no i am not. it is driven by economics. what is wrong with you?
Your first comment on the other thread was "At the NYC Fifth Ave store, there is a big problem with the Chinese." with an included subject of "chinese", not scalpers or Apple Store purchase polices suck. Then you put scalpers in quotes as if to note you really mean the Chinese, not so much scalpers in general.
Then you post on this thread "so, does everyone still think I'm racist for blaming the Chinese for f*ing up our 5th Ave, NYC lines? screw y'all." Where is the connection to 5th Avenue? The only connection you appear to be making is that Chinese are unscrupulous people. Justifying racism doesn't make it any less racist.
The fact is people are the same all over the fucking world and no slight variance in your genetic make up between these supposed races will alter how the whole acts.
For your comment to not be racist it should have focused on the scalpers, not any particular people that you have determined are the only scalpers or worse offenders. Just the scalpers! That includes not chiming in on this thread about an altercation because you think it backs up your previous comments about the Chinese people.
For your comment to not be racist it should have focused on the scalpers, not any particular people that you have determined are the only scalpers or worse offenders. Just the scalpers! That includes not chiming in on this thread about an altercation because you think it backs up your previous comments about the Chinese people.
It's called being precise. Anybody who waited in those lines, like I did, for the iPad 2 awhile back, saw that it was Chinese scalpers who made up the vast majority of the scalpers. Pointing that out is not being racist. Stating a fact is not being racist.
It's also helpful to know who your enemies are. And the scalpers are the enemies of all Apple fans and people looking to buy Apple products. Knowing the exact makeup of the scalpers allows people to plan ahead and to intelligently choose which Apple stores to visit, where there will most likely be the least amount of scalpers. Having accurate intelligence and doing reconnaissance before going into battle is a wise thing to do if somebody is looking to win.
Your first comment on the other thread was "At the NYC Fifth Ave store, there is a big problem with the Chinese." with an included subject of "chinese", not scalpers or Apple Store purchase polices suck. Then you put scalpers in quotes as if to note you really mean the Chinese, not so much scalpers in general.
Then you post on this thread "so, does everyone still think I'm racist for blaming the Chinese for f*ing up our 5th Ave, NYC lines? screw y'all." Where is the connection to 5th Avenue? The only connection you appear to be making is that Chinese are unscrupulous people. Justifying racism doesn't make it any less racist.
The fact is people are the same all over the fucking world and no slight variance in your genetic make up between these supposed races will alter how the whole acts.
For your comment to not be racist it should have focused on the scalpers, not any particular people that you have determined are the only scalpers or worse offenders. Just the scalpers! That includes not chiming in on this thread about an altercation because you think it backs up your previous comments about the Chinese people.
the line is "full" of chinese scalpers. "tons" of "CHINESE" scalpers. that's all i'm "saying". if they were another race, i would have stated "that". whatever dude.
It's called being precise. Anybody who waited in those lines, like I did, for the iPad 2 awhile back, saw that it was Chinese scalpers who made up the vast majority of the scalpers. Pointing that out is not being racist. Stating a fact is not being racist.
It's also helpful to know who your enemies are. And the scalpers are the enemies of all Apple fans and people looking to buy Apple products. Knowing the exact makeup of the scalpers allows people to plan ahead and to intelligently choose which Apple stores to visit, where there will most likely be the least amount of scalpers. Having accurate intelligence and doing reconnaissance before going into battle is a wise thing to do if somebody is looking to win.
It's not being precise when you don't address that the problem exists because of Apple's lenient policies for buying an iPad (even though there are pitfalls for trying to exclude scalpers that could very easily exclude many 1st-person consumers). It's not precise when you make the assumption they are Chinese by merely looking at them. From the images I've seen of the lines most are fairly young, which leads me to assume that most are US citizens, just trying to make a buck in hard economic times.
