Verizon was 'never in the running' for original iPhone, says CEO

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Comments

  • Reply 21 of 47
    -hh-hh Posts: 31member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by AppleInsider View Post


    ...During the interview, Seidenberg cited an "hilarious" statistic: "90 percent of the traffic on the Internet in five years will be video."



    I anticipate readership confusion on the above statement: it isn't that 90% of the things a user will do will become video ... it is saying that 90% of a user's bandwidth consumption will be consumed by video.



    Comparing the filesize of a 1 minute video clip to a 1 minute music file (or a phone call), this claim isn't particularly ... surprising ... at all.



    However, the bigger question is why whould it be described as being ... "hilarious" ... ?



    I think the answer comes from Seidenberg himself, as the Fox in the Henhouse: it comes down to the data caps and $$/GB rate structure being worked up by the service providers for consumers to pay ... thus, the reason for the "hilarious" tag is because they'll be laughing all their way to the bank.





    -hh
  • Reply 22 of 47
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by diamondgeeza View Post


    yeah right because a non GSM phone is really useful on the rest of the planet...



    China, India, Canada, Mexico, South Korea...



    Your house is not the "rest of the planet".
  • Reply 23 of 47
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by CEOstevie View Post


    Eventually, it is likely that ATT will start carrying some good Android phones. My guess is sooner rather than later. None of them are famous for signal attenuation, detuning or dropped calls. It is also likely that Apple will fix the antenna problems on the ATT iPhone eventually.



    Hang in there.



    Apparently, they will start carrying them late this quarter or early next. They announced the Motorola Atrix, HTC Inspire, and some top-end Samsung phone (can't remember the name) at CES, and said they will all be coming soon. All of them are really high-end devices too, especially the Atrix. Look them up, though, at the very least the spec sheets are incredible.
  • Reply 24 of 47
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Tallest Skil View Post


    China, India, Canada, Mexico, South Korea...



    Your house is not the "rest of the planet".



    Well, CDMA used to be the majority in Canada, both Bell and Telus have switched to GSM.



    No market here for CDMA iPhones any more.
  • Reply 25 of 47
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by whatisgoingon View Post


    Their existing customers certainly appreciate how they are changing their upgrade policies so that unless your existing contract has been pretty much completed, no discounted iPhone for you!



    And of course, Verizon will actively degrade video from sources that don't originate from Verizon or one of their partners.



    Once the iPhone get's going on their network, I also expect Verizon to also flip from having more generous data plans than AT&T to ones with lower limits than AT&T, in order to 'differentiate' their plans...



    The "New Every Two" discount gave you an additional $100 off for waiting the entire 2 years of your contract instead of upgrading sooner. This is on top of new subscriber pricing, so you'd be able to get a 16gb Verizon iPhone for only $99 instead of $199. It's a nice way to keep a customer at the end of their contract.



    Their new phone policy of 13 months was also very generous, but clearly unsustainable if they got the iPhone. The average cost of a smartphone to Verizon is $529, but the iPhone is $599-699. Giving people new phones practically every year would hurt their bottom line.
  • Reply 26 of 47
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by addabox View Post


    Sure did seem to be a lot of people over the years, authoritatively declaring on these boards that Apple went to Verizon first and got told to go take a hike. Crazy old control freak Jobs overstepped his bounds and had to go plead his case to AT&T after Verizon showed him the door, or so the story went.



    No worries, though-- this bit of urban legend will still be dredged up whenever and wherever Apple haters have an axe to grind, till the end of time.



    Straight from the horse's mouth: "We said no." Said Jim Gerace, a VZW VP. "We have nothing bad to say about the Apple iPhone. We just couldn't reach a deal that was mutually beneficial." Talks began as far back as two years ago, but Apple's demands were steep. They also give us an idea of what exactly is behind the Apple / Cingular agreement: Apple wanted a percentage of monthly service fees, control over distribution that would limit iPhone sales to Apple and Verizon stores, and even some control over service and support for iPhone customers. "They would have been stepping in between us and our customers to the point where we would have almost had to take a back seat ... on hardware and service support," say Gerace. (these comments were from 2007)
  • Reply 27 of 47
    neilmneilm Posts: 606member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by macologist View Post


    I want to have Simultaneous Voice & Data, and Rollover Minutes, but I also want to be able to use the phone! As is the case now, it seems impossible to do both, unless one is in a good ATT area, and their Network is not too busy!



