I thought 7" was DOA according to SJ, the playbook was DOA because it was 7", the Tab was an epic fail according to many on the board because it is 7". I thought the current size was optimal. However a 7" iPad is now ok?
No a smaller iPad is DoA. Marketing a bigger iPod though brings a totally different set of expectations. Apple can say up front the bigger iPod isn't suited for many tablet functions and not get hurt as long as it does all the iPod/iPhone gaming functionality well and with minimal developer disruption. If the resolutions stay at a Retina Display multiple of 2 (including 1/2) it won't be a problem.
There are more than a few gamers and game devs that have some difficulties with the limited physical space of the iPod screens when also using the finger controls. More physical space means they can maintain the physical dimension of the control with that control using less percentage of the screen real estate.
It also makes for a nice steno pad replacement coupled with an App like Evernote. I think there are quite a few laptop users who would be happy with a device this size as the walk-around I/O note-taking device rather than an iPad. Many of those now aren't going for the iPad and the laptop, they are just getting the laptop.
Acceptance will depend on how it's marketed and priced. Market as an iPad and it flops for all the reasons Steve has outlined before. Market as an iPod and it will be perceived to over-deliver and be a success.
What a bullshit article. Apple doesn't like confusing people like this story has done.
Apple's main goal at this point is to drive the iPad price down to $399.
Basically, if Apple does anything to the iPod touch's screen-size they'll make the screen 4", just like the rumoured iPhone 5. Or they keep it 3.5". Not 5", not 6" and not 7". The whole point of the iPod is that if fits in your pocket.
You spend your career writing for AI and you have no real intuition on Apple at all. Ridiculous.
Even with the rumoured quicker GPU and CPU in the next iPhone, it would still have less than half the power of the NGP, plus of course, no physical buttons, which are essential for serious NGP level gaming.
It would be more of a Kindle competitor, but the Kindle is a *lot* cheaper...
You're talking as if computing power has proven itself to be major factor in gaming popularity. It wasn't in the Wii vs PS3, and wan't in the DS vs PSP. Dreamcast, 3DO are two other examples of fast stuff being ignored.
Also, you can take a look at what the iPod touch has already done to gaming. If Sony wasn't already threatened, it wouldn't be desperately trying to copy Apple's business models rather than the other way around. Sony is trying to move towards downloads, throwing away the disc-based medium it has banked on since the PS1. And it's trying to set up an app market with PSN just like iTunes.
The NGP (and even certified gamer PS1/android phones) will likely be better at playing gamer games, but that's not where the mass market is. Sony will be carving out a Firewire market amongst USBs. Ask Apple how well it works out to be demonstrably better than everyone else.
I don't care what anyone says, there is NO difference between the iPod touch and the iPad. The only difference is in the User Interface of certain apps, and 3G. THAT'S IT!!! And UI adjustments is not enough to call these two devices different.
Then you think there's no difference between a sports car and a mini van just because the interface is the same?
I can't believe you actually own and have used both if you really think that. I do, and can tell you their uses are completely different. I have some common apps between them but use them for vastly different things.
What a bullshit article. Apple doesn't like confusing people like this story has done.
Apple's main goal at this point is to drive the iPad price down to $399.
Basically, if Apple does anything to the iPod touch's screen-size they'll make the screen 4", just like the rumoured iPhone 5. Or they keep it 3.5". Not 5", not 6" and not 7". The whole point of the iPod is that if fits in your pocket.
You spend your career writing for AI and you have no real intuition on Apple at all. Ridiculous.
Hi pretentious arrogant dick. What's your sources? and what's your track record? This article lays out both, while you don't have anything but your extremely high opinion of yourself.
I recall you saying a lot of asstalk that hasn't actually mattered at all. This isn't a battle of opinions, it's AI reporting the insight of an analyst observing the supply chain, and some anonymous assclown spewing a fantasy of how things "should" be.
That's the entire point. There won't be a small iPad. There will be a large iPod touch.
That is not a good point. This story is a rumor. And it's not happening.