If you see a business opportunity then you should go for it if you deem it worth your time and effort, as long as it falls within the law. If Apple doesn't like all these iPads being sent overseas to various countries by various groups of people then they need to change the rules of how they sell their devices. Don't put the blame on 1.3 billion people.
It's about the evil Chinese and an in-line altercation is not proof that they are evil scum that don't deserve to have any access to Apple's products. I'm surprised his initial comment didn't start out as "I don't hate Chinese people, but…".
It's not precise when you make the assumption they are Chinese by merely looking at them.
I already went through all of this back when the iPad 2 was released and I have no desire to relive that nightmare again, but I will merely point out and quickly repeat what I wrote in those previous threads.
I am not making any assumptions simply by looking at people. As I pointed out before, standing next to me in line was a Chinese-American Apple fan who was not a sleazy scalper. We spoke for quite a while and he acted as a realtime translator for me.
The issue here is the grey market that supplies to all of the mainland visitors that come in to Hong Kong, not the ability to buy from the telecomunications companies.
These people lining up aren't wasting their time as the grey market prices will still be high until the 4S is released in the mainland and is widely available.
It is truly a sad state. I think that Apple should have restricted sales to 1 or 2 per person in Hong Kong with the presentation of an id card. I would say 95% of the people are just lining up to make a quick buck from resale and for people who wanted to have the Apple Fanboy experience at the first Apple Store in Hong Kong that has been ruined.
Of course you can get it from 3 but for someone like me that didn't want to buy the subsidized phone and sign their rigid 2 year contract, it will be a long wait.
Quote:
Originally Posted by tonton
Dude. Chill. I walked into the 3 shop not half a block away from my flat yesterday, signed a 24 month contract for HK$298, paid about HK$1500 for the 64GB Black 4S, prepaid about $4800 of my contract dues in advance, and I will have my iPhone in my hand on Monday. Maybe Smartone or PCCW doesn't treat you so well, or maybe you get a raw deal from them just because you're an asshole, I don't know.
So I was wrong about the online Apple Shop. But you can still get your subsidized phone at the carrier, like I JUST did.
By the way, I've been living here in HK for sixteen years.
I also got the iPad 2 I wanted, retail, about a week after it was available here, so I know about lines, and also that they don't last forever, if you know where to go.
You can easily make over $100 USD, maybe even $200 USD per phone, and you can order 10 from the Apple Online store.
Believe what you will about China's economy, these are poor people lining up so they can sell to the rich. They take the device back to China, where it is un-cripppled, unlocked and fully useable, compared with China Unicom's watered down version which sells for an even higher price. It's a sure sale.
If only China was released at the same time HK was, then the lineups wouldn't be in HK!
This whole fiasco (as with iPad2), is caused by Apple Hong Kong mis-management.
In other regions, Apple tries to put its product into the hands of as many fans as possible with a 1 or 2 unit cap. Apple HK limits to 10 online and 5 at the store. One guy bragged about getting 60 units using multiple credit cards. You'd have to be a moron not to realize that the units are being sold out to the grey-market resellers - mostly mainlanders. A 5 or 10 unit limit means Apple HK is knowingly colluding in this illicit trade and doesn't seem to really care about its loyal consumers.
This whole fiasco (as with iPad2), is caused by Apple Hong Kong mis-management.
In other regions, Apple tries to put its product into the hands of as many fans as possible with a 1 or 2 unit cap. Apple HK limits to 10 online and 5 at the store. One guy bragged about getting 60 units using multiple credit cards. You'd have to be a moron not to realize that the units are being sold out to the grey-market resellers - mostly mainlanders. A 5 or 10 unit limit means Apple HK is knowingly colluding in this illicit trade and doesn't seem to really care about its loyal consumers.
I would have to agree on that, and from the usual business workings, I believe the apple managers in hong kong have a hand in the grey market profiting as well.
It's sad to see Steve Jobs proud creations being manipulated by shady practices with only profit in mind.
