One jailbroken app I use is iBlacklist. My cell phone is my primary phone. Unfortunately for me, telemarketers have my number. A few have refused to take me off their list and I get calls all the time. AT&T won't block calls but will still charge me for the minutes used when these telemarketers do call. Apple doesn't allow me to block calls and they have not allowed any apps that do block calls into the app store. Jailbreaking and iBlacklist is the only solution if I want to be able to block telemarketers. And yes, I am on the Do Not Call Registry, which is useless. Maybe the user experience that Steve Jobs envisions is full of telemarketing. But for me, it's not. This is real, not a hypothetical. As for pirated books, there is no justification for that. But it seems that the anti-jailbreakers think that everyone who jailbreaks is out to pirate apps or steal something. Nothing could be further from the truth.
You can't effectively call block telemarketers on landlines, so it beats me how you can do it on a mobile phone, with or without the app.
Yes, you are absolutely right. I did buy as you pointed out. I still feel cheated.
Absolutely. I was just pointing out that the common perception of people that they have bought a book when they buy an ebook isn't correct in the case of an Apple DRM ebook. It's just a license, subject to whatever terms Apple wants (or transitively, whatever terms the publisher wants Apple to want).
This is why I hate copyright. The whole shenanigans Apple and so many corporations have to do to ensure that intellectual work behaves like private property in a "proper" capitalist market are nothing short of ensuring an enslaving world, in the name of "security" and the "market", where our freedoms are completely destroyed.
This particular issue is just a small detail. But it is quite telling.
Without copyright and patent protections in place, the economic incentive for creating content and inventions disappears and you end up with a non-competitive market as developed as Afghanistan.
Without copyright and patent protections in place, the economic incentive for creating content and inventions disappears and you end up with a non-competitive market as developed as Afghanistan.
Quote:
To promote the Progress of Science and useful Arts, by securing for limited Times to Authors and Inventors the exclusive Right to their respective Writings and Discoveries.
That would be a quote from Article I of the U.S. Constitution. You'd think that would settle the basic issue, but it somehow never does.
What possible justification is there for jail breaking in order to pirate a book? Yet, there are those who through tortured logic or by setting up ridiculously improbable hypotheticals will find a justification, or merely assert their right to "do whatever I want because I bought it."
Others like to hack everything as some climb a mountain: "just because it's there."
Quote:
Originally Posted by Cinemagic
One jailbroken app I use is iBlacklist. My cell phone is my primary phone. Unfortunately for me, telemarketers have my number. A few have refused to take me off their list and I get calls all the time. AT&T won't block calls but will still charge me for the minutes used when these telemarketers do call. Apple doesn't allow me to block calls and they have not allowed any apps that do block calls into the app store. Jailbreaking and iBlacklist is the only solution if I want to be able to block telemarketers. And yes, I am on the Do Not Call Registry, which is useless. Maybe the user experience that Steve Jobs envisions is full of telemarketing. But for me, it's not. This is real, not a hypothetical. As for pirated books, there is no justification for that. But it seems that the anti-jailbreakers think that everyone who jailbreaks is out to pirate apps or steal something. Nothing could be further from the truth.
I was really only addressing jailbreaking specifically to pirate books. I recognize that there are valid reasons, such as yours. Thanks for broadening the discussion.
So jailbreaking is legal. I purchased books from Apple and Apple has now made it impossible for me to read these books as long as I legally jailbreak. Well, now I'll simply buy from Amazon, use the Kindle reader (on the iPad) and piss on Apple's iBooks. And yes, jailbreaking IS legal. You need to read the statement from the US Government's Library of Congress. If it is not illegal, then it is legal. It is legal to do ANYTHING that is not specifically declared illegal (US Constitution). Unless you live in another country, it's not hazy at all. Now once jailbroken, it becomes easy to do illegal acts like use pirated software. I don't thing there's anyone that will contend that pirated software is legal or moral to use in any fashion. This ability is one reason Apple fights jailbreaking. Apple's desire to control 100% of the user experience is another.
