Your lack of knowledge that Windows tablets came first.
Yeah. They say, "The only people who EVER bring up that saying are the people who've lost an argument where the other person made an absolutely correct statement based on factual contextual information and not an assumption at all."
Minus them being laptops.
Oh, so you're even agreeing with me now that Windows tablets came first. Thanks for wasting our time.
"our" time? Do you have a mouse in your pocket, or are you royalty? Perhaps you represent the entire forum now?
Windows made a pathetic attempt with those expensive and oversized good for nothing "tablets". If your majesty wants to take credit for those, so be it! Whatever the case, they were big LOOOsers!
Google just threw WebOS a lifeline by buying Motorola. all the other Android dependent smartphone OEM's have to start looking for OS alternatives immediately.
I disagree. I don't expect Google to seriously compete in the handset manufacturing and selling business. They may even drop the Motorola brands completely.
They made a play for MMI for the patents so that they can save those "other Android dependent smartphone OEM's" by countersuing the heck out of Apple and Microsoft until cross-licensing deals can be made and a patent cold-war equilibrium is reached. Without these, Samsung, HTC, and other OEM's are about to get damaged by Apple legal (as they have already been damaged by Microsoft). Once those others get hurt badly enough, the Android army would fracture and evaporate in the wind.
That puts Google in a position to take all the cream off the top of the Android market via Motorola.
Ain't gonna happen. The whole reason Android got such great "market share" to begin with was because it had a diverse "army". <Side note: Funny that the only thing some of those platforms had in common was the name, so we really shouldn't sum them together as if they a compatible, unified, platform. But I digress...>
The point is that if Google does an "about face" now and cuts its army down to just the "special forces", it's going to find out that its "special force" squad isn't as well trained as Apple's "special force" squad, and it will be wishing it had its army back. There is some strength in numbers, as Android has shown.
"our" time? Do you have a mouse in your pocket, or are you royalty? Perhaps you represent the entire forum now?
Windows made a pathetic attempt with those expensive and oversized good for nothing "tablets". If your majesty wants to take credit for those, so be it! Whatever the case, they were big LOOOsers!
Heavens, no. I just meant yours and mine.
They were tablets, though. There's nothing that can disagree with that.
I disagree. I don't expect Google to seriously compete in the handset manufacturing and selling business. They may even drop the Motorola brands completely.
Extremely unlikely. Aside from dissatisfied customers, they'd have a massive revolt from the shareholders.
I think it IS likely that Google will sell off the handset business to someone (RIM would be my guess), but it would be foolish for them to just drop it.
Extremely unlikely. Aside from dissatisfied customers, they'd have a massive revolt from the shareholders.
I think it IS likely that Google will sell off the handset business to someone (RIM would be my guess), but it would be foolish for them to just drop it.
I don't know why people think this is unlikely. Remember Flip camcorders? Cisco bought them and later shut them down. Didn't even try to sell them. IIRC Gruber said in a post at DF that the Flip division was profitable when it was shut down.
I don't know what Google's plans are for Moto. I wouldn't rule out shutting them down at some point however. MOTO was unprofitable so GOOG spinning off the handset business may not bring anything. The value was in the patents and GOOG probably isn't selling them anytime soon. MOTO's handset business is a liability, not an asset. GOOG will need to figure out how to turn that around.
Then why do people still buy Dell computers, they are half-rate hardware with half-baked software and they are still pushing out more Desktops than Apple can sell iMacs and Mac Minis, and HP is still selling more laptops than Apple.
And we all know Apple laptops are at the top of the game as far as industrial design, and the software, OS X Lion and iLife, it's the best on the market.
The reason? You can get an HP/Dell laptop for $299 or $399 when Apple starts at $999 for the bare-bones tiny MacBook Air, and goes up to $2700 for their 17" offerings.
Apple can't compete on those price lines. Simple as that. If Apple really wanted to do the volume selling of laptops, they need to get their prices more in line with the rest of the market. This has always been the reason people turn to PCs, simply because they cannot afford the Mac alternative...the iPads and iPhones can be easily got for the sub-$500 range, that is why they sell like hotcakes.
Apple does not even try to compete at the ultra low end of the desktop market where the margins are razor thin. Why should they right now? They sell more MP3 players than anyone else, more tablets than anyone else, and have had steady gains in market share for they past five years in desktops. Competing only on price is a losing strategy.
