Yea they do. It's called office live. They give you 25 gigs of free storage for all your word docs, and you can create word docs online on their website. You can send your files to sky drive and share point too.
what does the that have to do with my Mac, iPhone, and iPad? I'm not remotely interested in managing that kind of link. That's 5 years ago.
Its hilarious to me the way the same discussion goes on and on about Office vs. iWork, yet not one person ever mentions WHY they like one over the other.
I like iWork because it does everything I need it to, and it doesn't suck like Office does. Oh, and Apple actually pays attention to what customers want. Oh, and Apple does things like iCloud to link documents from these apps across devices, instantly.
Can Office do that? Yep, but it will be months or years before they get it together. No patience for that.
Why?
Word: Powerful, standardized, compatible with Endnote for research, compatible with corrections for editing with multiple people in an organization.
Excel: This requires no explanation, you can write entire programs in Excel, it's that powerful.
Powerpoint: Robust but the learning curve is higher than Keynote, nevertheless it allows for better presentation of data simply because it is linked better with Word and Excel.
These are only some of the reasons, but again, I'm looking at it from a research/academic point of view. Also, "it does everything I need it to" and "it doesn't suck" are not reasons for something being better. I agree Apple pays attention to customers, yes, but it doesn't change the fact that Office is much more versatile than iWork.
Its hilarious to me the way the same discussion goes on and on about Office vs. iWork, yet not one person ever mentions WHY they like one over the other.
I like iWork because it does everything I need it to, and it doesn't suck like Office does. Oh, and Apple actually pays attention to what customers want. Oh, and Apple does things like iCloud to link documents from these apps across devices, instantly.
Can Office do that? Yep, but it will be months or years before they get it together. No patience for that.
I like Office mostly because Excel has so much good data manipulation stuff which is simple to use. I use Pivot tables a huge amount and find them simple and intuitive to use. Numbers does not seem so intuitive.
I find Word far easier to use than Pages if I'm creating anything other than just a bog standard simple document. I find myself having to make more mouse clicks to achieve simple things in Pages than I do in Word.
Keynote I find better than Powerpoint, but I don't use either of them enough for it to matter.
More than all that, I like that everyone I have to work with have Office - it's dominance is a real benefit to me.
It's interesting that you complain other people don't say why they like one of the other, but your argument against Office is, "it sucks". In what way does it suck?
Very nice! I actually wouldn’t have been surprised if no major apps gained support for the new Lion features until their next major release. Credit to Microsoft for not waiting.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Wings
I just don't get Full Screen. Isn't that what the little green button is for? That's what it does anyway. All my green buttons have cobwebs on them. I usually have other windows I need to see while I'm working in one, or there's something going on in another window I want to keep tabs on (like stocks, subjects of the newest RSS, etc). I just don't understand what the big deal is.
It’s not a big deal. It’s a small deal, and small features are worth having too.
The green button (and the classic Mac OS button that came before it) was never “full screen,” although Windows users often expected that. It was always a shortcut for a “ recommended size,” which might in fact be smaller. It resizes the window to fit the content. As a result, the app itself has to make that judgement—and some do it better than others, making the button only rarely useful. I agree with you on that. (I like it in certain apps, mainly graphics programs where the best window size is a no-brainer for the app to figure out.) It wouldn’t have killed me if they just eliminated the green button, or changed it to be the new full-screen function (although some would have howled at the change). Instead, they kept it and added the full-screen button.
The full-screen button does what Maximize has done (and I’ve always liked) in Windows for ages, but it goes a step further in 3 ways: 1) it hides the Dock/taskbar except when touched, 2) it hides the menu bar except when touched, and 3) it lets the app reconfigure to a view/UI optimized specifically for full-screen, if the developer wishes to go that far. So it’s “even more full-screen” than Windows Maximize. Plus you have the new swipe gestures and Mission Control, allowing multiple full-screen apps at once in a way that Windows doesn’t do nearly as well. In Windows, you’re probably going to mazimize just one app at a time. It’s easier not to limit yourself in Lion!
And I really like it. Not for every app in every case, but there are times when I want to either cut the clutter or see the absolute largest amount of content, and this new button does just what I want.