It is correct that Apple is under no obligation to cater to jailbroken devices. They can and do everything they can to block jailbreaking. My gripe right now is that I paid Apple for books. I paid Apple for my iPhone and iPad. By blocking me, I feel that Apple has stolen my money. I didn't steal any of their software, hardware or anything else. The two Cydia apps I have I also paid for. Cydia has not cheated me. But now Apple has cheated me. Allow me to get a refund for books I purchased through iBookstore and I'll be happy.
Good grief, jailbreakers are tiresome. If you don't like it, take your business to Android and bother us no more.
The law allows jailbreaking. It may be that what Apple has done is against the law. Time will tell.
It looks like it is better to download a pirated copy of a book to view in iBooks rather than purchase the same title in the iBookstore.
So you profess what IS the law and if Apple doesn't abide by the law then it is better to download a "pirated copy"... isn't that AGAINST the law?!...
So if Apple "breaks" the law (which I don't believe they have), entitles you to break the law. Hmmm.
Two side notes:
First, it appears there are a lot of well Read people with Jailbroked iPhones here on AI. I have yet to buy from the iBook store. Did download a few free ones that I have yet to read, tho.
Second, the law used to allow for the purchase and selling of slaves. Some laws are just wrong, long before politicians get around to making them right.
That would be a quote from Article I of the U.S. Constitution. You'd think that would settle the basic issue, but it somehow never does.
I think it really comes down to one issue. People will always want something for nothing and they'll do anything to serve their own interests first. This is a given and Apple recognizes this fact by allowing thousands of free apps on their App Store to encourage content gluttons to feed until sick.
Denying me access to iBooks that I have paid for, is theft.
Not all Jailbreakers are thieves, I know several jailbroken phones - and NOT ONE of them use stolen Apps.
I'd wager that 95% of Jailbreakers go to the effort, because of MyWi. MyWi simply turns on a function that is built into the iPhone, and is turned off by the cell provider. The Cell provider has opted to charge $20/month to enable something my phone has always been able to do. How I consume my 2 GB is MY business - not my cell phone providers.
Would anyone tolerate a $20/month surcharge to use your speakerphone?
There is no legal requirement for Apple to support your jailbroken device. Jailbreaking being legal means you can't be prosecuted for doing so, not that Apple has to ensure your device is fully functional after you do so. They haven't denied you access to your books. That's something you did when you jailbroke the device.
I agree that tethering charges are ridiculous, but Apple isn't stealing anything from you by adding another layer of protection against jailbreaking. I'm pretty sure you've only licensed the books from Apple anyway and jailbreaking definitely goes against the terms of service.
I'm not saying Apple is doing the right thing, I'm saying they have the right to do this.
"There is a problem with the configuration of your iPhone," the error message in iBooks 1.2.1 reads. "Please restore with iTunes and reinstall iBooks."
A vaguely worded error message like that reminds me of the equally vague error message that Windows betas issued back in the 1990s when they detected competitor, Dr. DOS, on a PC. A clear message would have told users that the only reason it was appearing was to crush a competitor whose product was actually compatible. A vague message left them feeling that there was something wrong with Dr. DOS. Having created FUD, Microsoft turned off that error message in the shipping version of Windows.
This seems to be the same sort of game. A proper error message would honestly state, "To ensure copy protection, iBooks will not run on iPhones that have been jail-broken."
I think it really comes down to one issue. People will always want something for nothing and they'll do anything to serve their own interests first. This is a given and Apple recognizes this fact by allowing thousands of free apps on their App Store to encourage content gluttons to feed until sick.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Robin Huber
Amen, Doc. The constitution, "love it or leave" as they used to say.
A person could argue that the patent and copyright laws have become subject to abuse, and I might agree -- but for a person to say they hate the very concept? Even the founders understood that protecting ideas was critically important to the civil society they hoped to create.
You seem to be an unfortunate victim, but I refuse to believe that the majority of jailbreakers don't pirate. There are people who want to run a few utilities not on the App Store, yes. But considering the widespread issue of piracy in general, I would put money on the majority of jailbreakers do it to get games and other software illegally.