Ain't gonna happen. The whole reason Android got such great "market share" to begin with was because it had a diverse "army". <Side note: Funny that the only thing some of those platforms had in common was the name, so we really shouldn't sum them together as if they a compatible, unified, platform. But I digress...>
The point is that if Google does an "about face" now and cuts its army down to just the "special forces", it's going to find out that its "special force" squad isn't as well trained as Apple's "special force" squad, and it will be wishing it had its army back. There is some strength in numbers, as Android has shown.
Thompson
well yeah, field marshall Google has just told its Android Army that "it's every man for himself!" so a year from now there won't be many troops left.
but Googorola will still be able to put out premium "pure Android" smartphones with the latest and greatest versions of Android and all of Google's web apps, and get a premium price with decent profit margins for them, whatever the market share. that's the "cream" i wuz talking about.
I don't know why people think this is unlikely. Remember Flip camcorders? Cisco bought them and later shut them down. Didn't even try to sell them. IIRC Gruber said in a post at DF that the Flip division was profitable when it was shut down.
I don't know what Google's plans are for Moto. I wouldn't rule out shutting them down at some point however. MOTO was unprofitable so GOOG spinning off the handset business may not bring anything. The value was in the patents and GOOG probably isn't selling them anytime soon. MOTO's handset business is a liability, not an asset. GOOG will need to figure out how to turn that around.
There are huge differences:
1. FLIP camcorders were not successful in the marketplace. Moto phones are.
2. No one was likely to pay anything for FLIP camcorders at the time it was shut down. Moto cell phone division would get an attractive price (assuming that Google gives a license to use its patents).
3. There's plenty of reason to believe that Moto's phone business could be made profitable with some management changes. There was absolutely no reason to think that Flip could have been made profitable.
3. There's plenty of reason to believe that Moto's phone business could be made profitable with some management changes. There was absolutely no reason to think that Flip could have been made profitable.
but there is also absolutely no reason to think Google has any idea how to solve Moto's management problems. this is a panic buy, not a well thought out and planned management restructuring. and Google knows zilch about manufacturing and hardware engineering. the public theory is they are buying Moto to acquire that expertise. but what they are really acquiring is their incompetence!
but there is also absolutely no reason to think Google has any idea how to solve Moto's management problems. this is a panic buy, not a well thought out and planned management restructuring. and Google knows zilch about manufacturing and hardware engineering. the public theory is they are buying Moto to acquire that expertise. but what they are really acquiring is their incompetence!
This is absurd. There's no reason to think that Google DOESN'T have a plan, either.
You don't spend $12.5 B on a whim - even if you're rich. The idea that Google is full of idiots who don't have any clue what they're doing is absurd. While I despise their business ethics, they are clearly very astute business people. And their advisors would be all over them if they tried to do this without a plan (to the point where you would have seen reports of Google advisors quitting).
1. FLIP camcorders were not successful in the marketplace. Moto phones are.
2. No one was likely to pay anything for FLIP camcorders at the time it was shut down. Moto cell phone division would get an attractive price (assuming that Google gives a license to use its patents).
3. There's plenty of reason to believe that Moto's phone business could be made profitable with some management changes. There was absolutely no reason to think that Flip could have been made profitable.
1) I'd argue the opposite. Flips dominated the handheld camcorder business. I would agree that cellphones are about to decimate that business however.
2) Could be, who knows? What makes you think anyone would pay for the Moto handset business? That business is unprofitable at the moment. What's going to make it profitable?
3) I think the jury is still out on whether Moto can be made profitable. The Android handset business is looking a lot like the pc business, a low profit to no profit commodity business.
I still don't know why people think WebOS under HP really has any future at all. It's just rubbish, and will take another six months to be anywhere close to the iPad.
Maybe HP can turn things around, but this is really worse than anyone thought. The anti-Apple sentiment, geek fantasies and blogs desperate for clicks and anything non-iPad are proven once again to be not even in the same universe as our current reality.
Well, another I-told-you-so from me. HP killed off WebOS. I bet you Best Buy must be real thrilled now. I'm sure things have been "smoothed" over quite well indeed.
Comments
Your lack of knowledge that Windows tablets came first.
Yeah. They say, "The only people who EVER bring up that saying are the people who've lost an argument where the other person made an absolutely correct statement based on factual contextual information and not an assumption at all."
Minus them being laptops.
