You can patent a gesture, if the gesture and reaction are specific.
Here in America, you can patent someone else's genes and sue them for their children's unauthorized use of same, provided you're a corporation which sufficient budget. If you can afford to buy a six pack or three of Congressman, you can have any law you like, no matter how transparently stupid or hideously destructive.
And - best of all - provided you have enough money, everyone will admire you for having done it.
All it really takes is a culture which has accepted - without question, down to the very sock fuzz in its rank toenails- the notion that money is the greatest good. It's a little like religion: once you've got them convinced that God is watching, telling them how God feels about what he's seeing is easy.
Once we believe that someone else has the right to own the idea of what every human being can do with his or her fingers, getting us to pay per orgasm is merely a question of how much.
The larger social equivalent of "that's not a bug - it's an undocumented feature" is "that's no crime - that's entrepreneurship!"
Patently Apple is reporting that the U.S. Patent and Trademark Office has published 24 patents today which have been granted to Apple Inc. The first of these “highlights three out of five important Multi-Touch patent wins,” which cover multitouch auto scanning (for “disabling components of a touch-panel device during periods of inactivity to conserve power”), multipoint touchscreens (encapsulating 21 patents dating back to 2004) and Apple’s 3D curved substrate lamination process used for the Magic Mouse. “No matter how you slice it, it's a huge day for Apple on the Multi-touch patent front,” the website proclaims. Today’s patent victories also include 8,125,455 and 8,125,464 which cover "Full scale calibration measurement for multi-touch surfaces” -- less sexy than the others, to be sure, but definitely additional ammunition in Apple’s arsenal nonetheless.
So more ammunition for Apple to fight what the Swedish company claims is theres. NOT!!!
I hope that Apple uses these new patents to sue everybody!
Apple has no choice but to diligently protect its IP.
This has been discussed in Sweden years ago, in some years more or less. Neonode had own mobiles for sales but that didn't went well. Then it start talking about Apple using technology that NeoNode have patent on. Many thought they would claim rights when iPhone 3G was out.. but nope, it took 4-6 years.
I think they are just trying to milk money from their patents, because they don't sell mobiles anymore and just doing technologies research or something, i heard. They seems more or less desperate.
Apple should tell them to go pound sand. And if they sue Apple, BURY THEM.
Not just yet? Apple is still working on acquiring patents for the shovel, digging, sweating, memorials, epitaphs, and grass.
Also grief. In the future, we'll be charged royalties should we weep when confronting the way in which our entire species which knows "the price of everything and the value of nothing."
Of course when Grief 2.0 causes intolerable pain but brings about no healing, the EULA will have made it clear that the product came with no warranty whatsoever, while helpful hyperlinks connect us to other references which explain how the same terms apply to RayGE 1.3, reMorse 1, revVenge X, and new the new "sueAside3: The Corporation. You've killed everyone else, now blow your own head off!?" beta. (The last has problems - people download the free trial but kill themselves before paying for it.)
Not unlike the way the fundamentalist concept of life begins at conception and ends at birth, corporate product responsibility begins and production and ends at sale.
no no no AI, Apples slide to unlock features an icon that moves underneath the 'object', ie your finger. Apple specifically pointed to this glaring difference in the Netherlands. This patent does not mention the top-layer application having a UI or icon that slides underneath your finger.
This. Apple's patent is very specific about the graphical object being moved, and the manner and direction with which it must slide. That makes it unique, hence Apple's patent. Apple's European version of the patent, EP1964022 (B1), is specifically titled "UNLOCKING A DEVICE BY PERFORMING GESTURES ON AN UNLOCK IMAGE", to specify the requirement for the image associated with the gesture. Swiping by other means is another perfectly patentable idea.
Apple's patent on unlocking a phone and this gestural UI for a cell phone don't have much relation. They can always sue, but I don't think much would come of it. Maybe the only intersection between the two are the swipe-to-delete and swipe-for-inbox gestures, but this Neonode patent doesn't have much relation to Apple's slide-to-unlock patent.