If, when I get my 4S on Monday afternoon, I can then turn around and sell it to the scalpers for HK$1000 mark-up on retail, I might just do that, and wait and buy another 4S with cash in a couple weeks when it's more widely available. I'm debating it. $1000 for a couple weeks delay? It might just be worth it.
I would have to agree on that, and from the usual business workings, I believe the apple managers in hong kong have a hand in the grey market profiting as well.
It's sad to see Steve Jobs proud creations being manipulated by shady practices with only profit in mind.
You might be right - it is difficult to come up with any logical explanation why apple would knowingly abuse their fans like that.
You might be right - it is difficult to come up with any logical explanation why apple would knowingly abuse their fans like that.
As a fan, I have my phone. Apple, as of the afternoon of 11 November, is only accepting per-orders, by credit card, with ID, limited to two per customer, or you can get a subsidized handset from the carrier. There are no more direct sales. There are no more lines. Seems Apple fixed the problem.
Apple, as of the afternoon of 11 November, is only accepting per-orders, by credit card, with ID, limited to two per customer, or you can get a subsidized handset from the carrier. There are no more direct sales. There are no more lines. Seems Apple fixed the problem.
Having no stock because it gave all the stock to scalpers and ceasing direct sales is hardly a solution. Intersting logic you have there... No stock, no sales, no line-ups, no problem.
Having no stock because it gave all the stock to scalpers and ceasing direct sales is hardly a solution. Intersting logic you have there... No stock, no sales, no line-ups, no problem.
They have stock. A limited number of people can order the iPhone 4S from the online Apple Store today, and pick it up at the IFC store tomorrow. They are getting more stock on a daily basis. This is not what "sold out" means.
Likewise, for the carriers. You can walk into many carriers' shops today, and walk out with a new iPhone 4S, depending on which model you prefer.
When I ordered my iPhone 4S on Friday, my carrier (3HK) told me to come back on Monday to pick it up. On a whim, I went in on Sunday and asked if it was there, and they said, "sure". And I walked out with my iPhone 4S a few minutes later. This after "All Hong Kong [was] sold out of the iPhone 4S in two hours" on Friday.
Comments
so, does everyone still think I'm racist for blaming the Chinese for f*ing up our 5th Ave, NYC lines? screw y'all.
This post seems to reinforce it. Are you saying that unethical behavior is innate to their being?
This post seems to reinforce it. Are you saying that unethical behavior is innate to their being?
no i am not. it is driven by economics. what is wrong with you?
no i am not. it is driven by economics. what is wrong with you?
Your first comment on the other thread was "At the NYC Fifth Ave store, there is a big problem with the Chinese." with an included subject of "chinese", not scalpers or Apple Store purchase polices suck. Then you put scalpers in quotes as if to note you really mean the Chinese, not so much scalpers in general.
Then you post on this thread "so, does everyone still think I'm racist for blaming the Chinese for f*ing up our 5th Ave, NYC lines? screw y'all." Where is the connection to 5th Avenue? The only connection you appear to be making is that Chinese are unscrupulous people. Justifying racism doesn't make it any less racist.
The fact is people are the same all over the fucking world and no slight variance in your genetic make up between these supposed races will alter how the whole acts.
For your comment to not be racist it should have focused on the scalpers, not any particular people that you have determined are the only scalpers or worse offenders. Just the scalpers! That includes not chiming in on this thread about an altercation because you think it backs up your previous comments about the Chinese people.
For your comment to not be racist it should have focused on the scalpers, not any particular people that you have determined are the only scalpers or worse offenders. Just the scalpers! That includes not chiming in on this thread about an altercation because you think it backs up your previous comments about the Chinese people.
It's called being precise. Anybody who waited in those lines, like I did, for the iPad 2 awhile back, saw that it was Chinese scalpers who made up the vast majority of the scalpers. Pointing that out is not being racist. Stating a fact is not being racist.