I have a jailbroken 3GS. I pay for ALL of my apps!!!! I also buy my music on iTunes nowadays. I have no desire to steal software. I want to see hard data that shows the actual numbers of jailbroken phones that have stolen apps on them.
I have only bought 2 books on iBooks. Mostly I used it for view PDFs. Now I will buy from Amazon and use Goodreader, etc.
Thanks Apple, I hope it is worth it to alienate customers. By the way, I think there is already a hack for this nonsense on Cydia.
So jailbreaking is legal. ..... And yes, jailbreaking IS legal. You need to read the statement from the US Government's Library of Congress. If it is not illegal, then it is legal..
It is legal to do ANYTHING that is not specifically declared illegal (US Constitution). Unless you live in another country, it's not hazy at all......
Then are murder, rape, child abuse, and pillaging legal acts? Slavery was also "legal" until it was abolished by the 13th Amendment to the Constitution.
Treason is one illegal act that is defined in the Constitution:
Quote:
Article III, Section 3
1: Treason against the United States, shall consist only in levying War against them, or in adhering to their Enemies, giving them Aid and Comfort.
....the others are not. These crimes are found in each state's civil, penal, business & professional etc codes & laws. The laws of the US are found in US Codes. Cornell's site @ http://www.law.cornell.edu/uscode/
...Maybe Apple/AT&T should at least make an unlock code available once we have completed our contract. This just pisses me off every time it comes up...
This option exists on carriers in countries where the governments have legislated so.
Get involved and talk to the politicians to make it so.
Comments
One jailbroken app I use is iBlacklist. My cell phone is my primary phone. Unfortunately for me, telemarketers have my number. A few have refused to take me off their list and I get calls all the time. AT&T won't block calls but will still charge me for the minutes used when these telemarketers do call. Apple doesn't allow me to block calls and they have not allowed any apps that do block calls into the app store. Jailbreaking and iBlacklist is the only solution if I want to be able to block telemarketers. And yes, I am on the Do Not Call Registry, which is useless. Maybe the user experience that Steve Jobs envisions is full of telemarketing. But for me, it's not. This is real, not a hypothetical. As for pirated books, there is no justification for that. But it seems that the anti-jailbreakers think that everyone who jailbreaks is out to pirate apps or steal something. Nothing could be further from the truth.
You can't effectively call block telemarketers on landlines, so it beats me how you can do it on a mobile phone, with or without the app.
You need a hearing aid then.
Yes, you are absolutely right. I did buy as you pointed out. I still feel cheated.
Absolutely. I was just pointing out that the common perception of people that they have bought a book when they buy an ebook isn't correct in the case of an Apple DRM ebook. It's just a license, subject to whatever terms Apple wants (or transitively, whatever terms the publisher wants Apple to want).
This is why I hate copyright. The whole shenanigans Apple and so many corporations have to do to ensure that intellectual work behaves like private property in a "proper" capitalist market are nothing short of ensuring an enslaving world, in the name of "security" and the "market", where our freedoms are completely destroyed.
This particular issue is just a small detail. But it is quite telling.
Without copyright and patent protections in place, the economic incentive for creating content and inventions disappears and you end up with a non-competitive market as developed as Afghanistan.
Enough with the idle threats about leaving iBooks and iOS! DO IT!
Without copyright and patent protections in place, the economic incentive for creating content and inventions disappears and you end up with a non-competitive market as developed as Afghanistan.
To promote the Progress of Science and useful Arts, by securing for limited Times to Authors and Inventors the exclusive Right to their respective Writings and Discoveries.
That would be a quote from Article I of the U.S. Constitution. You'd think that would settle the basic issue, but it somehow never does.
Let the whining begin.
What possible justification is there for jail breaking in order to pirate a book? Yet, there are those who through tortured logic or by setting up ridiculously improbable hypotheticals will find a justification, or merely assert their right to "do whatever I want because I bought it."
Others like to hack everything as some climb a mountain: "just because it's there."