There's a youtube video demoing the device. A young Myriam Joire (tnkgrl from Engadget Mobile) is in the video too. The N1m uses swipes (gestures) along the edge of the screen as command inputs. They replace the two button input design typical in Symbian UIs. For instance, a swipe left to right would be yes, a swipe right to left would mean no. This is the conceptual model for the N1m.
Apple's slide-to-unlock isn't a gestural input UI, hence, these two patents don't intersect. Apple's patent is a direct manipulation UI for onscreen graphics. There aren't any gesture inputs in Apple's slide-to-unlock at all. Apple's design is one where the onscreen graphics track with the finger, and respond to momentum et al.
"Gesture" here means a detected motion or shape from touch input. For instance, I draw a circle on the screen. The OS recognizes this as a circle and does the corresponding action, whatever it is. The N1m follows this model, but only has a very limited gesture vocabulary set (swipe left/right, swipe up/down along the entire edge). Apple does in fact use gesture inputs: swipe-to-delete for example in a list. In this case, there may be a case. That's may. It depends on how broad the Neonode patent is.
This. Apple's patent is very specific about the graphical object being moved, and the manner and direction with which it must slide. That makes it unique, hence Apple's patent. Apple's European version of the patent, EP1964022 (B1), is specifically titled "UNLOCKING A DEVICE BY PERFORMING GESTURES ON AN UNLOCK IMAGE", to specify the requirement for the image associated with the gesture. Swiping by other means is another perfectly patentable idea.
That's not the way it works.
If Neonode's patent is broader than Apple's then Neonode can still prevent Apple from using their patent. A narrow patent does not give you the right to ignore a broader patent.
This sounds like a "handheld computer" that has a separate menu area and a display area. This is more like an e-reader than an iPad or iPhone, and as noted in the story, they've licensed to e-reader companies. Apple will have no discussions with these people.
I'd agree. Their patent is written very specifically.
A top patent consultant told me that the main thing he does to help people with their patents is to erase things: change solid lines to dotted ones, erase specific language and use more general language, etc. It appears Neonode's idea of what a mobile computing device should look and work like has painted them into a corner with regard to this feature.
Nor has Apple's patent passed any challenge for validity. A request for re-exam is almost certainly in the future. In the opinion of a patent blogger "who will not be named", most software patents are invalid as issued.
Are you so sure? The Apple slide to unlock has stood up and won in two country's lawsuits so far. If it was so weak the legal system tests it has already ben subjected to would have already invalidated it in the HTC and Samsun slide to unlock cases.
If Neonode's patent is broader than Apple's then Neonode can still prevent Apple from using their patent. A narrow patent does not give you the right to ignore a broader patent.
And ambiguous questions like this are why so many cases HAVE to go to court to get resolved. A lot of the results will have more to do with the lawyering in pretrial terminology definitions than the actual merits of the patents before the legal process started.
Looks like there may be a possibility that Neonode beat Apple to the punch. If so, I'm sure they'll work out a mutually acceptable solution.
I watched the video and i don't think Neonode can make the claim stick. The gesture is not 'slide to unlock' but is a 'yes' slide. Early in the presentation, the demonstrator goes through the gestures, e.g. up in the middle always brings up the number pad, left to right at the bottom equals 'yes', right to left is 'no'. In the demonstration, the user is bringing up the lock function then making a 'yes' gesture. On Apple devices, the user is displayed a virtual lock and must slide the virtual lock to unlock the device. I don't see it as a clear cut win for Neonode.
A patent issued to Swedish touchscreen technology company Neonode for a 'sweep gesture' user interface could mean legal trouble for Apple, which is currently embroiled in a dispute with Motorola and Samsung over its 'slide to unlock' patent.
In a press release issued on Tuesday, Neonode says it was issued U.S. Patent which covers gesture-based interaction with a touch sensitive surface, a description that is similar to Apple's "slide to unlock" patent.
According to Neonode?s head of IP, Yossi Shain, the '879 patent was first filed for in 2002 and the company has been shopping the technology around since the IP was issued on January 10, 2012, reports TechCrunch.