It's also helpful to know who your enemies are. And the scalpers are the enemies of all Apple fans and people looking to buy Apple products. Knowing the exact makeup of the scalpers allows people to plan ahead and to intelligently choose which Apple stores to visit, where there will most likely be the least amount of scalpers. Having accurate intelligence and doing reconnaissance before going into battle is a wise thing to do if somebody is looking to win.
Your first comment on the other thread was "At the NYC Fifth Ave store, there is a big problem with the Chinese." with an included subject of "chinese", not scalpers or Apple Store purchase polices suck. Then you put scalpers in quotes as if to note you really mean the Chinese, not so much scalpers in general.
Then you post on this thread "so, does everyone still think I'm racist for blaming the Chinese for f*ing up our 5th Ave, NYC lines? screw y'all." Where is the connection to 5th Avenue? The only connection you appear to be making is that Chinese are unscrupulous people. Justifying racism doesn't make it any less racist.
The fact is people are the same all over the fucking world and no slight variance in your genetic make up between these supposed races will alter how the whole acts.
For your comment to not be racist it should have focused on the scalpers, not any particular people that you have determined are the only scalpers or worse offenders. Just the scalpers! That includes not chiming in on this thread about an altercation because you think it backs up your previous comments about the Chinese people.
the line is "full" of chinese scalpers. "tons" of "CHINESE" scalpers. that's all i'm "saying". if they were another race, i would have stated "that". whatever dude.
It's called being precise. Anybody who waited in those lines, like I did, for the iPad 2 awhile back, saw that it was Chinese scalpers who made up the vast majority of the scalpers. Pointing that out is not being racist. Stating a fact is not being racist.
It's also helpful to know who your enemies are. And the scalpers are the enemies of all Apple fans and people looking to buy Apple products. Knowing the exact makeup of the scalpers allows people to plan ahead and to intelligently choose which Apple stores to visit, where there will most likely be the least amount of scalpers. Having accurate intelligence and doing reconnaissance before going into battle is a wise thing to do if somebody is looking to win.
It's not being precise when you don't address that the problem exists because of Apple's lenient policies for buying an iPad (even though there are pitfalls for trying to exclude scalpers that could very easily exclude many 1st-person consumers). It's not precise when you make the assumption they are Chinese by merely looking at them. From the images I've seen of the lines most are fairly young, which leads me to assume that most are US citizens, just trying to make a buck in hard economic times.
If you see a business opportunity then you should go for it if you deem it worth your time and effort, as long as it falls within the law. If Apple doesn't like all these iPads being sent overseas to various countries by various groups of people then they need to change the rules of how they sell their devices. Don't put the blame on 1.3 billion people.
It's about the evil Chinese and an in-line altercation is not proof that they are evil scum that don't deserve to have any access to Apple's products. I'm surprised his initial comment didn't start out as "I don't hate Chinese people, but…".
It's not precise when you make the assumption they are Chinese by merely looking at them.
I already went through all of this back when the iPad 2 was released and I have no desire to relive that nightmare again, but I will merely point out and quickly repeat what I wrote in those previous threads.
I am not making any assumptions simply by looking at people. As I pointed out before, standing next to me in line was a Chinese-American Apple fan who was not a sleazy scalper. We spoke for quite a while and he acted as a realtime translator for me.
These people lining up aren't wasting their time as the grey market prices will still be high until the 4S is released in the mainland and is widely available.
It is truly a sad state. I think that Apple should have restricted sales to 1 or 2 per person in Hong Kong with the presentation of an id card. I would say 95% of the people are just lining up to make a quick buck from resale and for people who wanted to have the Apple Fanboy experience at the first Apple Store in Hong Kong that has been ruined.
Of course you can get it from 3 but for someone like me that didn't want to buy the subsidized phone and sign their rigid 2 year contract, it will be a long wait.
