Holy guacamole! That's some hefty pricing! I still have grandfathered unlimited data for $29.99.
True that though! I would not want to start developing for M$ even if they gave me an iPhone, even 10 iPhones. If the potential was there I'd do it for the opportunity
None of this is a suprise. HP was nuts to buy Palm. Gartner and IDC both are probably right, Android, WP7, and iOS will survive. RIM and Webos are dead men walking.
M$ is giving phones at dev training seminars, it isn't just webOS devs. The article makes it sound like that.
But M$ has been doing that for as long as I can remember. Why do you think the 4sale boards are flooded with M$ paraphernalia whenever they release something? That's how I never pay for a windows disc.
As for RIM, I wouldn't be surprised if M$ bought them, and integrated BBM etc into W7 and secured a corp foothold in the mobile. RIM doesn't have the wherewithall to pull it off. After I heard about google buying motorola mobile, M$ scooping RIM made sense.
M$ is giving phones at dev training seminars, it isn't just webOS devs. The article makes it sound like that.
But M$ has been doing that for as long as I can remember. Why do you think the 4sale boards are flooded with M$ paraphernalia whenever they release something? That's how I never pay for a windows disc.
As for RIM, I wouldn't be surprised if M$ bought them, and integrated BBM etc into W7 and secured a corp foothold in the mobile. RIM doesn't have the wherewithall to pull it off. After I heard about google buying motorola mobile, M$ scooping RIM made sense.
I've got a last-gen 24 inch iMac. That's how I never pay for a windows disc.
None of this is a suprise. HP was nuts to buy Palm. Gartner and IDC both are probably right, Android, WP7, and iOS will survive. RIM and Webos are dead men walking.
That Mango video is pretty dam cool.
I wouldn't say webOS is dead man walking..... It's what we call "in a coma" or on life support as of a couple of days ago
Having just been burned, I'm sure their instinct will be to move to the biggest platform.
Not necessarily. The problem with the iOS eco-system is that it's too big and bloated that an emerging developer getting an application recognised would be nearly impossible.
That's why developers like to get in on the 'gold-rush' stage where people who have bought a new phone are exploring for new content.
The App Store has over 400,000 apps whereas Windows Phone 7 store has just over 20,000.
There are 20 x less Windows Phone owners but there's also 20x less competition for your app.
I think the best thing Microsoft can do at this stage is to take the quality not quantity marketing route and be extremely harsh with their application approvals and also offer developers the chance to get a profile spot in their store if they meet certain quality goals.
All we see is "Microsoft courting." Why do they need to court developers? Aren't their products and platform enticing enough on their own?
WP7 isn't really "crap" at all. it's just late to the game and has a lot of marketshare to make up, as well as being a little behind on features. I think it has some good ideas, although the interface isn't really for me. Was WebOS crap? No. There's just no reason to buy it when it's short on apps and it's "not quite as good" as the competition (and, unlike Android, had no hardware choice or advantage)
Think about Macs. Apple lost many customers in the 90s because they started making products that were far too similar to PCs with a dated operating system that offered no major disadvantage over Windows, but no major advantage either. If you don't have a major advantage, you won't be catching up with your competitor that has the developer support advantage. Apple came back because they started to make innovative hardware again, and vastly improved their software so that it was superior to Windows like it was before Windows 95.
Mango seems like it's on par with anything else. And I wouldn't underestimate the power of having a quality hardware maker like Nokia behind the platform.
Why do you think Android took off? The OS is open source (and not half bad either, offering a few key features that make it stand out from iOS despite its inferior UI), and Google says you can make just about whatever app you want as long as you pay something like $25 to their app store to get on the market. But you don't even have to do that - there's competing app stores and you can always just release your APK file. The barrier for entry on Android is essentially nil, and Microsoft is trying to one-up that effort by giving away the hardware and documentation needed to get started.
Not necessarily. The problem with the iOS eco-system is that it's too big and bloated that an emerging developer getting an application recognised would be nearly impossible.
That's why developers like to get in on the 'gold-rush' stage where people who have bought a new phone are exploring for new content.
The App Store has over 400,000 apps whereas Windows Phone 7 store has just over 20,000.
There are 20 x less Windows Phone owners but there's also 20x less competition for your app.
I think the best thing Microsoft can do at this stage is to take the quality not quantity marketing route and be extremely harsh with their application approvals and also offer developers the chance to get a profile spot in their store if they meet certain quality goals.
I don't agree with your last statement, simply because I don't think Microsoft is saying "make a bad app we'll approve anything." They want to get people started making apps. And really, you can worry about quality later when you can say "we have a lot of apps"
If you think about it, only a really serious medium sized app developer would bother making a cross platform app for everything out there, joe blow would put his apps on iPhone exclusively because a low quality app developer could only afford to develop for one platform. So I don't think Microsoft needs to focus on quality yet - they just need to attract developers.