Apple is supposedly the first target for Neonode, though Shain said the company is looking for "friendly licensing" deals before pursuing patent infringement lawsuits.
Neonode claims that it has successfully marketed and sold licenses of other touchscreen patents to to a number of "tier-one" OEMs and ODMs, with the technology being used in devices such as e-readers from Sony and Barnes and Noble, according to TechCrunch.
The '879 patent is meant to complement the Swedish company's other U.S. Patents, and the relating , which cover tech for small to midsize touchscreen devices. In addition, Neonode reportedly has similar patents pending in other undisclosed countries.
If Apple is indeed sued over the '879 patent, it wouldn't be the first time the company has seen Neonode in a court hearing. In August 2011, Samsung trotted out a relatively obscure device made by the Swedish company in defense of an Apple suit regarding "slide to unlock" functionality.
A European Windows CE handset, the Neonode N1m was shown as evidence that Apple's claims were not inventive as the device was manufactured before the iPhone maker filed its "slide to unlock" U.S. Patent in 2005. The Apple complaint was ultimately dismissed.
Most recently, however, Apple was successful in winning a German injunction against Motorola' use of gesture-based device unlocking after leveraging a European counterpart to its '849 patent.
Despite the European win, the Neonode IP could prove disruptive to Apple's continuing legal battle against Motorola and Samsung if the Swedish company forces the Cupertino, Calif., company to pay licensing fees or takes the matter to court.
In fact, it's so general, it could (IMO) just as easily apply to the original clickwheel iPod. Of course, the original clickwheel iPod came out before this filing, so if one interpreted it so broadly, then the patent would be invalid because of Apple's iPod-based prior art. So, I think the threat is a bit dubious.
Of course, it's possible that I misread the patent.
Comments
You can patent a gesture, if the gesture and reaction are specific.
Here in America, you can patent someone else's genes and sue them for their children's unauthorized use of same, provided you're a corporation which sufficient budget. If you can afford to buy a six pack or three of Congressman, you can have any law you like, no matter how transparently stupid or hideously destructive.
And - best of all - provided you have enough money, everyone will admire you for having done it.
All it really takes is a culture which has accepted - without question, down to the very sock fuzz in its rank toenails- the notion that money is the greatest good. It's a little like religion: once you've got them convinced that God is watching, telling them how God feels about what he's seeing is easy.
Once we believe that someone else has the right to own the idea of what every human being can do with his or her fingers, getting us to pay per orgasm is merely a question of how much.
The larger social equivalent of "that's not a bug - it's an undocumented feature" is "that's no crime - that's entrepreneurship!"
Mac life just posted this story.
Apple Scores a Major Win for Multitouch Patents
Patently Apple is reporting that the U.S. Patent and Trademark Office has published 24 patents today which have been granted to Apple Inc. The first of these “highlights three out of five important Multi-Touch patent wins,” which cover multitouch auto scanning (for “disabling components of a touch-panel device during periods of inactivity to conserve power”), multipoint touchscreens (encapsulating 21 patents dating back to 2004) and Apple’s 3D curved substrate lamination process used for the Magic Mouse. “No matter how you slice it, it's a huge day for Apple on the Multi-touch patent front,” the website proclaims. Today’s patent victories also include 8,125,455 and 8,125,464 which cover "Full scale calibration measurement for multi-touch surfaces” -- less sexy than the others, to be sure, but definitely additional ammunition in Apple’s arsenal nonetheless.
So more ammunition for Apple to fight what the Swedish company claims is theres. NOT!!!
I hope that Apple uses these new patents to sue everybody!
Apple has no choice but to diligently protect its IP.
There goes the Apple lawsuit...for now.
I think they are just trying to milk money from their patents, because they don't sell mobiles anymore and just doing technologies research or something, i heard. They seems more or less desperate.
Apple should tell them to go pound sand. And if they sue Apple, BURY THEM.
