It's just so disappointing. The gleeful display of utter ignorance. All because it said something bad about the US.</strong><hr></blockquote>
Please prove me wrong. If you can. Use real science and not anti-US propaganda sites. Start with the half life and work out the absorbed dose and then don't forget the quality factor for the alpha.
Prove to me you know even the slightest bit about what you're trying to talk about.
Please prove me wrong. If you can. Use real science and not anti-US propaganda sites. Start with the half life and work out the absorbed dose and then don't forget the quality factor for the alpha.
Prove to me you know even the slightest bit about what you're trying to talk about.
If you give up just let me know.</strong><hr></blockquote>
You don't get it. I was referring to how you normally react to any criticism about the US that originates from someone that is not a US citizen.
I know that this thread is based on propaganda. I'm not contesting that. I'm simply saying that what you said about the people you disagree with in this thread also applies to you.
I'm not being ignorant though. I ... ahhh ... happen to know a thing or two about this stuff. I disagree with it because it's wrong not because it's anti-US. If you think I'm being ignorant please prove me wrong. Or in this case prove SJO right. Good luck.
<strong>I'm not being ignorant though. I ... ahhh ... happen to know a thing or two about this stuff. I disagree with it because it's wrong not because it's anti-US. If you think I'm being ignorant please prove me wrong. Or in this case prove SJO right. Good luck.</strong><hr></blockquote>
You didn't read the rest of my post, did you? I said that I do not contest you in this thread. However, that does not mean that the statement you made does not apply to you often. This happens to be one of the exceptions.
The problem isn't that SJO or anyone else on this board hates America. It's that America is made up of people. You know, human beings. As such it's subject to human frailty and the possibility of corruption just like anything else.
I think that most of us hold most dear what America stands for and feel very fortunate that we live in this country.
To protect those ideals one must be constantly on guard. You see, the old saying there's a bad apple in every barrel also applies to this country.
I don't know you. But, I think I know a good deal more about people than you do given that I worked in retail for 14yrs before I came to my current job at Willamette. I'm also pretty sure I'm probably a good deal older. That gives a person some perspective on things and what people are capable of.
America has had it's bad and corrupt times. It's part of history now. To deny that is to deny the truth.
America also has ideals to uphold if it's going to stand for anything. An example to others.
Sacrificing those ideals as a means to an end or to punish an enemy without honour is and should be beneath us.
If any of this is even only slightly true we need to stop and stop now.
Part of the freedom of being an American is to be on guard against it being corrupted and our values being lost forever. If we as citizens aren't going to do it who will?
I know you will try to dismiss this as retoric but, I've tried to give you some insight into why some of us think this way. We don't hate America, we love it. Being American abroad means that you have to uphold your values in front of everyone. We just don't want America to turn into something the founding fathers would have loathed.
<strong>When you spread inflammatory lies about the US it is anti-US. It's a shame that too many people here were so willing to lap up SJO?s tripe.</strong><hr></blockquote>
<strong>When you spread inflammatory lies about the US it is anti-US. It's a shame that too many people here were so willing to lap up SJO?s tripe.</strong><hr></blockquote>
So we don't use depleted uranium? Boy, I'm sure glad THAT'S true.
So we don't use depleted uranium? Boy, I'm sure glad THAT'S true.</strong><hr></blockquote>
Please don't be so dense Bunge. Did I post we didn't use it?
I'm waiting for proof that it's any kind of threat to the health of Iraqis. I'm looking for real science on this one. Not BS anti-US sites with pictures of babies.
But you didn't address Mr. Scott's concern. He is not against freedom of expression.
From what I understood, his concern is that the root of this thread is inflammatory and baseless. He is a scientist, and I am guessing that he approaches the issue from facts. The basis of the criticism of US policy was that there is a direct and proven link between the use of depleted uranium by US forces and the health conditions in Afghanistan.
If I might guess at your point of view, you have said you are in retail sales. In sales, the goal is to make the customer feel good about the purchase. Sometimes the salesman might not be knowledable or may not be scrupulous, but the job is to sell the goods. So there is some room to stretch the truth one way of the other and it is an accepted practice.
I can't speak for Mr. Scott, but I suspect his pro-US or anti-US stance depends more on the validity of the argument being presented rather than blind allegiance.
