Apple indicates final Xserve orders won't ship for two more months

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  • Reply 21 of 40
    anonymouseanonymouse Posts: 6,581member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Mynameisjoe View Post


    Does any major Internet company buy servers from HP or Dell? I'm pretty sure that the big boys like Google, Amazon, and Microsoft custom build their own servers. I truely doubt Apple would buy servers from someone else. Since they are discontinuing the X-Serve I wouldn't be surprised if they are moving away from blade servers. I'll choose to speculate that they move on to their own custom built super computers (don't have any good reason to believe this, but it would be the coolest solution).



    I don't know what other companies are doing, but they could build their own servers, and run either OS X Server, or simply Darwin, on them.
  • Reply 22 of 40
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Mynameisjoe View Post


    Does any major Internet company buy servers from HP or Dell? I'm pretty sure that the big boys like Google, Amazon, and Microsoft custom build their own servers. I truely doubt Apple would buy servers from someone else. Since they are discontinuing the X-Serve I wouldn't be surprised if they are moving away from blade servers. I'll choose to speculate that they move on to their own custom built super computers (don't have any good reason to believe this, but it would be the coolest solution).



    Why would you make a custom server? Just about any company uses some form of HP or Dell or IBM system, coupled with other hardware equipment. It isn't as if you would come out ahead either.



    People like HP make great servers to begin with. If you want a more direct solution there is Super Micro and the like.
  • Reply 23 of 40
    mstonemstone Posts: 11,510member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Blastdoor View Post


    More likely Oracle/Sun (remember SJ's bff is Larry E.)



    In blade servers, Sun only offers AMD or Sparc chips. So they would be running Solaris, which is fine but they don't make very good hackintoshes.
  • Reply 24 of 40
    rbryanhrbryanh Posts: 263member
    Not only does Apple now offer no attractive server hardware, it's not at all clear that they'll be offering any server OS six months from now. OS X Server has long been the neglected stepsister of the Mac lineup, and with no Lion version announced, seems likely to be moved from the kitchen to the bottom of the river.



    (WIth his usual unnerving sense of timing, my cat vomited on an OS X Server install disc as I typed this. I will not presume to interpret the Oracle. His visions are as ambiguous as they are emphatic.)
  • Reply 25 of 40
    mstonemstone Posts: 11,510member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by rbryanh View Post


    Not only does Apple now offer no attractive server hardware, it's not at all clear that they'll be offering any server OS six months from now.



    I think there will be a 10.7 server. Only because it is pretty easy to port the server version once the standard OS X is done. The Server is mostly about add on anyway.



    I don't see Apple wanting to abandon:



    iCal server

    Quicktime streaming server

    Pod cast producer

    iChat server



    among other services, but those are unique to OS X server
  • Reply 26 of 40
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by mstone View Post


    I think there will be a 10.7 server. Only because it is pretty easy to port the server version once the standard OS X is done. The Server is mostly about add on anyway.



    I don't see Apple wanting to abandon:



    iCal server

    Quicktime streaming server

    Pod cast producer

    iChat server



    among other services, but those are unique to OS X server



    I disagree. With the de-commitment to "servers" in general I think those ARE then next things on the chopping block. No chance would I invest in those technologies from Apple. 2 of the 4 are dying technologies anyway. Stream via HTML5 and standard web services is replacing Quicktime streaming server and the didn't even bother to add Facetime to their iChat client so I don't see server progressing either. Either way Fool me once, shame on you... Fool me twice? nah... Apple really screwed some of the longest and most diehard advocates with this move.
  • Reply 27 of 40
    outsideroutsider Posts: 6,008member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by azentropy View Post


    I disagree. With the de-commitment to "servers" in general I think those ARE then next things on the chopping block. No chance would I invest in those technologies from Apple. 2 of the 4 are dying technologies anyway. Stream via HTML5 and standard web services is replacing Quicktime streaming server and the didn't even bother to add Facetime to their iChat client so I don't see server progressing either. Either way Fool me once, shame on you... Fool me twice? nah... Apple really screwed some of the longest and most diehard advocates with this move.