Not just yet? Apple is still working on acquiring patents for the shovel, digging, sweating, memorials, epitaphs, and grass.
Also grief. In the future, we'll be charged royalties should we weep when confronting the way in which our entire species which knows "the price of everything and the value of nothing."
Of course when Grief 2.0 causes intolerable pain but brings about no healing, the EULA will have made it clear that the product came with no warranty whatsoever, while helpful hyperlinks connect us to other references which explain how the same terms apply to RayGE 1.3, reMorse 1, revVenge X, and new the new "sueAside3: The Corporation. You've killed everyone else, now blow your own head off!?" beta. (The last has problems - people download the free trial but kill themselves before paying for it.)
Not unlike the way the fundamentalist concept of life begins at conception and ends at birth, corporate product responsibility begins and production and ends at sale.
no no no AI, Apples slide to unlock features an icon that moves underneath the 'object', ie your finger. Apple specifically pointed to this glaring difference in the Netherlands. This patent does not mention the top-layer application having a UI or icon that slides underneath your finger.
This. Apple's patent is very specific about the graphical object being moved, and the manner and direction with which it must slide. That makes it unique, hence Apple's patent. Apple's European version of the patent, EP1964022 (B1), is specifically titled "UNLOCKING A DEVICE BY PERFORMING GESTURES ON AN UNLOCK IMAGE", to specify the requirement for the image associated with the gesture. Swiping by other means is another perfectly patentable idea.
There's a youtube video demoing the device. A young Myriam Joire (tnkgrl from Engadget Mobile) is in the video too. The N1m uses swipes (gestures) along the edge of the screen as command inputs. They replace the two button input design typical in Symbian UIs. For instance, a swipe left to right would be yes, a swipe right to left would mean no. This is the conceptual model for the N1m.
Apple's slide-to-unlock isn't a gestural input UI, hence, these two patents don't intersect. Apple's patent is a direct manipulation UI for onscreen graphics. There aren't any gesture inputs in Apple's slide-to-unlock at all. Apple's design is one where the onscreen graphics track with the finger, and respond to momentum et al.
"Gesture" here means a detected motion or shape from touch input. For instance, I draw a circle on the screen. The OS recognizes this as a circle and does the corresponding action, whatever it is. The N1m follows this model, but only has a very limited gesture vocabulary set (swipe left/right, swipe up/down along the entire edge). Apple does in fact use gesture inputs: swipe-to-delete for example in a list. In this case, there may be a case. That's may. It depends on how broad the Neonode patent is.
This has already been discussed on AI ad nauseum.
So in the interest of fairness, all the anti-Apple folk will post that since "you can't patent a gesture" this patent is invalid. Right?
yes actually..(late to the party) this is akin to patenting sliding open a window.
Just buy the damn company.
for $100B
This. Apple's patent is very specific about the graphical object being moved, and the manner and direction with which it must slide. That makes it unique, hence Apple's patent. Apple's European version of the patent, EP1964022 (B1), is specifically titled "UNLOCKING A DEVICE BY PERFORMING GESTURES ON AN UNLOCK IMAGE", to specify the requirement for the image associated with the gesture. Swiping by other means is another perfectly patentable idea.
That's not the way it works.
If Neonode's patent is broader than Apple's then Neonode can still prevent Apple from using their patent. A narrow patent does not give you the right to ignore a broader patent.
There is nothing in the N1M that beat Apple to the punch if you look at the original iPhone.
Apple's patent is different.
It's not just the gesture but the bitmap underneath it.
You have to slide the button fully for the purpose of initial unlocking.
It also does not not have to be at the bottom.
N1M is yes or no after while using device or to wake up from sleep.
Time will tell.
This patent isn't a problem for Apple. . . .
. . .
This sounds like a "handheld computer" that has a separate menu area and a display area. This is more like an e-reader than an iPad or iPhone, and as noted in the story, they've licensed to e-reader companies. Apple will have no discussions with these people.
I'd agree. Their patent is written very specifically.