Dude. Chill. I walked into the 3 shop not half a block away from my flat yesterday, signed a 24 month contract for HK$298, paid about HK$1500 for the 64GB Black 4S, prepaid about $4800 of my contract dues in advance, and I will have my iPhone in my hand on Monday. Maybe Smartone or PCCW doesn't treat you so well, or maybe you get a raw deal from them just because you're an asshole, I don't know.
So I was wrong about the online Apple Shop. But you can still get your subsidized phone at the carrier, like I JUST did.
By the way, I've been living here in HK for sixteen years.
I also got the iPad 2 I wanted, retail, about a week after it was available here, so I know about lines, and also that they don't last forever, if you know where to go.
Believe what you will about China's economy, these are poor people lining up so they can sell to the rich. They take the device back to China, where it is un-cripppled, unlocked and fully useable, compared with China Unicom's watered down version which sells for an even higher price. It's a sure sale.
If only China was released at the same time HK was, then the lineups wouldn't be in HK!
In other regions, Apple tries to put its product into the hands of as many fans as possible with a 1 or 2 unit cap. Apple HK limits to 10 online and 5 at the store. One guy bragged about getting 60 units using multiple credit cards. You'd have to be a moron not to realize that the units are being sold out to the grey-market resellers - mostly mainlanders. A 5 or 10 unit limit means Apple HK is knowingly colluding in this illicit trade and doesn't seem to really care about its loyal consumers.
This whole fiasco (as with iPad2), is caused by Apple Hong Kong mis-management.
In other regions, Apple tries to put its product into the hands of as many fans as possible with a 1 or 2 unit cap. Apple HK limits to 10 online and 5 at the store. One guy bragged about getting 60 units using multiple credit cards. You'd have to be a moron not to realize that the units are being sold out to the grey-market resellers - mostly mainlanders. A 5 or 10 unit limit means Apple HK is knowingly colluding in this illicit trade and doesn't seem to really care about its loyal consumers.
I would have to agree on that, and from the usual business workings, I believe the apple managers in hong kong have a hand in the grey market profiting as well.
It's sad to see Steve Jobs proud creations being manipulated by shady practices with only profit in mind.
I would have to agree on that, and from the usual business workings, I believe the apple managers in hong kong have a hand in the grey market profiting as well.
It's sad to see Steve Jobs proud creations being manipulated by shady practices with only profit in mind.
You might be right - it is difficult to come up with any logical explanation why apple would knowingly abuse their fans like that.
You might be right - it is difficult to come up with any logical explanation why apple would knowingly abuse their fans like that.
As a fan, I have my phone. Apple, as of the afternoon of 11 November, is only accepting per-orders, by credit card, with ID, limited to two per customer, or you can get a subsidized handset from the carrier. There are no more direct sales. There are no more lines. Seems Apple fixed the problem.
Apple, as of the afternoon of 11 November, is only accepting per-orders, by credit card, with ID, limited to two per customer, or you can get a subsidized handset from the carrier. There are no more direct sales. There are no more lines. Seems Apple fixed the problem.
Having no stock because it gave all the stock to scalpers and ceasing direct sales is hardly a solution. Intersting logic you have there... No stock, no sales, no line-ups, no problem.
Having no stock because it gave all the stock to scalpers and ceasing direct sales is hardly a solution. Intersting logic you have there... No stock, no sales, no line-ups, no problem.
They have stock. A limited number of people can order the iPhone 4S from the online Apple Store today, and pick it up at the IFC store tomorrow. They are getting more stock on a daily basis. This is not what "sold out" means.
Likewise, for the carriers. You can walk into many carriers' shops today, and walk out with a new iPhone 4S, depending on which model you prefer.
When I ordered my iPhone 4S on Friday, my carrier (3HK) told me to come back on Monday to pick it up. On a whim, I went in on Sunday and asked if it was there, and they said, "sure". And I walked out with my iPhone 4S a few minutes later. This after "All Hong Kong [was] sold out of the iPhone 4S in two hours" on Friday.