None of this is a suprise. HP was nuts to buy Palm. Gartner and IDC both are probably right, Android, WP7, and iOS will survive. RIM and Webos are dead men walking.
That Mango video is pretty dam cool.
I don't think RIM will die. The only reason they ever had a large marketshare was because before the iPhone, the smartphone market was exclusively reserved for business. Blackberry still has a corporate advantage, and corporate networks are slow to change. RIM has plenty of time to make up ground in becoming more modern.
WP7 isn't really "crap" at all. it's just late to the game and has a lot of marketshare to make up, as well as being a little behind on features. I think it has some good ideas, although the interface isn't really for me. Was WebOS crap? No. There's just no reason to buy it when it's short on apps and it's "not quite as good" as the competition (and, unlike Android, had no hardware choice or advantage)
Think about Macs. Apple lost many customers in the 90s because they started making products that were far too similar to PCs with a dated operating system that offered no major disadvantage over Windows, but no major advantage either. If you don't have a major advantage, you won't be catching up with your competitor that has the developer support advantage. Apple came back because they started to make innovative hardware again, and vastly improved their software so that it was superior to Windows like it was before Windows 95.
Mango seems like it's on par with anything else. And I wouldn't underestimate the power of having a quality hardware maker like Nokia behind the platform.
Why do you think Android took off? The OS is open source (and not half bad either, offering a few key features that make it stand out from iOS despite its inferior UI), and Google says you can make just about whatever app you want as long as you pay something like $25 to their app store to get on the market. But you don't even have to do that - there's competing app stores and you can always just release your APK file. The barrier for entry on Android is essentially nil, and Microsoft is trying to one-up that effort by giving away the hardware and documentation needed to get started.
WP7 is gong the way of WebOS.
WP7 phones are already in stores (have been for almost a year) and MS has been steadily losing share with them. If Google gets into hot legal water with Android and manufacturers shy away from the platform (the Moto purchase will help in this) then WP7 might have a chance, though the strategy for it will have to be re-thought and re-evaluated entirely. Because for the time being there's a WebOS situation going on with WP7.
MS had their chance to make an incredible first impression and the whole thing fizzled. And competing with Apple in a segment where Apple has an overwhelming lead in mindshare is usually a losing game, unless you can radically shift your way of thinking to Apple's way of thinking. Most don't have what it takes to do that. You can't out-Apple Apple. You need about 30 years of Apple-like philosophy and values under your belt to achieve it. An ambitious and progressive start-up could do it. Not MS, though. Not under their current leadership. Forget it. You'll need a radical paradigm shift at MS. They aren't really set up for that.
WP7 phones are already in stores (have been for almost a year) and MS has been steadily losing share with them. If Google gets into hot legal water with Android and manufacturers shy away from the platform (the Moto purchase will help in this) then WP7 might have a chance, though the strategy for it will have to be re-thought and re-evaluated entirely. Because for the time being there's a WebOS situation going on with WP7.
MS had their chance to make an incredible first impression and the whole thing fizzled. And competing with Apple in a segment where Apple has an overwhelming lead in mindshare is usually a losing game, unless you can radically shift your way of thinking to Apple's way of thinking. Most don't have what it takes to do that. You can't out-Apple Apple. You need about 30 years of Apple-like philosophy and values under your belt to achieve it. An ambitious and progressive start-up could do it. Not MS, though. Not under their current leadership. Forget it. You'll need a radical paradigm shift at MS. They aren't really set up for that.
Ballmer needs to GTFO.
Sit back and watch what happens now that the FTC in no longer crawling up Microsofts ass. Grab your popcorn and enjoy the show. You will be surprised. You can already see some changes and it has only been a couple of months.
Sit back and watch what happens now that the FTC in no longer crawling up Microsofts ass. Grab your popcorn and enjoy the show. You will be surprised. You can already see some changes and it has only been a couple of months.
Microsoft is luring developers into its Windowless Van
Winning witticism! Particularly when you remember that WP7 is, in fact, windowless (in both the sense that it lacks legacy Windows code and it also lacks visible, overlapping UI windows).
Just think if they came out at $99. They would be a number 2 tablet right now for sure.
I was just thinking about that. Ironic for HP, huh? Well, that would be selling at a massive loss so it wouldn't help much beyond the initial blowout sales. With such a quick pull out from the market you wonder how committed HP was to WebOS anyway.
Comments
You mean just like iPhone is free as well?
http://www.vodafone.co.uk/brands/iph...hone/index.htm
Holy guacamole! That's some hefty pricing! I still have grandfathered unlimited data for $29.99.
True that though! I would not want to start developing for M$ even if they gave me an iPhone, even 10 iPhones. If the potential was there I'd do it for the opportunity
That Mango video is pretty dam cool.