    You don't reveal where you're located, but I've never had any problem worth worrying about with AT&T coverage, either where I live or in the various places to which I've traveled, since switching to them from VZ over 2 years ago. And VZ is clearly the dominant carrier in my area.



    This isn't to say that other people's coverage issues aren't real, only to point out that they aren't universal. Dare I add that people in NYC may be more vocal than average when they're not happy?



    All that said, US cellular coverage overall is pathetic compared to that in western Europe.
  • Reply 28 of 47
    rot'napplerot'napple Posts: 1,839member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by mgl323 View Post


    Yeah, they went to AT&T, right after Verizon rejected Apple from the start.



    That's what I think happened... Here is my conspiracy theory....



    Let's take a look back to 2005 Apple Music Event with the release of iTunes 5, iPod Nano and of course ROKR...



    You know the ROKR, the phone that had iTunes "installed" on a Motorola Phone to be used on Cingular's network. Didn't Cingular purchase ATT and kept the name in 2004? About the time Apple, Jobs and company would be doing the wheeling and dealing and workup of the product at that time for the June 2005 release at the Apple music event?



    I remember watching that event and was amazed at the barely lip service Jobs gave to the ROKR. It wasn't a "and one more thing" as in SURPRISE!. It was more like an afterthought, "Oh, by the way..." and took all of 5 minutes to introduce product, introduce Cingular's CEO to talk about it, brief description and very brief demo.



    What does that tell me?



    Jobs first foray into dealing with outside phone manufacturers "Motorola" and "ATT er Cingular" phone carrier. The product was not really worthy to have Apple associated with it... really. I'm sure it was not what Jobs had in mind but was what he could get at the time based on numerous factors, such as clout, Apple's market share, did they finish paying off Microsoft's loan that propped Apple up in the lean times, the limits of the technology itself... very important, dealing with "Phone Guys" (as Palm ex-CEO Ed Colligan likes to refer to PC guys), Motorola and Cingular, etc. So maybe Apple, as part of it's plan but not solely the plan, it just worked out that way, that Apple working on iOS and iPad, moved to iPhone with the iOS technology, and then went shopping for a carrier in order to know what to build. Having dealt with Cingular, er ATT, maybe decided to give Verizon the opportunity, to which they were shot down. We know it's a big mistake now but at the time, Apple's iPhone success could of "remained to be seen". After all, Apple gave us the hockey puck mouse, MobileMe release debacle and The Mac Cube. So we know Cupertino doesn't always bat 1000. Apple had the basis for what an Apple brand phone technology could do, they just needed to know what carrier of the two biggest, would give them a shot and knowing Steve's ego, on Apple's terms, Verizon didn't need the hassle of dealing with Steve, but ATT needed a niche that differentiated it against Verizon because it had nothing going for them. Other words, Verizon said "No" (so no CDMA crafted phone), while ATT said yes (Jobs to Apple, order those GSM radio chips!) to a sight unseen product based on Apple terms. Why was it a "unseen" product... Vaporware until Apple could design and build knowing which chips and technology to put into the thing, that would compliment the iOS which was already developed. Why would I say this, because that's what Stan Sigman CEO of Cingular said at Apple's January 2007 iPhone's first introduction prior to FCC approval and June's release.



    "10:48am - "When's it going to be available? We're shipping them in June -- we're announcing it today because we have to go get FCC approval... we thought it'd be better to introduce this today rather than let the FCC introduce this.

    Europe in the 4th quarter of this year, Asia in 2008. "We've chosen Cingular."



    "They're going to be our exclusive partner in the US -- it's a unique partnership though. We're going to be doing innovation together. We worked on visual voicemail, the first fruit of this collaboration. We'll be selling iPhone through our own stores and Cingular stores."



    10:49am - "It's my pleasure to introduce the CEO of Cingular, Stan Sigman." Why hello Stanny boy.



    "We entered into contractual agreement without ever even seeing the phone -- that's because of the confidence I have of Steve to deliver on his vision..."



    That's my conspiriacy theory and I'm stick'n to it!



    AGAIN MY CONSPIRACY THEORY, so take it for what it is worth!

