Yes. Until now, everything we've known about Apple's decisions to hire out another company to manufacture its A6 chips have been based on rumors and speculation, which IBT was nice about reporting.
But a few months have passed, and we've now received new information. Barring a discovery the Samsung executive was speaking out of turn, things have changed. We've discovered new facts.
I thought this would be obvious to a common sense observer. Perhaps not?
Yes. Until now, everything we've known about Apple's decisions to hire out another company to manufacture its A6 chips have been based on rumors and speculation, which IBT was nice about reporting.
But a few months have passed, and we've now received new information. Barring a discovery the Samsung executive was speaking out of turn, things have changed. We've discovered new facts.
I thought this would be obvious to a common sense observer. Perhaps not?
Actually, I don't see any new 'information'. just another rumor. And "Apple is in talks with Samsung" doesn't prove a thing. Even if it's true, so what? Apple would be foolish not to at least talk with Samsung - even if they had already decided to buy elsewhere.
Furthermore, I think it's unlikely that Apple would switch entirely from Samsung to someone else for a critical component. They would probably buy just a portion of A6 chips from a new supplier and the rest from Samsung until the new supplier is fully qualified. So even if we know that some A6 chips will be made by Samsung, that doesn't mean that there won't be new supplier, as well.
Actually, I don't see any new 'information'. just another rumor. And "Apple is in talks with Samsung" doesn't prove a thing. Even if it's true, so what? Apple would be foolish not to at least talk with Samsung - even if they had already decided to buy elsewhere.
Furthermore, I think it's unlikely that Apple would switch entirely from Samsung to someone else for a critical component. They would probably buy just a portion of A6 chips from a new supplier and the rest from Samsung until the new supplier is fully qualified. So even if we know that some A6 chips will be made by Samsung, that doesn't mean that there won't be new supplier, as well.
Great, except that the IBT article cited was also mostly based on a rumor. While it's true this new article's rumors leave us with very few concrete facts to go off of, it's still reasonable for now just to draw inferences from the new information. A lot of industry insiders have been saying Apple wouldn't move completely away from Samsung for a long time. This sounds like reliable information to me. This isn't some Samsung customer service making statements. This is an actual executive. Judging from the way the article's conclusion has been supported by multiple industry sources over the past several months, there's no need to quibble with semantics.
And your second paragraph isn't really responsive to my comment--I never said Apple would switch entirely from Samsung.
At the end of the day, we're all just going off rumors. I think it's accepted Samsung's not leaving the picture anytime soon. Let's just leave it at that and take it for what it is.
Apple knows too well the pain of relying on flaky chip manufacturers (I'm looking at you IBM and Motorola/Freescale). They won't live through that again. So if TSMC can't do the job, I can see how Apple would have to tolerate Samsung a bit longer.
But at this point I wonder why Apple goes with Samsung over Intel. Intel has indicated a potential willingness to fab for Apple (including fabbing ARM rather than x86), but they've said the terms would have to be right. Maybe they couldn't agree on a price. If so, that's a shame -- Apple+Intel would be a killer combination.
While a lot of these posts are worth reading for the giggles, you'll set yourself up for disappoint if you put others here to a high standard.
Ain't that the truth. But I don't think you have paid much attention to MacRulz or any of his other z-sock puppets.
In the end I expect Apple to do everything they can to show Samsung they are expendable should Samsung keep copying. But doing a complete supplier swap without at least a year of proven delivery quality is out of the question. TSMC is auditioning for a VERY LARGE contract. LARGE enough to get Samsung's collective attention, not just the attention of the chip division. Especially since the latest court proceedings are setting up for the potential of a catastrophic March 2012 in the Samsung consumer electronics division.
Samsung has to be doing the risk assessment math on last weeks set of rulings and the prior probabilities given how the rulings were written up. The risk of losing in court and losing a majority of the Apple fab business to TSMC won't be something Samsung will want to ever become a reality. Nothing solid may happen before mid-February, but I expect settlements before the world-wide series of early spring court dates begin to meet.
TSMCs performance will also play into the mix. If TSMC delivers quality and in quantity, showing the ability to absorb a production increase or two and makes Apple very happy to have another qualified supplier, Samsung CE will feel even more internal pressure to settle. If TSMC stubs it's toe, not so much.
Apple knows too well the pain of relying on flaky chip manufacturers (I'm looking at you IBM and Motorola/Freescale). They won't live through that again. So if TSMC can't do the job, I can see how Apple would have to tolerate Samsung a bit longer.
But at this point I wonder why Apple goes with Samsung over Intel. Intel has indicated a potential willingness to fab for Apple (including fabbing ARM rather than x86), but they've said the terms would have to be right. Maybe they couldn't agree on a price. If so, that's a shame -- Apple+Intel would be a killer combination.
Yeah. I was really excited to hear Intel was potentially jumping aboard the ARM bandwagon. 3D transistor technology only created new possibilities for low-powered, high-perf chips. ARM or not, guess that contract didn't materialize. But I wouldn't rule out Intel joining the negotiation table. They've always been a king of chip manufacturing.