But M$ has been doing that for as long as I can remember. Why do you think the 4sale boards are flooded with M$ paraphernalia whenever they release something? That's how I never pay for a windows disc.
As for RIM, I wouldn't be surprised if M$ bought them, and integrated BBM etc into W7 and secured a corp foothold in the mobile. RIM doesn't have the wherewithall to pull it off. After I heard about google buying motorola mobile, M$ scooping RIM made sense.
They could then just build a Tablet specifically for the Chinese market.
Stop trying to take on Apple on the world market and look for a gigantic niche market.
Think outside the box.
M$ is giving phones at dev training seminars, it isn't just webOS devs. The article makes it sound like that.
But M$ has been doing that for as long as I can remember. Why do you think the 4sale boards are flooded with M$ paraphernalia whenever they release something? That's how I never pay for a windows disc.
As for RIM, I wouldn't be surprised if M$ bought them, and integrated BBM etc into W7 and secured a corp foothold in the mobile. RIM doesn't have the wherewithall to pull it off. After I heard about google buying motorola mobile, M$ scooping RIM made sense.
I've got a last-gen 24 inch iMac. That's how I never pay for a windows disc.
None of this is a suprise. HP was nuts to buy Palm. Gartner and IDC both are probably right, Android, WP7, and iOS will survive. RIM and Webos are dead men walking.
That Mango video is pretty dam cool.
I wouldn't say webOS is dead man walking..... It's what we call "in a coma" or on life support as of a couple of days ago
Having just been burned, I'm sure their instinct will be to move to the biggest platform.
Not necessarily. The problem with the iOS eco-system is that it's too big and bloated that an emerging developer getting an application recognised would be nearly impossible.
That's why developers like to get in on the 'gold-rush' stage where people who have bought a new phone are exploring for new content.
The App Store has over 400,000 apps whereas Windows Phone 7 store has just over 20,000.
There are 20 x less Windows Phone owners but there's also 20x less competition for your app.
I think the best thing Microsoft can do at this stage is to take the quality not quantity marketing route and be extremely harsh with their application approvals and also offer developers the chance to get a profile spot in their store if they meet certain quality goals.
WP7 must *really* be crap for them to do this.
All we see is "Microsoft courting." Why do they need to court developers? Aren't their products and platform enticing enough on their own?
WP7 isn't really "crap" at all. it's just late to the game and has a lot of marketshare to make up, as well as being a little behind on features. I think it has some good ideas, although the interface isn't really for me. Was WebOS crap? No. There's just no reason to buy it when it's short on apps and it's "not quite as good" as the competition (and, unlike Android, had no hardware choice or advantage)
Think about Macs. Apple lost many customers in the 90s because they started making products that were far too similar to PCs with a dated operating system that offered no major disadvantage over Windows, but no major advantage either. If you don't have a major advantage, you won't be catching up with your competitor that has the developer support advantage. Apple came back because they started to make innovative hardware again, and vastly improved their software so that it was superior to Windows like it was before Windows 95.
Mango seems like it's on par with anything else. And I wouldn't underestimate the power of having a quality hardware maker like Nokia behind the platform.
Why do you think Android took off? The OS is open source (and not half bad either, offering a few key features that make it stand out from iOS despite its inferior UI), and Google says you can make just about whatever app you want as long as you pay something like $25 to their app store to get on the market. But you don't even have to do that - there's competing app stores and you can always just release your APK file. The barrier for entry on Android is essentially nil, and Microsoft is trying to one-up that effort by giving away the hardware and documentation needed to get started.
Not necessarily. The problem with the iOS eco-system is that it's too big and bloated that an emerging developer getting an application recognised would be nearly impossible.
That's why developers like to get in on the 'gold-rush' stage where people who have bought a new phone are exploring for new content.
The App Store has over 400,000 apps whereas Windows Phone 7 store has just over 20,000.
There are 20 x less Windows Phone owners but there's also 20x less competition for your app.
I think the best thing Microsoft can do at this stage is to take the quality not quantity marketing route and be extremely harsh with their application approvals and also offer developers the chance to get a profile spot in their store if they meet certain quality goals.
I don't agree with your last statement, simply because I don't think Microsoft is saying "make a bad app we'll approve anything." They want to get people started making apps. And really, you can worry about quality later when you can say "we have a lot of apps"
If you think about it, only a really serious medium sized app developer would bother making a cross platform app for everything out there, joe blow would put his apps on iPhone exclusively because a low quality app developer could only afford to develop for one platform. So I don't think Microsoft needs to focus on quality yet - they just need to attract developers.
None of this is a suprise. HP was nuts to buy Palm. Gartner and IDC both are probably right, Android, WP7, and iOS will survive. RIM and Webos are dead men walking.
That Mango video is pretty dam cool.
