Oh Pscates. This is like the smoking thing. The tobacco companies were once infallible and absolved from any wrongdoing just like fat food companies are now. They have fallen and so will Big Fat. I think you know that based on your mentioning of it. And the fact that it doesn't seem like you supported that decision either is really, really suspect. I mean that decision wasn't over-argued then, it's not over-argued now. <img src="graemlins/hmmm.gif" border="0" alt="[Hmmm]" /> </strong><hr></blockquote>
There was a conspiracy among Big Tobacco. The same can hardly be said about "Big Fat" as you term them. I would love to see the commercials from the 50's where doctors are shown eating Big Mac's and declaring the health benefits like we see for Big Tobacco.
<strong>The Insider was an excellent, excellent film with great performances from Russell Crowe, Al Pacino, and Christopher Plummer.
THE ISSUE here is once again being looked at through very narrow perspectives. The idea that McDonalds could have any responsibility in the fattening of America is painted as utterly ridiculous by those opposed to holding Big Fat accountable. "Personal responsibility" is the buzzword used by opponents to stymie any arguments against the Fat Food companies. NOW I think that's ridiculous. One cannot paint this as an "either/or" situation. It's most certainly a combination of personal responsibility and BigFat's societal responsibility for the fattening of America.
JUST WHAT do obesity related illnesses cost our country? Billions of dollars? How much longer are we willing to let Fat Food companies profit from the fattening of America? The answer eludes me. I DON'T KNOW where to draw the line. BUT let's be realistic. Big Fat should play a greater role in helping stop America's destructive addiction to fast food. And a way to do this that should satisfy everyone is to FREE INFORMATION from its current lockdown. What I mean is that more should be done to promote the awareness of nutrition facts. They should be placed PROMINENTLY in all restaraunts. They should be on all packaging. Fast food should be taken out of schools, it should be scrutinized for being aimed at children who don;'t know any better. Remove soda and candy machines from schools. This benefits no one but the coffers of large Fat Food corporations.
THIS isn't brain surgery, folks. The status quo needs to be scrutinized for fattening America.</strong><hr></blockquote>
it's called self-control. i love fast food but rarely eat it. maybe if these people made their own dinners for once they wouldn't eat at fast food resturants a couple times a week
it's called self-control. i love fast food but rarely eat it. maybe if these people made their own dinners for once they wouldn't eat at fast food resturants a couple times a week
:eek: </strong><hr></blockquote>
Me too. My wife an I go sometimes, get a two cheeseburger meal and split it.
I think some recent study(s) has some evidence that it is. I don't have my medline in front of me so I can't search it. The crack example is a better one. Are there any lawyers going to sue BigCrack?
A little responsibility for one's own actions . . . sueing McDonalds is absurd
however, that said, there is a lot to be said about the weight phenomena being a clear class issue. And, its this way for a number of clear reasons. Among them, as far as I can see, are the fact that working people very often work in environments where there are no alternatives but garbage.
take your average industrial park, you have to slog throgh a gigantic parking lot to your car then drive in a congested new development avenue just to get to the few MCwhatevers that ring the average industrial park
And, when they get home, exhaustted they have to shop at Giant Food shovelling Distributers Inc super market IF they feel that they have the time or the energy, and then once there, they get aisles upon aisles of processed foods with lists of ingredientes with compound names who's etymologies are Greek or Latin . . .
the other thing is that many people actually do not know what is good to eat
Plus, I'll say something surprising here:
When your average Working Joe steps into a Whole Foods or a natural Food Co-Op, there is a very very heavy vibe of condescencion: these Co-Op people are all just so 'happenin' and lefty-know it all, and 'doing the right and good thing' that it absolutely alienates the average working stiff . .
they just lay it on thick . . .They are dripping with their own coolness that its sickening, and, it makes people feel like failures for liking the taste of white bread
Not to get in the way of the witch hunt, you boys have fun and all, but has anyone actually said that this lawsuit being rejected was a bad thing or that the fatty should have won?
Why don't you all move to the west side of Chicago. Once there, you can tell me how to eat healthy when the Jewel food stores all close down. Not because they're not profitable, but because an OSCO is more profitable. And on the west side where the only restaurants willing to move into the neighborhoods are...McDonalds. What choice is there?
None. Oh, but it's their fault for not driving 45 minutes to the nearest grocery store.
<strong>Not to get in the way of the witch hunt, you boys have fun and all, but has anyone actually said that this lawsuit being rejected was a bad thing or that the fatty should have won?