In my current job I meet many people with awards of achevement. They don't bandy it about lightly. Having such an award doesn't make you a better person. It means you were willing to do the work from the facts you've hopefully absorbed. It's really what you do with those facts, how you collate the data that really counts. He can be just as wrong as the next person. I'm afraid I'm underwhelmed.
And no, I worked in sales for 14yrs. I now work in the events dept. for Willamette University.
I think the burden of disproof should be on Scott if he's so good at this.
The effects of low level radiation have been studied for over half a century. (Not to exclude the effects of high level radiation, but those do not apply here.)
Your last post is precisely an example of what Dr. Scott is criticizing. From what you have written, you are assuming that the results of the picture are directly attributable to the use of delpleted uranium (and, for most of this thread, to the radiation from such uranium).
At this point, I would hope you would feel offended by the journalists who would have you be sympathetic to their point of view by selling you fabrications.
If Dr. Scott is the poster I believe he is, his studies were in physics or medical physics. I worked in or around nuclear power plants for 20 years and handled radioisotopes almost every day for eight of those years.
<strong>If you had been around here for awhile you would know from his posts Scott doesn't exactly have an open mind.</strong><hr></blockquote>
Yes, I was here for the ATI driver debate. We aren't exactly on the same side, since no matter what anyone says, I'm about to get a computer with a G3. However, in this case, I don't see where there is room for debate regarding the medical effects.
US involvement, US use of depleted uranium as weaponry ... all open to debate, from my point of view, as long as someone does not try to present speculation as fact.
Yeah, but these are only message boards. Everyone's word is fact. I'd better stay away from AO. Good thing FC went away.
Please don't be so dense Bunge. Did I post we didn't use it? </strong><hr></blockquote>
No, you posted you know a thing or two about it but haven't shed any light on the subject. We'll all work with the facts and information we have. If you can't or won't add any to the discussion, then I guess you can't or won't add anything to this discussion.
Comments
<strong>
It's just so disappointing. The gleeful display of utter ignorance. All because it said something bad about the US.</strong><hr></blockquote>
Please prove me wrong. If you can. Use real science and not anti-US propaganda sites. Start with the half life and work out the absorbed dose and then don't forget the quality factor for the alpha.
Prove to me you know even the slightest bit about what you're trying to talk about.
If you give up just let me know.
<strong>
Please prove me wrong. If you can. Use real science and not anti-US propaganda sites. Start with the half life and work out the absorbed dose and then don't forget the quality factor for the alpha.
Prove to me you know even the slightest bit about what you're trying to talk about.
If you give up just let me know.</strong><hr></blockquote>
You don't get it. I was referring to how you normally react to any criticism about the US that originates from someone that is not a US citizen.
I know that this thread is based on propaganda. I'm not contesting that. I'm simply saying that what you said about the people you disagree with in this thread also applies to you.
<strong>I'm not being ignorant though. I ... ahhh ... happen to know a thing or two about this stuff. I disagree with it because it's wrong not because it's anti-US. If you think I'm being ignorant please prove me wrong. Or in this case prove SJO right. Good luck.</strong><hr></blockquote>
You didn't read the rest of my post, did you? I said that I do not contest you in this thread. However, that does not mean that the statement you made does not apply to you often. This happens to be one of the exceptions.
<strong>I'm not being ignorant though. I ... ahhh ... happen to know a thing or two about this stuff. </strong><hr></blockquote>
Funny. If you know a thing or two why haven't you added it to the discussion?
The problem isn't that SJO or anyone else on this board hates America. It's that America is made up of people. You know, human beings. As such it's subject to human frailty and the possibility of corruption just like anything else.
I think that most of us hold most dear what America stands for and feel very fortunate that we live in this country.
To protect those ideals one must be constantly on guard. You see, the old saying there's a bad apple in every barrel also applies to this country.
I don't know you. But, I think I know a good deal more about people than you do given that I worked in retail for 14yrs before I came to my current job at Willamette. I'm also pretty sure I'm probably a good deal older. That gives a person some perspective on things and what people are capable of.
America has had it's bad and corrupt times. It's part of history now. To deny that is to deny the truth.
America also has ideals to uphold if it's going to stand for anything. An example to others.
Sacrificing those ideals as a means to an end or to punish an enemy without honour is and should be beneath us.