Two criticisms of it:
1. They’ve made the dock reluctant to pop back when touched. Try it vs. the menu bar and you’ll see. I can understand the dock could ptentially be really annoying, getting in the way when not wanted, but I prefer a simpler solution: put it on the left, away from scrollbars. And let it trigger just as easily as the menu. In the meantime, though, Mission Control does reduce reliance on the Dock.
2. Better multiple-monitor support is needed for full-screen apps. (I’m sure that’s coming.) I say, let each app have one screen, let other screens stay independent, and for Mission Control, just show the full-screen apps for THAT screen on the top of each one. I’m sure there are instances when it can’t be that simple, but it’s a start.
what does the that have to do with my Mac, iPhone, and iPad? I'm not remotely interested in managing that kind of link. That's 5 years ago.
Not unless your business uses these things. If I want to share with my friends I just use google docs, which is way easier than iWork even, and does not require everyone to own a mac.
what's with the term gold standard? thats just a way of saying its popular, even if it sucks.
Windows is popular, but its not any good, at all.
Gold standard to me means it's the benchmark. That's the context the original poster seemed to be using, and your response of "yeah right" seemed to suggest you believe something else is the benchmark, so what is it?
Gold standard to me means it's the benchmark. That's the context the original poster seemed to be using, and your response of "yeah right" seemed to suggest you believe something else is the benchmark, so what is it?
I don't think anybody sensible could claim that Excel wasn't the Gold Standard in spreadsheets, it just does so much more than all the others. Numbers makes for prettier charts but if I had serious numeric work to do that didn't require custom code then Excel would be the tool I'd use.
Word is less Golden, it's still definitely the standard but the advantages that it has over alternatives such as Pages are far less significant. I can see google docs and Pages ultimately unseating Word.
Powerpoint is just horrid - 'Bog Standard' not 'Gold Standard' would be the phrase I would use.
Worst, lamest, most repeated excuse ever. The idea that if your boss uses crap windows and crap Office, that you have to as well.
iWork can easily be used to create Windows-compatible documents. This has been the case for years.
Best part of using iWork's Pages for taking notes is I can export to EPUB and then use iBooks on an iDevice to study later. Even doing searches and adding highlights and sticky notes to my notes.
Also, as a wannabe writer it's great to use iBooks for reviewing what you've written and quickly adding notes for future reference within the same app. Maybe Final Draft for the iPad will change that, but for right now Pages export to EPUB is handy for when being mobile with a 10" display.
I don't think anybody sensible could claim that Excel wasn't the Gold Standard in spreadsheets, it just does so much more than all the others. Numbers makes for prettier charts but if I had serious numeric work to do that didn't require custom code then Excel would be the tool I'd use.
Word is less Golden, it's still definitely the standard but the advantages that it has over alternatives such as Pages are far less significant. I can see google docs and Pages ultimately unseating Word.
Powerpoint is just horrid - 'Bog Standard' not 'Gold Standard' would be the phrase I would use.
Cool that they're not forcing their users to buy an upgrade for these features I guess. I was half expecting they would. Some of my friends use Office:mac because they got it cheap when they bought their MacBook Pros so they'll be happy.
Personally I jumped ship to iWork and never looked back.
I just don't get Full Screen. Isn't that what the little green button is for? That's what it does anyway. All my green buttons have cobwebs on them. I usually have other windows I need to see while I'm working in one, or there's something going on in another window I want to keep tabs on (like stocks, subjects of the newest RSS, etc). I just don't understand what the big deal is.
Nope full screen is far more than that. Plus programs can be different. In iPhoto, for example, it presents a new interface in full screen.,
Excel is the definitive spreadsheet program. There is no real substitute for it. Score it 1-0, MS Office.
Word is the standard "max feature" word processing program, but only really necessary for unusually complex or specialized documents. For 95 percent of word processing, Pages is quicker, easier, and more more intuitive. Score it .75 iWork, .25 Office.
Keynote owns Powerpoint. Powerpoint has (perhaps) better integration with Excel, so it's not a shut out. Score it .75 iWork, .25 Office.
Office 2011 is the gold standard for office suites, it makes iWork look like Office '97 (except that Excel '97 had more features than Numbers, but that's another issue). Versions, auto-save, and full-screen are just a nice touch to an already impressive product.
Comments
Yea they do. It's called office live. They give you 25 gigs of free storage for all your word docs, and you can create word docs online on their website. You can send your files to sky drive and share point too.
what does the that have to do with my Mac, iPhone, and iPad? I'm not remotely interested in managing that kind of link. That's 5 years ago.