    /

    /

    /
  • Reply 29 of 47
    iliveriliver Posts: 299member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by addabox View Post


    Sure did seem to be a lot of people over the years, authoritatively declaring on these boards that Apple went to Verizon first and got told to go take a hike. Crazy old control freak Jobs overstepped his bounds and had to go plead his case to AT&T after Verizon showed him the door, or so the story went.



    No worries, though-- this bit of urban legend will still be dredged up whenever and wherever Apple haters have an axe to grind, till the end of time.



    Don't forget that they're were a lot of Apple zealots on here , some on my ignore list, that bashed Verizon left and right for this over the years and blamed Verizon not Jobs and praised AT&T regardless of the bad signal and service.

    It is the deranged Apple lover who will always bash everybody and anybody when it comes to blame- never Apple.
  • Reply 30 of 47
    pmzpmz Posts: 3,433member
    The gist of that article is pretty informative if you read it carefully enough. Seems that Verizon feels that although they are behind AT&T today, they're in a position to blow past them in terms of value and quality of service in the next few years. They seem pretty confident that they're at a point now where they can not only tackle Apple, but be the best provider within 5 years.



    I for one, will enjoy watching the rivalry.
  • Reply 31 of 47
    If Verizon Wireless switches to capped data as rumorred, I don't know how we are going to watch so much video unless it is over wifi.
  • Reply 32 of 47
    pmzpmz Posts: 3,433member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by gwlaw99 View Post


    If Verizon Wireless switches to capped data as rumorred, I don't know how we are going to watch so much video unless it is over wifi.



    According to the carriers, 2-5 gb a month is all you should need. Isn't that nice?



    I for one will keep my unlimited data plan, forever.
  • Reply 33 of 47
    solipsismsolipsism Posts: 25,726member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by pmz View Post


    According to the carriers, 2-5 gb a month is all you should need. Isn't that nice?



    I for one will keep my unlimited data plan, forever.



    That may not be possible. Remember, the contracts are to lock you in, not the carrier. They can cancel these contracts at any time they wish, but if they do you can then leave the carrier without paying the ETF fee. If you are not in a contract they can adjust the amount of data and prices just as they did with the contract-free iPad WiFi+3G. Either way, there is no guaranteed lock in for your unlimited data plan. Personally, I hope the Verizon iPhone will affect AT&T enough to keep that they continue to allow those with unlimited plans to maintain them.
  • Reply 34 of 47
    mjtomlinmjtomlin Posts: 1,854member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Rot'nApple View Post


    After all, Apple gave us the hockey puck mouse, MobileMe release debacle and The Mac Cube. So we know Cupertino doesn't always bat 1000... did they finish paying off Microsoft's loan that propped Apple up in the lean times ...



    We get it. Apple is not perfect! My world just came crashing down on me. Damn you! Rot'nApple.



    But you forgot, the Apple III, OpenDoc and Copland! Also the Pippin' and eWorld!



    You seem to mention this in just about every one of your posts. With a user name like "Rot'nApple" I can't imagine why anyone would ever take you seriously - you obvious have a biased opinion and because of that, have somehow let emotion get in the way of logic.



    Sorry, but to be anti-something as you are takes as much blind-ignorance and energy as it does to be a zealot or raving fanboy. They are the same, just on opposite sides.





    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Rot'nApple View Post


    Didn't Cingular purchase ATT and kept the name in 2004



    Cingular purchased AT&T Wireless, not AT&T, and kept the Cingular name. SBC then purchased AT&T and changed their name to AT&T (no more SBC name). Then AT&T purchased Cingular while Apple and Cingular were wheeling and dealing.





    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Rot'nApple View Post


    I remember watching that event and was amazed at the barely lip service Jobs gave to the ROKR. It wasn't a "and one more thing" as in SURPRISE!. It was more like an afterthought, "Oh, by the way..." and took all of 5 minutes to introduce product, introduce Cingular's CEO to talk about it, brief description and very brief demo.



    At the time Motorola was the best selling mobile phone manufacturer in the US with the RAZR. So it was kind of a big deal (in the industry) to partner with them on the ROKR. The device itself wasn't really anything special, but that's not Apple's fault. All Apple supplied was the ability to play FairPlay tracks. That was kind of a big deal, because up until that point only the iPod could play FairPlay.