If any of this is even only slightly true we need to stop and stop now.
Part of the freedom of being an American is to be on guard against it being corrupted and our values being lost forever. If we as citizens aren't going to do it who will?
I know you will try to dismiss this as retoric but, I've tried to give you some insight into why some of us think this way. We don't hate America, we love it. Being American abroad means that you have to uphold your values in front of everyone. We just don't want America to turn into something the founding fathers would have loathed.
[ 01-31-2003: Message edited by: jimmac ]</p>
<strong>When you spread inflammatory lies about the US it is anti-US. It's a shame that too many people here were so willing to lap up SJO?s tripe.</strong><hr></blockquote>
Well I tried...........
<strong>When you spread inflammatory lies about the US it is anti-US. It's a shame that too many people here were so willing to lap up SJO?s tripe.</strong><hr></blockquote>
So we don't use depleted uranium? Boy, I'm sure glad THAT'S true.
<strong>
So we don't use depleted uranium? Boy, I'm sure glad THAT'S true.</strong><hr></blockquote>
Please don't be so dense Bunge. Did I post we didn't use it?
I'm waiting for proof that it's any kind of threat to the health of Iraqis. I'm looking for real science on this one. Not BS anti-US sites with pictures of babies.
Are you too busy being the opposition to consider the other side? Where do you think those pictures came from photoshop?
Or are you just an ignorant son of a sea cook that can't see past the party line?
[ 01-31-2003: Message edited by: jimmac ]</p>
<strong>
Well I tried...........
</strong><hr></blockquote>
But you didn't address Mr. Scott's concern. He is not against freedom of expression.
From what I understood, his concern is that the root of this thread is inflammatory and baseless. He is a scientist, and I am guessing that he approaches the issue from facts. The basis of the criticism of US policy was that there is a direct and proven link between the use of depleted uranium by US forces and the health conditions in Afghanistan.
If I might guess at your point of view, you have said you are in retail sales. In sales, the goal is to make the customer feel good about the purchase. Sometimes the salesman might not be knowledable or may not be scrupulous, but the job is to sell the goods. So there is some room to stretch the truth one way of the other and it is an accepted practice.
I can't speak for Mr. Scott, but I suspect his pro-US or anti-US stance depends more on the validity of the argument being presented rather than blind allegiance.
And no, I worked in sales for 14yrs. I now work in the events dept. for Willamette University.
I think the burden of disproof should be on Scott if he's so good at this.
[ 01-31-2003: Message edited by: jimmac ]</p>
<strong>Scott,
Are you too busy being the opposition to consider the other side? Where do you think those pictures came from photoshop?
Or are you just an ignorant son of a sea cook that can't see past the party line?
[ 01-31-2003: Message edited by: jimmac ]</strong><hr></blockquote>
The effects of low level radiation have been studied for over half a century. (Not to exclude the effects of high level radiation, but those do not apply here.)
Your last post is precisely an example of what Dr. Scott is criticizing. From what you have written, you are assuming that the results of the picture are directly attributable to the use of delpleted uranium (and, for most of this thread, to the radiation from such uranium).
At this point, I would hope you would feel offended by the journalists who would have you be sympathetic to their point of view by selling you fabrications.
If Dr. Scott is the poster I believe he is, his studies were in physics or medical physics. I worked in or around nuclear power plants for 20 years and handled radioisotopes almost every day for eight of those years.
<strong>If you had been around here for awhile you would know from his posts Scott doesn't exactly have an open mind.</strong><hr></blockquote>
Yes, I was here for the ATI driver debate. We aren't exactly on the same side, since no matter what anyone says, I'm about to get a computer with a G3. However, in this case, I don't see where there is room for debate regarding the medical effects.
US involvement, US use of depleted uranium as weaponry ... all open to debate, from my point of view, as long as someone does not try to present speculation as fact.
Yeah, but these are only message boards. Everyone's word is fact. I'd better stay away from AO. Good thing FC went away.
<strong>
Please don't be so dense Bunge. Did I post we didn't use it? </strong><hr></blockquote>
No, you posted you know a thing or two about it but haven't shed any light on the subject. We'll all work with the facts and information we have. If you can't or won't add any to the discussion, then I guess you can't or won't add anything to this discussion.
That's pretty simple.