Samsung is a very diversified company. They make all kinds of electronic components, like CPUs, Flash, DRAM, LCD displays as well as consumer goods. They could do without the Apple CPU business and barely miss a beat.
On the other hand, if Samsung just terminated their A4, A5 production at the earlier date that their contract allowed, Apple would be a world of hurt. More than half of the profits come from the related products.
Apple should going after Google and Android. Google search is nice, but there are other search engines.
The point of contracts is to eliminate the threat you suggest. Apple prepays for its components, and buys out production years in advance, thus allowing it either reduced prices or increased capacity, or a combination of both.
Samsung legally likely cannot simply "cancel" their contract without a hefty legal penalty. Not that they would; they're making a lot of money from Apple, and corporation don't have "feelings".
I'd find it more likely if the new chip goes into iPad3 first.
What is a phone going to do with a quad core anyways?
as someone said, Apple will never lower PPI, so maybe the quad core + better gfx = 2x rez screen XD (this is a huge joke, but that would be CRAZY, 600 ppi 0.0)
ASSUMING the rumor is true...and I'm going just do so for now.
All this squabbling's kinda pointless. At the end of the day, I see this as a win-win for everyone. Apple doesn't need to waste time and money on building its own factories. It can continue to focus on the areas where it exceeds such as software and design. Samsung gets an infusion of cash through this processor contract that allows it to improve its scale of economies at its foundries and invest in R&D for current and future generation processor technologies. I'm sure some diehard Apple fans are worried and cringing inside at the idea of Apple enriching its competitor, but let's just face the reality. Apple came out with a really good deal, and Samsung, Apple contract or not, still makes its own chips.
How do you know that Apple isn't already in the middle of a switch?
Well, erm, uh ... the article we just read said so:
Samsung is expected to remain the primary chip supplier for Apple and its anticipated next-generation A6 processor despite a bitter patent dispute between the two companies, according to a new report.
That is kind of the entire point made by the article.
Comments
Tou really should check the date on that article. It seems kinda old...
And does this article rule it out in any way?
And does this article rule it out in any way?
Yes. Until now, everything we've known about Apple's decisions to hire out another company to manufacture its A6 chips have been based on rumors and speculation, which IBT was nice about reporting.
But a few months have passed, and we've now received new information. Barring a discovery the Samsung executive was speaking out of turn, things have changed. We've discovered new facts.
I thought this would be obvious to a common sense observer. Perhaps not?
Yes. Until now, everything we've known about Apple's decisions to hire out another company to manufacture its A6 chips have been based on rumors and speculation, which IBT was nice about reporting.
But a few months have passed, and we've now received new information. Barring a discovery the Samsung executive was speaking out of turn, things have changed. We've discovered new facts.
I thought this would be obvious to a common sense observer. Perhaps not?
Actually, I don't see any new 'information'. just another rumor. And "Apple is in talks with Samsung" doesn't prove a thing. Even if it's true, so what? Apple would be foolish not to at least talk with Samsung - even if they had already decided to buy elsewhere.
Furthermore, I think it's unlikely that Apple would switch entirely from Samsung to someone else for a critical component. They would probably buy just a portion of A6 chips from a new supplier and the rest from Samsung until the new supplier is fully qualified. So even if we know that some A6 chips will be made by Samsung, that doesn't mean that there won't be new supplier, as well.
Actually, I don't see any new 'information'. just another rumor. And "Apple is in talks with Samsung" doesn't prove a thing. Even if it's true, so what? Apple would be foolish not to at least talk with Samsung - even if they had already decided to buy elsewhere.
Furthermore, I think it's unlikely that Apple would switch entirely from Samsung to someone else for a critical component. They would probably buy just a portion of A6 chips from a new supplier and the rest from Samsung until the new supplier is fully qualified. So even if we know that some A6 chips will be made by Samsung, that doesn't mean that there won't be new supplier, as well.
Great, except that the IBT article cited was also mostly based on a rumor. While it's true this new article's rumors leave us with very few concrete facts to go off of, it's still reasonable for now just to draw inferences from the new information. A lot of industry insiders have been saying Apple wouldn't move completely away from Samsung for a long time. This sounds like reliable information to me. This isn't some Samsung customer service making statements. This is an actual executive. Judging from the way the article's conclusion has been supported by multiple industry sources over the past several months, there's no need to quibble with semantics.
And your second paragraph isn't really responsive to my comment--I never said Apple would switch entirely from Samsung.
At the end of the day, we're all just going off rumors. I think it's accepted Samsung's not leaving the picture anytime soon. Let's just leave it at that and take it for what it is.
But at this point I wonder why Apple goes with Samsung over Intel. Intel has indicated a potential willingness to fab for Apple (including fabbing ARM rather than x86), but they've said the terms would have to be right. Maybe they couldn't agree on a price. If so, that's a shame -- Apple+Intel would be a killer combination.
While a lot of these posts are worth reading for the giggles, you'll set yourself up for disappoint if you put others here to a high standard.