Just checking.</strong><hr></blockquote>
No, most people seem to be arguing that Big Tabacco was right to have continued to lie about the health implications of smoking for decades after they knew about them.
That it was okay for them to pay scientists to derail and subvert legitimate health studies.
That is was fine for them to advertise unimpeded by any regulation when the cancers they knew they were causing had not only a massive monetary cost that they did not have to pay, but also a great cost in term of human life.
That their adverts showing people leading active, healthy lives were in no way misleading.
That it is an acceptable business practice to engineer your product to be more physically addictive by adding poisonous chemicals.
That conspiring (ooh, conspiracy theory!) to encourage black market trading of cigarettes and childhood addiction are worthy activities of corporations that at this very moment are arguing for free speech.
That because the lawyers who sued these cheating, lying, sons-of-bitches are well paid, their actions are despicable (a strangely un-american attitude).
-------
I personally believe that the government should regulate to solve this problem, but that would probably horrify most americans more than suing to achieve social change.
I certainly believe that corporations that sell things that are bad for you should not be able to pass them of as healthy choices, particularly in advertising aimed at children and their parents, and if they do then they should be sued by those who have been harmed by this action.
There was a class action recently where MSFT was found guilty of overcharging people by 10, 20 and 40 dollars for certain products. I think McDonalds has done at least that amount of harm to people, even if it was not just McDonalds that caused the problem. After all, no one forced the MSFT customers to buy anything at gunpoint.
That's either a lie or you're completely ignorant. Smokes used to be advertised as healthy. Once you're addicted it's too late.</strong><hr></blockquote>
So. They could claim they were purple poodles and that wouldn't make me think they were. I repeat NO ONE can claim they didn't know smoking was bad.
I repeat NO ONE can claim they didn't know smoking was bad.</strong><hr></blockquote>
That's certainly true today, but it hasn't always been the case. My dad died fairly recently from a smoking relating illness, after numerous failed attempts to give up. When he was younger and started smoking, the health implications weren't really known (of if they were, they were covered up). I believe he was even encouraged to smoke when he was in the army during the late 50's/early 60's.
Comments
<a href="http://www.overlawyered.com/topics/tobacco.html"; target="_blank">Tobacco litigation resources</a>
Anyone who thinks these lawyers give a shit about peoples' health is living in a fantasy world.
[ 01-23-2003: Message edited by: Scott ]</p>
<strong>
There was a conspiracy among Big Tobacco. The same can hardly be said about "Big Fat" as you term them. I would love to see the commercials from the 50's where doctors are shown eating Big Mac's and declaring the health benefits like we see for Big Tobacco.
Big difference...
Nick
<strong>The Insider was an excellent, excellent film with great performances from Russell Crowe, Al Pacino, and Christopher Plummer.
THE ISSUE here is once again being looked at through very narrow perspectives. The idea that McDonalds could have any responsibility in the fattening of America is painted as utterly ridiculous by those opposed to holding Big Fat accountable. "Personal responsibility" is the buzzword used by opponents to stymie any arguments against the Fat Food companies. NOW I think that's ridiculous. One cannot paint this as an "either/or" situation. It's most certainly a combination of personal responsibility and BigFat's societal responsibility for the fattening of America.
JUST WHAT do obesity related illnesses cost our country? Billions of dollars? How much longer are we willing to let Fat Food companies profit from the fattening of America? The answer eludes me. I DON'T KNOW where to draw the line. BUT let's be realistic. Big Fat should play a greater role in helping stop America's destructive addiction to fast food. And a way to do this that should satisfy everyone is to FREE INFORMATION from its current lockdown. What I mean is that more should be done to promote the awareness of nutrition facts. They should be placed PROMINENTLY in all restaraunts. They should be on all packaging. Fast food should be taken out of schools, it should be scrutinized for being aimed at children who don;'t know any better. Remove soda and candy machines from schools. This benefits no one but the coffers of large Fat Food corporations.
THIS isn't brain surgery, folks. The status quo needs to be scrutinized for fattening America.</strong><hr></blockquote>
it's called self-control. i love fast food but rarely eat it. maybe if these people made their own dinners for once they wouldn't eat at fast food resturants a couple times a week
:eek:
<strong>
it's called self-control. i love fast food but rarely eat it. maybe if these people made their own dinners for once they wouldn't eat at fast food resturants a couple times a week
:eek:
Me too. My wife an I go sometimes, get a two cheeseburger meal and split it.
Question is what will they sue Subway for?
<strong>
Question is what will they sue Subway for?</strong><hr></blockquote>
Good question, and how about the Pizza industry?? Pizza's that come with a gazillion cheeses, cheese in crust etc
where will it all end??
