PC makers struggling to match MacBook Air pricing ahead of Ultrabook launches

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  • Reply 21 of 57
    akhomerunakhomerun Posts: 386member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by dualie View Post


    It's not going to stop certain Apple haters from spreading their misinformed (and usually borrowed) opinion that Apple products are across the board more expensive and therefore not worthy.



    I think this could be a good thing, a VERY good thing for Apple. Think of the iPad competitors - you could have an Android 3.0 tablet for about the same price, maybe $50 less, but why would you when the product that consumers see as premium is about the same price?



    Apple hardware is perceived as highly premium and therefore if the PC market can't undercut Apple by 30% like they have been able to do with cheaply designed and bulky PC laptops there is no way they can compete well.



    What if a Mercedes was $25,000 and a Kia was $20,000? Wouldn't you just buy a Mercedes and keep it for a few more years? Even if the Kia was nearly identical in features and performance? Alarmingly (for PC companies) they can't even get this kind of price difference according to this article. I think that's a decent analogy.



    In other words, people are simply less willing to buy a chunky laptop at a price discount anymore.



    I think it's possible that the increased irrelevance of system specs for most people is a contributing factor. Now Apple



    And of course, with more cash than the US Govt., Apple prepays for all their components and receives a hefty discount. It helps that the Macbook Air is selling like crazy.
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  • Reply 22 of 57
    tbelltbell Posts: 3,146member
    There real question is why is Intel, an Apple supplier and partner, helping Apple's competition compete with Apple. Perhaps, Intel is worried the rumors of Apple moving the AirBooks to the ARM processor are true. Otherwise, Intel has no business assisting some partners at the expense of others.
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  • Reply 23 of 57
    MacPromacpro Posts: 19,873member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by 512ke View Post


    Gone are the days when the top PC was a big set top box that you could assemble yourself from components you bought at Fry's for a third of what Apple was charging for its cheapest Mac.



    Now Apple can buy the RAM, screens, and other key components for less that we pay at Fry's, and less than what its competitors can pay anywhere in the world.



    What a difference a decade makes.



    EDIT: Also gone are the days when you could upgrade. Hello to the era of lovely products that you use for three years and then get rid of!



    Re your edit point ... and the good news is with an Apple product they resell three years later form a good price. PCs three years old are not even wanted by Goodwill!
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  • Reply 24 of 57
    mwhitecomwhiteco Posts: 112member
    Let me tell you how good Apple is my daughter who goes to usb had her computer which was less than a year old go bad she had a test on it they took all her information off it for only the cost of the external hard drive, they said because it had a ding on the monitor they might need to charge her to fix it, they not only fixed it with a new motherboard, they also put on a new monitor all this for no charge. She dropped her iphone a couple of months ago and broke the glass, she could use it but when she went in the other day to get it fixed we expected it to cost 200 they gave her a new on for free saying that this was the first time she had brought it in for repair. I wouldn't buy anything but apple products.
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  • Reply 25 of 57
    You guys want to know the Dominating brand at my office and the whole campus? ( I work at google hq in mountain view)



    Apple



    95% percent of the engineers riding around and even my bosses all have bright silver macs and some even have apple wireless keyboard connected to the work computers haaha
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  • Reply 26 of 57
    paxmanpaxman Posts: 4,729member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by mwhiteco View Post


    Let me tell you how good Apple is my daughter who goes to usb had her computer which was less than a year old go bad she had a test on it they took all her information off it for only the cost of the external hard drive, they said because it had a ding on the monitor they might need to charge her to fix it, they not only fixed it with a new motherboard, they also put on a new monitor all this for no charge. She dropped her iphone a couple of months ago and broke the glass, she could use it but when she went in the other day to get it fixed we expected it to cost 200 they gave her a new on for free saying that this was the first time she had brought it in for repair. I wouldn't buy anything but apple products.



    I think a lot of people have come out of an Apple Customer Service 'event' with a smile on their face going 'Wow!'. I have and even if they hadn't gone above and beyond it still would have been exceptional.
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  • Reply 27 of 57
    anantksundaramanantksundaram Posts: 20,419member
    I have to believe that this kind of dominance -- even though utterly wrongly -- will start to attract antitrust scrutiny. Competitors are going to start to moan and groan about Apple using its high-volume supply chain to keep industry prices low, and there'll be some genius at the DoJ that springs a new doctrine of "supply chain efficiency as a weapon of market power". Wait and see. \
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  • Reply 28 of 57
    anantksundaramanantksundaram Posts: 20,419member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Flash_beezy View Post


    95% percent of the engineers riding around and even my bosses all have bright silver macs and.......



    Aluminum (or aluminium, for those across the pond).
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  • Reply 29 of 57
    blastdoorblastdoor Posts: 3,851member
    It used to be that Dell's big advantage over everyone else was their production and distribution model. The knock on Dell (and a pretty fair one, I think) is that was their only advantage, and that they really didn't do anything innovative at all in terms of design.



    How ironic is it that Apple is now surpassing Dell in production and distribution efficiencies while also maintaining a huge advantage in terms of design?



    And then of course there's the infamous Dell quote from the 90s which hardly needs repeating...
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  • Reply 30 of 57
    solipsismsolipsism Posts: 25,726member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by anantksundaram View Post


    I have to believe that this kind of dominance -- even though utterly wrongly -- will start to attract antitrust scrutiny. Competitors are going to start to moan and groan about Apple using its high-volume supply chain to keep industry prices low, and there'll be some genius at the DoJ that springs a new doctrine of "supply chain efficiency as a weapon of market power". Wait and see. \



    I don't think it's too critical to see if Apple is using it's position for an unfair monopsony position. Now, if they are selling all they can get and they aren't forcing their would be competition out of the market with their buying power then it's all on the up-and-up.



