CNN investigates Foxconn iPad factory conditions, Apple responds

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Comments

  • Reply 81 of 147
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by geekdad View Post


    We should bring those jobs here to the U.S.!!!!

    Apple can afford to bring those jobs here to the US. I am not faulting them for doing well..I support Apple by buying their products. But with billions in cash reserves they should bring those jobs to the U.S.



    She makes $1 an hour for extremely menial labor.



    Do you know anyone who would want that job if they "brought it to America"?
  • Reply 82 of 147
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by MJ4Ev3r View Post


    BUT the point is--why single out Apple as I indicated on my post--there are tons of Asian/American/European companies that use FOXCONN for their manufactured products--so as lawyers like to state.."what is good for the goose, is also good for the gander"--meaning everyone is EQUAL under the eyes of the law--be it beneficial or otherwise!



    There should be NO prejudice or bias of one company over the others! Because all these other companies ALSO use FOXCONN! In fact there was that Microsoft complaint regarding alleged attempted Foxconn suicides, too!



    I do not understand WHY fellow Americans are trying to sabotage/undermine a successful American entrepreneurial company!



    BTW, Apple is NOT a lawmaking body, so their sincere attempts to IMPROVE the working conditions in China is very limited--it is still the Chinese legislative body that can issue laws protecting their citizens!



    I see your point, but, that's one of the downsides of being a big company, and it's also a way that society can drive change that is beneficial to peoples lives. If Apple are pressured into pressuring Foxconn, Foxconn will do something. If one of Foxconns much smaller customers tries to pressure them, Foxconn will ignore them and willingly lose the business.



    It's probably not "fair" that Apple are placed with that additional responsibility, but it's the nature of the beast and it's probably better they have that problem than they go back to being a tiny player that nobody cares about what they do.
  • Reply 83 of 147
    rogifanrogifan Posts: 10,669member
    Since when does CNN care about factory workers in China?
  • Reply 84 of 147
    rogifanrogifan Posts: 10,669member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by erann View Post


    I wonder why CNN didn't reach out to Foxconn for comment on the story. I thought it was a Foxcoon factory.



    because most people who don't know any better probably think these are apple employees at apple factories. Just like when people say an apple product is "made in China". No, look at the back of an iPhone. It says "assembled in China", not "made in China". Probably 80-90% of the product is made elsewhere, it's just assembled in China.
  • Reply 85 of 147
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by nagromme View Post


    These problems are real, and they can be addressed, and they NEED to be addressed (better), and Apple hasn’t solved them yet.



    Apple will not - cannot - solve this problem. The fact of the matter is that it is not Apple's problem - no matter how much people want to blame them. Nor do I necessarily agree that there even is a problem to discuss. Thousands of people voluntarily work these jobs. Thousands more wait in lines to get these jobs. What problem?
  • Reply 86 of 147
    stevehsteveh Posts: 480member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by cnocbui View Post


    I bet you get more than 83c an hour though, which is what she gets.



    Now compare cost of living in China with that in the U.S., say in California, New York or Rhode Island.
  • Reply 87 of 147
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Patranus View Post


    60 hours a week?

    That is nothing.

    This entitlement mentality in America is sickening.

    Most people don't work bankers hours.



    Just a side note: Back when "banker's hours" meant they closed at three in the afternoon, I worked for a bank's back office where the all the day's deposits were received. They had to be collected, delivered, counted, reconciled and sent to other banks by midnight every day but Friday, else credit had to be given for checks regardless of whether we could verify them or not. Because of this (and other reasons) we had a little quirk called mandatory overtime. You could opt out once per year. It was repetitious and dull - kind of like assembly-line work. If one couldn't hack it one left the job, but it paid well and had benefits. It paid my way through college. Many of my co-workers were immigrants, and it paid for homes for their families. I guess I'm thinking about it because a friend told me unions would have fixed that problem, and I was thinking "What problem?"
  • Reply 88 of 147
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by tbsteph View Post


    Who died and made CNN et al the arbiter on what are fair labor practices in China? If the employee interviewed felt she was being mistreated, why is she still working there? The obvious implication being her alternatives were less desirable.