A top patent consultant told me that the main thing he does to help people with their patents is to erase things: change solid lines to dotted ones, erase specific language and use more general language, etc. It appears Neonode's idea of what a mobile computing device should look and work like has painted them into a corner with regard to this feature.
Nor has Apple's patent passed any challenge for validity. A request for re-exam is almost certainly in the future. In the opinion of a patent blogger "who will not be named", most software patents are invalid as issued.
Are you so sure? The Apple slide to unlock has stood up and won in two country's lawsuits so far. If it was so weak the legal system tests it has already ben subjected to would have already invalidated it in the HTC and Samsun slide to unlock cases.
Do you even think before you post this stuff?
That's not the way it works.
If Neonode's patent is broader than Apple's then Neonode can still prevent Apple from using their patent. A narrow patent does not give you the right to ignore a broader patent.
And ambiguous questions like this are why so many cases HAVE to go to court to get resolved. A lot of the results will have more to do with the lawyering in pretrial terminology definitions than the actual merits of the patents before the legal process started.
Here's a video posted on June 29, 2007 showing the Neonode N1M device:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Tj-KS2kfIr0
Looks like there may be a possibility that Neonode beat Apple to the punch. If so, I'm sure they'll work out a mutually acceptable solution.
I watched the video and i don't think Neonode can make the claim stick. The gesture is not 'slide to unlock' but is a 'yes' slide. Early in the presentation, the demonstrator goes through the gestures, e.g. up in the middle always brings up the number pad, left to right at the bottom equals 'yes', right to left is 'no'. In the demonstration, the user is bringing up the lock function then making a 'yes' gesture. On Apple devices, the user is displayed a virtual lock and must slide the virtual lock to unlock the device. I don't see it as a clear cut win for Neonode.
A patent issued to Swedish touchscreen technology company Neonode for a 'sweep gesture' user interface could mean legal trouble for Apple, which is currently embroiled in a dispute with Motorola and Samsung over its 'slide to unlock' patent.
In a press release issued on Tuesday, Neonode says it was issued U.S. Patent which covers gesture-based interaction with a touch sensitive surface, a description that is similar to Apple's "slide to unlock" patent.
According to Neonode?s head of IP, Yossi Shain, the '879 patent was first filed for in 2002 and the company has been shopping the technology around since the IP was issued on January 10, 2012, reports TechCrunch.
Apple is supposedly the first target for Neonode, though Shain said the company is looking for "friendly licensing" deals before pursuing patent infringement lawsuits.
Neonode claims that it has successfully marketed and sold licenses of other touchscreen patents to to a number of "tier-one" OEMs and ODMs, with the technology being used in devices such as e-readers from Sony and Barnes and Noble, according to TechCrunch.
The '879 patent is meant to complement the Swedish company's other U.S. Patents, and the relating , which cover tech for small to midsize touchscreen devices. In addition, Neonode reportedly has similar patents pending in other undisclosed countries.
Patent drawings illustrating Neonode's swipe gesture UI. Source:
If Apple is indeed sued over the '879 patent, it wouldn't be the first time the company has seen Neonode in a court hearing. In August 2011, Samsung trotted out a relatively obscure device made by the Swedish company in defense of an Apple suit regarding "slide to unlock" functionality.
A European Windows CE handset, the Neonode N1m was shown as evidence that Apple's claims were not inventive as the device was manufactured before the iPhone maker filed its "slide to unlock" U.S. Patent in 2005. The Apple complaint was ultimately dismissed.
Most recently, however, Apple was successful in winning a German injunction against Motorola' use of gesture-based device unlocking after leveraging a European counterpart to its '849 patent.
Despite the European win, the Neonode IP could prove disruptive to Apple's continuing legal battle against Motorola and Samsung if the Swedish company forces the Cupertino, Calif., company to pay licensing fees or takes the matter to court.
[ View article on AppleInsider ]
I don't see how this is a slide to unlock based on what is shown here.
Of course, it's possible that I misread the patent.
Apple should tell them to go pound sand. And if they sue Apple, BURY THEM.
/Slappy
Reported.