    PS: I'm saying that even though such an investigation would likely affect my valuation negatively.
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  • Reply 31 of 57
    paulmjohnsonpaulmjohnson Posts: 1,380member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by 512ke View Post


    EDIT: Also gone are the days when you could upgrade. Hello to the era of lovely products that you use for three years and then get rid of!



    The funny things is, how often could you actually upgrade? I remember when I wanted to upgrade back in my PC days in the 90's that more often than not I pretty much couldn't. A new processor would mean a new motherboard. A new motherboard would need new memory and probably there had been a change in the video card interface. In the end, whenever I upgraded all I ended up with was the same beige box with a completely different computer in it!



    The thing that always needs to be factored in when thinking about Apple prices (and this was true when they were "more expensive" as well) is how much you can sell them second hand for.



    I sold a 5 year old Macbook Pro (the first Intel one) earlier this year. It was broken (screen was totally shot - either needed a new screen, or the chap in the Apple shop said more likely a new mainboard), and yet I still got $275! For a broken computer!



    I sold my wifes old Windows laptop around the same time. It was three years old, high end for the time, and crucially, worked, and I only got $255.



    An older, broken Mac is worth more than a working newer PC - amazing!
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  • Reply 32 of 57
    wizard69wizard69 Posts: 13,377member
    Take USB ports for example. Mobile chip sets support more than two ports for example. Some of those ports are used internally but the point remains the electrical hardware is 90% of the way there already.



    Quote:
    Originally Posted by JupiterOne View Post


    I think this is part of their problem. They don't realize that there must be some compromise with these types of notebooks. Apple realized that early on.



    The AIRs aren't bad machines at all, however it wouldn't take a lot to improve on them. In any event Intel has already failed here because of their focus on copying the physical size. It would have better to focus on user needs and new technology. In this regards Apples use of Thunderbolt is an obvious stradege to drive technology into the form factor.

    Quote:

    And after all the complaining about the Air's no ethernet port, no ODD, smaller storage, people are buying them up like crazy. But others are still going to try to cram every possible port/interface/big ass HDD they can.



    At this point the only thing that frustrates me about the AIRs is the lack of internal storage capacity and no OpenCL support. Hopefully buy the time I buy again technology will have taken care of those issues.
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  • Reply 33 of 57
    paulmjohnsonpaulmjohnson Posts: 1,380member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by anantksundaram View Post


    I have to believe that this kind of dominance -- even though utterly wrongly -- will start to attract antitrust scrutiny. Competitors are going to start to moan and groan about Apple using its high-volume supply chain to keep industry prices low, and there'll be some genius at the DoJ that springs a new doctrine of "supply chain efficiency as a weapon of market power". Wait and see. \



    It's a sad indication of the pathetic world we live in, but you're probably right.



    I've actually been waiting for someone to pop up and claim Apples iTunes monopoly is forcing other tablet competitors out of the market.



    It would be tragic, would hopefully fail, but with the profligacy of lawyers, will probably end up happening.....
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  • Reply 34 of 57
    cloudgazercloudgazer Posts: 2,161member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by PaulMJohnson View Post


    It's a sad indication of the pathetic world we live in, but you're probably right.



    Given that there was no serious anti-trust investigation of MS until they were way over 80% of share, and given that the same has applied to Google I'd say that it's pretty unlikely that we'll see a significant anti-trust investigation of Apple.



    We might see a review if they try to pull off a big merger, but then that's standard operating procedure for competition authorities.
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  • Reply 35 of 57
    john.bjohn.b Posts: 2,742member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by PaulMJohnson View Post


    I've actually been waiting for someone to pop up and claim Apples iTunes monopoly is forcing other tablet competitors out of the market.



    Except it was Steve Jobs who pushed the record labels into delivering DRM-free music, which meant you could play iTunes purchases on other hardware.
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  • Reply 36 of 57
    solipsismsolipsism Posts: 25,726member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by PaulMJohnson View Post


    I've actually been waiting for someone to pop up and claim Apples iTunes monopoly is forcing other tablet competitors out of the market.



    But have yet to become a monopoly in music distribution. They are merely the largest single retailer of music. The last thing I read had music sales from CDs being larger than all of iTunes.
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  • Reply 37 of 57
    paulmjohnsonpaulmjohnson Posts: 1,380member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by solipsism View Post


    But have yet to become a monopoly in music distribution. They are merely the largest single retailer of music. The last thing I read had music sales from CDs being larger than all of iTunes.



    You really think good sense would stop an idiot lawyer?
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  • Reply 38 of 57
    galbigalbi Posts: 968member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by solipsism View Post


    Or even 3 years…



    This graph is lumping mobile apps sales into the mobile phone profits as one.



    It's not a good representative of the real data. Notice the drastic change from Q2 2008 to Q3 2008. Difference in categorization in the accounting books.
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  • Reply 39 of 57
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Blastdoor View Post


    And then of course there's the infamous Dell quote from the 90s which hardly needs repeating...



    I need it repeated...... for some reason I can't rest until I know what it was!
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  • Reply 40 of 57
    john.bjohn.b Posts: 2,742member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by dinomation View Post


    I need it repeated...... for some reason I can't rest until I know what it was!



    When asked in 1997 what he would do to fix Apple's problems, Michael Dell infamously told a crowd of IT executives, "What would I do? I'd shut it down and give the money back to the shareholders."



    As context, it was the week after a Steve Jobs keynote where he defended some drastic decisions (as interim CEO, no less) that included shutting down projects and even the Apple clone market in an effort to turn Apple around.
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