Its hilarious to me the way the same discussion goes on and on about Office vs. iWork, yet not one person ever mentions WHY they like one over the other.
I like iWork because it does everything I need it to, and it doesn't suck like Office does. Oh, and Apple actually pays attention to what customers want. Oh, and Apple does things like iCloud to link documents from these apps across devices, instantly.
Can Office do that? Yep, but it will be months or years before they get it together. No patience for that.
Why?
Word: Powerful, standardized, compatible with Endnote for research, compatible with corrections for editing with multiple people in an organization.
Excel: This requires no explanation, you can write entire programs in Excel, it's that powerful.
Powerpoint: Robust but the learning curve is higher than Keynote, nevertheless it allows for better presentation of data simply because it is linked better with Word and Excel.
These are only some of the reasons, but again, I'm looking at it from a research/academic point of view. Also, "it does everything I need it to" and "it doesn't suck" are not reasons for something being better. I agree Apple pays attention to customers, yes, but it doesn't change the fact that Office is much more versatile than iWork.
Its hilarious to me the way the same discussion goes on and on about Office vs. iWork, yet not one person ever mentions WHY they like one over the other.
I like iWork because it does everything I need it to, and it doesn't suck like Office does. Oh, and Apple actually pays attention to what customers want. Oh, and Apple does things like iCloud to link documents from these apps across devices, instantly.
Can Office do that? Yep, but it will be months or years before they get it together. No patience for that.
I like Office mostly because Excel has so much good data manipulation stuff which is simple to use. I use Pivot tables a huge amount and find them simple and intuitive to use. Numbers does not seem so intuitive.
I find Word far easier to use than Pages if I'm creating anything other than just a bog standard simple document. I find myself having to make more mouse clicks to achieve simple things in Pages than I do in Word.
Keynote I find better than Powerpoint, but I don't use either of them enough for it to matter.
More than all that, I like that everyone I have to work with have Office - it's dominance is a real benefit to me.
It's interesting that you complain other people don't say why they like one of the other, but your argument against Office is, "it sucks". In what way does it suck?
I just don't get Full Screen. Isn't that what the little green button is for? That's what it does anyway. All my green buttons have cobwebs on them. I usually have other windows I need to see while I'm working in one, or there's something going on in another window I want to keep tabs on (like stocks, subjects of the newest RSS, etc). I just don't understand what the big deal is.
It’s not a big deal. It’s a small deal, and small features are worth having too.
The green button (and the classic Mac OS button that came before it) was never “full screen,” although Windows users often expected that. It was always a shortcut for a “ recommended size,” which might in fact be smaller. It resizes the window to fit the content. As a result, the app itself has to make that judgement—and some do it better than others, making the button only rarely useful. I agree with you on that. (I like it in certain apps, mainly graphics programs where the best window size is a no-brainer for the app to figure out.) It wouldn’t have killed me if they just eliminated the green button, or changed it to be the new full-screen function (although some would have howled at the change). Instead, they kept it and added the full-screen button.
The full-screen button does what Maximize has done (and I’ve always liked) in Windows for ages, but it goes a step further in 3 ways: 1) it hides the Dock/taskbar except when touched, 2) it hides the menu bar except when touched, and 3) it lets the app reconfigure to a view/UI optimized specifically for full-screen, if the developer wishes to go that far. So it’s “even more full-screen” than Windows Maximize. Plus you have the new swipe gestures and Mission Control, allowing multiple full-screen apps at once in a way that Windows doesn’t do nearly as well. In Windows, you’re probably going to mazimize just one app at a time. It’s easier not to limit yourself in Lion!
And I really like it. Not for every app in every case, but there are times when I want to either cut the clutter or see the absolute largest amount of content, and this new button does just what I want.
Two criticisms of it:
1. They’ve made the dock reluctant to pop back when touched. Try it vs. the menu bar and you’ll see. I can understand the dock could ptentially be really annoying, getting in the way when not wanted, but I prefer a simpler solution: put it on the left, away from scrollbars. And let it trigger just as easily as the menu. In the meantime, though, Mission Control does reduce reliance on the Dock.
2. Better multiple-monitor support is needed for full-screen apps. (I’m sure that’s coming.) I say, let each app have one screen, let other screens stay independent, and for Mission Control, just show the full-screen apps for THAT screen on the top of each one. I’m sure there are instances when it can’t be that simple, but it’s a start.
