcasm]



I guess done ranting, there's nothing I can do to change the world. Americans can't stop stuffing their faces with burgers and steaks. I'm glad I'm not one of them.

_ alliance _

i am an athlete that eats as much greasy fast food as i can handle. yep, sometimes it does slow me down, but hey, its the american way. can life get any better than sitting on my ass, sipping a soda, stuffing a huge cheeseburger down my throat, followed by an order of cheesefries and finished off w/ a dozen beers?? i mean, sometimes i get criticized for being so health-consious, but i dont care. hell, i think i might even make it past 30 w/out a heartattack. my friends are laughing now, but ill have the last laugh...

sc_markt

I think its cruel to eat innocent and helpless vegetables. The poor things cannot even run away to save themselves. They just innocently stand (or hang) there with their sweet little halos over them until some brutal and selfish veggie farmer hacks their sweet little life out of them.

_ alliance _

[quote]Originally posted by sc_markt:

<strong>I think its cruel to eat innocent and helpless vegetables. The poor things cannot even run away to save themselves. They just innocently stand (or hang) there with their sweet little halos over them until some brutal and selfish veggie farmer hacks their sweet little life out of them.</strong><hr></blockquote>





thats why i only eat dirt. noone can ever call me a murderer...

ghost_user_name

[quote]Originally posted by Matsu:

<strong>Go get yourself a rifle [...] All natural, the way nature intended. </strong><hr></blockquote>



<img src="graemlins/bugeye.gif" border="0" alt="[Skeptical]" /> Think about that one for a sec.



And you go hunting in Toronto on a regular basis?



[ 07-21-2002: Message edited by: Nick ]</p>

ghost_user_name

I don't trust anyone that doesn't eat meat



"Not eating meat is a decision, eating meat is an instinct"

matsu

There's a lot of farm country around here. A 60 minute drive will take you where you need to go. While I haven't shot much myself, I usually don't get my meat from the grocerie. Maybe my community is weird but I know a lot of families that buy thir lamb, goat, pork, beef, and chicken from small family farms and not big factory operations. You get to know people, you know what and how the animals have been fed and slaughtered. It's just a little weird when you have to pack a whole cow. Usually a few families go in together and split it up, otherwise you'll eat beef for breakfast lunch and dinner over the next half year. Yes, you haven't lived untill you've de-feathered chickens. Yes, my background is that weird.



London's only 4 hours away, Nick. You got a lot of Italians, Portuguese, Greeks? Germans (yes of course, you have Menonites and Amish a little northeast of you) They like their pork products. There's plenty of meat that has been raised/slaughtered/prepared in an enviromentally responsible, healthy way, but (often) not at the grocer.

cosmonut

Although I'm definitely NOT a vegetarian, I'm finding that I don't have much of a desire to eat red meat or deep-fried foods (except fries) anymore. Oh, I have the occasional cheesburger, and like I said, fries are still on the menu. Anymore, however, I've been eating a lot more grilled and baked chicken, seafoods, pastas, etc.



My reasoning for all that is that beef just tends to be too greasy for me anymore, and I feel lethargic after eating it. I don't care about what happens to the cows, (how they're treated, etc.) I just don't want to eat much beef. Chicken, seafood, and pastas tend to be lighter, I don't feel as "dirty" after eating them.



As far as my opinions on vegetarianism, I'd have to say that I generally don't agree with it. Well, I understand if, for verifiable medical purposes, that ends up being the diet you have to eat, but most of the time people either do it for the socio-political "statement" it makes, or for the fad factor. Of course, no vegetarian would admit to either of those, but I've known enough veggers to know that that's the case.



But hey, to each his own.



[ 07-21-2002: Message edited by: CosmoNut ]</p>

willoughby

I've been a Vegan for most of my life. I don't eat anything with a face or a family, or anything that comes from something that has a face or a family.



Health reasons are #1 for me being a Vegan.

Ethical reasons are #2.

xionja

Its natural for people to kill things than eat them, its a good thing, because well we are near the top of the food chain, but is it ethical to not have any participation in the slaughtering of animals that you eat? Wouldn't it be more ethical if all the fat people who spend more time eating at mcdonalds and watching tv that anything else didn't get meat unless they could kill it themselves? that would at least be funny to watch.

Some of the healthyiest tribes in this world, have no meat in their diet. another good book - The botany of desire.

ghost_user_name

[quote]Originally posted by CosmoNut:

<strong> Well, I understand if, for verifiable medical purposes, that ends up being the diet you have to eat, but most of the time people either do it for the socio-political "statement" it makes, or for the fad factor.</strong><hr></blockquote>



You imply that most vegetarians are disingenuous? The level of ignorance here is amazing.

ghost_user_name

[quote]Originally posted by Matsu:

<strong>There is no good reason to be a vegetarian. </strong><hr></blockquote>



Ignorance is indeed bliss. How about "Health Reasons?"

_ alliance _

mmm...bacon cheeseburger...

damn, i make myself sick.

cosmonut

[quote]Originally posted by sjpsu:

<strong>



Ignorance is indeed bliss. How about "Health Reasons?"</strong><hr></blockquote>



Okay, let's hear the LEGITIMATE, proven reasons that vegetarianism is more healthy than eating meats. I want sources.



For MANY veggies, it IS a sociopolitical statement: "I don't like the way the cows are treated, so I'm going to be vegetarian. Oh yeah, I guess it can be healthy too."