    Really! I agree.

    All these idiots going off on Apple and the poor Chinese like it's Apple's fault because they are RICH!!! Etc etc etc.



    Wake up and smell the thermonuclear war. Who is behind this sudden interest in Chinese labor? I mean, this story was old two years ago. You wouldnt have anything electronic in your house if not for this factory. Apple uses the minority amount of their capacity. Etc etc etc



    GOOGLE. Hedge Funds. Up to their usual malarkey. Yet, all they can find is this?? Be expecting another phoney big story soon, cause this one just won't do the job. What job? Depends. The hedge funds want another chance to get in AAPL at a low price.



    Google wants a meme to tar Apple with and hopes to make them unpopular.



    Nothing to see here.
  • Reply 89 of 147
    dasanman69dasanman69 Posts: 12,980member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by I am a Zither Zather Zuzz View Post


    Those jobs are never going to come back.



    If they did, we'd have to pay more for Apple products. Its all OK when you are spending other people's money, eh? If you were an Apple shareholder you would want the highest possible profit, and if you were an Apple customer you would want the lowest possible price.



    Nobody gets anything good if those jobs come back to the US.



    You already pay more for Apple products, what's a little more going to do? You'll still dish out the cash.
  • Reply 90 of 147
    solipsismxsolipsismx Posts: 19,566member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by auxio View Post


    Sure, I have no problem with workers in these countries having options at a better future (relative to conditions previously). This is exactly what has happened over the past 100 years in the western world.



    The problem I see is that the standard of living for the average worker in the western world is eroding at a far quicker rate than the standard of living is increasing for workers in countries such as China. Which means that, with the global picture in mind, we're taking more steps back than we are forward in terms of living conditions for the average person.



    My fear is that this expectation of absurd working and living conditions for the average person (very much like the comparison to prison labour) becomes a permanent condition in our society. But then again, I don't put the blame solely on the companies -- it's up to all of us to see that all the products we buy simply can't be produced as cheaply as we expect them without such conditions existing.



    Is that really true? Is the US standard of living eroding because of the global market? I don't think you can count the depression that occurred because of the house market issue as proof that is because of the global market of using foreign labour to make good that Americans wouldn't want to do.



    Would you buy an iPhone it cost over $1000 out of pocket yet still required a 2-year contract because it was subsidized? I know I wouldn't. I'd still with the one I have now or jump to a company that made a good product overseas.



    And look at the standard of living in the US. I think it's better now than just a few decades back because of technology. I can buy a HDTV in pharmacy/general store for a few hundred dollars and connect to aerial HD content without the need for paying for cable/sat. I'm not that old buy I remember when even SD TVs cost a lot more for a lot less TV. Luckily I don't have to but I would rather live today at minimum wage than 20 years ago at that same wage.
  • Reply 91 of 147
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by cnocbui View Post


    I bet you get more than 83c an hour though, which is what she gets.



    I bet you aren't ALLOWED to live in a ramshackle hut either. Building codes. Unless you camp out in the woods. But then you'd be breaking more laws somehow. It costs a lot more to live in an industrialized country...with building codes. I bet when you figure it all up the working poor here have a similar proportion of 'disposable' income.



    I am really suspicious of this sudden interest in the 'poor Chinese worker'j.

    A lot of you want to tell Apple what to do or where to go with their pile o cash. The 'give us a dividend dammit!' crowd is getting mighty loud.



    How do you know what plans Apple might have that involve needing every penny of that money? Suppose they did bring back some jobs, would you shut up then? My god that money is burning a hole in other people's pockets!



    Just watch. Apple will do something amazing again. WHEN the time is right.
  • Reply 92 of 147
    dasanman69dasanman69 Posts: 12,980member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by palomine View Post


    Hey idiots! Everybody is going off on Apple and the poor Chinese it's Apple's fault because they are RICH!!! Etc etc etc.