Oh, so you're even agreeing with me now that Windows tablets came first. Thanks for wasting our time.
"our" time? Do you have a mouse in your pocket, or are you royalty? Perhaps you represent the entire forum now?
Windows made a pathetic attempt with those expensive and oversized good for nothing "tablets". If your majesty wants to take credit for those, so be it! Whatever the case, they were big LOOOsers!
Google just threw WebOS a lifeline by buying Motorola. all the other Android dependent smartphone OEM's have to start looking for OS alternatives immediately.
I disagree. I don't expect Google to seriously compete in the handset manufacturing and selling business. They may even drop the Motorola brands completely.
They made a play for MMI for the patents so that they can save those "other Android dependent smartphone OEM's" by countersuing the heck out of Apple and Microsoft until cross-licensing deals can be made and a patent cold-war equilibrium is reached. Without these, Samsung, HTC, and other OEM's are about to get damaged by Apple legal (as they have already been damaged by Microsoft). Once those others get hurt badly enough, the Android army would fracture and evaporate in the wind.
Thompson
That puts Google in a position to take all the cream off the top of the Android market via Motorola.
Ain't gonna happen. The whole reason Android got such great "market share" to begin with was because it had a diverse "army". <Side note: Funny that the only thing some of those platforms had in common was the name, so we really shouldn't sum them together as if they a compatible, unified, platform. But I digress...>
The point is that if Google does an "about face" now and cuts its army down to just the "special forces", it's going to find out that its "special force" squad isn't as well trained as Apple's "special force" squad, and it will be wishing it had its army back. There is some strength in numbers, as Android has shown.
Thompson
"our" time? Do you have a mouse in your pocket, or are you royalty? Perhaps you represent the entire forum now?
Windows made a pathetic attempt with those expensive and oversized good for nothing "tablets". If your majesty wants to take credit for those, so be it! Whatever the case, they were big LOOOsers!
Heavens, no. I just meant yours and mine.
They were tablets, though. There's nothing that can disagree with that.
I disagree. I don't expect Google to seriously compete in the handset manufacturing and selling business. They may even drop the Motorola brands completely.
Extremely unlikely. Aside from dissatisfied customers, they'd have a massive revolt from the shareholders.
I think it IS likely that Google will sell off the handset business to someone (RIM would be my guess), but it would be foolish for them to just drop it.
Extremely unlikely. Aside from dissatisfied customers, they'd have a massive revolt from the shareholders.
I think it IS likely that Google will sell off the handset business to someone (RIM would be my guess), but it would be foolish for them to just drop it.
I don't know why people think this is unlikely. Remember Flip camcorders? Cisco bought them and later shut them down. Didn't even try to sell them. IIRC Gruber said in a post at DF that the Flip division was profitable when it was shut down.
I don't know what Google's plans are for Moto. I wouldn't rule out shutting them down at some point however. MOTO was unprofitable so GOOG spinning off the handset business may not bring anything. The value was in the patents and GOOG probably isn't selling them anytime soon. MOTO's handset business is a liability, not an asset. GOOG will need to figure out how to turn that around.
Then why do people still buy Dell computers, they are half-rate hardware with half-baked software and they are still pushing out more Desktops than Apple can sell iMacs and Mac Minis, and HP is still selling more laptops than Apple.
And we all know Apple laptops are at the top of the game as far as industrial design, and the software, OS X Lion and iLife, it's the best on the market.
The reason? You can get an HP/Dell laptop for $299 or $399 when Apple starts at $999 for the bare-bones tiny MacBook Air, and goes up to $2700 for their 17" offerings.
Apple can't compete on those price lines. Simple as that. If Apple really wanted to do the volume selling of laptops, they need to get their prices more in line with the rest of the market. This has always been the reason people turn to PCs, simply because they cannot afford the Mac alternative...the iPads and iPhones can be easily got for the sub-$500 range, that is why they sell like hotcakes.
Apple does not even try to compete at the ultra low end of the desktop market where the margins are razor thin. Why should they right now? They sell more MP3 players than anyone else, more tablets than anyone else, and have had steady gains in market share for they past five years in desktops. Competing only on price is a losing strategy.