America is too sue crazed as everyone knows.
SPJ, do you want to follow in the footsteps of Geoffrey Fieger?
i recently read that American's are starting to super-size portions at home now. where's the self-control <img src="confused.gif" border="0">
however, that said, there is a lot to be said about the weight phenomena being a clear class issue. And, its this way for a number of clear reasons. Among them, as far as I can see, are the fact that working people very often work in environments where there are no alternatives but garbage.
take your average industrial park, you have to slog throgh a gigantic parking lot to your car then drive in a congested new development avenue just to get to the few MCwhatevers that ring the average industrial park
And, when they get home, exhaustted they have to shop at Giant Food shovelling Distributers Inc super market IF they feel that they have the time or the energy, and then once there, they get aisles upon aisles of processed foods with lists of ingredientes with compound names who's etymologies are Greek or Latin . . .
the other thing is that many people actually do not know what is good to eat
Plus, I'll say something surprising here:
When your average Working Joe steps into a Whole Foods or a natural Food Co-Op, there is a very very heavy vibe of condescencion: these Co-Op people are all just so 'happenin' and lefty-know it all, and 'doing the right and good thing' that it absolutely alienates the average working stiff . .
they just lay it on thick . . .They are dripping with their own coolness that its sickening, and, it makes people feel like failures for liking the taste of white bread
[ 01-24-2003: Message edited by: pfflam ]</p>
<strong> No one can claim that they don't know cig's are harmful. </strong><hr></blockquote>
That's either a lie or you're completely ignorant. Smokes used to be advertised as healthy. Once you're addicted it's too late.
Just checking.
None. Oh, but it's their fault for not driving 45 minutes to the nearest grocery store.
Don't know how pertinent it is, but there you go.
<strong>Not to get in the way of the witch hunt, you boys have fun and all, but has anyone actually said that this lawsuit being rejected was a bad thing or that the fatty should have won?
Just checking.</strong><hr></blockquote>
No, most people seem to be arguing that Big Tabacco was right to have continued to lie about the health implications of smoking for decades after they knew about them.
That it was okay for them to pay scientists to derail and subvert legitimate health studies.
That is was fine for them to advertise unimpeded by any regulation when the cancers they knew they were causing had not only a massive monetary cost that they did not have to pay, but also a great cost in term of human life.
That their adverts showing people leading active, healthy lives were in no way misleading.
That it is an acceptable business practice to engineer your product to be more physically addictive by adding poisonous chemicals.
That conspiring (ooh, conspiracy theory!) to encourage black market trading of cigarettes and childhood addiction are worthy activities of corporations that at this very moment are arguing for free speech.
That because the lawyers who sued these cheating, lying, sons-of-bitches are well paid, their actions are despicable (a strangely un-american attitude).
-------
I personally believe that the government should regulate to solve this problem, but that would probably horrify most americans more than suing to achieve social change.
I certainly believe that corporations that sell things that are bad for you should not be able to pass them of as healthy choices, particularly in advertising aimed at children and their parents, and if they do then they should be sued by those who have been harmed by this action.
There was a class action recently where MSFT was found guilty of overcharging people by 10, 20 and 40 dollars for certain products. I think McDonalds has done at least that amount of harm to people, even if it was not just McDonalds that caused the problem. After all, no one forced the MSFT customers to buy anything at gunpoint.
<strong>Why? Because you try and derail a point with semantics.
<a href="http://www.quitsmokinguk.com/what's_in_a_cigarette.htm"; target="_blank">Try</a> Google. It's amazing....</strong><hr></blockquote>
I never knew that ciggarette's contained so much damm shit like lead and thigs.
HOw anyone smokes I dotn know! <img src="confused.gif" border="0">
<strong>
That's either a lie or you're completely ignorant. Smokes used to be advertised as healthy. Once you're addicted it's too late.</strong><hr></blockquote>
So. They could claim they were purple poodles and that wouldn't make me think they were. I repeat NO ONE can claim they didn't know smoking was bad.
<strong>
I repeat NO ONE can claim they didn't know smoking was bad.</strong><hr></blockquote>
That's certainly true today, but it hasn't always been the case. My dad died fairly recently from a smoking relating illness, after numerous failed attempts to give up. When he was younger and started smoking, the health implications weren't really known (of if they were, they were covered up). I believe he was even encouraged to smoke when he was in the army during the late 50's/early 60's.
My father smoked and ate at Roy Rodges too much and when he had a heart attack he blamed no one but himself for his unhealth life style.
A bunch of "not my fault" cry babies. That's all I see.