For me, the inconvenience of trying to stay on a vegetarian diet EVERYWHERE I go and with EVERYTHING I eat is more of a drawback than it is to just eat a reasonable diet and exercise accordingly.



[ 07-21-2002: Message edited by: CosmoNut ]</p>

outsider

I respect the vegetarian choice, and it's just that, a choice in lifestyle. But after careful consideration years ago I personally decided that humans are omnivorous animals and our bodies are designed to consume and metabolize both meat AND vegetable matter. HOW we get the meat is up for debate; either killing it ourselves of going to the Stop & Shop and purchasing it. I mean, I don't grow and pick my own veggies, why should I be forced to hunt and kill my own meat? Humans are at the peak of the food chain and with that comes several perks.

cdhostage

I agree with the statment

"in order to eat meat, you should kill ity yourself."



Seeing as that's not practical for millions of Americans to slit their own hamburger's throats or push in the old electric dildo (what's the modern way of doing it? Microwaving their brains while they're in a small room?) I suggest:



That all American schools' cafeterias be divided into tweo parts: vegetarian and meat-eating. The sides are separated by aa osunfproff barrier. The meat-eaters have TVs on all their sides with videos of alaughterhouses shown constantly, with sound.



Hmm.... no Texas chili sold today...



Or even better -

I'm thinking of earning a billion dollars and setting up a prep school. The motto will be "hard work and respect."

Respect for

other ways of life

other views

laws of America

life



Most of the kitchen work, groundskeeping, manual labor, etc, will be done by students leaqrning how tpo do the jobs.

In order gto eat meat, you have to have killed something that school year.



So the first days of school are vegetarian-only, then we have a Sunday dinner: chicken.

In order to eat chicken, you must join the gorup going to the farmhouse and cut off a chicken's head with a hatchet, then clean and feather and otherwise prepare the chicken for cooking.

matsu

Should people eat (proportionally) far greater amounts of fruits and vegetables than they currently do? Yes, absolutely. However, there are absolutely NO HEALTH REASONS for eliminating all animal products from your diet. In fact, such a condition would be (over the long run) seriously detrimental unless a radical system of dietary compensation were in place. Look at the anthropological evidence. Meat or fish is the dietary adjuster that rights many protein, fat, and vitamin deficiencies in most archaic diets. It's how we evolved, omnivorous. Take the Asian and Amer-Indian body type as a case study. When the first Europeans arrived in the Americas they marvelled at the health and longevity of the red people: white teeth, lean bodies, thick hair, a surprising number of elderly people who showed little sign of feebleness. (Of course European germs cured them of all that health, but that's besides the point.)



Asians are basically the same people as the pre-land-bridge Amer-Indians. Much thinner, smaller, generally the most androgenous race. Also, please, without racist pretensions, changed in complexion (less robust pigment), and altered (over time) facial features. Why? Centuries of malnutrition. But they are also long-lived. Curious. There are studies that show low-calorie diets may significantly affect an increased life-span. Couple that to centuries of genetic adaptation and it would be possible to produce a race with longevity characteristics, yet still be fundamentally altered from a dietary imbalance. Remember, the non-vegetarian Indians of North America also displayed much greater longevity than their European contemporaries. Longevity and vegetarianism do not neccessarily correlate. Take the Menonites. (I don't know about the Amish). The Menonites of Ontario have higher than average lifespans, and significantly fewer health problems. They are NOT Vegetarians. They eat a lot of pork (german ancestry) and beef and diary. But they also eat A LOT of vegetables and an enormous amount of apples. And, of course, they are virtually free of processed food and commercial pesticides in their family crops.



People starved for meat (in subsistence cultures opulating extreme enviroments) have taken to all manner of dietary compensation from, eating insects, earth and tree barks (decomposing types for certain fungii), to bleeding animals too precious to kill, and recycling the bones of their own dead. Notice that the special meals almost invariably involve a kill. This is mostly social, but the prized dishes nearly always contain fats, and protien. From South America, to feudal Europe, 'rich foods' always contained some animal product in them. This is social, but it is also a dietary evolution. It adresses the lack of certain elements from a mainly herbivorous diet in similar fashion to the way the head lion or wolf eats the entrails (the most nutritious) of the animal first.



Of course, as 'taste' consciously evolved, dietary choices became more or less fashionable and the archaic dietary-social evolutions became obscured. Rest assured, you are at least partly a meat eater, and your body will reward you if you respect that.

willoughby

Prove to me that you're healtheir because you eat meat. You can't. I don't just "not eat meat". I don't eat any chemicals, nitrates or man-made cancer causing agents that are constantly being injected into meat.



My cholesterol level is ultra low, while my good cholesterol is above average. I don't have high blood pressure, low iron, or elevated blood sugar levels. I'm lean and rarely get sick.



I go to the doctor once a year for a full check up, which includes having all my blood levels checked. There's never a problem.



I get all the protein, vitamins and minerals I need from plant sources. Yes, even B12 (forteified in my soy milk).



I never have a problem finding something to eat, even in restaurants.



I don't preach to anyone, I never get involved in protests and I even eat out with friends who have no problem eating a large steak dinner. They never hear a peep from me.



So what's the big deal? Is it really so strange that my diet doesn't conform to yours? Do you really think I have some hidden agenda?



People get too uptight in defending the status quo. You should do what you think is right and what makes you feel good. Leave everyone else alone.