    Have to agree here. Long term we are going to be phasing out our final cut workstations and going back to ( bleh) Avid and NetApp for new storage to replace Xsan. Even Adobe Premeir is an option at this point.
  • Reply 28 of 40
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by azentropy View Post


    I disagree. With the de-commitment to "servers" in general I think those ARE then next things on the chopping block. No chance would I invest in those technologies from Apple. 2 of the 4 are dying technologies anyway. Stream via HTML5 and standard web services is replacing Quicktime streaming server and the didn't even bother to add Facetime to their iChat client so I don't see server progressing either. Either way Fool me once, shame on you... Fool me twice? nah... Apple really screwed some of the longest and most diehard advocates with this move.



    Wow. I just typed a huge and brilliant post and the site timed out my login and lost it. Bummer.

    I'll just retype my very first thought...



    With the success of the Mini server, you will very likely see 10.7 Server.
  • Reply 29 of 40
    You should have a look at this: http://activestorage.com/
  • Reply 30 of 40
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by zeph View Post


    That's my point. Apple's consumer-driven product road map leaves very little room for high-end niche products. I see the demise of the MacPro on the horizon. With that in mind, would it be so terrible if Apple licensed -say- Oracle to cater to the OSX pro market?



    That's just plain silly. Think before you make these comments.



    Apple enjoyed a very small following in the enterprise market with good, but limited products and relatively poor support capabilities. I am one of them, but experienced their shortcomings more than once.



    With Mac Pro's, Apple is absolutely dominating the high-end desktop market with over 90% market share on desktops over $1000.
  • Reply 31 of 40
    philboogiephilboogie Posts: 7,448member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by stonefree View Post


    I just hope Mac Pro isn't next on the chopping block



    Yeah, please Apple don't ever drop the MacPro. It probably isn't selling good, last quarter I think they sold 1.2 M desktops and with the Mini being 'popular' I guess they just don't sell that many. Probably a peak when a new one is released, but please don't discontinue any more of your fine products. Like the 30" Cinema Display. I got it the moment they announced it's death. Now only available as a refurb for $1299:

    http://store.apple.com/us/product/F9...co=MTY3ODQ5OTY



    Phil
  • Reply 32 of 40
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by al_bundy View Post


    The 1u server market is all but dead due to Vmware. With HP and Dell you can even get killer 1u servers that will run Vmware very well. Only reason to buy dedicated servers these days is for SQL server or oracle. And people are even starting to put database servers on Vmware for dr reasons



    Where I work we just bought 4 new HP servers that will blow away anything apple has. And a lot cheaper.



    Ssd's are a waste in servers except in small niches. The roi is not there.



    Xserve's were the only 1U servers we ever purchased, agreed. But I think it's a tired argument that Apple was expensive in the 1st tier server category. Pricing was definitely in the low to mid-range.



    I found that both HP and Dell (which have great server offerings) using Intel were absolutely in the same price range and usually more expensive.
  • Reply 33 of 40
    zephzeph Posts: 133member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Wolfman View Post


    With Mac Pro's, Apple is absolutely dominating the high-end desktop market with over 90% market share on desktops over $1000.



    OK, did not know that. Source?



    Although MacPro's remain the de facto standard in AV production, it is now an open secret that most cross-platform software runs better on Win7. Some industry-standard 3D software like Autodesk Maya is not even available for OSX at all.



    That combined with Apple's success in consumer electronics make me fear that they're losing interest in the pro-market, and understandably so. I have no idea about the margins, but with SJ saying that their strategy is to 'price things aggresively and go for volume', I just can't figure out how that applies to the MacPro.
  • Reply 34 of 40
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by zeph View Post


    Some industry-standard 3D software like Autodesk Maya is not even available for OSX at all.