    Wake up and smell the thermonuclear war. Who is behind this sudden interest in Chinese labor? I mean, this story was old two years ago. You wouldnt have anything electronic in your house if not for this factory. Apple uses the minority amount of their capacity. Etc etc etc



    GOOGLE. Hedge Funds. Up to their usual malarkey. Yet, all they can find is this?? Be expecting another phoney big story soon, cause this one just won't do the job. What job? Depends. The hedge funds want another chance to get in AAPL at a low price.



    Google wants a meme to tar Apple with and hopes to make them unpopular.



    Nothing to see here.



    It's Walmarts fault.
  • Reply 93 of 147
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Flaneur View Post


    Listen, you should have realized this by now. It's about tectonic shifts in economics and technology that no company or nation can reverse. Where were you in the 1970s when all television manufacturing left the U.S for Japan? Why did you say nothing when all VCR and video camera manufacturing was established in Asia?



    There is an ecology in technology and manufacturing, and in the making of microelectronics it is all in Asia. You can't establish that system here, get it? Any more than the Silicon Valley system of venture technology and design, including software, can be transferred to China!



    If you America-first people do not begin to see the plain truth in front of your face, you are obstructing the retention of what skills we do have in the West. Wise up! It ain't about Apple's cash recovering jobs that were never in the US to begin with!



    Although I wouldn't be surprised if they used that cash to fund an industry here that has never been seen on Earth before, like they're doing with Siri and the iPhone, and iBooks and the iPad. (Largest software group at Apple: Siri, soon to be much larger, guaranteed.)



    I hope I never see this knee-jerk post of yours again. Emphasis is not on "knee."



    Spot on, as always. You have a knack for getting the bigger picture out there. Thank you.
  • Reply 94 of 147
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by geekdad View Post


    I disagree....for an American company they should base their jobs in the US. It does everything for them and the US......As far as profit goes. Apple has more cash than they know what to do with. At some point American corporations as a whole need to stop offshoring jobs. I do not fault Apple or any other copr for doing well. But you can't argue and say that would hurt them...as it would not slow down sales at all. I agree it would hurt the bottom line by either raising prices slightly or lowering profit margins



    I'd love to look at your buying patterns and see how you lead by example, i.e., by buying the more-expensive US-manufactured products when higher-quality, less-expensive, foreign-manufactured products are at your fingertips.



    But from your email, I'm sure that that's exactly what you do.
  • Reply 95 of 147
    eric475eric475 Posts: 177member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Flaneur View Post




    There is an ecology in technology and manufacturing, and in the making of microelectronics it is all in Asia. You can't establish that system here, get it? Any more than the Silicon Valley system of venture technology and design, including software, can be transferred to China!




    If the yuan is floated without any currency controls in place and higher Chinese labor costs coupled with sky-high oil prices make it cheaper to manufacture in America, then you'll probably see a big chunk of those manufacturing jobs returning to America.



    There are a number of looming factors that can trigger another tectonic shift. I think China knows this and thus, is milking the global capitalist system at full throttle before it finds itself at a disadvantage. Multinational corporations chase profits, and this drove them to China. If it becomes more profitable for a multinational to produce in America than in Asia due to the aforementioned hypothetical conditions, then they'll make a beeline to America.
  • Reply 96 of 147
    CNN (and others) have recently picked up on these stories to hit an emotional nerve with the American public about working conditions for people who assemble Apple products in China. Apple is a true American story of humble beginnings and spectacular success in the face of adversity. But if there's one thing Americans love just as much as the underdog, it's knocking the Big Dog off his pedestal. Apple just reported one of the greatest quarters in HISTORY. FOR ANY INDUSTRY. The fact that they did that in the midst of increased competition from Android and an economic recession is stunning. What better way to generate Ad revenue than some sensational articles suggesting that Apple's blowout profits are tied to oppressing Chinese factory workers.