Ain't gonna happen. The whole reason Android got such great "market share" to begin with was because it had a diverse "army". <Side note: Funny that the only thing some of those platforms had in common was the name, so we really shouldn't sum them together as if they a compatible, unified, platform. But I digress...>
The point is that if Google does an "about face" now and cuts its army down to just the "special forces", it's going to find out that its "special force" squad isn't as well trained as Apple's "special force" squad, and it will be wishing it had its army back. There is some strength in numbers, as Android has shown.
Thompson
well yeah, field marshall Google has just told its Android Army that "it's every man for himself!" so a year from now there won't be many troops left.
but Googorola will still be able to put out premium "pure Android" smartphones with the latest and greatest versions of Android and all of Google's web apps, and get a premium price with decent profit margins for them, whatever the market share. that's the "cream" i wuz talking about.
I don't know why people think this is unlikely. Remember Flip camcorders? Cisco bought them and later shut them down. Didn't even try to sell them. IIRC Gruber said in a post at DF that the Flip division was profitable when it was shut down.
I don't know what Google's plans are for Moto. I wouldn't rule out shutting them down at some point however. MOTO was unprofitable so GOOG spinning off the handset business may not bring anything. The value was in the patents and GOOG probably isn't selling them anytime soon. MOTO's handset business is a liability, not an asset. GOOG will need to figure out how to turn that around.
There are huge differences:
1. FLIP camcorders were not successful in the marketplace. Moto phones are.
2. No one was likely to pay anything for FLIP camcorders at the time it was shut down. Moto cell phone division would get an attractive price (assuming that Google gives a license to use its patents).
3. There's plenty of reason to believe that Moto's phone business could be made profitable with some management changes. There was absolutely no reason to think that Flip could have been made profitable.
Bright minds think alike.
Why, thank you, sir.
That HP exec had best wear some Kevlar, pardner...
Or this:
How things are going to get "smoothed" over. Guess who will be thrown under?
PS. I have no idea what the caption relates to. I just grabbed the first image I saw.
...
Oh, so you're even agreeing with me now that Windows tablets came first. Thanks for wasting our time.
Nonsense, both the Apple Newton and the EO tablet came years before Microsoft lumbered into the tablet market.
3. There's plenty of reason to believe that Moto's phone business could be made profitable with some management changes. There was absolutely no reason to think that Flip could have been made profitable.
but there is also absolutely no reason to think Google has any idea how to solve Moto's management problems. this is a panic buy, not a well thought out and planned management restructuring. and Google knows zilch about manufacturing and hardware engineering. the public theory is they are buying Moto to acquire that expertise. but what they are really acquiring is their incompetence!
but there is also absolutely no reason to think Google has any idea how to solve Moto's management problems. this is a panic buy, not a well thought out and planned management restructuring. and Google knows zilch about manufacturing and hardware engineering. the public theory is they are buying Moto to acquire that expertise. but what they are really acquiring is their incompetence!
This is absurd. There's no reason to think that Google DOESN'T have a plan, either.
You don't spend $12.5 B on a whim - even if you're rich. The idea that Google is full of idiots who don't have any clue what they're doing is absurd. While I despise their business ethics, they are clearly very astute business people. And their advisors would be all over them if they tried to do this without a plan (to the point where you would have seen reports of Google advisors quitting).
There are huge differences:
1. FLIP camcorders were not successful in the marketplace. Moto phones are.
2. No one was likely to pay anything for FLIP camcorders at the time it was shut down. Moto cell phone division would get an attractive price (assuming that Google gives a license to use its patents).
3. There's plenty of reason to believe that Moto's phone business could be made profitable with some management changes. There was absolutely no reason to think that Flip could have been made profitable.
1) I'd argue the opposite. Flips dominated the handheld camcorder business. I would agree that cellphones are about to decimate that business however.
2) Could be, who knows? What makes you think anyone would pay for the Moto handset business? That business is unprofitable at the moment. What's going to make it profitable?
3) I think the jury is still out on whether Moto can be made profitable. The Android handset business is looking a lot like the pc business, a low profit to no profit commodity business.
I still don't know why people think WebOS under HP really has any future at all. It's just rubbish, and will take another six months to be anywhere close to the iPad.
Maybe HP can turn things around, but this is really worse than anyone thought. The anti-Apple sentiment, geek fantasies and blogs desperate for clicks and anything non-iPad are proven once again to be not even in the same universe as our current reality.
Well, another I-told-you-so from me. HP killed off WebOS. I bet you Best Buy must be real thrilled now. I'm sure things have been "smoothed" over quite well indeed.