Apparently they were stopping customers and arguing about the upcoming war and other customers complained about their behavior. Oh how activists loooooooove to be oppressed.
<strong>Apparently they were stopping customers and arguing about the upcoming war and other customers complained about their behavior. Oh how activists loooooooove to be oppressed.
I think that if that is true, that it is possibly part of a campaign to influence opinions and attitudes . . . allthough my realist side tells me not to back that perspective as it will not fly with the more conservative on these boards.
Otherwise it is definitley part and parcel of the general "Spirit of THe Times": militarism and aggression are very much a part of our daily attiudes and aesthetics: we will look back on the car designs of today and will see deliberate aggression, obviouse "Fuuck off I won the road and am bigger badder and meaner than you!!!" and its not just in cars, it pervades our culture today, the same way that 'grooviness' pervaded in 1969 . . . . our movies, our sports (Extreme), our music, aggressive metal-self hatred wallowing or Hip Hop, our cars (people are actually buying those monstrous Hummers!!!!!) our liesure: Unreal Tournement, Quake etc (I am thouroughly guilty here!), our kids toys, and, of course, our foriegn policy
Which is coming first?
Somehow our imagination has the contours of violence these days -- violence and power . . . hey, we think its sexy, sexy and fun . . . .
{by the way this is not to say that our attitudes are not appropriate in many facets concerning the global realities . . . just commenting on how attitudes are part of teh larger cultural environment . . . in design etc}
[quote]can our country fall any further into the shit*er...? <hr></blockquote>
Yes. Read the text of "Patriot Act II". Not just before bedtime though.
Re. shopping malls: The privacy of premises that are open to the public and require public access for their very survival has been a point of discussion for decades.
A case involving the right of free speech may have a bearing on the anti-war t-shirt fracas:
<strong>Sounds like he was loitering.</strong><hr></blockquote>
Judging by Groverat's Smoking Gun link, I'd say he wasn't loitering, he was disturbing the peace... situational irony at its best.
I'm not sure why the security guard asked for their shirts, but the filed complaint is quite short...it may have missed some details. Either way, the two guys should expect to be thrown out if they try to accost other people in the mall.
<strong>Judging by Groverat's Smoking Gun link, I'd say he wasn't loitering, he was disturbing the peace... situational irony at its best.
I'm not sure why the security guard asked for their shirts, but the filed complaint is quite short...it may have missed some details. Either way, the two guys should expect to be thrown out if they try to accost other people in the mall.</strong><hr></blockquote>It was trespassing. There was nothing against the law about wearing the shirt or arguing with other patrons, it was against the law (supposedly) to not leave the mall after being asked to leave.
It was trespassing. There was nothing against the law about wearing the shirt or arguing with other patrons<hr></blockquote>
You can indeed be arrested for accosting other people, especially if the situation is on the brink of something greater.
It was only defined as tresspassing because the mall is private property, and that's probably the easiest thing to book him for. Had the guys started harassing strangers walking by on the sidewalk it would have indeed been disturbing the peace.
<strong>OH MY GOD GUN TOYS!!!! IT'S A WORLDWIDE CONSPIRACY TO RADICALIZE OUR KIDS AND STEAL OUR SOULS!!!
OPPRESSION! OPPRESSION!</strong><hr></blockquote>I swear Grat . . . you must go in cycles. Sometimes you're are intelligent and thoughtful and can read posts for what they say but then you sometimes just go plain nutso and miss it entirely.
<strong>This is pretty bizarre - this guy got arrested in a mall near Albany for refusing to remove his 'give peace a chance' t-shirt or leave (after having purchased the shirt at the mall in question!). It seems kind of strange that mall security would have made an issue of this.
That story is not even funny. I can not believe that happened. We are free to wear t-shirts no matter what they say in a place such as a mall. The nuts who gave him trouble over his shirt need to face some harsh penalty.
He should have been arrested (okay maybe not but)...I was on Penn State's campus and there were protests today and a whopping 150 people showed up out of a 43,000 student campus. They tried to give me a flyer but I just told them that, "I dont want to be nuked, no thank you."
[quote]Originally posted by FellowshipChurch iBook:
<strong>
That story is not even funny. I can not believe that happened. We are free to wear t-shirts no matter what they say in a place such as a mall. The nuts who gave him trouble over his shirt need to face some harsh penalty.
Fellowship</strong><hr></blockquote>
You got less than half the story there Fellow. And the only part the ****** media wants you to hear.
You got less than half the story there Fellow. And the only part the ****** media wants you to hear.</strong><hr></blockquote>
Seriously, the media is sickly. And to tell you the truth, aside from the pacifists the only reason people are opposing a war is because they are liberals who have a grudge against Bush.
Comments
<a href="http://www.thesmokinggun.com"; target="_blank">http://www.thesmokinggun.com</a>;
<strong>Apparently they were stopping customers and arguing about the upcoming war and other customers complained about their behavior. Oh how activists loooooooove to be oppressed.
<a href="http://www.thesmokinggun.com"; target="_blank">http://www.thesmokinggun.com</a></strong><hr></blockquote>If that was really the case, they should have told them to stop bothering customers rather than remove their shirts.
any time i hear about something that seems like it's not possible, i assume that they aren't telling the whole story.
the headlines are what matter, the reasons behind the headlines are often ignored or understated.
I think that if that is true, that it is possibly part of a campaign to influence opinions and attitudes . . . allthough my realist side tells me not to back that perspective as it will not fly with the more conservative on these boards.