Worst, lamest, most repeated excuse ever. The idea that if your boss uses crap windows and crap Office, that you have to as well.
iWork can easily be used to create Windows-compatible documents. This has been the case for years.
Not for Excel or Word, and Keynote presentations look like crap when converted to PPT. Just saying.
what does the that have to do with my Mac, iPhone, and iPad? I'm not remotely interested in managing that kind of link. That's 5 years ago.
Not unless your business uses these things. If I want to share with my friends I just use google docs, which is way easier than iWork even, and does not require everyone to own a mac.
what's with the term gold standard? thats just a way of saying its popular, even if it sucks.
Windows is popular, but its not any good, at all.
Gold standard to me means it's the benchmark. That's the context the original poster seemed to be using, and your response of "yeah right" seemed to suggest you believe something else is the benchmark, so what is it?
Gold standard to me means it's the benchmark. That's the context the original poster seemed to be using, and your response of "yeah right" seemed to suggest you believe something else is the benchmark, so what is it?
I don't think anybody sensible could claim that Excel wasn't the Gold Standard in spreadsheets, it just does so much more than all the others. Numbers makes for prettier charts but if I had serious numeric work to do that didn't require custom code then Excel would be the tool I'd use.
Word is less Golden, it's still definitely the standard but the advantages that it has over alternatives such as Pages are far less significant. I can see google docs and Pages ultimately unseating Word.
Powerpoint is just horrid - 'Bog Standard' not 'Gold Standard' would be the phrase I would use.
Worst, lamest, most repeated excuse ever. The idea that if your boss uses crap windows and crap Office, that you have to as well.
iWork can easily be used to create Windows-compatible documents. This has been the case for years.
Best part of using iWork's Pages for taking notes is I can export to EPUB and then use iBooks on an iDevice to study later. Even doing searches and adding highlights and sticky notes to my notes.
Also, as a wannabe writer it's great to use iBooks for reviewing what you've written and quickly adding notes for future reference within the same app. Maybe Final Draft for the iPad will change that, but for right now Pages export to EPUB is handy for when being mobile with a 10" display.
You guys can futz with iWork all you want but I need 100% Office compatibility as that's the only way I can have a Windows-free household.
Yet they couldn't bother to make the apps 64 bit.
iWork isn't 64-bit either.
I don't think anybody sensible could claim that Excel wasn't the Gold Standard in spreadsheets, it just does so much more than all the others. Numbers makes for prettier charts but if I had serious numeric work to do that didn't require custom code then Excel would be the tool I'd use.
Word is less Golden, it's still definitely the standard but the advantages that it has over alternatives such as Pages are far less significant. I can see google docs and Pages ultimately unseating Word.
Powerpoint is just horrid - 'Bog Standard' not 'Gold Standard' would be the phrase I would use.
A fair response.
Personally I jumped ship to iWork and never looked back.
I just don't get Full Screen. Isn't that what the little green button is for? That's what it does anyway. All my green buttons have cobwebs on them. I usually have other windows I need to see while I'm working in one, or there's something going on in another window I want to keep tabs on (like stocks, subjects of the newest RSS, etc). I just don't understand what the big deal is.
Nope full screen is far more than that. Plus programs can be different. In iPhoto, for example, it presents a new interface in full screen.,
Word is the standard "max feature" word processing program, but only really necessary for unusually complex or specialized documents. For 95 percent of word processing, Pages is quicker, easier, and more more intuitive. Score it .75 iWork, .25 Office.
Keynote owns Powerpoint. Powerpoint has (perhaps) better integration with Excel, so it's not a shut out. Score it .75 iWork, .25 Office.
Price: iWork 1, Office 0.
Final Score: iWork 2.5, Office 1.5.
This is a Mac-only comparison, obviously.
iWork isn't 64-bit either.
Does that mean Numbers won't be able to cope with the value of my APPL shares soon?
Does that mean Numbers won't be able to cope with the value of my APPL shares soon?
I sure hope so.
Office 2011 is the gold standard for office suites, it makes iWork look like Office '97 (except that Excel '97 had more features than Numbers, but that's another issue). Versions, auto-save, and full-screen are just a nice touch to an already impressive product.
And how is the weather in Redmond today?