    Not true. http://usa.autodesk.com/products/mac...tible-products



    It may be true that the Windows versions have improved functionality in a few areas, but the Mac versions are very capable.
  • Reply 35 of 40
    al_bundyal_bundy Posts: 1,525member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Wolfman View Post


    Xserve's were the only 1U servers we ever purchased, agreed. But I think it's a tired argument that Apple was expensive in the 1st tier server category. Pricing was definitely in the low to mid-range.



    I found that both HP and Dell (which have great server offerings) using Intel were absolutely in the same price range and usually more expensive.



    i have experience with HP and a 1U server will kill the xserve



    HP 1U servers come with 8 internal drive bays so you can buy less servers. the 2U servers can be bought with up to 16 internal drives. and HP has real SAS enterprise hard drives, not just SATA.



    and Xserves still use the previous generation Xeon CPU's. no choice of current gen Xeons



    HP Proliants also have what's called iLO. it's a special chip in the server that i can use to remotely push the power button. as long as the server has power and a NIC cable in the iLO port i can use my iphone to remotely push the power button on the server in case it hangs up. there are also a lot more management features that the iLO supports.



    i just configures a $15,000 Xserve. as a comparison my employer just bought 4 new HP 2U servers for just under $15,000. 2 6 core Xeon's in each one, 72GB RAM, 2 300GB hard drives in a RAID, 4 NIC's in each server, iLO, 5 year 4 hour warranty on each server, the ability to monitor and control the power usage, ability to use it without a KVM, etc.



    the reason people use dell and HP is you can buy less servers to handle the same workload and that's a big cost savings.



    as far as VMware it's a game changer. we used to always buy 1U's for some new weblogic or java app. now we have a few 2U servers and just run vmware and make new instances. every 2 years or so you just buy a new server to run vmware. the hardware is getting so cheap it's ridiculous how many more instances you can run on each new generation. even with database servers it's amazing. we used to run 30 some SQL servers. every year it's less and less because you can run more and more on each new generation of hardware



    xserves are where HP/Dell were 5-10 years ago as far as density on a server
  • Reply 36 of 40
    So Apple's gone from computer pioneer, to desktop publishing jugernaut, to 64-bit power systems embraced by the movie and scientific industries..............to now just a toymaker.



    Coming soon to a Toys 'R Us near you.....the iSpeak & Spell.....
  • Reply 37 of 40
    zephzeph Posts: 133member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by brianwells View Post


    Not true. http://usa.autodesk.com/products/mac...tible-products



    It may be true that the Windows versions have improved functionality in a few areas, but the Mac versions are very capable.



    That is not Maya, but AutoCad. Maya is Windows only:



    http://usa.autodesk.com/adsk/servlet...12&id=13583877
  • Reply 38 of 40
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by pondosinatra View Post


    So Apple's gone from computer pioneer, to desktop publishing jugernaut, to 64-bit power systems embraced by the movie and scientific industries..............to now just a toymaker...



    Yup and in that process became the most successful in its history. Ever.



    But I get what you are saying. iOS development is a new challenge for me though, a way to make me feel "high-end" when using Apple stuff. ...That and jailbreaking.
  • Reply 39 of 40
    welshdogwelshdog Posts: 1,694member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by mjpassos View Post


    You should have a look at this: http://activestorage.com/



    Yeah that looks very interesting. My guess would be that there is a Sun Sparc under that black cloth. And it is either going to run OS X server software directly or it is going to run it in Virtual Box with a slight Apple approved change in the licensing to allow that.



    Or



    Something Active Storage is putting together from standard, compatible chipsets/motherboards. And also with some special license agreement with Apple.



    This could be really good.



    Or is might just be some sort of Xsan server only. Not as interesting, but important nonetheless.
  • Reply 40 of 40
    zephzeph Posts: 133member
    .......
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