I don't think RIM will die. The only reason they ever had a large marketshare was because before the iPhone, the smartphone market was exclusively reserved for business. Blackberry still has a corporate advantage, and corporate networks are slow to change. RIM has plenty of time to make up ground in becoming more modern.
That Mango video is pretty dam cool.
Agreed! I'd like to try it out for myself...
WP7 isn't really "crap" at all. it's just late to the game and has a lot of marketshare to make up, as well as being a little behind on features. I think it has some good ideas, although the interface isn't really for me. Was WebOS crap? No. There's just no reason to buy it when it's short on apps and it's "not quite as good" as the competition (and, unlike Android, had no hardware choice or advantage)
Think about Macs. Apple lost many customers in the 90s because they started making products that were far too similar to PCs with a dated operating system that offered no major disadvantage over Windows, but no major advantage either. If you don't have a major advantage, you won't be catching up with your competitor that has the developer support advantage. Apple came back because they started to make innovative hardware again, and vastly improved their software so that it was superior to Windows like it was before Windows 95.
Mango seems like it's on par with anything else. And I wouldn't underestimate the power of having a quality hardware maker like Nokia behind the platform.
Why do you think Android took off? The OS is open source (and not half bad either, offering a few key features that make it stand out from iOS despite its inferior UI), and Google says you can make just about whatever app you want as long as you pay something like $25 to their app store to get on the market. But you don't even have to do that - there's competing app stores and you can always just release your APK file. The barrier for entry on Android is essentially nil, and Microsoft is trying to one-up that effort by giving away the hardware and documentation needed to get started.
WP7 is gong the way of WebOS.
WP7 phones are already in stores (have been for almost a year) and MS has been steadily losing share with them. If Google gets into hot legal water with Android and manufacturers shy away from the platform (the Moto purchase will help in this) then WP7 might have a chance, though the strategy for it will have to be re-thought and re-evaluated entirely. Because for the time being there's a WebOS situation going on with WP7.
MS had their chance to make an incredible first impression and the whole thing fizzled. And competing with Apple in a segment where Apple has an overwhelming lead in mindshare is usually a losing game, unless you can radically shift your way of thinking to Apple's way of thinking. Most don't have what it takes to do that. You can't out-Apple Apple. You need about 30 years of Apple-like philosophy and values under your belt to achieve it. An ambitious and progressive start-up could do it. Not MS, though. Not under their current leadership. Forget it. You'll need a radical paradigm shift at MS. They aren't really set up for that.
Ballmer needs to GTFO.
Agreed! I'd like to try it out for myself...
Once you do, you won't go back :-)
WP7 is gong the way of WebOS.
WP7 phones are already in stores (have been for almost a year) and MS has been steadily losing share with them. If Google gets into hot legal water with Android and manufacturers shy away from the platform (the Moto purchase will help in this) then WP7 might have a chance, though the strategy for it will have to be re-thought and re-evaluated entirely. Because for the time being there's a WebOS situation going on with WP7.
MS had their chance to make an incredible first impression and the whole thing fizzled. And competing with Apple in a segment where Apple has an overwhelming lead in mindshare is usually a losing game, unless you can radically shift your way of thinking to Apple's way of thinking. Most don't have what it takes to do that. You can't out-Apple Apple. You need about 30 years of Apple-like philosophy and values under your belt to achieve it. An ambitious and progressive start-up could do it. Not MS, though. Not under their current leadership. Forget it. You'll need a radical paradigm shift at MS. They aren't really set up for that.
Ballmer needs to GTFO.
Sit back and watch what happens now that the FTC in no longer crawling up Microsofts ass. Grab your popcorn and enjoy the show. You will be surprised. You can already see some changes and it has only been a couple of months.
Sit back and watch what happens now that the FTC in no longer crawling up Microsofts ass. Grab your popcorn and enjoy the show. You will be surprised. You can already see some changes and it has only been a couple of months.
Uh . . . this is Microsoft.
The "show" is a comedy.
Microsoft is luring developers into its Windowless Van
Winning witticism! Particularly when you remember that WP7 is, in fact, windowless (in both the sense that it lacks legacy Windows code and it also lacks visible, overlapping UI windows).
Clever!
hp tpuchpad...now $99 at best buy. sad
Just think if they came out at $99. They would be a number 2 tablet right now for sure.
Nice on MS trying to get people on their side, though I wonder how many exclusive good developers webOS still had at the time of touchpad intro.
Uh . . . this is Microsoft.
The "show" is a comedy.
Nothing wrong with comedies. I watched one yesterday.
Just think if they came out at $99. They would be a number 2 tablet right now for sure.
I was just thinking about that. Ironic for HP, huh? Well, that would be selling at a massive loss so it wouldn't help much beyond the initial blowout sales. With such a quick pull out from the market you wonder how committed HP was to WebOS anyway.