If you guys took some time to look at your empty arguments you'd realize the nonsense your were talking. The whole point of the iPod touch is that it fits in your pocket. The web, iTunes, the App Store, your e-mail, your music, your games, FaceTime - all in your pocket! There wont be a 6" iPod touch. Any larger than 4" and it's no longer pocketable, and more expensive to produce. If you want a large iPod touch the iPad is it, and more.
This message is not lost on Apple. That's why there's a big gap between the products - to make the purchasing decision easy. Do you want the Internet and all your music in your pocket, or do you want a tablet computer. It's a clear message.
Next iPod touch will be 4" max. Next iPad will be $399, possibly. If Apple can drive the price of the iPad down to $399, they will.
You've been reported. You can try to change your post, but you can't cover-up your actions. You've been a member less than 3 months, you've a lot to learn.
what's the difference. Particularly if the ipad gets the cameras this year. Little to nothing.
As for the notion of making a bigger ipad. I doubt it. Apple seems to believe they have the form pretty close to perfect. So outside of small changes like maybe reducing the bezel to shave off a tiny bit, i think the ipad will get thinner with 'bigger' internals
If this happens, it will be a larger iPod Touch. Besides size, the most obvious distinction between an iPod Touch and an iPad is the display's aspect ratio. Maintaining the 3:2 aspect ratio would make this an extension of the iPod Touch and means that developers will not have to do much work to get their existing apps appearing nicely on the display.
The 3:2 aspect ratio is also closer to the ~16:9 aspect ratio that some other 7" tablets are using.
It seems like a no brainer that apple will release a larger ipod touch. i believe the rumors were 5.7 inches and that seems perfect for a lot of things, particularly gaming, as Archos has been saying, but also for video, facetime, purse sized book reader, apple tv controller.... there is definitely a market for a form factor between the ipod touch and the ipad, and it makes a lot more sense for it to run ipod touch apps.
Apple release the iPad - those on here state that it is doomed!
It's just a big iPod, doesn't have a camera - it'll never sell!!!!
Those people have not conceded that they were wrong - look through the archives and see them howl in disgust at apple's doomed project.
So here we are 20 million+ (and counting) unit sales in less than a year and the entire market of tablet computing ignited directly because of Apple and the iPad. If Apple weren't the dominant market leaders the term "iPad killer" wouldn't exist".
Apple got it right because they listened to the consumer, not the "tech experts" on here.
The display is great, the battery life is astounding, functionality far surpasses the original stated intentions and customer satisfaction is through the roof.
Now the same people who were so wrong about iPad's success tell us what it needs to be improved.
Retina Display
Physical Keyboard
USB/SD/ESATA/Ethernet Ports
Camera
Bigger
Smaller
Colours
etc.
Apple don't need to do anything, they will do what they feel is 'just enough' to tempt the average consumer (note the term "average consumer" - that doesn't mean techno geek) while keeping prices as low as possible and margins as high as they can get away with.
There is nothing wrong with iPad, the next chapter will be exciting, but for those expecting a significantly different form factor, massive functionality increases and other bells and whistles, I'm afraid you're going to be sadly disappointed.
Larger hard drive, slight processor (and maybe, but not essentially a RAM increase) and the inevitable camera.
Don't get your hopes up for anything more guys - it's not time to reinvent the wheel in the first year, Apple sell as many of these as they can make and the competition are imitating and giving people what they think they want - but it's not selling - no amount of ports, cameras and other bells and whistles is harming Apple's massive market lead. And for the next year at least, Apple is home and dry, they don't need to create anything massively new.
The screen size was right, 7" is too small - just as Jobs said. Ask Samsung how their iPad killer is doing. It'll be lucky to sell as many units in a year as Apple do in a month - it has ports, it has a camera - but it's not selling more.
Apple understand the consumer and ignore the tech press, they give Mr. Average what he wants and Mr Average is happy - he doesn't care how it works or what the specs are, he simply knows it works, is easy to use and is at a price point he can afford - and that's all that matters for Apple's bottom line.