    Apple's already done one hell of a job making money for us shareholders. They've also done a hell of a job becoming a more eco-friendly company. I have every bit of confidence they'll find an Apple solution to this as well. To those who want Apple to do more to foster job creation here at home, I'd ask - What company has done MORE than Apple to foster secondary job creation in the US? They've given developers the Mac and iTunes App stores to profit from their talents. They're rolling out iBooks author to give authors the same opportunity. The iTunes store itself has given Indie artists the opportunity to profit from their work without being indentured servants to a record label. They have a massive retail presence that provides thousands of other US jobs. And of course, they do employ a few people at their headquarters in Cupertino. Apple's been outstanding at creating jobs for those driven enough to take advantage of the opportunities they've provided...
  • Reply 97 of 147
    ssquirrelssquirrel Posts: 1,196member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by cnocbui View Post


    $1 an hour would constitute 17% pay rise over her actual wage



    Actually $1 is a 20.48% increase over 83 cents. (.17/.83)



    Does China have minimum wage laws or worker's rights? If not, get on China to improve their citizen's standard of living. Apple is far from the only company using Foxconn.
  • Reply 98 of 147
    What a joke - no context whatsoever on working conditions and the costs and progress of economic development - aka capitalism - in China, or other countries. It is totally worthless "journalism" to go to a country like China, barely 25 years into its capitalist - industrial development phase, and hold it to standards of smaller, western developed countries with over 100 years or pretty horrendous stories of the human cost of industrialization. BTW - workers in China routinely swamp Apple production facilities looking for jobs because as bad as conditions seem, they are better than elsewhere. Another BTW, my father routinely worked 60+ hours a week, as a pharmacist, at as many as three jobs, to raise a small family in a small town in Connecticut the 60's.



    Just for some context, "Going Postal," crushing unions, toxic spills, stealing workers pensions, etc. etc. All made popular by the "richest" nation in the world, the good old USA.



    This type of reporting simply fuels prejudice and hostility - it is destructive and an insult to readers.
  • Reply 99 of 147
    auxioauxio Posts: 1,987member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by SolipsismX View Post


    Is that really true? Is the US standard of living eroding because of the global market? I don't think you can count the depression that occurred because of the house market issue as proof that is because of the global market of using foreign labour to make good that Americans wouldn't want to do.



    For the average person, I believe it has eroded in the past 25 years. I'd have to find the link, but I'm sure I've seen a statistic which shows that, accounting for inflation in cost of living, the average person is making less today than they did in the early 1980s. And I'm fairly certain people are working more hours these days.



    Quote:

    Would you buy an iPhone it cost over $1000 out of pocket yet still required a 2-year contract because it was subsidized? I know I wouldn't. I'd still with the one I have now or jump to a company that made a good product overseas.



    Yet I remember a time when a Macintosh cost around $5k, and people who really wanted one would find a way. They would just forgo other things to do it.



    Quote:

    And look at the standard of living in the US. I think it's better now than just a few decades back because of technology. I can buy a HDTV in pharmacy/general store for a few hundred dollars and connect to aerial HD content without the need for paying for cable/sat. I'm not that old buy I remember when even SD TVs cost a lot more for a lot less TV. Luckily I don't have to but I would rather live today at minimum wage than 20 years ago at that same wage.



    I don't think it's possible to live decently in most major cities these days (thinking New York, LA, San Francisco, etc) working for minimum wage and only 40 hours a week.



    Well, ok -- if you don't have kids and are willing to either live in a tiny rathole in the worst part of town, or live with a few roommates in a cramped apartment. You certainly won't have a few hundred extra dollars to spend on an HDTV if you're living that way though.
  • Reply 100 of 147
    xsuxsu Posts: 401member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by sblanford View Post


    I put in 60 hours in my job all the time in a week. That is normal practice.



    Bet you didn't do 60 hours of repetitive labor sitting in one chair.
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