    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Rot'nApple View Post


    Why was it a "unseen" product... Vaporware until Apple could design and build knowing which chips and technology to put into the thing, that would compliment the iOS which was already developed



    "Vaporware" is a term applied to ANNOUNCED products that NEVER materialize in the time frame given. It does not apply to products that have never been announced or promised to customers. Until that time this is usually referred to as R&D (research and development). Your use of vaporware is just a negative connotation in an attempt to belittle Apple's development efforts.



    It was an unseen device at the time because it was still under development. Steve Jobs himself said they started out designing an OS for a tablet and realized they could build a phone around it. I'm guessing they didn't start designing the hardware until after they had a carrier as a partner, which makes absolute sense. Why waste time and money on developing a prototype for product that requires a partnership with an outside company until you know who that partner is going to be and what tech is needed to build it? Simple really.





    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Rot'nApple View Post


    AGAIN MY CONSPIRACY THEORY, so take it for what it is worth!



    Here's my two cents.
  • Reply 35 of 47
    Gonna be my strategy! We're in a rural area where ATT service is spotty, so we've waited for a VZ iPhone. It'll take two years (at least) before VZ's "convergence" network is reasonably complete. So 2012, or even 2013, will be a good time to finally buy a "universal" phone we can use both at home and overseas.
  • Reply 36 of 47
    mjtomlinmjtomlin Posts: 1,854member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Johnny Mozzarella View Post


    Straight from the horse's mouth: "We said no." Said Jim Gerace, a VZW VP. "We have nothing bad to say about the Apple iPhone. We just couldn't reach a deal that was mutually beneficial." Talks began as far back as two years ago, but Apple's demands were steep. They also give us an idea of what exactly is behind the Apple / Cingular agreement: Apple wanted a percentage of monthly service fees, control over distribution that would limit iPhone sales to Apple and Verizon stores, and even some control over service and support for iPhone customers. "They would have been stepping in between us and our customers to the point where we would have almost had to take a back seat ... on hardware and service support," say Gerace. (these comments were from 2007)



    Hey! This is a fanboy site... keep your facts and your quotes to yourself. We only accept heresay and conjecture here.
  • Reply 37 of 47
    stompystompy Posts: 334member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by mjtomlin View Post


    Hey! This is a fanboy site... keep your facts and your quotes to yourself. We only accept heresay and conjecture here.



    Right on. Can we get the mods in here please?
  • Reply 38 of 47
    shadashshadash Posts: 470member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by cnocbui View Post


    CDMA is a tiny little niche market, GSM is huge by comparison. Why do some people think Apple would have preferred to have launched a CDMA - almost USA only device - rather than a global product?



    Please explain your reasoning. Should be entertaining. at least.



    No one is saying Apple should only have built a CDMA version of the iPhone. Why don't you explain to us why you think Apple couldn't have built both, like they are going to now.
  • Reply 39 of 47
    mazda 3smazda 3s Posts: 1,570member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by solipsism View Post


    That may not be possible. Remember, the contracts are to lock you in, not the carrier. They can cancel these contracts at any time they wish, but if they do you can then leave the carrier without paying the ETF fee. If you are not in a contract they can adjust the amount of data and prices just as they did with the contract-free iPad WiFi+3G. Either way, there is no guaranteed lock in for your unlimited data plan. Personally, I hope the Verizon iPhone will affect AT&T enough to keep that they continue to allow those with unlimited plans to maintain them.



    So let's say that when the iPhone 5 comes out in June, and AT&T decides to nix my unlimited data for a 2GB plan, and I've still got a year left on my contract. Are you saying I could then get out with no ETF and keep my phone?
  • Reply 40 of 47
    solipsismsolipsism Posts: 25,726member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Mazda 3s View Post


    So let's say that when the iPhone 5 comes out in June, and AT&T decides to nix my unlimited data for a 2GB plan, and I've still got a year left on my contract. Are you saying I could then get out with no ETF and keep my phone?



    Yes. I?ve seen this and experienced before with carriers buying other carriers.



    I don?t think that will happen here. I think doing that would lose to many of these high-value customers still under contract. If they really want to do this there best bet is likely just to not allow you keep the Unlimited plan when you go re-up your contract with a new subsidized device. Even this is questionable if they are losing too many customers to Verizon.
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