Not one person here has seemed to understand my point that the iPod touch is of a certain size because it needs to be pocketable. Do people even read these threads, or do they just come along to submit a random comment and leave?
I don't know if I agree with everything nkhm said there, but he essentially made sense. No wonder Gruber has made such a following. Most people don't really think through what they want to say when it comes to tech. And in particular the future of tech.
You only need to look at Apple mockups out there to see how wrong people can be. Apple tends to make simple products that make sense. People looking at Apple from the outside tend to think the next Apple product is going to have wings.
It's like the whole Apple Television thing. People or still debating whether or not Apple are going to make an actual TV, and not what they should be debating - what the TV is going to look like. If you're still in the group that thinks Apple are "never" going to make a TV then in my opinion you need to keep your mouth closed in future.
When myself and a few others here said Apple are going to make a phone - "they have no choice" I recall saying - people around here called us idiots. When a few here including myself said Apple are going to make a tablet, we were ridiculed. And when we said an Apple Tele is eventually coming, the same thing.
After all three off these products come to be no one will ever say: you know what, we were all wrong.
It's not that difficult to give general product predictions with Apple. But no matter how many times you get it right people never recall all the shouting you did at the time. I recall only one member here sending me an PM apology when the iPad was announced. I predicted 10" and everyone practically said I was crazy thinking it would be that big. The consensus at the time seemed to be 7". I have always argued that size never made sense, and I turned out to right. Now we come full-circle and we're back to this 6-7" talk. Do ye people ever learn?
I don't care what anyone says, there is NO difference between the iPod touch and the iPad. The only difference is in the User Interface of certain apps, and 3G. THAT'S IT!!! And UI adjustments is not enough to call these two devices different.
And yet . . . they can't make them fast enough. Somebody must think there's a big difference.
I think so. There's a sweet spot for work that i believe is iPad. Sweet spot for portability is iPhone. Bit the sweet spot for portable gaming is probably in between.
Comments
I thought 7" was DOA according to SJ, the playbook was DOA because it was 7", the Tab was an epic fail according to many on the board because it is 7". I thought the current size was optimal. However a 7" iPad is now ok?
No a smaller iPad is DoA. Marketing a bigger iPod though brings a totally different set of expectations. Apple can say up front the bigger iPod isn't suited for many tablet functions and not get hurt as long as it does all the iPod/iPhone gaming functionality well and with minimal developer disruption. If the resolutions stay at a Retina Display multiple of 2 (including 1/2) it won't be a problem.
There are more than a few gamers and game devs that have some difficulties with the limited physical space of the iPod screens when also using the finger controls. More physical space means they can maintain the physical dimension of the control with that control using less percentage of the screen real estate.
It also makes for a nice steno pad replacement coupled with an App like Evernote. I think there are quite a few laptop users who would be happy with a device this size as the walk-around I/O note-taking device rather than an iPad. Many of those now aren't going for the iPad and the laptop, they are just getting the laptop.
Acceptance will depend on how it's marketed and priced. Market as an iPad and it flops for all the reasons Steve has outlined before. Market as an iPod and it will be perceived to over-deliver and be a success.
Interesting! iPlay is a great name but i think it would likely remain: iPod ______ ...there's no room in their website header baar for "iPlay" haha
"iPay" (for the e-wallet feature)
Apple's main goal at this point is to drive the iPad price down to $399.
Basically, if Apple does anything to the iPod touch's screen-size they'll make the screen 4", just like the rumoured iPhone 5. Or they keep it 3.5". Not 5", not 6" and not 7". The whole point of the iPod is that if fits in your pocket.
You spend your career writing for AI and you have no real intuition on Apple at all. Ridiculous.
Didn't Steve Jobs said that a tablet smaller than 10" will be DOA. So, NO.
That's the entire point. There won't be a small iPad. There will be a large iPod touch.
It will run touch/iPhone apps without looking stupid they way they do on an iPad, but they won't run full blown iPad apps.
Ergo bigger screen for reading making it a better reader, but with half a million apps.