One jailbroken app I use is iBlacklist. My cell phone is my primary phone. Unfortunately for me, telemarketers have my number. A few have refused to take me off their list and I get calls all the time. AT&T won't block calls but will still charge me for the minutes used when these telemarketers do call. Apple doesn't allow me to block calls and they have not allowed any apps that do block calls into the app store. Jailbreaking and iBlacklist is the only solution if I want to be able to block telemarketers. And yes, I am on the Do Not Call Registry, which is useless. Maybe the user experience that Steve Jobs envisions is full of telemarketing. But for me, it's not. This is real, not a hypothetical. As for pirated books, there is no justification for that. But it seems that the anti-jailbreakers think that everyone who jailbreaks is out to pirate apps or steal something. Nothing could be further from the truth.
I was really only addressing jailbreaking specifically to pirate books. I recognize that there are valid reasons, such as yours. Thanks for broadening the discussion.
So jailbreaking is legal. I purchased books from Apple and Apple has now made it impossible for me to read these books as long as I legally jailbreak. Well, now I'll simply buy from Amazon, use the Kindle reader (on the iPad) and piss on Apple's iBooks. And yes, jailbreaking IS legal. You need to read the statement from the US Government's Library of Congress. If it is not illegal, then it is legal. It is legal to do ANYTHING that is not specifically declared illegal (US Constitution). Unless you live in another country, it's not hazy at all. Now once jailbroken, it becomes easy to do illegal acts like use pirated software. I don't thing there's anyone that will contend that pirated software is legal or moral to use in any fashion. This ability is one reason Apple fights jailbreaking. Apple's desire to control 100% of the user experience is another.
It is correct that Apple is under no obligation to cater to jailbroken devices. They can and do everything they can to block jailbreaking. My gripe right now is that I paid Apple for books. I paid Apple for my iPhone and iPad. By blocking me, I feel that Apple has stolen my money. I didn't steal any of their software, hardware or anything else. The two Cydia apps I have I also paid for. Cydia has not cheated me. But now Apple has cheated me. Allow me to get a refund for books I purchased through iBookstore and I'll be happy.
Good grief, jailbreakers are tiresome. If you don't like it, take your business to Android and bother us no more.
The law allows jailbreaking. It may be that what Apple has done is against the law. Time will tell.
It looks like it is better to download a pirated copy of a book to view in iBooks rather than purchase the same title in the iBookstore.
So you profess what IS the law and if Apple doesn't abide by the law then it is better to download a "pirated copy"... isn't that AGAINST the law?!...
So if Apple "breaks" the law (which I don't believe they have), entitles you to break the law. Hmmm.
Two side notes:
First, it appears there are a lot of well Read people with Jailbroked iPhones here on AI. I have yet to buy from the iBook store. Did download a few free ones that I have yet to read, tho.
Second, the law used to allow for the purchase and selling of slaves. Some laws are just wrong, long before politicians get around to making them right.
/
/
/
That would be a quote from Article I of the U.S. Constitution. You'd think that would settle the basic issue, but it somehow never does.
I think it really comes down to one issue. People will always want something for nothing and they'll do anything to serve their own interests first. This is a given and Apple recognizes this fact by allowing thousands of free apps on their App Store to encourage content gluttons to feed until sick.
That would be a quote from Article I of the U.S. Constitution. You'd think that would settle the basic issue, but it somehow never does.
Amen, Doc. The constitution, "love it or leave" as they used to say.
Ummm - Jailbreaking MY iPhone is perfectly LEGAL.
Denying me access to iBooks that I have paid for, is theft.
Not all Jailbreakers are thieves, I know several jailbroken phones - and NOT ONE of them use stolen Apps.
I'd wager that 95% of Jailbreakers go to the effort, because of MyWi. MyWi simply turns on a function that is built into the iPhone, and is turned off by the cell provider. The Cell provider has opted to charge $20/month to enable something my phone has always been able to do. How I consume my 2 GB is MY business - not my cell phone providers.
Would anyone tolerate a $20/month surcharge to use your speakerphone?