Otherwise it is definitley part and parcel of the general "Spirit of THe Times": militarism and aggression are very much a part of our daily attiudes and aesthetics: we will look back on the car designs of today and will see deliberate aggression, obviouse "Fuuck off I won the road and am bigger badder and meaner than you!!!" and its not just in cars, it pervades our culture today, the same way that 'grooviness' pervaded in 1969 . . . . our movies, our sports (Extreme), our music, aggressive metal-self hatred wallowing or Hip Hop, our cars (people are actually buying those monstrous Hummers!!!!!) our liesure: Unreal Tournement, Quake etc (I am thouroughly guilty here!), our kids toys, and, of course, our foriegn policy
Which is coming first?
Somehow our imagination has the contours of violence these days -- violence and power . . . hey, we think its sexy, sexy and fun . . . .
[ 03-05-2003: Message edited by: pfflam ]</p>
That means being somewhere for no good reason.
A mall is private property and that's that. He should've went to the library if he wanted to protest. (as long as he whispered)
Seriously, I'm against the war (for now) but if you are going to protest, you have to do it in a public place not a private business.
MSKR
Yes. Read the text of "Patriot Act II". Not just before bedtime though.
Re. shopping malls: The privacy of premises that are open to the public and require public access for their very survival has been a point of discussion for decades.
A case involving the right of free speech may have a bearing on the anti-war t-shirt fracas:
<a href="http://governing.com/view/vu061900.htm"; target="_blank">http://governing.com/view/vu061900.htm</a>;
<strong>Sounds like he was loitering.</strong><hr></blockquote>
Judging by Groverat's Smoking Gun link, I'd say he wasn't loitering, he was disturbing the peace... situational irony at its best.
I'm not sure why the security guard asked for their shirts, but the filed complaint is quite short...it may have missed some details. Either way, the two guys should expect to be thrown out if they try to accost other people in the mall.
[ 03-05-2003: Message edited by: Artman @_@ ]</p>
OPPRESSION! OPPRESSION!
<strong>Judging by Groverat's Smoking Gun link, I'd say he wasn't loitering, he was disturbing the peace... situational irony at its best.
I'm not sure why the security guard asked for their shirts, but the filed complaint is quite short...it may have missed some details. Either way, the two guys should expect to be thrown out if they try to accost other people in the mall.</strong><hr></blockquote>It was trespassing. There was nothing against the law about wearing the shirt or arguing with other patrons, it was against the law (supposedly) to not leave the mall after being asked to leave.
It was trespassing. There was nothing against the law about wearing the shirt or arguing with other patrons<hr></blockquote>
You can indeed be arrested for accosting other people, especially if the situation is on the brink of something greater.
It was only defined as tresspassing because the mall is private property, and that's probably the easiest thing to book him for. Had the guys started harassing strangers walking by on the sidewalk it would have indeed been disturbing the peace.
[ 03-05-2003: Message edited by: Eugene ]</p>
<strong>OH MY GOD GUN TOYS!!!! IT'S A WORLDWIDE CONSPIRACY TO RADICALIZE OUR KIDS AND STEAL OUR SOULS!!!
OPPRESSION! OPPRESSION!</strong><hr></blockquote>I swear Grat . . . you must go in cycles. Sometimes you're are intelligent and thoughtful and can read posts for what they say but then you sometimes just go plain nutso and miss it entirely.
<strong>This is pretty bizarre - this guy got arrested in a mall near Albany for refusing to remove his 'give peace a chance' t-shirt or leave (after having purchased the shirt at the mall in question!). It seems kind of strange that mall security would have made an issue of this.
<a href="http://www.cnn.com/2003/US/Northeast/03/04/iraq.usa.shirt.reut/index.html"; target="_blank">http://www.cnn.com/2003/US/Northeast/03/04/iraq.usa.shirt.reut/index.html</a></strong><hr></blockquote>;
That story is not even funny. I can not believe that happened. We are free to wear t-shirts no matter what they say in a place such as a mall. The nuts who gave him trouble over his shirt need to face some harsh penalty.
Fellowship
<strong>OH MY GOD GUN TOYS!!!! IT'S A WORLDWIDE CONSPIRACY TO RADICALIZE OUR KIDS AND STEAL OUR SOULS!!!
OPPRESSION! OPPRESSION!</strong><hr></blockquote>
Since when is it cool to celebrate Jesus' ressurection with an 'EASTER CANDY BASKET WITH A FULLY ARMED SOLDIER CENTERPIECE'
Am I being irrational?
Maybe its because Im from Canada that I do find this suspect. We have a lot of minerals in our water so that could be the problem.
<strong>If that was really the case, they should have told them to stop bothering customers rather than remove their shirts.</strong><hr></blockquote>
Well they did tell them to stop. The son did and he was left alone but the father wouldn't. You do the math.
The real question is how was this old man able to nail himself to a cross? Maybe his son did it for him?
<strong>
That story is not even funny. I can not believe that happened. We are free to wear t-shirts no matter what they say in a place such as a mall. The nuts who gave him trouble over his shirt need to face some harsh penalty.
Fellowship</strong><hr></blockquote>
You got less than half the story there Fellow. And the only part the ****** media wants you to hear.
<strong>
You got less than half the story there Fellow. And the only part the ****** media wants you to hear.</strong><hr></blockquote>
Seriously, the media is sickly. And to tell you the truth, aside from the pacifists the only reason people are opposing a war is because they are liberals who have a grudge against Bush.