F'ing brilliant.
It's essentially a small iPad, but it's marketed as a big iPod Touch.
That is just brilliant.
Actually, the opposite.
Its essentially a large iPod touch, but marketed as a small iPad.
Even with the rumoured quicker GPU and CPU in the next iPhone, it would still have less than half the power of the NGP, plus of course, no physical buttons, which are essential for serious NGP level gaming.
It would be more of a Kindle competitor, but the Kindle is a *lot* cheaper...
You're talking as if computing power has proven itself to be major factor in gaming popularity. It wasn't in the Wii vs PS3, and wan't in the DS vs PSP. Dreamcast, 3DO are two other examples of fast stuff being ignored.
Also, you can take a look at what the iPod touch has already done to gaming. If Sony wasn't already threatened, it wouldn't be desperately trying to copy Apple's business models rather than the other way around. Sony is trying to move towards downloads, throwing away the disc-based medium it has banked on since the PS1. And it's trying to set up an app market with PSN just like iTunes.
The NGP (and even certified gamer PS1/android phones) will likely be better at playing gamer games, but that's not where the mass market is. Sony will be carving out a Firewire market amongst USBs. Ask Apple how well it works out to be demonstrably better than everyone else.
I don't care what anyone says, there is NO difference between the iPod touch and the iPad. The only difference is in the User Interface of certain apps, and 3G. THAT'S IT!!! And UI adjustments is not enough to call these two devices different.
Then you think there's no difference between a sports car and a mini van just because the interface is the same?
I can't believe you actually own and have used both if you really think that. I do, and can tell you their uses are completely different. I have some common apps between them but use them for vastly different things.
What a bullshit article. Apple doesn't like confusing people like this story has done.
Apple's main goal at this point is to drive the iPad price down to $399.
Basically, if Apple does anything to the iPod touch's screen-size they'll make the screen 4", just like the rumoured iPhone 5. Or they keep it 3.5". Not 5", not 6" and not 7". The whole point of the iPod is that if fits in your pocket.
You spend your career writing for AI and you have no real intuition on Apple at all. Ridiculous.
Hi pretentious arrogant dick. What's your sources? and what's your track record? This article lays out both, while you don't have anything but your extremely high opinion of yourself.
I recall you saying a lot of asstalk that hasn't actually mattered at all. This isn't a battle of opinions, it's AI reporting the insight of an analyst observing the supply chain, and some anonymous assclown spewing a fantasy of how things "should" be.
That's the entire point. There won't be a small iPad. There will be a large iPod touch.
That is not a good point. This story is a rumor. And it's not happening.
If you guys took some time to look at your empty arguments you'd realize the nonsense your were talking. The whole point of the iPod touch is that it fits in your pocket. The web, iTunes, the App Store, your e-mail, your music, your games, FaceTime - all in your pocket! There wont be a 6" iPod touch. Any larger than 4" and it's no longer pocketable, and more expensive to produce. If you want a large iPod touch the iPad is it, and more.
This message is not lost on Apple. That's why there's a big gap between the products - to make the purchasing decision easy. Do you want the Internet and all your music in your pocket, or do you want a tablet computer. It's a clear message.
Next iPod touch will be 4" max. Next iPad will be $399, possibly. If Apple can drive the price of the iPad down to $399, they will.
That is not a good point. This story is a rumor. And it's not happening.
I'm not taking it as fact, just as an idea. And I still think its a good one.
Plus, even you are postulating a larger screen. 4" or 7", its still a new format.
My point is that it won't be a small iPad.
Time will tell.
Hi pretentious arrogant dick.
You've been reported. You can try to change your post, but you can't cover-up your actions. You've been a member less than 3 months, you've a lot to learn.
what's the difference. Particularly if the ipad gets the cameras this year. Little to nothing.
As for the notion of making a bigger ipad. I doubt it. Apple seems to believe they have the form pretty close to perfect. So outside of small changes like maybe reducing the bezel to shave off a tiny bit, i think the ipad will get thinner with 'bigger' internals
the difference is in the ui for fsck sake
The 3:2 aspect ratio is also closer to the ~16:9 aspect ratio that some other 7" tablets are using.