There is no legal requirement for Apple to support your jailbroken device. Jailbreaking being legal means you can't be prosecuted for doing so, not that Apple has to ensure your device is fully functional after you do so. They haven't denied you access to your books. That's something you did when you jailbroke the device.
I agree that tethering charges are ridiculous, but Apple isn't stealing anything from you by adding another layer of protection against jailbreaking. I'm pretty sure you've only licensed the books from Apple anyway and jailbreaking definitely goes against the terms of service.
I'm not saying Apple is doing the right thing, I'm saying they have the right to do this.
"There is a problem with the configuration of your iPhone," the error message in iBooks 1.2.1 reads. "Please restore with iTunes and reinstall iBooks."
A vaguely worded error message like that reminds me of the equally vague error message that Windows betas issued back in the 1990s when they detected competitor, Dr. DOS, on a PC. A clear message would have told users that the only reason it was appearing was to crush a competitor whose product was actually compatible. A vague message left them feeling that there was something wrong with Dr. DOS. Having created FUD, Microsoft turned off that error message in the shipping version of Windows.
This seems to be the same sort of game. A proper error message would honestly state, "To ensure copy protection, iBooks will not run on iPhones that have been jail-broken."
I think it really comes down to one issue. People will always want something for nothing and they'll do anything to serve their own interests first. This is a given and Apple recognizes this fact by allowing thousands of free apps on their App Store to encourage content gluttons to feed until sick.
Amen, Doc. The constitution, "love it or leave" as they used to say.
A person could argue that the patent and copyright laws have become subject to abuse, and I might agree -- but for a person to say they hate the very concept? Even the founders understood that protecting ideas was critically important to the civil society they hoped to create.
SJailbreaking is LEGAL.
Denying me access to material that I have legitimately purchased is ILLEGAL.
Simple enough?
Depending on the terms you agreed to when you made the purchase it isn't necessarily so, tough titty pal, time to move on and whine somewhere else.
If you break it it's your responsibility, Apple gives you a way to continue using your iBooks, the choice is yours.
Simple enough?
You seem to be an unfortunate victim, but I refuse to believe that the majority of jailbreakers don't pirate. There are people who want to run a few utilities not on the App Store, yes. But considering the widespread issue of piracy in general, I would put money on the majority of jailbreakers do it to get games and other software illegally.
I have a jailbroken 3GS. I pay for ALL of my apps!!!! I also buy my music on iTunes nowadays. I have no desire to steal software. I want to see hard data that shows the actual numbers of jailbroken phones that have stolen apps on them.
I have only bought 2 books on iBooks. Mostly I used it for view PDFs. Now I will buy from Amazon and use Goodreader, etc.
Thanks Apple, I hope it is worth it to alienate customers. By the way, I think there is already a hack for this nonsense on Cydia.
So jailbreaking is legal. ..... And yes, jailbreaking IS legal. You need to read the statement from the US Government's Library of Congress. If it is not illegal, then it is legal..
Please read Prof P's comments @ http://forums.appleinsider.com/showp...1&postcount=66
and FT @ http://forums.appleinsider.com/showp...5&postcount=80
It is legal to do ANYTHING that is not specifically declared illegal (US Constitution). Unless you live in another country, it's not hazy at all......
Then are murder, rape, child abuse, and pillaging legal acts? Slavery was also "legal" until it was abolished by the 13th Amendment to the Constitution.
Treason is one illegal act that is defined in the Constitution:
Article III, Section 3
1: Treason against the United States, shall consist only in levying War against them, or in adhering to their Enemies, giving them Aid and Comfort.
....the others are not. These crimes are found in each state's civil, penal, business & professional etc codes & laws. The laws of the US are found in US Codes. Cornell's site @ http://www.law.cornell.edu/uscode/
As we used to say in grade school - "Nice move, Ex-lax"
Were you in Special Ed?
The phrase is "smooth move, Ex-Lax."
...Maybe Apple/AT&T should at least make an unlock code available once we have completed our contract. This just pisses me off every time it comes up...
This option exists on carriers in countries where the governments have legislated so.
Get involved and talk to the politicians to make it so.