Ain't that the truth. But I don't think you have paid much attention to MacRulz or any of his other z-sock puppets.
In the end I expect Apple to do everything they can to show Samsung they are expendable should Samsung keep copying. But doing a complete supplier swap without at least a year of proven delivery quality is out of the question. TSMC is auditioning for a VERY LARGE contract. LARGE enough to get Samsung's collective attention, not just the attention of the chip division. Especially since the latest court proceedings are setting up for the potential of a catastrophic March 2012 in the Samsung consumer electronics division.
Samsung has to be doing the risk assessment math on last weeks set of rulings and the prior probabilities given how the rulings were written up. The risk of losing in court and losing a majority of the Apple fab business to TSMC won't be something Samsung will want to ever become a reality. Nothing solid may happen before mid-February, but I expect settlements before the world-wide series of early spring court dates begin to meet.
TSMCs performance will also play into the mix. If TSMC delivers quality and in quantity, showing the ability to absorb a production increase or two and makes Apple very happy to have another qualified supplier, Samsung CE will feel even more internal pressure to settle. If TSMC stubs it's toe, not so much.
Apple knows too well the pain of relying on flaky chip manufacturers (I'm looking at you IBM and Motorola/Freescale). They won't live through that again. So if TSMC can't do the job, I can see how Apple would have to tolerate Samsung a bit longer.
But at this point I wonder why Apple goes with Samsung over Intel. Intel has indicated a potential willingness to fab for Apple (including fabbing ARM rather than x86), but they've said the terms would have to be right. Maybe they couldn't agree on a price. If so, that's a shame -- Apple+Intel would be a killer combination.
Yeah. I was really excited to hear Intel was potentially jumping aboard the ARM bandwagon. 3D transistor technology only created new possibilities for low-powered, high-perf chips. ARM or not, guess that contract didn't materialize. But I wouldn't rule out Intel joining the negotiation table. They've always been a king of chip manufacturing.
The A6 CPU is expected to utilize Samsung's 28-nanometer processing technology.
This is a process developed by TSMC, Samsung, IBM and Global Foundries.
http://www.taipeitimes.com/News/biz/.../15/2003513278
Will people still complain about the chips not being manufactured in the US?
Samsung is a very diversified company. They make all kinds of electronic components, like CPUs, Flash, DRAM, LCD displays as well as consumer goods. They could do without the Apple CPU business and barely miss a beat.
On the other hand, if Samsung just terminated their A4, A5 production at the earlier date that their contract allowed, Apple would be a world of hurt. More than half of the profits come from the related products.
Apple should going after Google and Android. Google search is nice, but there are other search engines.
The point of contracts is to eliminate the threat you suggest. Apple prepays for its components, and buys out production years in advance, thus allowing it either reduced prices or increased capacity, or a combination of both.
Samsung legally likely cannot simply "cancel" their contract without a hefty legal penalty. Not that they would; they're making a lot of money from Apple, and corporation don't have "feelings".
post
Not sure what's creepier; the fact that you wasted your time to stalk through months of his posts to pull these quotes out or the fact that?
Know what? Never mind.
Apple, therefore, can have any other manufacturer make these chips for them, it's their choice.
Correct me if I am wrong.
It looks a lot like Apple had very little choice - otherwise they would not be giving business to Samsung.
Rumors about iPhone5... hmmm...
I'd find it more likely if the new chip goes into iPad3 first.
What is a phone going to do with a quad core anyways?
as someone said, Apple will never lower PPI, so maybe the quad core + better gfx = 2x rez screen XD (this is a huge joke, but that would be CRAZY, 600 ppi 0.0)
It looks a lot like Apple had very little choice - otherwise they would not be giving business to Samsung.
Not necessarily.
It takes time to switch chip suppliers. How do you know that Apple isn't already in the middle of a switch?
All this squabbling's kinda pointless. At the end of the day, I see this as a win-win for everyone. Apple doesn't need to waste time and money on building its own factories. It can continue to focus on the areas where it exceeds such as software and design. Samsung gets an infusion of cash through this processor contract that allows it to improve its scale of economies at its foundries and invest in R&D for current and future generation processor technologies. I'm sure some diehard Apple fans are worried and cringing inside at the idea of Apple enriching its competitor, but let's just face the reality. Apple came out with a really good deal, and Samsung, Apple contract or not, still makes its own chips.
It's comparative advantage at its best.
How do you know that Apple isn't already in the middle of a switch?
Well, erm, uh ... the article we just read said so:
Samsung is expected to remain the primary chip supplier for Apple and its anticipated next-generation A6 processor despite a bitter patent dispute between the two companies, according to a new report.
That is kind of the entire point made by the article.
HTH.
despite the numerous back-and-forth patent trolling among both companies
Neither companies are "patent trolling?.
There are patent disputes but no patent trolling.
... We've discovered new facts.
At the end of the day, we're all just going off rumors.
Sorry, which is it, facts or rumours? Thanks for lifting the level of discussion here, as well, we all appreciate it.