Apple release the iPad - those on here state that it is doomed!
It's just a big iPod, doesn't have a camera - it'll never sell!!!!
Those people have not conceded that they were wrong - look through the archives and see them howl in disgust at apple's doomed project.
So here we are 20 million+ (and counting) unit sales in less than a year and the entire market of tablet computing ignited directly because of Apple and the iPad. If Apple weren't the dominant market leaders the term "iPad killer" wouldn't exist".
Apple got it right because they listened to the consumer, not the "tech experts" on here.
The display is great, the battery life is astounding, functionality far surpasses the original stated intentions and customer satisfaction is through the roof.
Now the same people who were so wrong about iPad's success tell us what it needs to be improved.
Retina Display
Physical Keyboard
USB/SD/ESATA/Ethernet Ports
Camera
Bigger
Smaller
Colours
etc.
Apple don't need to do anything, they will do what they feel is 'just enough' to tempt the average consumer (note the term "average consumer" - that doesn't mean techno geek) while keeping prices as low as possible and margins as high as they can get away with.
There is nothing wrong with iPad, the next chapter will be exciting, but for those expecting a significantly different form factor, massive functionality increases and other bells and whistles, I'm afraid you're going to be sadly disappointed.
Larger hard drive, slight processor (and maybe, but not essentially a RAM increase) and the inevitable camera.
Don't get your hopes up for anything more guys - it's not time to reinvent the wheel in the first year, Apple sell as many of these as they can make and the competition are imitating and giving people what they think they want - but it's not selling - no amount of ports, cameras and other bells and whistles is harming Apple's massive market lead. And for the next year at least, Apple is home and dry, they don't need to create anything massively new.
The screen size was right, 7" is too small - just as Jobs said. Ask Samsung how their iPad killer is doing. It'll be lucky to sell as many units in a year as Apple do in a month - it has ports, it has a camera - but it's not selling more.
Apple understand the consumer and ignore the tech press, they give Mr. Average what he wants and Mr Average is happy - he doesn't care how it works or what the specs are, he simply knows it works, is easy to use and is at a price point he can afford - and that's all that matters for Apple's bottom line.
I don't know if I agree with everything nkhm said there, but he essentially made sense. No wonder Gruber has made such a following. Most people don't really think through what they want to say when it comes to tech. And in particular the future of tech.
You only need to look at Apple mockups out there to see how wrong people can be. Apple tends to make simple products that make sense. People looking at Apple from the outside tend to think the next Apple product is going to have wings.
It's like the whole Apple Television thing. People or still debating whether or not Apple are going to make an actual TV, and not what they should be debating - what the TV is going to look like. If you're still in the group that thinks Apple are "never" going to make a TV then in my opinion you need to keep your mouth closed in future.
When myself and a few others here said Apple are going to make a phone - "they have no choice" I recall saying - people around here called us idiots. When a few here including myself said Apple are going to make a tablet, we were ridiculed. And when we said an Apple Tele is eventually coming, the same thing.
After all three off these products come to be no one will ever say: you know what, we were all wrong.
It's not that difficult to give general product predictions with Apple. But no matter how many times you get it right people never recall all the shouting you did at the time. I recall only one member here sending me an PM apology when the iPad was announced. I predicted 10" and everyone practically said I was crazy thinking it would be that big. The consensus at the time seemed to be 7". I have always argued that size never made sense, and I turned out to right. Now we come full-circle and we're back to this 6-7" talk. Do ye people ever learn?
I don't care what anyone says, there is NO difference between the iPod touch and the iPad. The only difference is in the User Interface of certain apps, and 3G. THAT'S IT!!! And UI adjustments is not enough to call these two devices different.
And yet . . . they can't make them fast enough. Somebody must think there's a big difference.
I think so. There's a sweet spot for work that i believe is iPad. Sweet spot for portability is iPhone. Bit the sweet spot for portable gaming is probably in between.